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The Church Needs Therapy

Mark Labberton EPISODE 37

Dr. Labberton is president of Fuller Theological Seminary, and in this episode, we talk about how people leaving the church actually gives us a diagnosis of the state of the church, what God has been revealing in the church during Covid, and how real worship is always a threat to toxic forms of power.

CLEAN

All Episodes

Not Giving Up, but Growing Up

Not Giving Up, but Growing Up

Newest episode of "The Church Needs Therapy."

Why is the Church so Scared of Change?

Why is the Church so Scared of Change?

Newest episode of "The Church Needs Therapy."

Donald Trump part 1

Donald Trump part 1

Newest episode of "The Church Needs Therapy."

Jonathan Merritt

Jonathan Merritt

Re-imaging and expanding our language as Christians in the 21st Century.

Donald Trump part 2

Donald Trump part 2

The Church, power, Trump, and why leaders are smiling at tables they should be flipping over.

White supremacy, religious nationalism, justice, and what it means to be a witness.

Grace. Mercy. Peace.

Grace. Mercy. Peace.

Therapy can be emotionally exhausting. So, this week is a reminder of 3 important words while we're doing the real work of change.

Spiritual practices, liturgy, and why Aaron doesn't want you to mistake the richness of swimming in the River for the dry river bank of religion.

Donald Trump part 3

Donald Trump part 3

Trump, immigrants, POC, foreign nations, and why the Kingdom of God is not like Trump's America.

AJ is a great guy and this is a great episode about the Enneagram, self-awareness, and spiritual formation.

Growing into the Future Without Being Angry at the Past

Growing into the Future Without Being Angry at the Past

This episode is about growing, changing, and evolving without being angry or frustrated, and not losing our own joy along the way.

Brandan Robertson

Brandan Robertson

The church, the LGBTQ community, the Bible, and the future.

Can We Still Love and Embrace the Church?

Can We Still Love and Embrace the Church?

While we call the church to embrace and include outsiders, can those of us who feel like outsiders still embrace the church?

Nationalism, Idolatry, and The Election

Nationalism, Idolatry, and The Election

One last episode before the election about the church’s identity in Christ, and what that means for her relationship with America.

Carl Lentz, Megachurches, and the Christian Cult of Celebrity

Carl Lentz, Megachurches, and the Christian Cult of Celebrity

This episode is not really about Carl Lentz, its about the system and the culture the needs, celebrates, and devours Christian celebrities.

Dr. Ralph Basui Watkins

Dr. Ralph Basui Watkins

In this episode, we talk about Black Theology, resistance music, where the Spirit is in public protest, and how God is working through the lives of artists today.

Church, Shame, and Christmas as the Affirmation of our Bodies.

Church, Shame, and Christmas as the Affirmation of our Bodies.

Christmas is the cosmic celebration of the human body, Christmas teaches us that its okay to feel comfortable, and confident, and at home in our bodies.

Spiritual Bypassing, Darkness, Advent, and Home Alone

Spiritual Bypassing, Darkness, Advent, and Home Alone

The church has a hard time dealing with darkness and heavy emotions, but Advent and God do not.

In this episode, we talk about the church turns spirituality into a product, how massive gatherings around a celebrity preacher become a spectacle of consumerism, and how the Church doesn’t need more information, it needs a discipleship revolution.

In this episode, we talk about what it means to be a “failed missionary,” what happens when you see through the American Dream, and why she got tear gassed with her Tuesday night prayer group.

Doubt is actually a doorway to love, the difference between God and our understanding of God, and why Brian has been a leading voice for a new kind of Christianity the last 20 years.

Dr. Monica A. Coleman

Dr. Monica A. Coleman

How churches have a hard time being safe space for people with mental health struggles, the power of Jesus calling us friend instead of master, and why we all need spaces to walk in and be able to lose our mind, and still leave with dignity.

Listener Q&A: Disagreeing with the Church, Hell, Murder, The Enneagram, and Why People Struggle with Evangelicals.

