John McCain on Fox News: Muslims thanking god is no more offensive than Christians thanking god.

Where did this guy go in 2008?  Seriously.

There was nothing for McCain to gain for telling the truth on Fox News there and plenty for him to lose politically by saying that Christians do the same thing they find deplorable in other faiths to an audience guaranteed to be outraged at having their hypocrisy exposed.  And McCain set the record straight anyway.  Sure McCain sold himself out to the political machine in order to run for president, but there was integrity in that moment and I can respect that, as brief as it was.

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  • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

    I’m not aware of you taking the Lord’s name in vain. I often put one of the commandments at the end of my posts so people will understand what sin is. My 11 year old happened to be next to me so he wanted me to add the extra comment.

    You shall not covet.

    • islandbrewer

      So, is the commandment not to covet limited to particular things, or just coveting in general? Is it only tangible things that one shall not covet, or intangibles, too?

      “To covet” means “to desire” or “to long for.” Do you have a different definition?

      Am I coveting when I say that I covet my time with my kids? I covet talking about what books my older son is reading, or playing futsal with him. I covet the time I make art with my younger son. Or is it wrong to covet financial independence? Or covet peace?

      How about material things? May I covet a raise in pay? Or may I covet a new bike? How about the custom bike my neighbor built? I covet that. I’m not about to steal it, and I let him know every morning, “Hey Jay, I really covet your bike!” Now we have plans to go over to his shop and build one for me. I covet working on that project, it will be lots of fun.

      Why exactly is it wrong to covet, now?

      • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

        When you covet things (or people) more than God, then you are sinning.

        Matthew 16:26-27: – For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world and forfeits his soul? Or what shall a man give in return for his soul? 27 For the Son of Man is going to come with his angels in the glory of his Father, and then he will repay each person according to what he has done.

        • islandbrewer

          Oh, well, since I have absolutely no desire for God, I covet all the time. If I didn’t covet getting out of bed, or getting dressed, or acting in any way human, I’d be a pathetic lump.

          Note that your commandment didn’t say “Thou shall not covet anything more than God.” It just said, “Thou shall not covet.” How are you interpreting that very important limitation into that commandment?

          • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

            Oh, thanks for asking. There are lots of other verses that talk about God as being the center or first.

            Here are a few.

            Luke 10:27-28: – He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.”

            1 John 2:15-17 – Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in them. 16 For everything in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—comes not from the Father but from the world. 17 The world and its desires pass away, but whoever does the will of God lives forever.

            James 4:4 – You adulterous people, don’t you know that friendship with the world means enmity against God? Therefore, anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.

            Matthew 6:24 – “No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money.

          • islandbrewer

            Wait, those are New Testament reinterpretations! You’re drastically changing the original meaning! Did God not really think about the phrasing and do a half-assed job when they were first written?

          • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

            Not quite :-)

            Matthew 5:17-19 – “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

          • islandbrewer

            That … doesn’t answer the question. It just says that you should keep the commandments. It says nothing about putting limitations on them. Did you actually read that quote you pasted?

          • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

            The first commandment is:

            Exodus 20:1-3 – And God spoke all these words:

            2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.

            3 “You shall have no other gods before me.

            Anything you put before God breaks this commandment. Some people’s god is sex, or money, or kids, or possessions or status.

            Same argument with you shall have no idols. Many people’s idols are sex, money, kids, status.

            Also in Deuteronomy 6:5 – Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength.

            When you love the Lord your God with “all”, there is no other room to put something before God.

            My quote above was to show that Jesus did not come to abolish the law and the prophets (old testament) but fulfill it.

            Jesus fulfilled it all. He was perfectly righteous and without sin. That is why He was worthy to die on the cross as a substitute for our sins.

          • Andy_Schueler

            Newsflash: starving children are sinning by desiring food more than Dean´s god! That´s totally not bugfucking nuts Dean 😉
            Did you know that breathing is a grave sin? Don´t believe me? Just choose to believe me, then you´ll believe me.

          • Gehennah

            On “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery” do you have any actual historic evidence that there was a mass enslavement of the Hebrews in Egypt?

            And don’t bother posting the wheel in the red sea because a) at least the one that was sent for testing was discovered to be part of a motor, b) it wouldn’t be unheard of for a chariot to be put on a boat to go across the sea and fall of, we’ve lost dozens of airplanes off of aircraft carriers, at least one armed with a nuclear device, and c) the person that “found” all of this evidence was shown to be a fraud.

          • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

            I am sorry your heart is so hardened.

          • Gehennah

            My heart or mind isn’t hardened. I looked at the evidence, or in many cases, the lack of evidence there of.

