Quoting Quiverfull: African-Americans Being Targeted For Extermination by Pro Choice?

Quoting Quiverfull: African-Americans Being Targeted For Extermination by Pro Choice? January 5, 2015

by MQuotingatt Walsh from The Matt Walsh Blog – Black Lives Matter, So Let’s Outlaw Abortion

Editor’s note: Instead of insisting on equal treatment of races by law enforcement and justice for the blood spilled unjustly Matt Walsh decides to hijack the issues of race and the police to use as another reason to outlaw reproductive choice.

But maybe if we pivot the conversation we can salvage something meaningful out of it. Amid the mindless sloganeering of the Ferguson mob, they have stumbled on one truthful and important motto: “Black lives matter.”

Yes, they do. They most certainly do. And it’s without a doubt true that black people ARE under siege in this country. They ARE being exterminated and erased. They ARE being targeted for extinction. This is all very accurate and very important to understand. But cops aren’t the ones responsible. Officer Wilson and his brothers in law enforcement aren’t the enemy. The enemy is abortion. The exterminators are abortionists. The conspiracy has been hatched by the Infanticide Industry. Black people are killed by abortion more than by police, heart disease, AIDS, cancer, homicide, car accidents, and respiratory illness — COMBINED.

QUOTING QUIVERFULL is a regular feature of NLQ – we present the actual words of noted Quiverfull leaders, influential bloggers and cultural enforcers and ask our readers: What do you think? Agree? Disagree? This is the place to state your opinion. Please, let’s keep it respectful – but at the same time, we encourage readers to examine the ideas of Quiverfull and Spiritual Abuse honestly and thoughtfully.

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What Are Your Thoughts?leave a comment
  • Nea

    *sigh* Another white person assuming they have the right to tell people of color what to do and *that following the white person’s orders* makes the people of color free and independent. *eyeroll*

  • Saraquill

    Walsh, stop pretending that you care about lives that aren’t yours. Bringing up people who are a different color from you just makes you look more hateful.

  • “[M]indless sloganeering.” Until I stumble on a slogan I can put to good use, then it’s all good. Yeah, Matt Walsh, you are really going to convince protestors you’re an ally.

  • Nightshade

    ‘Black people are killed by abortion more than by police, heart disease,
    AIDS, cancer, homicide, car accidents, and respiratory illness —
    COMBINED.’ Numbers, please. And source for those numbers would be nice too.

  • Olivia

    His blog posts are the worst. It is unreal to me that he thinks there is some kind of conspiracy by the “infanticide industry”. I would love to hear his views on making birth control free and easily available in the inner cities. My guess is, they are very strongly opposed. Because he doesn’t ACTUALLY care.

  • Mary

    It’s a problem that black people have abortions at higher rates in the sense that it means they have unwanted pregnancies at higher rates. And that in turn is a problem because it means that they have less access to birth control and because many of those “unwanted” children might be “wanted” under better economic circumstances.

    If you want to reduce the rates of abortion among black women, improve the social safety net and access to contraceptives.

  • Mel

    I know, right! One of my biggest frustrations within the anti-abortion movement is the absolute refusal of adherents to work for the three most effective ways of decreasing abortions: Free access to highly effective forms of birth control, a social safety net that doesn’t penalize people for working, and access to a living wage.

    I’ve never met anyone who liked being on government assistance, but when each dollar earned cuts your benefits by 2 dollars, working in a dead-end job that takes you away from your family will actually put you economically behind faster than working.

  • Mel

    My thoughts exactly.

    The unsaid bias is “Black people are too stupid to see what’s going on.”

    Bullshit.

  • Catherine

    Exactly!

    It’s the correlation/causation thing all over again. Better social safety nets lead to lower abortion rates. It’s a win-win for all involved.

    Well, except maybe some of the more racist elements in the QF movement…

  • Nea

    Yup. In the name of personal power, the best thing for a person of color to do is tamely follow the orders of someone who doesn’t know them from Jack.

  • Baby_Raptor

    Those numbers don’t exist because “black people” aren’t killed by abortion in any real number. A fetus is not a person and abortion is medically safer than pregnancy so not many black individuals are dying from abortion.

  • Baby_Raptor

    I see red when these idiots start crowing about “black lives lost to abortion.” They’re almost always the same racist assholes who don’t give a shit about real people who aren’t white.

    Abortion doesn’t kill people. Racist assholes DO kill people; then they get cheered on by others who think they did good.

