More Background on That Fourth-Grader’s Creationist Science Quiz

***Update***: I think I’ve located the school in question but I am awaiting confirmation that this is their quiz.

***Update***: It’s Blue Ridge Christian Academy.

On Reddit and the atheist blogosphere, this image was circulating last week:

It’s supposedly a fourth grade science test from a private school a South Carolina. But we don’t exactly know which school because the submitter wouldn’t say. He said he got the quiz from his friend whose daughter attends the school and they’d like to keep that information under wraps (for the sake of the daughter) until the year ends.

Well, the people at Snopes tried to get to the bottom of this. They heard from the “friend” with the daughter. He wouldn’t tell them the name of the school, so we can’t technically verify that this is real (Snopes says this story is “Undetermined”), but we do get a little more information, including the full second page of the test:

Here’s the father:

I have since taught my daughter differently, but I am sure she is confused now and plan to make sure she understands that teachers are people too and can be factually wrong.

It’s a great school for Reading, Writing and Math. She is ahead of most of her peers and also is taking Latin there. But I now know to be vigilant for the rest of the year about her science teachings.

She will not be attending the school next year

Perhaps the scarier moment is when he realized she was being brainwashed by Ken-Ham-like material:

I didn’t know that this was being taught to her until we heard a radio commercial together about the Discover the Dinosaurs exhibit was coming to the TD Convention Center [in Greenville, South Carolina].

The Commercial starts out, “After 65 million years, the dinosaurs have returned …” She commented immediately that it was only four thousand years ago. When I corrected her, she snapped back, “Were you there?”

*face palm*

At least she won’t be going to that school after this year… but, even if it’s legal, no school should be brainwashing kids like this in the name of science, and the father and the Reddit submitter have a duty to name the school when the time comes so we can expose them. (I’ll stay on top of that.)

About Hemant Mehta

Hemant Mehta is the editor of Friendly Atheist, appears on the Atheist Voice channel on YouTube, and co-hosts the uniquely-named Friendly Atheist Podcast. You can read much more about him here.

  • Edmond

    Question 6: Which one fits the Behemoth described in Job 40? Obviously, the dinosaur is the intended answer.
    Question 15: The average size of a dinosaur was a… D) Sheep.
    My question… why would something the size of a sheep merit the title “Behemoth”?

  • Roger Bauman

    The next time someone says Jesus rose from the dead thousands of years ago, what can you say?

  • Gus Snarp

    Well, number 7 is correct. Sharp teeth alone don’t signify a meat eater, after all, gorillas have enormous, sharp canines that they do not use to eat meat. Of course, an adequate analysis of all the teeth, and perhaps also the jaw structures, can reveal that an animal is a carnivore.

  • Gus Snarp

    With that “were you there” question, it seems clear the curriculum comes directly from Ken Ham. The mindset that teaches this sort of thing is deeply disturbing.

  • Gus Snarp

    Were you there?

  • Sue Blue

    I could actually feel my neurons shriveling up as I read that retarded dreck. This has to be a Poe..or an Onion article….doesn’t it? Please don’t tell me that 4th-grade kids in this country in the 21st century are actually this brainwashed and ignorant, and that any state would really, really allow this to pass as “education”….

    Oh, shit. I’m moving to Iceland. Or Norway. Or Sweden. Anywhere where schools actually still teach real subjects.

  • Michael

    Not to mention that not all naturally carnivorous animals are meat eaters either. Pandas, for instance, adapted to eat plant life due to environmental concerns but they are naturally carnivores.

  • Gus Snarp

    Hmm. That’s interesting. Makes sense. Now I want to go read up on Panda evolution.

  • Conspirator

    I don’t see any reason not to believe this is true. Ken Ham exists, the Creation museum exists, polls show a scary number of people believe in YEC. It doesn’t surprise me at all that there are some schools out there teaching this crap. True I wasn’t there to witness it, but like evolution, there’s plenty of evidence to support this.

  • BobaFuct

    I don’t know…why is the test labeled “Genesis and the gospel” when there are no NT/Jesus/gospel-related questions or text in the quiz? Unless the idiot teacher equates “gospel” to “the bible in general”, but even then it doesn’t really make sense.

  • Canadian Atheist, eh!

    Hello from Canada!

  • Canadian Atheist, eh!

    It’s the “she snapped back” part that worries me most. Are they also teaching the kids to be disrespectful, to their own parents no less, on top of ignorant?

  • LiberatingLaura

    I am confused about why this is so shocking. This type of teaching goes on in private schools and home schools all over the U.S. Are you going to try to publish a list of names of all private schools teaching young earth (literal 7 day) creation and revisionist history, as well as math that doesn’t include “crazy” things like set theory (A Beka). This is not an isolated test at an isolated school.

  • Rich Wilson

    What I want to know is: Are T-Rex and Triceratops the same ‘kind’? And if not, then why is there only one word for both of them?

  • Gus Snarp

    Which leads (for the scientifically minded person, at least) one to ask how kinds are defined in general, where the evidence is for which animals belong in a kind together in either biology or even in the Bible, and how did those kinds give rise to the huge variety of life on earth in only a few thousand years, since that would seem to require far more rapid morphological and genetic change than evolution?

  • Paul Grimm

    This is why I’m glad the leader of my church has a masters in biology

  • Gregory Marshall

    Yeah, and isn’t that a stoning offense in the old testament?

  • Gregory Marshall

    Yeah, and isn’t that a stoning offense in the old testament?

  • Paul Grimm

    Seems like a fake by the way. Where are questions 8, 9, 10, and 11

  • Sven2547

    11 is on page two.
    It looks like the first image didn’t get the whole first page.

  • Rich Wilson

    Yes, well, Bobby Jindal has a degree in Biology from Brown. With honors. And was accepted to Harvard medical school (but didn’t attend).

  • Rich Wilson

    Every time I ask about ‘kinds’ I get an eyeroll and a bunch of different canine species spouted off as examples of a ‘kind’. They never get beyond that. I’m amazed that we could get Great Danes and Chihuahuas via natural selection along within a mere few thousand years.

    But you know, “I wasn’t there”.

  • Paul Grimm

    I’m referencing the Pope.

  • Paul Grimm

    Yeah looks like it was cut off

  • Paul Grimm

    Still think that page 2 doesnt match page 1. The person that answered page two makes his or her lower case a’s differently than page 1. Page 1 is a lot grayer than page 2. The clarity of the pictures are drastically different as well

  • Feminerd

    It’s surprisingly difficult to get a work visa from Canada. I’ve looked into it. Also, your weather is full of cold! Of course, that’s true of most of the sane places in the world :(

  • Rich Wilson

    And it gets harder as one gets older.

  • Spuddie

    Correction. Great Danes and Chihuahuas are not due to natural selection, but unnatural selection.

    Bred for a certain body type to fit human needs.

    Great Danes were bred for hunting.

    Chihuahuas bred as a cruel joke to the canine species. So cat owners can say, “my pet’s poops are bigger than that dog’s head!”

  • Spuddie

    Yeah but Bobby Jindal will say anything to be taken seriously by voters.

  • Sven2547

    The ‘a’s look similar enough to me.
    As for the photos, some people just aren’t very good at photography. Focusing on a close-up piece of paper isn’t as simple as snapping a portrait or a scenic view.

    I’m all-for the proper application of skepticism, but these days it feels like too many people have this knee-jerk reaction of “hoax” for no good reason. Creationist material of this nature is so abundant in real-life that there’s no reason for someone to make one up.

  • Michael David Barber Moghul

    School should lose it’s accreditation and its license to malpractice.

  • baal

    You can breed dogs for certain personalities too.

  • Gus Snarp

    I’m also a little disappointed that any 4th grade teacher would give an A+ on an exercise where a student had failed to use appropriate capitalization at the beginning of sentences and to conclude them with punctuation marks. My first grader is expected to do that.

  • Michael David Barber Moghul

    This is why the US is 29th in Education in the western world.

  • James

    I was recently contacted by a (Christian) international school, asking if I would be willing to teach high school science and present Young Earth Creationism as a viable alternative to evolution. It’s pretty standard for science teachers in Christian schools, and unfortunately we’re exporting it, too.

    Not a Poe.

  • Cary Whitman

    “This is not an isolated test at an isolated school”

    That is exactly why this is so shocking. Far to many seemingly rational theist (perhaps yourself included?) don’t seem to see anything wrong with teaching religious dogma masquerading as science, and far to many non-theists and moderate-thiests have no clue how much this is going on.

    Just look at the father described in the article. He sends his kid to what is probably a well-respected private school, she comes back reading and doing math very well, so he assumes everything is fine, until one day she starts spewing nonsense and now he has to make her un-learn the lies she’s been taught.

    I think you’re on to something with the idea of publishing a list of private schools and homeschool curriculum that teaches stuff like this. A big part of the problem is that it’s not commonly known how much this is going on. There would be a lot more backlash against these schools if more people knew what they were teaching, plus it would keep parents, like the father in this story, from being fooled into sending his kid there by their high reading and math scores.