            If you want to present actual evidence, then I’m completely for it.

      • Gehennah

        I’d argue nothing. If it wasn’t for our ability to covet something, then we’d still be living on the open plains as hunter gatherers

        • islandbrewer

          Oh, but those hunter gatherers were always coveting food, and shelter, and safety from predators. Covetous bunch, our hunter gatherer ancestors were.

  • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

    Soul is the life force of humans. We all have one and it lives eternally. There are only two choices though. Heaven or Hell, Mr. baal?

    • baal

      i hate false dichotomies. You’re missing the dead means dead reality. You’re also missing that cthulhu may awaken and then we’ll have unlife for ever here on earth but with endless terror and insanity. You could escape that by worshiping Cthulhu so that he may grant you oblivion (your unmaking) so that you need not suffer.

      • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

        When you realize you are a sinner and headed for hell, and you repent of your sins and put your trust in Jesus Christ, His perfect life, sacrificial death on the cross and resurrection on the third day, then God gives you the Holy Spirit so that you have a relationship with Him and know Him.

        Don’t believe me? Just repent of your sins and put your trust in Christ.

        • baal

          Don’t believe me? Just dance naked in a swamp. You’ll see and feel things that you have never imagined.

  • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

    Yep. Most people aren’t saved by hearing the gospel once. Sometimes it takes countless times. But don’t worry, I’m persistent.

    1 Corinthians 15:1-4: Now I would remind you, brothers,[a] of the gospel I preached to you, which you received, in which you stand, 2 and by which you are being saved, if you hold fast to the word I preached to you—unless you believed in vain.

    3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures, 4 that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures

    • baal

      Heard it a thousand times. Spamming me with bible verses is counter productive – It not only convinces me you’re not only not worth my time personally but that I should work against you and get as many people as possible to work against you.

  • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

    Ok. I’ll bite. let’s turn the tables. who or what created the universe? and what is your evidence?

    Did you know that the two greatest commandments are to Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength, and the second one is like it in that you shall love your neighbor as yourself?

    • islandbrewer

      Ok. I’ll bite. let’s turn the tables. who or what created the universe? and what is your evidence?

      I don’t know. No one does. I don’t have any evidence, nor have I heard of any evidence that anyone has for how the universe was created.

      We can follow the expansion of the universe backwards ~13.8 billion years ago to a point at which all matter and energy expanded rapidly from a single point. How that energy and matter came into existence is a great source of speculation. Stephen Hawking has shown how matter could hypothetically come into existence, but the truth is that no one knows.

      And that’s fine. I’d rather not know something than believe something that’s false.

      Punting the question to some giant invisible man in the sky doesn’t really have any support outside various folklores (including yours). It begs the question of where the giant invisible man came from.

      • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

        And that’s fine. I’d rather not know something than believe something that’s false.

        So you don’t know how the universe was created or came into existence, you just know it wasn’t God?

        You shall not worship idols.

        • islandbrewer

          So you don’t know how the universe was created or came into existence, you just know it wasn’t God?

          I have no reason to think it was your god any more than I have reason to think it was a giant Flying Spaghetti Monster. Or dreamt by a sleeping Cthulhu. Or sneezed out by the Great Green Arklseizure, awaiting the coming of the great white handkerchief.

          This is the place where lots of people get into semantic arguments of the definitions of “atheist” vs. “agnostic.” And, the position that I have, and frankly most people around here have, including Richard Dawkins, is best shown by talking about unicorns. No, not the reinterpretation of rhinoceroses as unicorns, but the horsey kind.

          I do not know for an absolute fact that unicorns don’t exist. I can’t prove the don’t exist. But the lack of evidence ever produced over thousands of years allows me to, with reasonable certainty, say that unicorns don’t exist. Do I “just know” there aren’t any unicorns? Whatever answer you give to that question, interpret the same answer to “you just know it wasn’t God?”

          Edit: Apologies for being a pedant, but define “worship” for me, and I’ll gladly list the things I “worship.” I personally wouldn’t say I worship anything, but lots of people like to muck about with fuzzy definitions just to make people frustrated. I’ll leave you to interpret which things are “idols.”

          • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

            Yes, but you don’t seem to be holding yourself to the same level of scrutiny that you are trying to hold me to.

            Those who say “provide evidence that satisfies me that there is a God” and when people say, “I don’t like that evidence, so there is no God,” Yet there is no evidence on how the universe was created from your (inclusive your, not singling you out) perspective, yet everyone still feels comfortable saying there is no God, even though you honestly need to answer that you don’t know.

            From your other post:

            We can follow the expansion of the universe backwards ~13.8 billion years ago to a point at which all matter and energy expanded rapidly from a single point

            Of course it points to a single point in time. It points to when God created the universe.