  • ConcepcionImmaculadaPantalones

    Note: this one is going to be a novel so be prepared for a long read or to skip it:

    I honestly have told people that I am unable to share my opinion about every single one of the recent (and not so recent) officer-involved deaths of POC/African Americans/Blacks. I wasn’t present at any one of these incidents, I do not know anyone involved, and thus lack the information I feel I would need to make any sort of statement about what happened, or whether any of it was wrong/right.

    I do see that there tends to be a greater likelihood of something as simple as a traffic stop turning into an arrest and jail time for anyone of color, here in California that translates in the numerical sense, to both Hispanic and black persons. This is merely from observation when I’m at one of the courthouses for work, and what I see on the streets. I worry for anyone who is unprepared financially and otherwise for a child, and finds themselves at the point where they must make a choice to have an abortion or not to. Rationally, if they decide to not have the child because they cannot support one, it makes sense to me – but the fact that if things were different economically and socially they would have the baby…it makes me sad that this is the way our world currently is. Life is never perfect, but living in the land of “not in our backyards!”-suburbanites that conveniently ignore when their neighbors are subtly racist and not so subtly class-ist while they take for granted how produce gets to the market, who cleans their offices and homes, prepares food in the kitchen of their favorite eateries, and how many of the people who do these kinds of jobs working for more than just one employer are stuck living in terrible neighborhoods, fearful of their children getting sucked into gang life and not being able to have the luxury of time spent at home to keep their kids from doing that let alone help with homework or the means to put them into after school activities…it’s disheartening to see so many turn away or feeling like they’re not the community that should be helping. How exactly is it going to be possible to get help to people who are all struggling these ways from within?! Even if there were to be an effort made to assist coming from the more affluent areas, I’m not sure that the intended recipients could be blamed if they were to view such largess skeptically or suspiciously. When Anaheim allowed Disneyland to expand, requiring the company to go around buying up multifamily housing properties and then demolished the buildings, they started the process with providing residents some cash to get another place to live but eventually that stopped – yet they still expect a supply of workers without providing good wages and benefits and screw around with union leadership.

    Oh, and if fox news and the rest of those all news all day channels fell off the planet, we’d have so much less rabid frothing over distraction politics. That distraction is being used to keep what we should be focusing on about our politicians out of view just long enough. So while the internet is blowing up over Ebola and such the real crappy stuff is hidden away.

  • Hannah

    This. The problem isn’t abortion. The problems are the things making women feel abortion is their only choice. Ie, poverty, lack of education, lack of access to birth control, systemic racism that means they’re not likely to advance in life on top of all those things…

    Edited for glaring spelling error

  • Alise

    As much as I hate to admit it, the guy isn’t completely off base. There’s a long and ugly history of eugenics in the sphere of reproductive medicine.

  • Baby_Raptor

    That may be true but that doesn’t mean that pro-choicers are currently actively going out of their way to ensure that black people “kill their children” at a higher rate than other races.

    Further, guys like the asshole running his mouth are the people who support policies that encourage abortion.

    So, yeah. The guy’s talking out his ass.

  • Emily Kimmel

    You do realize that this particular blogger is Catholic, and Catholics aren’t part of the Quiverfull movement, right? Among other things that distinguish them from the movement, they believe that families have the right (even the responsibility) to discern when to have another child instead of leaving it to ‘providence’ (they can use NFP), and women can argue with their husbands, say ‘no’ to sex, and have the right to leave if he’s abusive. The Catholic church even canonized a married woman who had a full-fledged career as a doctor (and wore pants!).

    There are people within Catholicism who are abusive, sure, but I have trouble understanding what a post on abortion has to do with spiritual abuse.

  • Emily Kimmel

    Not really. The majority of Planned Parenthood clinics are in minority neighborhoods- and they make a HUGE profit from their clinics by the way. It’s not the nonprofit it seems to be.

  • Baby_Raptor

    Other than the lies that a pregnancy is a person, females should be enslaved to their bodies, BC is “murder” or otherwise bad and about every other ‘fact’ that the pro-forced birth movement spouts?

    Well, there’s how they aren’t content to have their beliefs, instead forcing it on the rest of us via law. There’s the fact that Catholic hospitals refuse to perform standard care because of their belief that a conception is a “life.” The list goes on.

    is that abuse enough for you?

  • Baby_Raptor

    I’m going to believe PP’s own profit statements over someone who obviously has something against them, thanks.

  • Astrin Ymris

    Planned Parenthood clinics are in poor neighborhoods– which may also be minority neighborhoods– because that’s where the women (and men and teens) who need affordable reproductive health care are. Care like contraceptive services, STD testing and treatment, Pap smears and breast exams.