    And one last point, you seem to be arguing that this curriculum is OK because it’s being taught all over, in lots of different private and home schools. How does that make teaching lies OK? If most of the kids at your school are taking Ritalin to help them study, does that mean it’s OK for all students to do it? Or does that mean that Ritalin abuse is a serious problem in our schools that needs to be addressed and stopped? “Everyone is doing it, so it must be OK” is a pretty weak argument for doing anything.

    And does anyone really have anything against set theory??? I haven’t heard that one before!

  • slaq

    “No, but I know someone who was there… and his name is GOD.”

    Have you ever seen God?


  • Rich Wilson

    Ya, I botched my point. I really wanted to compare Lions and house cats. Or maybe ladybugs vs. Goliath beetles. The problem is getting them to commit to a ‘kind’ so you can explain how impossible it is if you’re also going to constrain yourself to 4K years post ark.

  • Timothy R Alexander

    Yes, I was there, the doctor took me.

  • Anna

    I’m baffled as to how the father could be shocked. Did the parents not investigate the school before they sent their daughter there? I would automatically assume that any school billing itself as a “Christian school” (as opposed to one affiliated with a particular denomination) would be teaching creationism. There’s no way such a school would not make its religious focus clear to prospective parents, and I would also assume that any school promoting YEC is also teaching other subjects from a biased perspective. This has evangelical and fundamentalist written all over it.

  • nude0007

    so he saved his daughter and refuses to allow the name of the school thus dooming the rest of the class. what a sweet guy.

  • Anna

    I’ve personally seen material from a Christian school (near liberal San Francisco) that had Jesus all over the spelling book! As you said, there’s tons of it out there. No need to make anything up.

  • Cary Whitman

    Yup, I was recently reading somewhere about how Sweden pretty much doesn’t allow homeschooling at all, apparently they believe all kids deserve a good education. Do you think it’s a coincident that they have one of the highest standards of living in the world?

  • Anna

    That was my first thought. It’s not just dozens of schools, not just hundreds, but thousands! And they’re all over the country, including liberal places like San Francisco and New York. I could name several right where I live.

  • Stev84

    The different colors are probably just lighting and not the paper. You can get that with different ambient lighting or just by using a flash.

  • Anna

    Question 6 reminds me of the infamous song:

  • Pluto Animus

    I have no sympathy for a parent who sends their kid to religious school and gets surprised when they find out the child is being brainwashed with lies.

  • eonL5

    Our brains seem to resemble Detritus’ brain: doesn’t work so well in hot weather. But give that copper a 10deg(F) day, and watch him derive some … uh… whatever mathematical thing it is that math-y types derive (Hemant: help! It’s over 60 here, today… that’s my excuse and I’m sticking to it.)

    (See: Discworld:

  • eonL5


  • Rain

    Sounds kinda fishy if you ask me.

  • Tony

    Why not do it?

  • SeekerLancer

    Yeah, I’m not going to make assumptions on this one without proof.

  • SeekerLancer

    Panda’s are pretty interesting. Their existence has been pretty confounding. It’s only in the past decade or so we’ve confirmed they are indeed bears.

  • indorri

    It’s over 60 here

    AHAHAHAHAHAHA :: gasp ::

    Sorry, must be all that tropical Caribbean air I used to breathe before I went up north.

  • SeekerLancer

    Oh Behemoth. It’s been too long.

  • LiberatingLaura

    No, I am absolutely against this kind of “teaching” (indoctrination). But I am surprised that a parent would not know that creationism is a part of the curriculum taught at his child’s school.
    I am not arguing that it is o.k. I am arguing that it is not shocking. And yes, one of the biggest Christian curriculum publishers on their website describe their math curriculum as not including set theory because it is not “from God” but one of man’s creations.

  • Charles Honeycutt

    “Was the sun shining seven minutes ago?”
    “How do you know? Light takes eight minutes to reach Earth. WERE YOU THERE?

  • LiberatingLaura

    Ok, so the list has already been started,

    They list schools by state, with links to the school’s website page that explains their philosophy.

    I guess if parents want to pay for private education that distorts thinking and reasoning skills, that is fine(not really), but the fact that there are 300 schools in the U.S. teaching creation and being paid for by tax dollars? That is not right.

  • D

    Answers in Genesis and Apologia make material just like this. The above quiz may be not the exact AIG or Apologia quiz, but I have seen this very information in both at conventions. And both are used by many homeschoolers and private schools. PLEASE don’t lump all homeschoolers together because there are some crazies who actually believe this nonsense. Because most of us think this is completely nuts and it gives us a bad name!

  • Michael Harrison

    Well, with the “Were you there?” question, we could have a lot of fun.

    Theist: “Were you there?”
    Skeptic: *expression turns serious, with relief* Oh, thank goodness! Listen, I need to tell you something important: The Soviets won the Cold War. Don’t let anyone know you know — and don’t believe the propaganda!

  • Dave Williams

    What, no bonus question, such as, “In which year did Jeebus hand the Constitution to George Washington?” [with the 2nd Amendment highlighted of course]

  • QuestionEverything

    I know some people that do it because the other schools in their district are dangerous or not really teaching anything. These private schools excel in many subjects but they horribly fail at others. I’d rather homeschool and get private tutors than send my kid off to these lunatics.

  • Anna

    I don’t see why not.

    Here’s a sampling of such schools near me: San Francisco Christian School, Valley Christian School, Redwood Christian School, Fremont Christian School, Milpitas Christian School, Grace Christian School, Berean Christian High School, Walnut Creek Christian School, Voice of Pentecost Academy, North Bay Christian Academy, Calvary Christian Academy

    I found most of these by browsing their websites. Many of them list textbooks and curriculum, and others stress that they promote a “biblical worldview” and their belief that the Bible is infallible or inerrant. Interestingly, I did find a few evangelical schools that appear to be fundamentalist in all other respects, but that do use secular science textbooks or Christian textbooks that don’t promote YEC.

    However, I did notice that one of the schools mentioned as condemning evolution in a 1996 article (below) shows no indication of such on their website. If you look there, everything seems extremely secular. So I wonder if students at that school are taught evolution in the official textbook, but creationism is promoted with supplemental materials.

    Various schools mentioned here:

  • Anna

    That’s a good list, although of course it only covers states that have voucher programs. Many states, including mine, aren’t included. Still, it gives a sense of the wide scope of the problem.

  • Feminerd

    Seriously! Over 60? It’s almost summer here (not counting the cold front that blew through yesterday). Soon we won’t see the underside of 90 F for months!

    Yes, I do live in Texas. Yes, Ted Cruz and Rick Perry do seem to support your contention that people’s brains quite working in hot climes. Still, I maintain that cold is evil! And cold! And full of shivers! And comes with liquid death falling from the sky (rain, sleet, snow)!

    As for deriving things- you derive derivatives (shocking, I know!), which are the slope of the curve or the rate of change (the derivative of velocity is acceleration, for example). Integrals give you the area under the curve. I think. High school calculus was awhile ago …

  • JoyG

    Oh, this is real… I checked one of the questions”What is the history book of the universe” and got answersingenesis right away (see this PDF If you look through the site, you’ll find some of the other questions too… I’ll bet this “quiz” was either put together by the teacher from material on that site or he/she had purchased something from them. They send out a lot of crap educational material. I started dry heaving about halfway through so I had to stop.

  • LesterBallard

    That phrase, especially from that smug motherfucker Ham, moves me to violence. Even more so when some kid parrots it.

  • LesterBallard

    Not towards the kid.

  • Vivienne Colquhoun

    Wow. I was super religious when I went to school (Mormon), but somewhere along the line I was taught that scripture was the Church’s explanation of things and science was mans and there was no need to reconcile them. But, at least when I was a kid, in the ’70′s, it was taken for granted that church and state were separate…I guess this is what happens when you put prayer back in school. I haven’t considered myself Mormon for ages, so I have no idea how they relate to these things currently.

  • allein

    Hey, my Chihuahua was the best dog ever.

  • Christopher Wing

    It can’t be that great of a school for writing – There’s no “The” before “Bible,” and there are incomplete sentences.

  • Ellie

    I think I just geyser-ed coffee through my nose. Oh, oh… You get a Carlin Badge, wear it proudly ;)

  • jqcitizen

    I wonder if the answer to #12 could also be “the Torah” since this is all old testament stuff? Those bible thumpers might have a different view if they realized they were teaching Judaism.

  • Alpha and Omega 3 fatty acids

    I am God. If you think I am not then you have no faith. Plus prove I am not…

  • The HE who is I am!

    You’re right…it is a stupid argument because the response would be, were you there? both answers are no, so neither of them can be validated…I feel sorry for people who believe so hardedly in something with little lack of (i mean no) evidence. It’s really sad….Plus I am God…Prove I am not…to question whether I am God or not is sacrilegious…

  • Your Creator!