            By the way, here is my evidence as to how I know God exists.

            When you realize you are a sinner and headed for hell, and you repent of your sins and put your trust in Jesus Christ, His perfect life, sacrificial death on the cross and resurrection on the third day, then God gives you the Holy Spirit so that you have a relationship with Him and know Him.

            Don’t believe me? Just repent of your sins and put your trust in Christ.

          • Gehennah

            I’ve believed, I’ve repented, but no, no proof for his existence even then.

            And I don’t say there is no god, I say I do not believe in a god, this is because I see no actual evidence of said god.

            We can trace back to the big bang. As to what caused it, we don’t really know. We have a few hypothesis such as Krauss’s model which fits what we see on today’s universe (zero energy, zero charge, zero spin, and flat) but we still need to do more research.

            I would say its you that is having the problem with evidence. You believe in a god with no real proof of said god. The default position should be disbelief until you have sufficient evidence by which to rationally believe.

          • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

            I would like you to consider that perhaps you really didn’t repent. The Bible talks about “many” believers who claimed Jesus as Lord but were not saved. It’s heartbreaking:

            Matthew 7:21-23 – “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

          • Gehennah

            I know what the Bible says, and its wrong.

          • Andy_Schueler

            Those who say “provide evidence that satisfies me that there is a God” and when people say, “I don’t like that evidence, so there is no God,” Yet there is no evidence on how the universe was created from your (inclusive your, not singling you out) perspective, yet everyone still feels comfortable saying there is no God, even though you honestly need to answer that you don’t know.

            1. There is no evidence that the universe was created.
            2. We don´t say “there is no God”. We say “you have just as much evidence for your God as ever other religion has – none”.

            Don’t believe me? Just repent of your sins and put your trust in Christ.

            Oh really? Did you know that you are delusional? Don´t believe me? Just believe that you are delusional, than you´ll believe that you are delusional.

          • islandbrewer

            What am I claiming without holding myself to the “same level of scrutiny that [I’m] trying to hold [you] to”?

            I think your confusing the statements that “there definitely are no unicorns” with “there’s no actual evidence for unicorns.” Do you feel comfortable saying “there are definitely no unicorns”? What evidence would you show for that?

            Don’t believe me? Just repent of your sins and put your trust in Christ.

            How can one put their trust in unicorns? Explain that to me. I can’t say, “Dear Mr. Jesus. I’m sorry for all the bad stuff I did, and I trust in you.” and mean that with any bit of sincerity.

            Take Gehennah, for instance. You were dismissing their claim to have once been a christian by saying that they had some sort of false conversion, and doubted their sincerity as a christian. How would you expect me to mouth words I don’t actually mean to something I don’t believe exists and expect a better result?

            You say that I’ll know when I trust in Christ. In order to trust in Christ, I’d have to believe. I don’t believe. I can’t simply choose to believe. If your belief system were true, your god is going to send me to hell for not doing something I’m incapable of doing, because I can’t choose to believe. Is that not all sorts of fucked up? (I know, I know, you think if God wants things fucked up that way, it must be ok.)

          • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

            I was hoping to have a dialogue with Gehennah about what I believe is his/her “false conversion.” Not out of judgment or hate or because lots of people point to people like that and then dismiss what I have to say.

            Rather, because I was one myself for so many years. I spent my life going to church. 41 years actually. But what I did was look around me and say I’m a good husband and father, and I go to church, and I go to Bible studies and if you asked me if I was saved, I always had the right answer. But what I was doing was pointing to my own righteousness and not relying on my Savior. I was a false Christian, trusting in a prayer that I said when I was 10 years old.

            But things changed three years ago for me. That is why I was hoping to talk to Gehennah. Because the Bible points to indicators of what a true Christian looks like. That’s why I provided that link to two sermons he could listen to, or even better to have a dialogue about it.

            So that is my motive.

          • Gehennah

            I (kind of like Matt Dillahunty really, although I butchered his name just now) actually began studying to become a ministers. I felt the power of the holy ghost and it told me that this is what god had in store for me. Of course, once I started studying the Bible, not just reading it, I found too many problems withing the Bible itself. Then when I compared the things that meshed within the Bible and compared it to the real world (people living for 500+ years, the global flood, the exodus, etc) and found that there is no evidence for these things, then I couldn’t keep believing in those things.

            And this realization absolutely devastated me. I wasn’t angry or anything like that, but I was absolutely devastated that I had been believing things for so long without question and then reality just didn’t fit into my beliefs anymore.

