Rock Beyond Belief | Defending The Religious Rights of Foxhole Atheists.

Army Chaplain Steven Firtko ‘simply offers’ Christ to atheist soldiers

October 11, 2011 by Justin Griffith

An atheist just captured a Chaplain doing the wrong thing. And he’s admitting to it as part of his regular routine. The sad thing is, he is not even aware of it.

His job is to tend the needs of the existing flock, not to grow it.

Other than in the extremely rare context of an atheist inviting such a conversation, he has no business bringing up the (pathetic) conversion tactics like complexity (appearance of design) and “It takes more faith to be an atheist.”

I can’t even imagine a scenario where it’s appropriate for a Chaplain to say “turn from your denial before it is eternally too late for you.”

Chaplain Steven Firtko, you are wrong.

Forced or not, you are not supposed to ‘offer’ that the Soldier you are standing near is risking eternal torture if he doesn’t change his mind. Even if you believe this to be true, you are absolutely not allowed to proselytize like that.

I just sent Chaplain Firtko a message

I hope you realize that we are entirely capable of living pluralistically within the army. I won’t deconvert your flock, and you don’t proselytize mine.
If evangelism means you can’t respect other’s beliefs as genuinely valid (not needing fixing), then evangelism has no place in the government.

I’m not talking about his right to free speech on Facebook (Army policies are actually now encouraging Soldiers to ‘tell the Army’s story’ and sign up for Facebook and have blogs.) I reserve the right to be critical of religions here as well. But he clearly describes his actions, attitude, and style as pertaining to his official duties, and well outside of a sermon to his flock.

He seems to have dug his hole deeper along these lines a month ago in the Fox News facebook page when the same atheist posted the screen shot. The conversation there was telling – the Christians stopped defending his actions and instead pretended that the Chaplain’s Facebook account was fake (in the face overwhelming evidence).

Just goes to show, there are no atheists in FoxNews.