    Hey everyone…God here…I just wanted to clarify that humans and dinosaurs never walked the Earth together, unless you count birds and humans because as you know, I evolved Dinosaurs into birds. I apologize for any misunderstanding this may have caused all you believers, and please don’t take everything I say so litterally! I have a great sense of humor! I mean I created Justin Bieber and Kim Karbigbuttion! Hilarious! This is your lord and Savior saying peace out and go Boston Red Sox! P.S. John Lennon says hi…

  • Hailey

    Oh my!!! I thought it was a joke at first. Those poor children, victims of their parents’ senseless religion. And our nation will pay the price.

  • Liz Calato

    The father says it’s a great school for reading and writing, etc, but she spelled “buried” like “buryed”…..she can’t be that far ahead of her peers.

  • Raising_Rlyeh

    As Lewis Black said, “Those 80 dagger-shaped teeth and huge claws were perfect for chasing down and killing any plants THAT TRIED TO RUN AWAY!”

    Sorry, but very sharp teeth are best for carnivores.If you notice we have a combo of sharp and dull teeth and we are omnivores. It is harder to grind up plant matter to digest it if you do not have teeth that can grind.

  • drnorth

    Kid scores 100%. That’s not even *Biblically* accurate on Question 3. First, because the Bible doesn’t mention dinosaurs and second, because even if you accept that the description of “beasts” might refer to what we now call “dinosaurs”, God started making them on the 5th day. He began in the waters, and then made a bunch more on land the next day.

  • The Other Weirdo

    Have you ever seen a sheep? They’re damn scary freaks. With their glowy eyes foreboding of death from above and the bleating used to call forth of the Devil, you would have to be some sort of a numbskull… or an atheist… not to see plain as day that the dinosaurs were all definitely the size of sheep.

  • Mark

    Could it be from the A-Beka or Bob Jones Press?

  • brad

    that bugged me too…made me think of some kind of dystopian, ultra religious future where children are encouraged to report their parents for reading “one of those old science books”…y’know…assuming they haven’t all been burned

  • Goatless

    Having seen a complete Tyrannosaurus Rex skeleton all I can say is.

    They must have some fucking big sheep wherever this came from.

  • bsoist

    I’m sure many of you know this, but there are many, many schools teaching this stuff. I’m not even sure why the families involved are wary of “naming names” – the school is almost certainly proud of its curriculum.

  • Sue Blue

    And Canada, too. My husband claims he can move to Canada with ease because his Dad is Canadian. But I don’t have any Canadian connections, only Scandinavian. Still…I’m a nurse and my husband’s a Boeing engineer so we wouldn’t exactly be seen as undesirable immigrants. Plus, Canada’s closer and you guys speak English.

  • Sue Blue

    Plus, Sweden and Norway are really beautiful, and most people speak English well (because they’re educated – not like many Americans who think that English should be the only language in the world and never bother to learn any other). Iceland is a really fascinating place, too. All have high standards of living by every metric – and a high proportion of non-theists.

  • Sue Blue

    My husband and I have seriously considered it, too. He’s less upset about the religious idiots; it’s the economy and the political scene that upset him the most. I’m always trying to convince him that a reasonable case can be made that the f_ck-buddy relationship between Republicans and evangelical christianity lies at the root of even the financial crisis. Whatever, we both say “I’ve had it with this bullshit!” at least once a week.

  • Mairianna

    Isn’t there a Bible quote that says something about ‘No one can know the mind of God”? So, how can anyone really KNOW him?

  • Spuddie

    I know. I apologize.

    The “natural selection” was like a loose thread on a sweater that one feels pathologically compelled to pull. Even through it will ruin it.

  • Spuddie

    Why would any intentionally want to breed a dog with a Chihuahua’s personality? =)

    Just kidding.

  • Anna

    It might still be a great school for reading and writing. It’s not unusual for fourth graders to misspell words, even in the best schools. I’m an excellent speller now, but I can spot errors when I look back at things I wrote in elementary school.

  • TheKaz1969

    you missed the question asking the average size of humans back then.. (the correct answer, of course, is an ant)

  • JA

    Along those lines, if we cannot know the mind of God, then how can we be sure that the bible is really written in his word?

  • bill stanley

    And this is education? What are they preparing these little darlings for, a life of poverty and ignorance?

  • Rich Wilson

    Fellow loose thread chaser here, I understand completely. No need to apologize for pointing out my own loose thread.

  • Gavin

    Funny how many commenters happen to be God. In an all-night coffee-shop discussion with a friendly born-again, he asked me how many gods I thought there were. I said, “let’s see…about six-and-a-half billion.” (This was a few years ago.) The only other patron broke up laughing (“that’s EXACLTY right!”), and has treated me like a prophet ever since.

    A little less funny is how many find this hard to believe. I was taught creationism in PUBLIC high school, in “liberal” Northern California.

  • CatDeville Llewellyn

    I’m sorry… when I first saw this it was reported that it came from a *public* school, and I was concerned. Now that I know that it is a private school, I am not only not concerned, but I think that the father is an absolute *idiot.* I mean, how clueless are we, really?

    Seriously! If it was coming out of a public school, that would be a completely different thing, but it’s says in the article that this is a *private* school… where they’re teaching a *4th grader Latin.*

    Do the math. It’s obvious from the test itself that this is a Christian school. If I had money in my pocket I’d give you 100-1 odds that it’s a *CATHOLIC* school. Did you *really* send your daughter to a Catholic school and *not* expect her to be indoctrinated in their catechism. That’s what Catholic schools are *for.* What were you thinking?

    And, yes… a Christian/Catholic school *absolutely* has the right to teach the children attending their school their religious catechism… that’s actually the *APPROPRIATE* place for them to be teaching their children their religious catechism… in *their* religious schools. We expect, and indeed *demand* that they keep their catechisms out of our public schools (separation of Church and State), but this is *not* “our” school, it is *theirs*.

    So, unless you are advocating to eliminate Freedom of Religion (something which you Atheists would be foolish to do, because if you eliminate freedom of religion, you are setting yourself up for the *establishment* of a state religion, and I can guarantee you – it *isn’t* going to be Atheism. Where will you be then?), then you need to understand that Churches are going to teach their catechism in *their* schools. Don’t want your child indoctrinated… easy… don’t send them to Catholic school.

    And as for not knowing “which” school it is. That’s not really relevant, because it doesn’t matter “which” school it is, if it’s a Christian school, it’s going to teach Christian doctrine. And if you know *where* it is, and it is indeed a Catholic school (as I suspect), then you don’t need to know which Catholic school in your diocese it is. *Every* Catholic school in the diocese is using the same catechism (More likely every Catholic school in the nation is using the same catechism.) All you have to do to verify whether it’s a Catholic school or not is to call the diocese, and ask if the local Catholic schools are teaching “Bible based science” or “creation science.” I would not expect them to hide it, because it is their *protected* right to do so.

  • Matt D

    I tell them it’s pointless to claim truth about something one already desires to be true, instead of being honest enough to examine if it isn’t.

  • VJBinCT

    How do you know Ken Ham exists? Were you there?

  • Conspirator

    Ken Ham says he exists, and Ken Ham says he’d never lie, therefore he must exist or else he’s lying. QED

  • Gavin

    Why must it be Catholic? The Roman Catholic hierarchy has renounced
    young earth creationism (even if the last two popes disagreed on ID).

  • Canadian Atheist, eh!

    We do speak English, but a surprising number of folks from the largely French-speaking province of Quebec don’t much like it when we do. And we NEED nurses!

  • Tobias2772

    I teach high school in South Carolina, so I am a little embarassed about all of this. It is not that uncommon to hear students expound upon some version of this anti-evolutionary stuff, that they have learned in church, but this is a step beyond.

    The school is Clavary Baptist School. You can go to their website here:
    You will clearly see that they are quite proud of their little indoctrination center.

  • Matt Warren

    I took tests like this when I was in fundamentalist christian schools. Lest anyone think of piling on the south any further, this was in New England. Didn’t surprise me a bit. If I hadn’t thrown my old Biology textbook out, I’d scan pages of it and entertain the whole lot of you.

  • Tobias2772

    Lots of religious schools in lots of states are allowed to practice this so called education without any accreditation from the state. Students are not allowed to transfer into state schools without some testing. It’s not a great system, but it’s better than what you seem to be envisioning.

  • Tobias2772

    Sorry, it’s a Baptist School. Being from South Caroline, Baptist was my first thought. Calvary Baptist School.

  • Tobias2772

    Both – and Answers in Genesis – I went to their website

  • pmorton

    Love Dr. Who. So cool!!

  • Anna

    Yes, there’s absolutely no way a Catholic school would be promoting YEC. Even in South Carolina, I can’t imagine that. Catholic schools do teach a lot of nonsense in their Religion classes, but their secular classes are generally fine. My boyfriend went to Catholic school and they always had secular textbooks for math, science, history, etc.

  • Sasha Shepherd

    Yeah, I was there. Cool dude, Jesus.