Listener Q&A: Disagreeing with the Church, Hell, Murder, The Enneagram, and Why People Struggle with Evangelicals.

Listener Q&A session # 1.

Listener Q&A Part 2: Qanon, Purity Culture, Moral Failures of Leaders, and Why so Many Christians Deny Critical Race Theory and Intersectionality

Listener Q&A Part 2: Qanon, Purity Culture, Moral Failures of Leaders, and Why so Many Christians Deny Critical Race Theory and Intersectionality

Qanon, how to respect other Christians who you believe are a part of the problem, purity culture and illusions about marriage, moral failures of Christian leaders and why so any Christians don’t care about injustice or believe in systemic racism.

In this episode, we talk about the power of place, how spiritual maturity includes joy and loving your enemies, and why being curious is more essential than being helpful.

Climbing the Christian Ladder, Vicarious Value, and Career Choices

Climbing the Christian Ladder, Vicarious Value, and Career Choices

In this episode, I talk about climbing the ladder, vicarious value, and career choices within the Christian Industrial Complex.

Gail Song Bantum

Gail Song Bantum

In this episode, we talk about the radical and inclusive love of God, how the movement of the Spirit does not always make sense, and always choosing conviction over conformity.

Using Religion to Avoid Reality

Using Religion to Avoid Reality

This is episode is about how we can use religion to avoid reality, how churches can create environments that encourage this, and why honesty is everything.

We talk about how facebook got him fired, the tension between the head and the heart for the church and the LGBTQ community, and why he named his first book, “UnClobber”

Q&A Legalizing Weed, AAPI Attacks and White Christian Nationalism, and Remaining Hopeful.

Q&A Legalizing Weed, AAPI Attacks and White Christian Nationalism, and Remaining Hopeful.

In this episode I answer questions about legalizing weed and how the church should engage and move forward, recent AAPPI attacks and the church’s response to White Christian Nationalism, and how to remain hopeful and committed to the church.

We talk about slowing down in a culture of speed and distraction, the difference between information and formation, and what a holistic spiritual life feels like.

Bridget Eileen Rivera

Bridget Eileen Rivera

We talk about the heavy burdens the church places on lgbtq folks, how her book is an invitation to see the world through the eyes of queer people, and that the places that are written off are so often the places Jesus is at work the most.

Spiritual Intelligence vs. Spiritual Experience

Spiritual Intelligence vs. Spiritual Experience

The difference between spiritual intelligence and spiritual experience, why the people who are the most dogmatic with their beliefs are the ones who know God the least, and why you can become less certain about your beliefs about God, but more free in Christ.

In this episode, we talk about the history of the Emergent Church, a Christianity worth believing, and why people are still talking about deconstruction.

We talk about why love matters more than being right, how knowledge becomes a way to avoid vulnerability, and why he has a podcast called, “the Bible for Normal People.”

Britt Barron (Re-post)

Britt Barron (Re-post)

We talk about the cost of authenticity, the future of the faith, and what happens when you fall in love with another woman while you’re on staff at an evangelical mega church.

The "God Bless the USA" Bible, Christian Resistance to Critical Race Theory, and Why The Body of Christ is Still so Beautiful

The "God Bless the USA" Bible, Christian Resistance to Critical Race Theory, and Why The Body of Christ is Still so Beautiful

In this episode, I talk the “God Bless USA” Bible, the Christian resistance to Critical Race Theory, other things that can frustrate me momentarily, and why the Body of Christ is still so beautiful

Pride, The Prodigal Older Brother, and Why The Church Keeps Refusing to Party

Pride, The Prodigal Older Brother, and Why The Church Keeps Refusing to Party

In this episode, I talk about PRIDE, how the church’s judgment makes them miss out on joy, and why the only boundaries that exist are the ones that are within us.

A Four Minute Father's Day Blessing

A Four Minute Father's Day Blessing

A blessing for all of us this holy and hard day.

John Phillip Newell

John Phillip Newell

We talk about how we have fallen out of relationship with the earth and one another, the sacred essence of all things, and why we need to keep listening to what our soul already knows.