    Only 3% of Planned Parenthood’s business is abortions. They prevent an estimated 516,000 unintended pregnancies a year. And they aren’t making “huge profits” on abortion or anything else.

    http://www.plannedparenthood.org/about-us/who-we-are/planned-parenthood-at-a-glance

    http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=4338#.VLMlBXsc36M

    http://www.give.org/charity-reviews/national/health/planned-parenthood-federation-of-america-in-new-york-ny-626

  • Emily Kimmel

    1.) A fetus is a person. I’m not sure what your exact views of abortion are (I have no idea whether you think a late term abortion is ok or not), so I’ll have to be broad with my explanation. Scientifically, that fetus has separate DNA from the mother from the very beginning. A little later on, that fetus can move on its own, and has been filmed trying to move away from objects (like scalpels) that are introduced into the womb. It can feel pain. After 24 weeks, it’s possible (with medical help) for the baby to live outside the womb. So yes, it’s a person.
    2.) Females enslaved to their bodies…not really sure what you mean by this. Are you enslaved to your lungs because you have to breathe? To your uterus because you have periods (if you’re a girl)? The womb’s natural function is to support a fetus and bring it to term, just like it’s the lung’s function to breathe. Now, it takes two people to ‘tango’, or to bring that particular function of the womb about, but that doesn’t change the fact that it’s a natural function.
    3.) Not all birth control is murder. Condoms and spermicides do not work by preventing implantation of a zygote. However, many birth control pills work partially that way, and pretty much all IUDs work primarily that way. Since the zygote has unique DNA already and is alive, it’s already a person and is killed by these forms of birth control. All artificial birth control (everything explained above) is deemed immoral by the Catholic church (there’s a reason for it, but limited space here. If you’re interested, read Humanae Vitae for the rationale behind this teaching), but Natural Family Planning, or understanding a woman’s fertile and infertile times to space or put off having children, is allowed. And is statistically just as effective as birth control when practiced correctly (and often a whole heck of a lot less expensive).

    I realize I probably won’t change your mind on this, but scientifically, pre-borns (at all their various developmental stages) are persons. So I think it’s abuse to kill them. As for women…unfortunately, many times the circumstances that lead to these pregnancies are abusive. I get that. And that needs to stop. That’s why I support pregnancy resource centers- so that these women have help. All the abortion does for the women is (at best) restore the status quo of their circumstances- not change them. So they return to the same abusive situation they were in before. There are THOUSANDS of stories of victims of incest or statutory rape being forced to have abortions to cover up the abuser’s ‘mistake’. Not to mention the stories of ‘botched’ abortions where the woman had medical complications as a result of the abortion. Or died.

    I think that abortion is more abusive than abolishing it. For the woman’s sake as well as the baby’s.

    http://www.feministsforlife.org/

  • Emily Kimmel

    This is why I have something against them, if anyone’s interested (and it’s not just because they do abortions, believe it or not).

    https://www.youtube.com/user/LiveActionFilms

  • Emily Kimmel
  • Astrin Ymris

    I believe objective, third party sources like the Better Business Bureau and Charity Navigator over groups with an ax to grind.

    Not willing to waste 30 minutes of my life, I Googled Live Action. I will say this: If individual clinic workers have broken the law, THEY should be held accountable, not all of Planned Parenthood. Saying otherwise is like saying the Catholic Church should be banned and all its assets seized under RICO on the grounds that some priests were sexual predators and some bishops protected and enabled them.

  • Emily Kimmel

    You know nothing about me. Please refrain from personal attacks.

    Just because I’m for supporting/rescuing women in abusive situations who happen to be pregnant does not mean I’m not for rescuing not pregnant women from those same situations. (I’m for women’s rights, by the way. I was on this blog because often it’s insightful, NOT because I wanted to pick a fight.)

  • Baby_Raptor

    1) None of those things you mentioned grant personhood. The capability for sentience and sapience grants personhood, which requires a brain. The brain does not develop til the third trimester.

    2) Something being a natural function does not mean we *have* to do it. Cancer is “natural.” Are you advocating for the complete halt of cancer treatments? Or, to use what we’re talking about, some people are born infertile. Some are born with issues that make carrying a pregnancy even more of a threat to their life than a normal pregnancy is.

    3) “Unique DNA and is alive” are not the requirements for personhood. Further, the fetus isn’t even truly alive. It doesn’t have the required organ and functions to be alive. It’s only “alive” because the pregnant person is acting as life support.