  • Anna

    You bet. They’re certainly not hiding their curriculum:

    Our curriculum is comprised of several publishers we feel address their particular subject best. We use Bob Jones, ABeka, Saxon Math, Easy Grammar, and Answers in Genesis. Each curriculum has been carfully chosen to maximize the educational experience for each child.

    I’ll resist the urge to make fun of the typo and just say that it’s hard to understand how the father could have been unaware of what the school teaches.

  • Karl Pietrowski

    Pure, unadulterated child abuse, and people wonder why America is suffering in the science/mathematics department. When you grow children up believing in the bible, and denying science, this is what you get. I blame the F***ing Flintstones. LOL.

    Naw, seriously though. The fact that nearly 1/2 the U.S. population believes in creationism is truly frightening, disturbing, and sick. I’m a physics major, so perhaps if affects me more personally. I can’t stand seeing children being indoctrinated, and brainwashed into blind faith. Let your kids be free-thinkers.

    Bottom line, I’ve spent far too much time in labs and research to suggest that evolution isn’t real. It’s a slap in the face to all the hard work that science has ever made just to say “God” did it. That’s a cop out. If “God” did it all, then what’s the point of science? Whats the point in learning how things work, and function in biology? What to unravel the workings of “God” ?give me a break. Just like when science proved that the Earth isn’t flat, or the center of the universe. LOL. And anyone who believes in the “young Earth” model that suggests that the Earth is ~6,000-10,000 yrs of age … Help yourself to a real science education

  • Smooveface Pointsball

    I’m unsure that this is a real thing here. A fake thing perhaps?

  • Brent Lind

    While I haven’t read all of the comments, I feel the need to inform people about the Discover The Dinosaurs exhibit. I went when it was in town with my girlfriend and her 4 kids. I love dinosaurs and so do the kids. It was an awful bait and switch scam. Very few of the dinosaurs were to scale; perhaps they were “babies,” but it really was terrible. It’s all about funneling you into the gift shop and all of the extras that you have to pay a ton of money for on top of the admission price. The kids and I spent most of the time making fun of the scientific inaccuracies. If this sham of an exhibit comes to your town, save your money. Take your kids to an actual museum and not this. Yes, it really was that bad.

  • Zaoldyeck

    As a physics grad myself, I find old earth creationists annoying, but not being a biologist, the old earth creationism argument doesn’t really affect physics as a discipline. (Other than the idea of promoting basic anti-science belief)

    … Young earth creationism is different. Creationism like this denies literally every branch of science I can conceive of, including biology. It is worlds above in terms of delusion.

  • Karen Whiddon

    Why is that?

  • Maggie Anderson
  • Michael Rosensweig

    Actually God is not a name. It’s a noun, not a proper noun. Maybe people need to learn their bibles better. God is a title..Can allude to anything that is worshiped. Even money, which has more devotees then any god on this planet. Always been that way.

  • Alex

    I have a feeling it was a private catholic school

  • Gerardo Lagunes

    we really need to do something about this fundamentalist…. is a danger for humanity

  • sunshine

    So teaching truth is brainwashing?

  • dabble53

    That’s a translation, so once you start mistranslating, you end up with nouns (incorrectly) becoming proper names.

  • dabble53

    And the length of your tape measure is…? Who held the end at the sun? :)

  • Tommy

    Ha. Hahaha. Hahahhaha!!!

    That can’t be real. I mean, seriously?

  • dabble53

    Your thermostat stops working, or at least it gets stuck in one position.

  • dabble53

    I’m surprised it’s that high on the list! I would have guessed more like 90th. Never mind being factually wrong, but so many have no concept of what it means to “think” and “critical thinking” means it’s on life support.

  • Lucas Symosko

    No wonder kids are soooooo fucking stupid anymore, look at what their teaching kids these days……….. I’ve lost faith in humanity

  • Fizzelen

    Who wrote the bible?
    In want languages was the bible written?
    What nationality was Jesus?

    Hint, the incorrect answers are Jesus, English, American

  • dabble53

    It was a science test, not a grammar test. We all know engineers and scientists s**k at English
    Although I remember some of my cousins getting A’s on their English papers with spelling and grammar I would expect to see from someone dealing with ESL. (Chicago public school system for the cousins.)

  • dabble53

    Not to mention different parts of Genesis have the days mixed up.

    An interesting short read on creationism’s “day” can be seen here

  • dabble53

    Maybe they’re big on transportation and actually do carfully choose things. They certainly aren’t rationally choosing their curriculum.

  • dabble53

    They are being prepared for life as a GOP politician.

  • Rich Wilson

    Evidently we gave someone a butt-hurt :-)

  • dabble53

    The Mormons (and churches in general) were very big on separation because they didn’t wan’t government to regulate them in any way. Now they hate separation because they want to regulate the government (and all the citizens) so it (and they) follow the church’s ways……now that they feel they can do the controlling.

  • dabble53

    Why? Disrespectful kids were to be killed, according to the bible.
    Can’t be picking an choosing what parts you want to follow now, can you?

  • Benjamin Gathright

    Bob Jones University (from Greenville, SC) uses very similar education programs, and has a satellite based grade school curriculum.

  • Scott Jameson

    Chihuahua are unique branch from coyote family tree. Harsh conditions and paucity of shady spots in Mexico made their smaller ‘foot-print’ valuable for survival.

    Chihuahuas ran in large packs for enhanced kill capacity with occasional large prey. However, the pack’s great asset was its ability to cover all the exits during raids on prairie dog communities.

    Only later, after the Spanish-American War, were Chihuahuas domesticated as lap-dogs; albeit vicious.

  • wickedangrybroguy

    Catholics believe in evolution. I went to Catholic school and no one believes dinosaurs existed at the same time humans did. In fact I learned way more than I would’ve had I gone to my local public high school which I don’t think even offered AP Calculus.

  • johnson

    Large penis.

  • Junk See

    Why are secular scientists so afraid of another theory? None of us were alive when the dinosaurs were. Carbon dating has long ago been proved to be inaccurate. Why don’t secular scientists ever share that they find human bones at digs? Because that would tarnish their theory and give more credence to creation science. The dead sea scrolls and the torah have been around a lot longer than any scientist secular, creation, or otherwise. Why can’t both “theories” be taught side by side? What are secularists afraid of? People are smart, let them decide for themselves instead of forcing it down their throats. Creationists have no fear of teaching about both “theories”. Could it be it is because they have better proof?

  • Carl Wilson

    Oh the humanity! Finally, the teachings of the Bible have been revealed!!!
    Wait until Hemant finds out about the millions of people across the globe that take the Bible literally as show of faith that the Bible is the inspired Word of a perfect God. He’ll have to reveal the names of these millions of people so he can expose them for what they really are… Christians!
    And what’s up with a father who sends his daughter to, quite clearly, a private Christian school, and now he too discovers what they teach? He and Hemant need to go into the wilderness, build a grass hut and eat some sustainable rice cakes while they hash out what other people believe then find some of that ‘respect for what other people believe’ that they like to crow about.

  • DaveHimslef

    There is no unnatural selection. Great Danes and Chihuahuas are breeds that were manipulated by another organism called Humans. The process is natural and the result is natural.

  • Tamare Olch

    This is so wrong on many levels, giving false information to an impressionable young person. I’m a mother and I’ve chosen to wait until my kids are old enough to understand what religion is before they make up their mind as to what they want to believe in, not indoctrinate them. I myself am more atheist then anything but whatever they choose that is their own prerogative.

  • Anna

    No, not Catholic. The Catholic church accepts evolution and I can’t imagine religious content even coming up in science class, let alone YEC.

    It’s important not to lump all religious schools together. The only schools teaching creationism are conservative evangelical and fundamentalist schools. Catholic schools do not teach it, nor do schools affiliated with moderate and liberal Protestant denominations. For example, I doubt there would be any Episcopal schools teaching creationism.

    Interestingly, I just went to have a look at the websites for the three Lutheran schools in my immediate area. Now, I would have assumed that the Lutherans would accept evolution, but one of them is affiliated with the Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod, and the other two with the Missouri Synod. According to what I was able to find, both of those denominations are officially creationist.

    However, one of those school

  • Anna

    Oh, and just for fun, at least one of these schools apparently beats children:

    A couple of others seemed cagey on their websites. I suspect they are also hitting children, but it was not explicitly stated in the school handbook.

    Parents should be very, very careful. Even in states that have banned corporal punishment in public schools, private schools are still allowed to hit children. Only two states (New Jersey and Iowa) have outlawed it in private schools.

  • Tobias2772

    This christian school may have every Constitutional right to damage their students like this, but we should all recognize this as a severe threat to our society and it’s progress. These people will become adults and professionals in their communities and the vast majority of them will never let go of this bullshit dogma. It will inform many of their decisions as citizens.