Growing, Changing, and Letting Go: Part 1 Relationships

Growing, Changing, and Letting Go: Part 1 Relationships

In this episode, I talk about how growing affects our relationships, how institutional acceptance gets in the way of real change, and how there is something we need to let go of in order to keep moving forward.

Growing, Changing, and Letting Go: Part 2 Security

Growing, Changing, and Letting Go: Part 2 Security

How growing requires us to let go of our old forms of security, why changing is so scary, and how the Spirit keeps calling us forward

Frank Schaeffer

Frank Schaeffer

In this episode, we talk about how Frank helped start the pro-life movement and the religious right and why he came to regret it, how most “family values” are actually a form of misogyny, and how mothering can help save the planet.

1 Year Anniversary!

1 Year Anniversary!

Phil Wood comes on and interviews me for the 1 year episode--we talk about the best times of the past year with the podcast, my forthcoming book, and why we all need to trust the River.

Phil and Jen Wood

Phil and Jen Wood

In this conversation we talk about stepping away from their role in the church and how it has affected their relationship (for the better), their deep belief that life can always become more expansive, and what the past year has reveled about the church.

Faith Without Risk is an Empty Gesture to an Impotent god (or why it's okay to risk more)

Faith Without Risk is an Empty Gesture to an Impotent god (or why it's okay to risk more)

In this episode I talk about how the best stories always involve risk, how a decision not to risk is a decision not to love again, and why failure is a friend of freedom.

Risk and Letting Go of (The Illusion of) Control

Risk and Letting Go of (The Illusion of) Control

This episode is about why taking risks always requires letting go of control.

In this conversation we talk about his new book, “If God is Love, Don’t be a Jerk,” deconstructing on the way to adult spirituality, and fighting for a Christianity that resembles Jesus.

Peak experiences, Christian Conferences, Burning Man, and Why None of Them Matter Without Contemplation.

Peak experiences, Christian Conferences, Burning Man, and Why None of Them Matter Without Contemplation.

This episode is about Peak experiences, Christian Conferences, Burning Man, and Why None of Them Matter Without Contemplation.

Dr. Angela N. Parker

Dr. Angela N. Parker

In this conversation we talk about his new book, “If God Still Breathes, Why Can’t I?” the difference between being a chaplain for the empire and a prophet for the revolution, and how white supremacist authoritarianism take up residency in our minds and bodies.

Rev. Sarah Heath

Rev. Sarah Heath

In this conversation we talk about Sarah’s journey to becoming a progressive pastor in Orange County, the creativity that emerges when you stop fighting the old, and how transformation only happens in real relationships.

In this conversation we talk about creating a plan for our own flourishing, the real meaning of being born again, and the outcome of creating systems where leaders can’t be fully human.

In this conversation we talk about his new book, “The Thing Beneath the Thing,” his journey of being a part of some of the most influential churches in the U.S. and how we can uncover the pain hidden in the depths of our life.

Phileena Heuertz

Phileena Heuertz

In this conversation we talk about how centering prayer helped save her, how spiritual depth is usually a form of being undone, and how the future of our faith can become more experiential.

Why The Church Wants to be More Welcoming, But Doesn't Know How

Why The Church Wants to be More Welcoming, But Doesn't Know How

In this episode I talk about what we need to let go of to be welcoming, why we need to surrender our need to control other people’s process, and why worrying about who is in and who is out is a waste of time.

Doubt Does Not Deny Your Faith, It Deepens It.

Doubt Does Not Deny Your Faith, It Deepens It.

In this episode I talk about what I don’t believe in the Bible, how doubt deepens our faith, and how your picture of God may change, but the presence of Christ remains.

Toxic Positivity, Crack House Churches, and Will Smith

Toxic Positivity, Crack House Churches, and Will Smith

I talk about what toxic positivity is, what the church’s version of it looks like, and why Christ-shaped hope is so much better than positive thinking.

This is All About Joy?

This is All About Joy?

In this episode I talk about how Jesus focuses on joy, why we have a complicated relationship with joy, and the connection between heaviness and holiness.