            I was fortunate though, I had my best friend and she helped me through the time. She had never believed to begin with, so she didn’t know exactly how I was feeling, but she was there for me and helped me through my nightmares of burning in hell, my questioning, what if I was wrong. The cool thing is she didn’t push me one way or another, she just helped guide me along whatever path I chose, and stayed rational, which was cool of her since I spent years trying to convert her to Christianity.

            It’s like JT says, I can’t start believing in god without sufficient evidence anymore than I can step off of the side of a building and believe that gravity will stop working.

          • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

            Yes, every former Christian has their own story. I have spoken to and heard many people’s stories. I pray you will reconsider.

          • Gehennah

            Then show me evidence that a) your god exists, and b) that your god is worthy of worship.

            The Bible in itself does neither, especially the second part since the god described in the Bible is immoral.

        • Gehennah

          Do you believe that the entire earth was flooded 4500 years or so ago?

          • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

            Yep:

            Genesis 6:5-8 – The Lord saw how great the wickedness of the human race had become on the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time. 6 The Lord regretted that he had made human beings on the earth, and his heart was deeply troubled. 7 So the Lord said, “I will wipe from the face of the earth the human race I have created—and with them the animals, the birds and the creatures that move along the ground—for I regret that I have made them.” 8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the Lord.

            Genesis 7:17-24 – For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth. 18 The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water. 19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. 20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits. 21 Every living thing that moved on land perished—birds, livestock, wild animals, all the creatures that swarm over the earth, and all mankind. 22 Everything on dry land that had the breath of life in its nostrils died. 23 Every living thing on the face of the earth was wiped out; people and animals and the creatures that move along the ground and the birds were wiped from the earth. Only Noah was left, and those with him in the ark.

            24 The waters flooded the earth for a hundred and fifty days.

          • Gehennah

            Then you are believing something that is demonstrably wrong.

  • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

    Actually, God gave us a conscious so we would know right from wrong and when we are sinning. That is why we all know lying and stealing are wrong.

    How many times have you told a lie in your life?

    • Cake

      Lying is not a sin.

  • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

    Hi Cake. I will never save anyone. God does the saving.

    So believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved.

    • Cake

      Such stupid bullshit you spew.

  • Gehennah

    I’m sorry, I will never go to the way of the master. Ray Comfort is one of the most dishonest Christians out there. He continually lies, he continually misrepresents scientific facts, and ignores any facts that contradict what he says.

    He is the apex of dishonest, and he knows it. But he makes good money from it.

    • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

      Ok. It’s your choice. It’s always there if you ever reconsider.

  • Mark W.

    Sorry, but I don’t believe in fairytales.

    • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

      Wow, me either!! Evolution is such a joke.

      • Andy_Schueler

        Yeah… well, the funny thing is, that everyone who actually bothers to learn something about biology ends up being convinced that evolution is true. Completely independent of whether they are Hindus or Buddhists or Daoists or Jews or Agnostics or Christians or Atheists. The only exception are Muslims and Christians that are commited to the idea that Genesis just MUST be LITERALLY true – no matter how clearly reality contradicts that (yes, Muslims accept Genesis as divine revelation, and muslim fundies believe the same fairy tales regarding “creation” that you believe).

      • Mark W.

        Yes you do. The bible.
        On the other hand, evolution is a scientifically verifiable fact.

        • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

          Not quite. you just believe scientists’ assertions about what happened millions and billions of years ago.

          Did you know that Jesus said, whoever looks upon a woman to lust after them has already committed adultery in their heart?

          • Andy_Schueler

            Did you know that this alleged saying of Jesus is breathtakingly stupid?

  • Mark W.

    This is a prophecy? You can’t be serious. What kind of mental gymnastics did you pull off to convince yourself of such nonsense. I find it quite interesting that all of these claimed prophecies of the bible have not been used to predict one thing in the future. Always hindsight 20/20 vision.

    • http://NeedGod.com/ deanforGod

      Hey Mark, Here’s a paragraph. Who do you think this describes?

      Surely he took up our pain and bore our suffering, yet we considered him punished by God, stricken by him, and afflicted. But he was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was on him, and by his wounds we are healed. We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to our own way; and the Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all.

      • Andy_Schueler

        Surely he took up our pain and bore our suffering

        And christians tell us that we just want to not be held accountable for our actions 😀

  • Angela Quezada Bertone

    Religious Freedom should be for all not a particular group. There are other Christians who feel the same way. I am one of them. I think it is wrong when one religious observation is allowed while others are denied. Recently I experienced just the opposite where pagan religious holiday observance was promoted and even government buildings are even allowed to decorate with such symbols. However, as a Christian my symbols are not allowed. It is time we all take a stand for equality and not fight each other for having different faiths.