    As a publc school teacher, I see so many young kids limit their rational thinking power with so much of this mythological indoctrination. Even students who do not cling to this kind of fundamentalism, still create artificial boundaries about what they are willing to critically challenge and rationally examine. It is one of the most heartbreaking experiences to see an otherwise intelligent and inquisitive young adult deliberately avoid following their line of analysis because it has run abruptly into indoctrinated dogma. It is antithecal to every reason for which I pursued becoming an educator. And it continues to drag our society down. I am convinced that religion is the single greatest barrier to our hope of allowing our wisdom to keep up with our knowledge..

    It is this regard that I wish we could stop these neanderthals from crushing each succeeding generation of children’s minds.

    In this regard, i would like to find a way to stop these religious neanderth

  • Tobias2772

    It is hard to reply to your position as serious when you provide no evidence for your creationist position and call every piece of evidence for evolution lies. Do you really think that if a scientist found evidence of human bones in the same geological time frame as dinosaurs, that they wouldn’t shout it to the stars ? They would instantly become famous and rich.
    If you are going to question the evidence and ethics of every expert that happens to disagree with your indoctrinated mythology, then I am afraid that I have already wasted too much time on your position.

  • Anonymous

    This is obviously fake.

  • Rich Wilson

    Because there is no other theory. Creationism isn’t a theory. Intelligent design isn’t a theory. They don’t make testable falsifiable claims as to how things happen.

    Carbon dating has been proved to be accurate for the times scales it’s used for. Over and over and over again. Carbon dating is not used to date dinosaur fossils however. Other forms of radiometric dating are used for older fossils.

    If you think secular scientists aren’t sharing some of their findings, then how do you know about these findings that haven’t been shared? “I know you have a pet tiger and you’re just not telling anyone about it!”

    Secularists aren’t afraid of any legitimate science. They’re opposed to wasting classroom time teaching myths. All the evidence for evolution is backed up with actual observations of the real world. There are no observations of the real world to support biblical creationism. None. There are a multitude of observations that refute biblical creationism.

    The problem is biblical creationists root their belief in faith. There is NO evidence that will convince someone who has determined that their view cannot change.

    Secular scientists can be convinced with evidence. They aren’t because the evidence hasn’t been found. Creationists can’t be convinced with evidence, because it’s important to them to have faith. Any evidence that disproves biblical creationism is seen as a test of faith, and rejected out of hand.

  • Jamal

    It’s a private school. So what that the 4th grader is being taught unpopular ‘science’? Everyone gets older and makes up their mind for themselves anyway. At least by that time, she’ll have the valuable knowledge not to believe everything she will hear right off the bat.

  • Jim Silverman

    this seems incredibly fake.

  • fatboy11

    These idiots shouldn’t be allowed to breed. Ignorance breeds ignorance.

  • Anna

    Why would you think it is fake? The school in question apparently uses the science curriculum from Answers in Genesis:

  • Jeremy Hughes

    I went to a public school in CA that in the early 90′s we got crap like this, I kind of knew that it was BS all along, and I used to mess with teachers by writing in wrong verses, wrong information, and drew a lot of wieners. LMAO – YES, in the early 90′s teaching creation was STILL happening IN PUBLIC SCHOOLS, we could also get spanked, the last time I got spanked in a public school was in 1992 after a teacher from Northern California named Mr. Hartrum asked my stepdad if he could spank me in class, and my stepdad (narcissist shytbag btw) told him yes. It happened maybe twice and I threw a desk at the teacher and ran home, never happened again, I think he was just glad no police were called.

    I also got a 3 day suspension once for saying that if “god were real, I’d fight him, why? Because he’s a jerk.” LMAO oh to be 8-9 again! : )

  • Anna

    That’s quite scary. Creationism isn’t allowed in California public schools, and corporal punishment was banned across the state in 1986, so it was absolutely against the law for your teacher to do that. He is indeed lucky the police weren’t called!

    Out of curiosity, what school or school district were you in? It might be a good idea to know the name just so we can keep an eye on what’s happening there. Or even just the county. Unfortunately, something being illegal often doesn’t stop teachers and administrators in conservative areas from trying to sneak prayer, creationism, etc. into their classes.

  • fatboy11

    Apparently you are unaware of just how pathetic these religious nutjobs really are.

  • Jeremy Hughes

    Lassen County. OUr town is pretty bad to be honest, a few years ago the DA mayor and several other high ranking members of the community were involved in a cocaine/prostitution scandal, they are still ALL in office, the only people that got in trouble were the prostitutes, EVEN THOUGH they were servicing the very men that sent them to Prison… You can actually view a PBS documentary about my town, it’s called “Prison Town USA” Most of our community is heavily religious, in fact, if I were to go into the local wal-mart and scream “I’m an Atheist” I have zero doubt I would be attacked in the parking lot by some zealot christian. We are world famous for sending 20 year old’s to prison for getting into fist fights, or for multiple marijuana posessions. It’s quite ridiculous, our town needs Internal Affairs but I bet they’re same team so wouldn’t help…

  • fatboy11

    Well said, religion has no business being involved in education. Just like Hitler and Stalin, brainwash them when they’re young and you own a large percentage of them for life. Religion is an evil predator.

  • Anthony J. Mitchell

    Religious indoctrination has no place in the education system.

  • Spuddie

    Much like the “natural flavors” seen in soft drinks and candy. The process is artificial. Guided by human hand and contrivance.

  • dong johnson

    the ark was really shaped like a massive donger.

  • Heather Long

    This is the text.

    “Behold, Behemoth,[c]
    which I made as I made you;
    he eats grass like an ox.
    16 Behold, his strength in his loins,
    and his power in the muscles of his belly.
    17 He makes his tail stiff like a cedar;
    the sinews of his thighs are knit together.
    18 His bones are tubes of bronze,
    his limbs like bars of iron.

    Kind of sounds like a Kangaroo maybe? or maybe a mammoth even though they were not in that part or the earth.

  • JM_Wonn

    Interestingly enough the “Behemoth” was described as a single legendary animal, and not –say, an entire species or even an entire clade of animals. To pigeonhole all dinosaurs as being “behemoths” despite tremendous physical and behavioral differences between them is an obvious ad hoc explanation.

  • Ben Mullen

    the answer to number 15 is prolly about right oddly enough. Sure we all know the big ones, but there were a lot of small ones too. I suspect sheep average is about right.

  • Tobias2772

    I think that you underestimate the insisdious effects of early indoctrination. Even if this youngster grows to understand the science of evolution, other, more basic patterns of non-inquiry will have been established as the norm.

  • Tobias2772

    My friend, I wish it was so. This is Calvary Christian School in Greer, SC. Look up their web site and see for yourself.

  • Ryan Martin

    Fire that teacher, fire everyone involved in creating that curriculum. Do it now, do it always. Seek it out and exterminate ignorance from the ranks of our teachers.
    Sell that weak sauce in your backwater church. If I caught someone teaching my children religious beliefs in school as part of the curriculum I’d do everything possible to sue everyone I could along that chain of stupid. .It’s probably unconstitutional, its unethical, it’s deceptive, it’s confusing to the child. It’s poisonous to society. KEEP IT IN CHURCH you bastards! We will not let you teach our children garbage.

  • Jingles

    I went to Catholic school for 14 years, and I can attest that they do *not* teach Creationism. Evolution is accepted (and taught) as the prevailing and most conclusive scientific theory. Religious discussions are primarily kept in religion classes. Only one school I attended (for only a year) allowed religion to spill over into other courses, but this school was not acknowledged by the diocese; this school was basically run by weird fundamentalists who thought Harry Potter and the Bernstein Bears were evil. Luckily, I just checked, and that school is *CLOSED*.

  • lakawak

    When this is proven to be fake, will all your idiots admit that you are in NO way more intelligent than most people?

  • Rich Wilson

    That’s proof that that kind of school is out there. But is that the only candidate?

    Hemant, why are you trying to figure out which school it is if the father doesn’t want to ‘out’ it at this point? It seems irresponsible of him to publish it if he doesn’t want the school known, since surely the teacher will recognize it, but are you not going against the father’s wishes?

  • Paul Housley

    child abuse.

  • Ravi

    These folks are setting their kids for failure in global economy. At the end all we will have will be pakistani style mullahs

  • robwbright

    Several questions for you:

    1: There are an estimated 1,263,186 animal species and 326,175 plant species in the world. Assuming the age of the Earth is 4.54 billion years, what is the average rate of speciation?

    2: How many mutations, on average, are required per speciation?

    3: What scientifically significant predictive model relies primarily upon evolution by natural selection?

    4: Which of the various human sub-species is the most evolved; i.e. modified by mutation and natural selection from the most recent common human ancestor? Which is the least evolved?

    And finally…

    5: Do creationists pose a serious threat to society? If so, why?

  • RCorrino

    I really hope these people would stop giving Christians a bad name. Most of us do believe in evolution as well as the Sun being the center of out solar system. We also treat the Bible as a “how-to” manual and not as a history text.

    Jesus would be rolling in his grave if had not ascended into heaven……

  • Brian

    Ha Ha! That’s funny!