In this conversation we talk about his newest book, “God Speaks Through Wombs,” the heart of the poet today, and why imagination is so vital for the future.

In this conversation we talk about his new video curriculum, “The Biblical Case for LGBTQ Inclusion,” the authority of the Bible, and his desire to change hearts and minds.

What is Advent? Preachers N' Sneakers, and a Spirituality of Subtraction

What is Advent? Preachers N' Sneakers, and a Spirituality of Subtraction

In this episode I respond to some questions about Advent, the Instagram account Preachers N' Sneakers, and what a spirituality of subtraction means.

Leaving Nets Behind, a Zen Story, and a Word.

Leaving Nets Behind, a Zen Story, and a Word.

Tune in to the first episode of "The Church Needs Therapy" in 2022!

In this conversation we talk about his new book, “Say Yes,” a faith that makes sense for us today, and what it means to be a curator of awesomeness.

In this conversation we talk about his new book, “Shoutin’ In The Fire,” the movement toward wholeness and freedom, and responding the question of how to be Black, Christian, and American at the same time.

Why IMAGINE is In Her Final Chapter: The Story of How We Got Here With Special Guest: Christine Sweeney

Why IMAGINE is In Her Final Chapter: The Story of How We Got Here With Special Guest: Christine Sweeney

In this conversation we talk about why IMAGINE is in her last chapter, how we got to this place together, and why acceptance holds all things together.

In this conversation we talk about her new book, “Red Lip Theology,” how the personal is the theological, and the beauty of black faith.

Brandan Robertson (Part 2)

Brandan Robertson (Part 2)

We talk about what it means to empty ourselves like Jesus, how privilege can become a tool for liberation, and how the places we want to avoid have the power to awaken us.

Hell (not really), The Possibility of Peace, and Particularity

Hell (not really), The Possibility of Peace, and Particularity

In this episode, I talk about hell (kind of, but not really), the vision of personal peace Jesus articulates, and one thing we need to let go of in order to experience this peace more.

Good Friday: A Guided Contemplative Experience

Good Friday: A Guided Contemplative Experience

By remembering the passion and suffering of Christ, we have a chance to face our own suffering, and to discover this Christ with us.

Losing Our Heroes and Gaining Our Voice

Losing Our Heroes and Gaining Our Voice

In this episode I talk about what we desire from our heroes, how they always fail us and become human, and why that’s necessary for owning our own voice.

In this conversation we talk about soul graffiti, our true self, and life beyond our trauma responses.

Jonathan Martin

Jonathan Martin

In this conversation we talk about his newest book, “The Road Away From God,” living the cross and resurrection, and following the questions wherever they lead you.

Dr. Holly Oxhandler

Dr. Holly Oxhandler

In this episode we talk about Holly's book "The Soul Of The Helper," the need for helpers to know their layer of divinity, and holding space for hard feelings, complexity, and messiness.

Brian McLaren 2

Brian McLaren 2

In this conversation we talk about his newest book, "Do I Stay Christian?" what you gain after you experience relational loss, and giving Christianity permission to evolve.

In this conversation we talk about the book he co-authored with Ben Sternke, “Having The Mind of Christ: Eight Axioms To Cultivate a Robust Faith,” naming how whiteness works, and life beyond deconstruction.

It's (not) That Serious

It's (not) That Serious

Why we can take life seriously and not seriously at all, and why we need to let go of our need for change while we are working for change.

In this conversation we talk about his new book, “The God Who Riots,” Jesus and the temple, and what we are actually saved from.

Amanda Held Opelt

Amanda Held Opelt

In this conversation we talk about her new book, “A Hole in The World: Finding Hope in Rituals of grief and Healing” and how there is no life hack for grief.

Dr. Alma Zaragoza-Petty

Dr. Alma Zaragoza-Petty

In this conversation we talk about her new book, "Chingona: Owning Your Inner Badass for Healing and Justice.”

In this conversation we talk about her new book, “Bringing Up Kids When Church Lets You Down: A Guide for Parents Questioning Their Faith.” This is such a timely book and conversation for so many right now.