There are no atheists in fox news - bill o'reilly subtle

22 Comments | Leave a Comment

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Bradley
sounds like this guy is in league with Ray Comfort. I’m surprised he didn’t use the banana argument.
https://www.facebook.com/theslydog Slydog
“Why do atheists care about religion?”
“It takes more faith to be an atheist!”
“Proof of god is all around you!”
“The Earth is complex and finely tuned!”
(and my personal favorite)
“You’ll be sorry when you die!”
Do they EVER get tired of rattling off the same tired bullshit???
SERIOUSLY!!!
Dustin
I wonder if he is available to help soldiers overcome religious faith in favor of reason. What if a soldier desires some counseling during a deconversion? Would he try to convince them to maintain their “faith”? Or would he do his job and provide secular philosophical counseling (or refer the soldier to someone who could)? This is why we need to either authorize humanist chaplains, or abolish the unconstitutional state priesthood altogether. I don’t want my money paying a clergyman’s salary so he can “offer” me something that is already freely available, force me to attend mandatory ceremonial worship rituals, or compel me to take offensive anti-atheist “spiritual fitness” classes.
In the last spiritual fitness class I was forced to attend, the chaplain literally told everyone that atheists have no basis for moral standards, and therefore had no moral objection to raping and murdering children. Can you imagine the cries of persecution if an atheist could force people to listen to him denounce the thousands of god-approved child rapes and murders in the Bible? Spiritual fitness is nothing less than a full-on anti-EO war against atheist soldiers.
I wonder how many times this Chaplain Firtko has forcibly prayed over
http://www.youtube.com/user/KatyPerryVEVO 386sx
the Christians stopped defending his actions and instead pretended that the Chaplain’s Facebook account was fake (in the face overwhelming evidence).
I don’t blame them. He does not seem like a real person! Incredibly bad stuff!
Erp
I did some hunting a while back. It is interesting to look at the various codes of ethics that govern chaplains in different areas.
The current code of ethics for those chaplains affiliated with the NCMAF (National conference on ministry to the Armed Forces) can be found at
http://www.ncmaf.org/policies/codeofethics.htm
It is notable that this January 2011 version dropped
I will not proselytize from other religious bodies, but I retain the right to evangelize those who are not affiliated.
which is found in earlier versions and can still be found in some places. See http://mca-usa.org/ministry-forum/ and follow link to code of ethics. However the new one does not explicitly ban proselytization (though it does seem to imply it).
- Justin Griffith
  I’ve been looking for the source of this horrible doctrine for so long. Thank you so much. I’m on it.
- Aliasalpha
  Even before that was edited wouldn’t it have meant “I’ll leave people from other religions alone but atheists are fair game”?
http://larianlequella.com larianlequella
“It takes more work to deny god and be an atheist, than it does to simply believe.”
While I suppose in essence that is true. Thinking can be hard for some people. Having intellectual integrity is hard work. Standing up against a protected power structure takes balls.
However, I gotta say this jackwad is a total fucking moron! His appeals to ignorance and his own authority are just sick. The guy needs to be given an LOR!
- TychaBrahe
  It depends.
  In my heart and mind, I spend no time or energy being an atheist. I also spend no energy avoiding football games, baseball games, bingo parlors, riverboat casinos, and swing dance lessons. Fortunately, no one is trying to drag me to a riverboat casino.
  Unfortunately, people are trying to drag me, metaphorically, to religious services and beliefs, and avoiding those, and making the world safe for other atheists (and other practitioners of non-majority religions, because I care about those as well) does take time and energy.
- Aquaria
  I spend about as much time denying his genocidal scumbag in the sky as I do not collecting stamps.
  Which is not at all.
  Like someone else said, I spend a lot of time keeping this creep from trying to force me into his delusion. But actually denying it? Nope. Only the effort to say, “that’s bullshit.”
Svant
I like how he appeals to the lazy, Hey it takes more work to be atheist than christian. So be lazy and just join us…
The Lorax
It takes more work to be an atheist…?
… yeah, if you’re a fucking idiot.
The most difficult question I have ever faced in my life is, “Is there a god?” There is no physical evidence to prove it one way or another, so the question becomes philosophical.. and once you enter that territory, crazy shit starts to happen… shit that would make Lewis Carroll cry in his sleep. So no, don’t tell me it’s easier to believe in your god… I’ve got questions that you can’t answer, logical contradictions that you can’t resolve, and serious fucking issues with your vicious, immoral dogma. Maybe you think I’m crazy, but it’s easier for me to believe in what I see and experience, and things that are connected in logical, predictable fashions, than that religious nuttery.
Insightful Ape
He does have a couple of points. It is indeed easier to believ what you are told than to investigate and think for yourself. Also, the fact that you are fighting proves that one thing exists, and that one thing is harassment.
RAmen
- Aquaria
  Believing whatever you’re told isn’t easy. That’s why they have to work so hard at making sure you don’t stray. You not only have to work at it constantly with the praying and the church services and the deeds and all that, but you also have to keep your other faitheads in line and constantly second-guess your every thought or action or feeling by what an imaginary scumbag might think of it.
  And then there’s the danger of being taken in by any crazy idea there is, the lack of education affecting your opportunities, and so on.
  That’s exhausting!
Anri
“It takes more work to deny god and be an atheist, than it does to simply believe.”
It also takes more effort to be an adult than to be a child. It takes more effort to be an educated person than an ignorant one. It takes more effort to be good at something than it does to be mediocre at it.
What about something taking more effort leads us to assume it’s inferior?
Aquaria
There’s so much wrong in this one, but this is the thing that made my irony meter send parts flying all the way to Argentina:
Do you REALLY think your fellow atheists need YOU to protect them from well-meaning chaplains and commanders? Really?
You’re not well-meaning, because you’re obviously dangerously stupid, and determined to make other people just as stupid.
By the way, you ignorant gump, don’t you deluded morons have a concept of your brother’s keeper? I seem to remember from being subjected to your delusion that you kinda sorta do.
Justin is being his brother’s keeper, in a way that you couldn’t possibly measure up to, much less comprehend. If we don’t stand up to your bigoted stupidity, just who do you think will?
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Hello there, I found your site by the use of Google whilst searching for a related subject, your website got here up, it appears great. I have bookmarked to my favourites|added to bookmarks.
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100002623032216 jackiegarner
Repeatedly self proclaimed atheist have turned to Christian chat sites or countless other sites where believers communicate to leave comments about how ignorant and deceived those people are who would dare to admit they believe in a creator God. Previously I would spend hours discussing any and all issues of doubt raised, but then one day God reveled a scripture to me that has since enabled me to comprehend the full blown rejection of any god being in charge. This verse reads as follows…
The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.
As difficult as it may seem for a believer to accept that some people are completely closed to their understanding we must accept that unless a person is seeking there is no way they will find anything other then what pleases their own understanding.
The one thing that does puzzle me however is why seemingly every atheist would become so angry about something they don’t even believe.
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1270033241 stevenfirtko
FLORIDA COURT SETS ATHEIST HOLY DAY
In Florida , an atheist created a case against Easter and Passover Holy days. He hired an attorney to bring a discrimination case against Christians and Jews and observances of their holy days. The argument was that it was unfair that atheists had no such recognized days.
The case was brought before a judge. After listening to the passionate presentation by the lawyer, the judge banged his gavel declaring, “Case dismissed!”
The lawyer immediately stood objecting to the ruling saying, “Your honor, How can you possibly dismiss this case? The Christians have Christmas, Easter and others. The Jews have Passover, Yom Kippur and Hanukkah, yet my client and all other atheists have no such holidays…”
The judge leaned forward in his chair saying, “But you do. Your client, counsel, is woefully ignorant.”
The lawyer said, ” Your Honor, we are unaware of any special observance or holiday for atheists.”
The judge said, “The calendar says April 1st is April Fool’s Day. Psalm 14:1 states, ‘The fool says in his heart, there is no God.’ Thus, it is the opinion of this court, that, if your client says there is no God, then he is a fool. Therefore, April 1st is his day. Court is adjourned…”
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1270033241 stevenfirtko
“Wwhat may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools.”
ATHEISTS ARE WITHOUT EXCUSE
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1270033241 stevenfirtko
“What may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools.”
ATHEISTS ARE WITHOUT EXCUSE
Joel
Jees guys, grow some balls! Soldiers are constantly bombarded with all kinds of conversions – As in – you should try drinking!, or “What, you are still a virgin?” “Not going to the strip club – what, you gay?” But if someones asks about your spiritual background or tells you what they think that suddenly violates some rights that you think you have. Grow up man. If you are convinced your beliefs are right what is the big deal?

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Army Chaplain Steven Firtko ‘simply offers’ Christ to atheist soldiers