  • Rich Wilson

    I started answering these, and couldn’t help thinking these must have been cut/paste from somewhere. Turns out my answers for your 1-3 were pretty much the same as Mike Williamson’s I was prepared to do a bit more on your 3), but since the author of voxday (is that you?) doesn’t understand speciation, there’s not much point.

    If you’re really curious, I’d be happy to explain things, but you don’t appear to be interested in anything that might change your mind.

  • Hemant Mehta

    I’m looking at it more from a journalistic perspective. The information is out there, so I can do whatever digging I would like. I understand the father’s concern (I never spoke with him), but if I don’t find the school, I guarantee someone else will.

  • James

    The funny thing is all modern carbon dating methods used on Dinosaurs
    have all dated dinosaurs at less than 20 thousand years old. Also every expert that has looked at the
    radiation that causes carbon dating has seen that it shows that the radiation
    has less than 30 thousand years old.
    Also every expert calculating the magnetic core of the earth that causes
    atmosphere on the earth has admitted that if they calculate the absolute oldest
    the magnetic core could be is a few million years old. I used to believe in Evolution until I attended
    public university that was trying to teach Evolution. I don’t know any of the science teachers that
    did not try to teach evolution but saw that science showed crude and hug facts
    arguing against evolution, like stated above. When I
    push the issue looking for proof from the biggest evolution experts in the
    world they have none. I changed my mind
    because I was fascinated about evolution and looked deeper to find everything
    to be based on theories sitting on hypothesis and the facts actually disagree
    with it all.

  • james

    All modern science dis-agrees with evolution, from carbon
    dating to fossils but they still teach it and wont teach the facts till you get
    into very advanced courses. And at that
    point you have to either follow the facts or evolution.

  • Mark Burcaw

    I find it interesting that many call young earth scientists flat earthers when it was the Bible to which many of such individuals hold out as true which plainly declared the earth to be round when most scientists of the day believed the earth was flat! Seems we usually hear that stated the other way around by those who want to promote the theory of spontaneous life also known as evolution.

  • Rich Wilson

    The funny thing is all modern carbon dating methods used on Dinosaurs have all dated dinosaurs at less than 20 thousand years old.

    Carbon dating isn’t used on dinosaur fossils. Carbon dating is used in 10′s 1000′s of years, not 100s of millions.

    Also every expert that has looked at the radiation that causes carbon dating has seen that it shows that the radiation has less than 30 thousand years old.

    You’re not making any sense. It sounds like you read something on AiG, and are trying to spout it back from memory, but getting it so jumbled it’s not even just wrong, it’s gibberish.

    Also every expert calculating the magnetic core of the earth that causes atmosphere on the earth has admitted that if they calculate the absolute oldest the magnetic core could be is a few million years old.

    Ok, I’m able to glean enough out of that one to point you (or more likely anyone who’s actually interested in learning something) here

    tl;dr; a couple of experts using very shoddy methods and gross assumptions assume the earth’s magnetic core decay rate is orders of magnitude off.

    If you want to keep this world view, I’d suggest not looking into the GPS measured rates of plate tectonics. Or the how we find the same fossils in Australia, Antarctica and South America 90-70 million years ago (off the top of my head, I’m not googling, so don’t take those numbers as, you know, gospel) but they diverge after that. The same age that we deduce the 3 continents were one based on GPS measurements of plate tectonics.

  • Rich Wilson

    Round Sphere. It is only with hindsight word twisting that people can get ‘sphere’ out of biblical descriptions of the cosmos. Evidenced by the fact that people who relied on the bible for descriptions of the cosmos got it horribly wrong. So even if the bible did mean ‘sphere’ it was so poorly described that nobody got it until science did.

    Evolution is not the theory of spontaneous life. Evolution is the explanation for the diversity of life that we have today.

  • Rich Wilson

    Adric! It’s been a long time!

  • Comment Zilla

    Why is it so hard for you to believe that God made the universe and all of it’s living things in a logical and rational fashion instead of magic?

    Planets and animals are born not snapped into existence. Why would the creation of the universe be any different?

    It’s also worth noting that the concept of a day is based on the earths rotation in reference to the sun, which is not a constant – the earths rotation is slowing. Also day at the north pole is 6 months vs. 12 at the equator if your considering daylight instead of the rotation of the earth.

    “And there was evening and there was morning, one day.” Bible

    So 12 month days for Eskimos and 24 hour days for Israelites?

    Considering how well engineered the earth is it’s hard to believe he’d jettison the laws of physics and time that he created to govern life on earth.

    Considering that the Bible was written at a time when most people were uneducated, unable to read or write, I doubt he was going to breakout the laws of physics to the masses.

    He left us a wonderful universe to discover and our universe didn’t operate according in logical, predictable and measurable manner, we never would have made it to the moon or invented the light bulb.

    God did create the earth, just not by magic in a week. Besides, the it’s pretty hard to have a”day” when the Sun was not created until the 4th day? Somewhat of a paradox.

  • wysiwyg

    This is one more example (among thousands) of the industry of religion (IOR) working to surrepticiously and deviously hijack the minds of innocent youngsters to accomplish the IOR’s goal of forcing lifelong servility on them long before they are old enough to understand what is actually being done to them.

    Religion has viewed science and freethought as it’s enemies for centuries, and while teaching YEC nonsense is largely the intent of Christian fundamentalists, it is only part of a wide spectrum of disingenuous and disinformative dogma that makes up much of the IOR’s concentrated effort to inculcate children and the otherwise guileless and gullible.

  • Anna

    I share your outrage about the content, but this is a private religious school, not a public one. They are legally allowed to teach children such nonsense.

  • Comment Zilla

    “spontaneous life also known as evolution”

    Nothing spontaneous about it. God created the universe with a big bang that evolved into the wonderful world we are blessed with today.

    Was God going to hand us a physics book on the mechanics of time and space or a guide to live a moral life?

  • Anna

    That sounds awful. I haven’t been to your county, but I have visited the one immediately to the west, Shasta County, with Shasta Lake and Mount Lassen. It’s beautiful country up there. Shame the citizens are so small-minded!

  • Rich Wilson

    Couldn’t he have given us a guide to a moral life that included the idea that women aren’t property?

  • Michael W Busch

    The “tape measure” here is radar and spacecraft ranging. You can bounce radio waves off the solar corona; although ranging the planets and asteroids works better.

  • Michael W Busch

    “When I push the issue looking for proof from the biggest evolution experts in the world they have none.”

    You are a liar.

    Nobody uses carbon dating on dinosaur bones. It’s all potassium-argon and uranium-lead on rocks that old. And you would know that if you had actually talked to “the biggest evolution experts in the world” and understood even a very small fraction of the available evidence. I encourage you do actually read up on the science. You can start here:

  • Michael W Busch

    “Why is it so hard for you to believe that God made the universe and all of it’s living things in a logical and rational fashion instead of magic?”

    Because there is _no_ evidence for such a god (or any other sort of god). And that is not the god described in the Bible.

    Nor does the chaotic history of life on Earth, from prebiotic chemistry to self-catalyzing chemical systems to early single-celled life to the current biosphere indicate any overarching intent. To the contrary – very many things in the history of life on Earth are due to entirely random events, events which happen at predictable rates.

    “Considering how well engineered the earth is”

    The Earth isn’t engineered _in any way_. I could describe its entirely natural formation and history in quite considerable detail. Or you could look it up: .

    And there is _no_ evidence to support

  • Rich Wilson

    The more people who are in on a secret, the harder it is to keep. Presuming that >99% of all biologists on the planet are in on a giant conspiracy, along with the same proportion of geologists and paleontologists is worse than believing the moon landings were hoaxed. Wait, don’t tell me you don’t believe we’ve been to the moon either…

    The facts that they teach in advanced courses are no different than the facts available to anyone who wants to do the research. It’s not like Scientology where you have to be ‘cleared’ to get the ‘higher order’ teachings.

  • Michael W Busch

    You are a liar. Go and learn:

  • Skip Nordenholz

    There is one words for lots of groups of organisms, mammals, tetrapods, animals, Eukaryota.

  • Michael W Busch

    On the off chance that you are actually honestly looking for answers to those questions:

    1. That is not an accurate count. Most species that have ever lived are extinct, and many currently-extant species have not yet been described. And speciation rates vary very dramatically, depending on the rate of mutations in a population, the distribution of that population, the selective forces acting on it, and the lifespans of the lifeforms concerned, among other things. Your question is not a meaningful one.

    2. Again, not a meaningful question. See the previous point.

    3. All of evolutionary biology and by extension much of medicine and agriculture. Example: We want to prevent malaria. But we know that the malaria-causing plasmodium species will be strongly selected for as people are given anti-malarial drugs. So we can’t use the same drugs all the time, because the plasmodium population will evolve resistance (this has already happened once).