    So do you consider the human body itself murder? Because it has ways to keep a conception from implanting. Then there’s ectopic pregnancies. Oh, and the ~85% of pregnancies that miscarry before the person even knows they’re pregnant.

    I realize I probably won’t change your mind on this, but scientifically, pre-borns (at all their various developmental stages) are persons.

    Science does not deem a being a *person* because it has human DNA. It deems it a human because it has human DNA. those two words are NOT synonymous.

    I think that abortion is more abusive than abolishing it. For the woman’s sake as well as the baby’s.

    What gives you the right to make that decision for anyone but yourself? Other than your misinformation and your warm fuzzy feelings about fetuses.

  • Emily Kimmel

    So a baby born with ancelepsy isn’t a person? All they have is a brain stem. What about people whose brains didn’t form fully (mentally challenged or retarded)? Or babies born prematurely? I happen to be pregnant right now, and I can feel my baby moving (which requires a brain to send signals to the muscles), even though I’m in the second trimester. Brain waves are detected as early as the first trimester.

    Cancer is ‘natural’ but so are mutations and infectious diseases. None of those are natural, healthy functions of the human body.

    So people on artificial life support aren’t ‘alive’ nor ‘persons’ according to your definition.

    I don’t consider natural miscarriages murder anymore than I do having cancer. It’s not deliberate medical intervention designed to remove and kill the baby. Ectopic pregnancies are tragedies- neither the baby nor the mother can survive them if they’re carried to term, so yes, they warrant medical intervention. Even then, the Church says that the death of the child has to be a secondary, unwanted, effect of the treatment. So you remove the section of the tube that the baby implanted in, not the baby itself. Splitting hairs, but it’s a complex moral issue.

    Did you read the entirety of that last paragraph that you quoted me on? I’m talking women in general. Every woman I’ve known (and, by the way, I’m friendly with all of them) who’ve had an abortion regrets it. Deeply. As in, 20-something years later they still cry about it. I get that there are women who claim that they have no regrets about it, but in my (admittedly limited) experience, it’s something that damages women.

    And warm fuzzy feelings aside, if I believe that murder is taking place, then yes, I’m going to say it’s wrong. And if I believe something is misinformation, I’m not going to repeat it as truth. Because it’s not.

  • Emily Kimmel

    I apologize if I misread your comment.

    Or it’s a response to incoming data and a growing number of women coming out and saying it was a negative experience. What other ‘horseshit’ are you referring to? I’ve never been aware of anything changing, just being added on, if that makes any sense. Pro-lifers still say that the fetus is a person, just as they always have been. So there’s a growing sense that the woman is a victim and suffering too- what’s wrong with that? Isn’t that a good thing? Doesn’t that mean that maybe the pro-life movement is finally ‘getting it’?

    Not for being in poor neighborhoods. For EXPLOITING poor neighborhoods. The CEO of PP is fabulously wealthy, lives in a mansion, and that company, by their own admission, makes a pretty hefty profit. Now, maybe it does some good. But I don’t like the bad that they’re doing. I support other efforts to help disadvantaged, poor women, but that’s not one of the ones I can support.

  • Emily Kimmel

    From WebMD:
    “Both types of IUD prevent fertilization of the egg by damaging or killing sperm. The IUD also affects the uterine lining (where a fertilized egg would implant and grow).”

    From the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists on Birth Control Pills:

    “The mucus in the cervix thickens, which makes it hard for sperm to enter the uterus. The lining of the uterus thins, making it less likely that a fertilized egg can attach to it.”

    Affecting the uterine lining causes a (very early) abortion, since that fertilized egg (also known as a zygote) already had distinct DNA from both its parents (the same DNA it would have were it allowed to grow and be born) and is an entity separate from them. That’s the scientific data.

    No, I don’t work in a pregnancy resource center. So you can rest easy knowing you’re not paying me. 😉

  • Baby_Raptor

    A “baby” is born. You are not currently gestating a baby. It’s a fetus. The difference is birth.

    I happen to be pregnant right now, and I can feel my baby moving (which requires a brain to send signals to the muscles)

    This is not true. It requires *nerves* to react to things, whether or not the brain is there.

    Cancer is ‘natural’ but so are mutations and infectious diseases. None of those are natural, healthy functions of the human body.

    Pregnancy is not healthy. There is nothing healthy about a parasite leeching off a person’s fluids and nutrients, ‘morning’ sickness making a person unable to keep food down, massive body changes shifting a person’s center of balance, or the myriad of other things about pregnancy that threatens a person’s health/life.

    By the way? Abortion is statistically safer than pregnancy. All the people who cry crocodile tears about folks “harmed” by abortion ignore this fact.