Old Church New Church, Red Church Blue Church

Old Church New Church, Red Church Blue Church

In this episode I talk about the space between old churches and new churches, and helps us think through what to do about church now.

Alexander John Shaia

Alexander John Shaia

Alexander John is one of those rare elders and sages that can make you feel and know that everything is going to be okay. His vision of Jesus is one of the most profound you will hear, his heart for the world will leave you hopeful, and he can help us the beauty in the path of Jesus, and in everything.

Dr. Mallory Wyckoff

Dr. Mallory Wyckoff

In this In this conversation we talk about her newest book “God Is,” fresh images and feminine metaphors for God, and what it means that God is in the waves.

The Joy of Letting Go Interview

The Joy of Letting Go Interview

One of my best friends, author, and creator of the Youtube channel “3-ology” Kevin Livermore interviewed me for his channel, and he was gracious enough to let me use the audio for the podcast. https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Famzn.to%2F3GdetnJ%3Ffbclid%3DIwAR1iBLCYV1IPp0t-0DWqFqClU7rsWN1YN83KLpXMmYQ-yCiZJs49lZV__BI&h=AT0fW_OiGtC5TpQAp-eFG68BsDQ4M9skx_60mBAkNlXMtmD3L2G8ycoi6H40F2VoGx7w1544r0Cpycl_pgOL32isbflB4Fl2RqnXmgcw1zK9VIEnBslmtqlO7jXtHNHk-yWYg3hL https://www.youtube.com/@3ology/featured

Aurelia Dávila Pratt

Aurelia Dávila Pratt

In this conversation we talk about her newest book “A “Brown Girl’s Epiphany," divine intuition, and the need to step out of old things and into new things.

Why the Bible is Like Your Old Journals: Also Evolution, Consciousness, Eunuchs, Jesus, and Paul

Why the Bible is Like Your Old Journals: Also Evolution, Consciousness, Eunuchs, Jesus, and Paul

In this conversation I talk about why the Bible is just like your old journals, how God “changes” his view of Eunuchs in the Bible, and also evolution, consciousness, Jesus, and Paul.

Heather Hamilton

Heather Hamilton

In this conversation we talk about her newest book “Returning to Eden: A Field Guide For The Spiritual Journey,” the purpose of mythological stories, and integrating our whole journey.

Rev. Dr. Otis Moss III

Rev. Dr. Otis Moss III

We talk about his newest book “Dancing In The Darkness: Spiritual Lessons for Thriving in Turbulent Times” the richness of Black Spirituality, and what has been revealed in the United States the past few years.

In this conversation we talk about Caroline's book “Practicing The Pause: Jesus’ Contemplative Practice, New Brain Science, And What It Means To Be Fully Human” the real meaning of repentance, and what happened to Thomas Merton on 4th and Walnut.

Spiritual Experience and Inner Authority vs. People's Expectations and External Authority

Spiritual Experience and Inner Authority vs. People's Expectations and External Authority

In this episode I talk about the big shift from living up to people’s expectations and external authority, to deep spiritual experience and owning our inner authority.

We Ask for Wisdom, But Never Ask for Permission

We Ask for Wisdom, But Never Ask for Permission

In this episode I talk about letting go of the need for reassurance or permission on our journey to inner authority.

Jason Adam Miller

Jason Adam Miller

In this conversation we talk about his book “When the World Breaks: The Surprising Hope and the Subversive Promises in the Teachings of Jesus,” and what it means for a pastor to keep growing into the future while still honoring your past.

Justin McRoberts

Justin McRoberts

In this conversation we talk about his book, “Sacred Strides: The Journey to Belovedness in Work and Rest” and you will discover why you want to go out and get this book!

In this conversation we talk about centering prayer, his online contemplative community “Closer Than Breath,” and his up and coming “Christian Mystic Summit.”

What Am I Doing Now?

What Am I Doing Now?

This podcast is me answering the question, "what am I doing now?"