    4. There is no such thing as “most evolved” or “least evolved”. Evolution has no direction and no goals. There are also no “human sub-species” – we’ve been a close-to-uniform species for many tens of thousands of years, and the most recent human common ancestor was only a few thousand years ago. This question is meaningless too.

    5. Yes. Teaching lies as facts is always a bad thing.

  • Rich Wilson

    You’re describing scientific nomenclature. What I’m attempting to do rhetorically is make sense of biblical nomenclature. ‘Kind’ seems to sometimes be species and sometimes genus or even family.

  • Michael W Busch

    I think you have confused “respect other people” for “respect for what other people believe” or for “not calling out people for teaching nonsense as fact”.

  • Michael W Busch


    Your jokes aside, here’s the real story: The Chihuahua most likely are descended from the Techichi, a breed of dog common in Toltec settlements. Coyotes are Canis latrans and don’t usually interbreed with domesticated dogs. Although coydogs and coywolves do exist, they have decreased fertility relative to either coyotes or dogs/wolves. This illustrates the nearly complete speciation between Canis latrans and Canis lupus.

  • mutie

    No one knows yet how the universe began. And that’s the difference between your book of myths and the real world … one pretends to know all the answers, and the other realizes answers come through investigation and proof, if at all.

  • wysiwyg


    I’ll make the assumption that you believe in creationism and trust you will correct me if I’m wrong.

    If you believe the Bible then you believe a god created the universe and all that exists for the purpose of providing a sustaining habitat for the unique object of it’s creation and it’s supreme love and affection, namely humans. You will defend that idea via the bilical “dominion” claim.

    And if you believe all other forms of life on earth are therefor subject to human domination, and that such a proclaimed hierarchy establishes the status of humans as this god’s sole chosen and most cherished life form in all of creation — you. would. be. wrong.

    In fact, if you believe you were created by a god, then you were created merely to be a host, to provide an ideal habitable environment for the miriad of bacteria that live in your gut, because they have true dominion. They can and do survive without you, but you cannot and will not survive without them. Based on Biblical claims of dominion, the universe and everything in it was created for bacteria. Sorry.

  • populartruthorrealtruth?

    Interesting that you fight this. There is just as much science that supports (hard factual science discovered and explored by highly respected professional scientists around the world and well documented) the Christian theory as there is evidence of evolution over millions of years. In fact, if you were a science teacher, you would have researched and found that there is more evidence than evolution and that much of the evidence used to originally prove evolution has now been disproven. It was only last year that I read a new theory by atheist/secular scientists from a university in Australia that say that the evolution theory could be wrong and came up with a new theory that actually is not as far fetched as evolution. Also, I remember a couple of years back that there was talk of re-writing science textbooks/buying new updated textbooks as some of the evolution stuff was no long held true.

    What evidence do you have to disprove this point of view?

    And, now you understand how Christian parents feel about what they believe is false jammed down their child’s throat at school no matter if they like it or not. They have to suck it up and don’t have a choice. At least this father does have a choice. If he doesn’t like it he can take her away from it and teach his point of view. It isn’t brainwashing, it is a point of view where there is some scientific evidence to back it up. Parents should be able to choose what point of view their child learns. If you want evolution taught, then go to a school that teaches it, if you want a creationist point of view, then go there.

    To name and shame a school who is willing to provide a point of view parents want their child to learn and give them a choice is horrible. It is like having a website name and shame all the schools who teach evolution….oh hang on, that is acceptable so it is not shameful. Heaven forbid there are different points of view in the world, even if they have science to back it up!! Reminds me of the time when everyone thought the world was round…………there was evidence for it and evidence against it but the most popular one was always taught, and it was even in the Bible as early as 800BC, which science and history experts the world round all agree – more evidence for you….

  • fatboy11

    You religious whackjobs take stupid to a whole new level. You don’t even begin to know what you are talking about.

  • Rich Wilson

    There is just as much science that supports (hard factual science discovered and explored by highly respected professional scientists around the world and well documented) the Christian theory as there is evidence of evolution over millions of years.

    No. There is soundly refuted evidence against evolution. There is no evidence for biblical creation. Even the ID people couldn’t make it in a court of law when they had their chance to lay it all out.

  • james

    There are not many examples of carbon dating dinosaurs. For two basic reasons one carbon dating mathematically
    and scientifically does not work on samples that are approaching 100k years or
    older, but they have never found samples that show carbon proof of being
    anywhere near that old. But since it’s
    easy to do and easy to read a result as to old to get conclusive evidence there
    have been evolution scientists that have cordon dated dinosaurs which leads to
    the other reason not many are willing. The other reason is every time a dinosaur is
    carbon dated the results are always conclusive as a provable and scientific
    date less than 20 thousand years old. The
    results are always conclusive and the only plausible explanation on trying to
    say it’s wrong is human error, which repeating the experiment should fix but
    never does. If you have researched into
    the issue you would know what I am talking about but since you don’t then go do
    your research. – Also it is considered scientific fact that the radiation that
    causes carbon dating leveled off in the atmosphere after 30K Years of the earth
    existing, but it is also scientific fact that the radiation is still raising.

  • james

    Yes anyone can look this up, that is why even a state
    started to offer creation as an alternative.
    Enough people said hay wait evolution does not line up with
    science. Shouldn’t we teach science not
    some evolution religion? The thing is
    evolution is an out dated religion that has been disproven, but it is currently
    a state funded religion. If the
    government decided to not fund theory’s that have been completely scientifically
    disproven then it evolution would not be taught. It has grown to a point that evolution uses
    gossip and slander to attach creationism like slapping grade school homework up. How about you read a high school or college
    level creationist textbook, you can if you want. Creationism is standing very strong in the
    scientific world and the higher level text books could confuse you and make you

  • Rich Wilson

    a statestarted to offer creation as an alternative

    Would that be PA? Where it went to federal court? And where both sides presented their cases? And where the ID side failed miserably because they didn’t have any evidence for anything. They presented evidence against evolution, but it was destroyed. As for evidence for any other theory, I’ll let creationist Paul Nelson handle that:

    Easily the biggest challenge facing the ID community is to develop a full fledged theory of biological design. We don’t have such a theory right now and that’s a real problem. Without a theory it’s hard to know where to direct your research focus. Right now we’ve got a bag of powerful intuitions and a handful of notions such as irreducible complexity, but as yet no general theory of biological design.

    If the government decided to not fund theory’s that have been completely scientifically disproven then it evolution would not be taught.

    Which government? You know, evolution also works in other countries, right?

  • dabble53

    But since you aren’t “there”, you can’t conclusively prove radar hasn’t bounced off of some unseen thing that’s closer, or that the radar (electromagnetic) waves have actually bounced off the corona instead of passing through and bouncing off of something behind the sun. (I personally don’t believe this, but this is the reasoning the fundamentalists bring into play.)

  • slaq

    If you’re referring to the God of the bible, then yes, God is capitalized. If you’re talking about god as a concept, then no, god is not capitalized.

    “Gosh golly, God was sure a dick to the Israelites!”
    “I don’t believe in any concept of god.”

  • dabble53

    Schools need/have a license to malpractice?

  • David Evans

    “the magnetic core of the earth that causes atmosphere on the earth”

    Can you reference any published book or paper that says that?

    “The funny thing is all modern carbon dating methods used on Dinosaurs
    have all dated dinosaurs at less than 20 thousand years old”

    Can you reference any published book or paper that says that?

    I’m not holding my breath.

  • Anna

    Good grief, where did all of these creationists come from? Did this post get linked on some fundamentalist blog? It’s unusual to see so many drop in all at once.

  • Anna

    There could be negative repercussions for the man’s daughter. I’m a little curious why you seem so intent on “outing” the school. These types of schools aren’t unusual in any part of the country, especially South Carolina. If it’s not Calvary Christian School, it will be another just like it. Teaching creationism is the norm for evangelical and fundamentalist schools.

  • Jeremy Hughes

    Ya it’s a beautiful little area, just populated by the ugliest / stupidest people I’ve ever met. I live in one of those po dunk ass retard towns where everyone still think’s Obama is a socialist muslim and everyday I get to hear about how Reagan was the best president ever. I sometimes, just to enjoy the moment, say thing’s like “what do you think Reagan’s most successful piece of legislation was?” or “How do you think Reagan’s policies affected modern economics?” And sometimes if I want to really see the true face of stupidity I will ask people “Why is 1913 an important year for the American people?” and they just stare at me, usually I get “didn’t we have a war with someone?” LMAO I can’t take it. THese morons think they know everything, but upon closer inspection it becomes totally obvious that they are indeed, the most illogical and uneducated bunch around.

  • redie

    Buahahaha, i supposed this is a test from US

  • Jeremy Hughes

    Just take solace in the fact that all of them post one ignoramus comment, then whenever someone with a real brain posts a follow up, they never return. THis is because they don’t understand evolution in the first place, they don’t understand Geology, they don’t understand basic facts… They have NO argument, just pitiful strings of rhetoric and bible based bs. They cannot argue with us on this point because they are so inherently wrong. I just wish my religious family could see it, sadly, I’m the only one in my family that doesn’t still believe this cruel hoax.