    So people on artificial life support aren’t ‘alive’ nor ‘persons’ according to your definition.

    It’s called “life support” for a reason.

    Did you read the entirety of that last paragraph that you quoted me on? I’m talking women in general. Every woman I’ve known (and, by the way, I’m friendly with all of them) who’ve had an abortion regrets it. Deeply.

    So your biased, inaccurate data means that you should be able to make perfect stranger’s decisions for them?

    I do not regret my abortion at all. It saved my life.

    And, guess what? When you shame people for their actions and convince them of false notions like “a fetus is a baby!” they’re going to feel bad for what they did. That’s what you’re trying to make them do! You don’t get to make these people feel bad for what they did and then claim that they feel that way like it matters. How many of these people would be perfectly happy with their decisions if they weren’t shamed for it?

    What about the damage you’re doing to people by stripping away their rights and forcing them to stay pregnant?

    And if I believe something is misinformation, I’m not going to repeat it as truth. Because it’s not.

    You believing something does not automatically make it true. Facts are facts whether you believe them or not.

    I don’t consider natural miscarriages murder anymore than I do having cancer. It’s not deliberate medical intervention designed to remove and kill the baby

    But the fetus is still dying. You can’t handwave that away simply because it’s inconvenient.

    Even then, the Church says that the death of the child has to be a secondary, unwanted, effect of the treatment. So you remove the section of the tube that the baby implanted in, not the baby itself. Splitting hairs, but it’s a complex moral issue.

    Why should the church’s opinions on morals matter to a person who isn’t a Catholic? I don’t believe a conception is a person. My rights to my own beliefs and to safe, accurate medical care should trump your personal opinion.

  • Emily Kimmel

    One woman I know was told that. Defended it as the ‘right choice’ for years. And no, we haven’t judged her. She’s still mourning, and just recently will really talk about it.

    Hmm. So all those Catholics with ‘fetus fetishes’ who work to help the poor (look up Catholic charities) don’t count?

    I don’t want women to be hurt. I see abortion hurting them. So, no, I don’t want them to choose abortion.

    Nope, I don’t want birth control. You’re right there. I’m just fine with NFP though. People do have a responsibility when it comes to their reproduction. I don’t have a problem with that.

    Look, I care for women. You obviously care for women. We have very different ideas on how to help them, and what’s good for them in society. I’d appreciate it if we could both agree that we do have at least that in common.

  • Baby_Raptor

    “Abortion” is no longer defined as the medical procedure for removing a pregnancy. To the pro-forced birth crowd it’s *anything* that prevents pregnancy, stops pregnancy or even has a chance of affecting it.

    If you’re doing anything that could in some way affect your purpose of constantly gestating fetuses, it’s abortion.

  • Baby_Raptor

    You don’t “care for women.” You want *people* (not all people that can become pregnant are women) to adhere to your beliefs and you frame it as “caring for them” so it’ll be more palatable in your mind.

    If you cared for people you would respect their rights to make their own decisions, handle their responsibilities in the way best for them and stop pretending that you are in *any* way equipped to do those things for them.

  • Emily Kimmel

    It also says that about the uterine lining, and it thinning, preventing an implantation. Which seems to assume that it ALSO works by preventing implantation, even if it PRIMARILY works by preventing ovulation. The fail-safe is the thinning. It’s part of how it works, which is why they included it in the description. Not all of how it works, which is why I included the part about the sperm and the thick mucus.

    I NEVER said I’m against women getting access to good healthcare, by the way. I like women. I am one.

  • Emily Kimmel

    So…if a friend is hooked on drugs but ok with it , I’m just supposed to sit there and watch? After all, he/she is dealing with their responsibilities in a way ‘best for them’. (Yes its a different situation, but I’m applying your logic).

    I don’t want people to ‘adhere to my beliefs’, I want them to stop murdering babies and hurting women.

  • Emily Kimmel

    I don’t. I want a form of murder outlawed.

  • Emily Kimmel

    …sigh.

    Look, we’re not going to find common ground, and you’re right, we’re just running in circles. I wish you all the best. Ciao.

  • Suzanne Harper Titkemeyer

    You want something you are personally defining as murder to be outlawed. You do not speak for everyone. Legislating morality never works out well. This is just one of those issues we’ll have to agree to disagree on.

    I’m locking the comments on this thread because it’s pretty obvious you only want to shout out your opinions like they are the only ones that matter, not engage in thoughtful discussion. I thank you for not resorting to personal insults but think this discussion isn’t going to end well.