Cosmic Christ part 1: Really? Jesus?

Cosmic Christ part 1: Really? Jesus?

In this episode I begin talking about The Cosmic Christ, why when people say Jesus sometimes, it feels weird and out of place.

Cosmic Christ part 2: Jesus is What God Looks Like in Public

Cosmic Christ part 2: Jesus is What God Looks Like in Public

In this episode I continue talking about The Cosmic Christ, and how Jesus is what God looks like in public.

Amanda Held Opelt 2

Amanda Held Opelt 2

This week is a great conversation with Amanda Held Opelt. In this conversation we talk about her newest book, “Holy Unhappiness: God, Goodness, And The Myth Of The Blessed Life”

In this episode my friend Phil Wood interviews me and asks about the journey to episode 100 and what is ahead.

Uncertainty Is My Specialty (part 1)

Uncertainty Is My Specialty (part 1)

This is a walk through the experience of certainty, facing the unknown, and some things to think about while we are going through these spaces.

Uncertainty Is My Specialty (part 2)

Uncertainty Is My Specialty (part 2)

This is a walk through the experience of certainty, facing the unknown, and some things to think about while we are going through these spaces.

The Reverend Mamas

The Reverend Mamas

In this conversation we talk about the the creative drive to write a children’s book, the difference between the power of God's presence and the presence of God's power, and their newest book, “My Love, God Is Everywhere.”

Dr. Carmen Acevedo Butcher

Dr. Carmen Acevedo Butcher

In this conversation we talk about mystics, translating ancient writings for the modern era, and her newest book, “Practice Of The Presence: A Revolutionary Translation.”

Dr. Chanequa Walker-Barnes

Dr. Chanequa Walker-Barnes

In this conversation we talk about what gets in the way of exercising care for our sacred selves, discerning our bodies spirit-given wisdom, and Dr. Walker-Barnes' newest book, “Sacred Care: Daily Practices For Nurturing Our Whole Selves.”

In this conversation we talk about who the mystics are, why there is resistance to the word mystic, and his newest book, “The New Big Book of Christian Mysticism.”

Advent Sermon for People Without a Church (and also everyone else too)

Advent Sermon for People Without a Church (and also everyone else too)

This is an Advent sermon for people without church right now (and also for everyone else too). In this sermon, I suggest that Advent might be a time of God asking you, “What do you still really want?”

Dr. Andrew L. Whitehead

Dr. Andrew L. Whitehead

In this conversation we talk about disentangling Christianity from Christian Nationalism, power and fear, and his newest book, “American Idolatry: How Christian Nationalism Betrays The Gospel And Threatens The Church.”

In this conversation we talk about his history within the church his and movement away from organized religion, a spirituality rooted in the wilderness, and his newest book, “The God of Wild Places: Rediscovering The Divine In The Untamed Outdoors.”

José Humphreys

In this conversation we talk about why Harlem is so special, neighborhoods as ecosystems, and how the ancient concept of Jubilee affects how we think about justice and liberation today.

Dr. Ralph Basui Watkins Returns

Dr. Ralph Basui Watkins Returns

In this conversation we talk about risking creatively, the cost of living truthfully, and feeling the love of God through the embrace of his LGBTQ+ siblings in the church.

Dr. Terence B. Lester

Dr. Terence B. Lester

In this conversation we talk about staying grounded and real, how to keep doing the work without losing our joy, and why unearthing history essential for the health and wholeness of our society and country

Molly LaCroix, LMFT

Molly LaCroix, LMFT

This week is a great conversation with Molly LaCroix, LMFT. In this conversation we talk psychology and spirituality, the various selves within, and how IFS helps us see new things within biblical stories.

Episode 114 of The Church Needs Therapy is up! This week is a great conversation with Keith Giles. In this conversation we talk about the wisdom and quantum dimensions of the non-canonical book, The Gospel of Thomas.

In this conversation we talk about the difference between contemplation and coping, being similar to a plant, and her new book, “Queering Contemplation: Finding Queerness in the Roots and Future of Contemplative Spirituality”

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