    ATM I’m having my mother view the “Cosmos” series by Carl Sagan, she watched episode one and two, sneered and scoffed everytime he would say something about the true age of the earth. THe 2nd weekend I brought out episode 3 and 4, my mom says “We decided we don’t want to watch anymore of that show, we don’t believe in it, and we think it is wrong” So I pulled the ONE AND ONLY card I had in my deck. I had been thinking since the first 2 episodes that she would do soemthing like this. SO I told her that I cannot force her to believe in anything, that she is in control of her faith. I told her that I had never had a choice when I was a kid, and that I deserved the respect of her at least seeing my viewpoint. “For all I know, you might become more religious after this mom, I’m not trying to convince you that there is NO god, I just want you to at least KNOW both sides of the story.” She agreed but was quite sad looking, watched 3 and 4, and afterwards was asking me a string of questions about cosmology and astronomy, it was pretty cool! I doubt it will change her mind, but at least she will have SOME clue to what she is talking about when she debates people, and eventually I think she will see through it just like I did. : ) Good luck ppl!

  • Anna

    I did a little sleuthing around, and there are tons of possible candidates for South Carolina:

    Blue Ridge Christian Academy, Southside Christian School, Anderson Christian School, Greenwood Christian School, Grace Christian School, Easley Christian School, Florence Christian School, Tabernacle Christian School, Conway Christian School, Crosspoint Christian Academy, Hawthorne Christian Academy, Hilton Head Christian Academy

    Well, I got tired of checking websites, but those are some of them. I just Googled “Christian schools in South Carolina,” and these were the first results that came up. All of them list creationist science textbooks as part of their curriculum, so they’re not hiding anything.
    As a matter of fact, I think it would be harder to find a Christian school in South Carolina that didn’t teach creationis,

  • Jeremy Hughes

    Your views were first disproved nearly 50 years ago, way to be behind the times. Also, Evolution is NOT how life started, it is the study of how it changes. Way to once again prove how LITTLE you actually understand about basic theories.(also, as a little tip, look up the DEFINITION of a “scientific theory” – Your definition of a THEORY is WRONG. SOrry, but it is!)

    Another way we know your beliefs are wrong? Common sense… IT doesn’t take a genius to study ancient religions and come to the EASY realization that they are all old world texts that just got conglomerated into a new easy to spread religion that was able to help early governments control their flock.

    That is the ultimate nail in the coffin, is that these people ignore human nature, and benefit God with society. It wasn’t God people, it was a Ruler realizing he could control you better if you feared NOT ONLY HIM, but ETERNAL HELLFIRE!!! Great scam! Truly Great Scam!

  • Anna

    It’s good if we can get people like your mother to think about what they were taught! I must admit I don’t even attempt to engage with creationists online because it seems like they are a lost cause. Maybe there’s hope, though.

  • Andy Phillips

    God is most definitely a proper noun referring to a being.

    Many study my Bible to understand God, and many read the dictionary to understand the English. Perhaps you should do more of the latter.

  • Michael W Busch

    Actually, you can – you bounce radar beams off of a bunch of different objects, which lets you constrain the properties of the intervening interplanetary medium.

    But I agree with you: the lengths Ken Ham and similar people go to too avoid admitting their mistakes would be impressive if they weren’t so outrageous.

  • Michael W Busch

    “The thing is evolution is an out dated religion that has been disproven,”

    I believe you mistyped “evolution” where it should read “creationism”.

    “Creationism is standing very strong in the scientific world and the higher level text books could confuse you and make you think.”

    You are continuing to be a liar. I say this as a professional scientist.

    The scientific community nearly uniformly considers creationism as a particularly dangerous form of nonsense.

  • Michael W Busch

    You do not understand carbon dating, and your misunderstandings are so bad that it is obvious that you have never actually learned how it works. I say this as someone who has taught planetary science.

    Go learn the actual science:

  • Mike Lilienthal

    Fundamentalists who bring up this type of reasoning can be grouped into a much larger category of arguers, known by the laymen as “idiots.” :)

  • scotchleaf

    I don’t understand why biblical literallists don’t claim the Sun goes around the Earth, since in Joshua 10:1-15 God stopped the sun and moon in their tracks around the Earth. Is it that when the bible clearly contradicts scientific evidence, it should be taken allegorically?

  • David

    Looks real to me, I took more than a few of these tests when I was going through a private religious Elementary school in Virginia. Mum probably still has them in a box somewhere. Don’t bother exposing the school. There are thousands of schools all across the United States, and fewer but still some in my home country, Australia, that teach such foolishness. Twenty years later I’m an Elementary teacher myself, and am well aware how moronic these sorts of “educational” programmes are, but the question of private school regulation is difficult. I believe the best option is to develop a strong public education system without removing people’s freedom to teach their children as they wish. Then take a deep breath, realise that stupidity isn’t going away any time soon, and give the strong public system time to do its job. We can contribute to the progress of knowledge and the advancement of humanity, but we have to realise that it takes generations, not years or decades, and that we’re part of a much larger picture.

  • Vic C.

    Hey Mehta,
    are you a muslim?

  • Hemant Mehta

    Nope. Atheist. Shocking, I know.

  • Maxwell

    Not sure why people assume this is real…there is still no evidence it is legit, yet people seem to enjoy assuming, despite the lack of corroboration, that it is real.

  • HerbanCowgirl

    OMG I’m laughing so hard picturing a large pack of Chihuahuas with enhanced kill capacity.

  • HerbanCowgirl

    Homeschooling doesn’t necessarily equate to a poor education. I homeschool my 5 year old son, who can read and write, operate a laptop computer, and is very scientifically literate for his age. He also knows more about world religions than most American adults.

    I homeschool him partly because the lifestyle works for our family, but mostly because the schools in my neighborhood seem to be nothing but holding pens for behavioral cases. The private schools are not only out of my budget, but are VERY conservative Christian.

    Just thought I’d throw that out there and represent for the (albeit small) secular/atheist homeschooling community. :)

  • Gus Snarp

    I was going to argue that in primary school, every time you write a sentence on a test, you’re being graded on your ability to write a sentence properly as well as on the content, but then I realized the grade doesn’t matter. I was also going to argue that the “+” is the important thing, a plus means better than an A and is usually a completely arbitrary designation and a bonus and you don’t hand out bonuses to people who’ve failed the basics of sentence construction, even if they’re answers were correct, but I realized that’s not true either.

    Try it in college. Answer an essay or short answer with rampant grammatical errors and see if they don’t get the red pen of doom and some measure of points off. A few professors will let you slide, but not many. Usually they take out their anger at the fact that students have made it to their level without ever learning the basics of sentence construction on the student, when it’s properly directed at the teacher who gave them an A+ in 4th grade when they didn’t use punctuation and capitalization.

  • Rich Wilson
  • Anna

    Well, if it’s the same one (Calvary Christian School) mentioned elsewhere, it’s not accredited:

    A lot of these types of schools aren’t.

  • dave

    “How should the Jews pay for betraying the savior?”

    Might be a joke now but this is where it usually ends up….

  • Lagerbaer

    - Were you there?
    - Yes, indeed I was
    - … no way. Don’t be silly
    - Well, were YOU there to confirm that I wasn’t?

  • Steve Huhta

    Have you ever seen wind?

  • Steve Huhta

    I find it odd that a father sends his child to a school dedicated to Christian and Biblical principles, then is shocked when a teacher actually teaches Christian and Biblical principles. Didn’t he read what he was signing when he enrolled his child?

  • Steve Huhta

    Michael is a noun, albeit a proper noun, yet just a noun. I see evidence that he/it exists, yet I will choose to believe he/it does not exist, or that he/it is just a product of mass hallucination.

  • Steve Huhta

    It’s a good thing you didn’t take the quiz. You probably would have failed!

  • argradmom

    I agree – brainwashing kids in the name of science is not cool. It’s fine to teach this theory but it’s important to also have the kids understand what the mainstream belief is as well. Unfortunately, many schools brainwash kids into thinking that the theory of evolution is more than just a theory and the only answer to how we all got here and when teachers try to provide alternative theories/explanations, they get railed at. IMO, teaching evolution as fact is just as much a brainwashing problem as the one described in this article.

  • Who cares

    Yeah, no shit she wont be attending the school next year…After this school year the school is closing it’s doors.

  • babycarrot

    They’re teaching blatant lies. The earth IS billions of years ago, dinosaurs DID live millions of years ago, and they did NOT live with people. Is lying to children and undermining their education a “Christian principle”?

  • Jim

    Kids like that need the belt.

  • Cactus_Wren

    That “the average dinosaur was the size of a sheep” is very popular in creationist material. It’s never sourced, and it’s deeply reliant on a misconception of the meaning of “average”, but it’s very important because if the “average” dinosaur was the size of a sheep then Noah could *easily* have fitted them onto the ark.