Quoting Quiverfull: Part 1 – Have Sex With Me Or Else!

Quoting Quiverfull: Part 1 – Have Sex With Me Or Else! May 28, 2015

quotingquiverfullby Biblical Gender Roles at BiblicalGenderRoles.com – 8 Steps To Confront Your Wife’s Sexual Refusal

Editor’s note: Checking in again with the guy that insists that he is owed sex by his wife because once you buy the cow you should be drinking milk anytime you want it. He doesn’t get sexual consent, he doesn’t understand that women are not consumable objects. This is the kind of screwed up thinking in Quiverfull and Evangelical Christianity that leads to rape and other sexual crimes. Men are not ‘owed’ sex ever!

How should you as a husband handle it when your wife directly refuses to have sex without a valid reason? Is there anything a Christian husband can do about this?

This will be my last post specifically about sexuality in this series on “How to be godly husband”. I will reference may reference sex a little in the next post I will be doing on “knowing your wife”.

Christian Husbands – let me be crystal clear here. The situation I am addressing in this post is not your wife occasionally turning you down for sex (even with a bad attitude, as opposed to for health or other legitimate reasons). What I am addressing here is the wife who consistently and routinely denies her husband sexually simply because she does not need sex as much or she thinks she should not have to do it except when she is in the mood or she thinks her husband should have to earn sex with her by “putting her in the mood” by doing various things she expects or likes.

In two previous posts in this series I addressed these key issues:

In “Christian Husbands – You don’t pay for the milk when you own the cow!” we established this Biblical principle:

Neither the husband, nor the wife have to earn sex in marriage.

A wife cannot flatly refuse her husband, she may only ask for a delay (a raincheck) and then she needs to make good on that raincheck as soon as possible.

A husband has the right to confront his wife’s sexual refusal as a sin not only against him, but also against God.

In “Is a husband selfish for having sex with his wife when she is not the mood?” I elaborated further on this subject of sexual refusal in marriage with these principles:

A husband ought not to feel guilty for having sex with his wife when she is not in the mood if she yields, even grudgingly.

A husband needs to use prayerful discernment to discover if her reasons for “not being in the mood” are for legitimate physical or mental health reasons or if the problem is wrong thinking and wrong attitude on the part of his wife. If her reasons are legitimate, then she needs to seek medical or psychological help as soon as possible.

Now in this post we will talk about how to handle the sexual refusal of a wife when it is because she has a wrong attitude and wrong thinking about marriage and sex.

 

QUOTING QUIVERFULL is a regular feature of NLQ – we present the actual words of noted Quiverfull leaders, cultural enforcers and those that seek to keep women submitted to men and ask our readers: What do you think? Agree? Disagree? This is the place to state your opinion. Please, let’s keep it respectful – but at the same time, we encourage readers to examine the ideas of Quiverfull and Spiritual Abuse honestly and thoughtfully.

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Comments open below

NLQ Recommended Reading …

Quiverfull: Inside the Christian Patriarchy Movement by Kathryn Joyce

13:24 – A Story of Faith and Obsession by M Dolon Hickmon

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What Are Your Thoughts?leave a comment
  • Rachel

    Get her medical or psychological help not because you care about her as a person but rather so that she can get right back to giving you sex. Sickening.

  • Mel

    I do take some exception to the comment “This is the kind of screwed up thinking in Quiverfull and Evangelical Christianity” I have been part of the Lutheran Evangelical church all of my life and we DO NOT believe any of this. No one in my church would ever advocate this type of behavior, which I firmly believe is about as close to rape as you can get. I also feel that a good deal of these men cross that line. We do not believe in our Lutheran Evangelical church that this type of behavior should ever be tolerated.

  • Nea

    You do not own her because slavery is illegal. All her reasons are legitimate because she is the final authority on what happens to her person. No human being speaks for God. Having sex with a person against their will is rape, which is both a crime and a sin condemned in the Bible.

    That was easy.

  • Suzanne Harper Titkemeyer

    Alright, replace Evangelical with Fundamentalist..

  • Gypsy Rose B

    Would “my husband is a sanctimonious, misogynistic douchenozzle whose behavior grosses me out to no end” be a legitimate reason to deny sex?

  • Allison the Great

    It would go right over this dick bag’s head. If he reduces everyone to their gender role, then he’s not very intelligent.

  • She’s not a cow, and it’s not milk. How hard is that to understand?

  • Allison the Great

    I get why he has been divorced (smart woman, I’m glad she got away from this douchebag) but how the fuck did he manage to get married again? Did he do the whole Silence of the Lambs thing? Did he pretend he had a broken arm so that an unsuspecting young girl would come help him move something in the back of his van only so that he could push her in? Did he keep her in the basement until she had Stockholm Syndrome and then marry her when he knew she wouldn’t run? It boggles the mind.

  • *deep sigh* WHY do I still read these things when I KNOW what they do to my blood pressure? *headdesk*

  • Allison the Great

    It’s alright, buddy. We’re here for you, to be all snarky and shit and lower your blood pressure.

  • I just threw up in my mouth a little.

  • Poster Girl

    I was just going to comment the exact same thing.

  • Mel

    Yes.

  • Poster Girl

    The ELCA is considered a mainline Protestant church. When the word “evangelical” is used in the context as it was in this post, it’s referring to a certain type of “born-again” Christian who adheres to a specific set of beliefs.

    My own pastor in a super-liberal denomination describes his beliefs as “liberal and evangelical.” There is no way I would consider the phrase “screwed up thinking in Quiverfull and Evangelical Christianity” to apply to him or anyone else in my church. (On the contrary, we take a pretty firm line against those who encourage sexism or homophobia.)

  • GHN

    I guess that in this guy’s bible, both the wife and the cow are livestock.

  • SAO

    This is the kind of problem that divorce solved. The wife probably can’t stand her husband and doesn’t want him to ever touch her again. According to the bible, he can’t divorce her or have sex with anyone else. So, he’s stuck. He bullies, cajoles, or coerces her, he rapes her or he never has sex again for the rest of his life.

    Any wonder why no fault divorce became pretty much universal?

  • Melody

    I remember that I used to feel that it was a bit harsh when I read that early feminists occassionally compared marriage to simply another form of prostitution (lifelong with one client, trading financial security for bodily access) because, you know… what about love? Surely people loved each other and would (even within a patriarchal society where women had few rights) treat each other well?

    “You don’t pay for milk when you own the cow,” is basically the same thing… He is saying he bought permanent access to a woman’s (a wife’s) body, never mind that she is a person with her own needs, feeling, and personality. It makes me sick…

    Reading this feels like we have such a long way to go yet… The fact that even some still think and say these things… non-apologetically.

  • Nea

    I’ve said before, for all,they call secular women whores, they treat their own like them – hired sex workers who must put out with a smile whenever and for whatever the John wants because they’ve been paid for with a wedding ring.

  • Momtoafew

    This book, pornography, and rape all have something in common-they all seek to control the women involved, regardless of her consent…same intent, different ‘stated’ reasons behind it…

  • Melody

    You just can’t win as a woman… Either you’re ‘bad’ and perceived as one or you’re ‘good’ and treated like one. Sounds to me like the ‘good’ girls are actually getting the worst ordeal here, which kind of defies the purpose… Aren’t their marriages supposed to be better because godly?

  • BlueVibe

    Also: Somebody doesn’t understand cows. Cows don’t produce milk just all the time for the Hell of it–they dry up after their calves have been weaned. And cows that are stressed and not cared for properly aren’t good milkers. It’s not free milk–you have to earn it by coddling her.

    So, even if women and sex were cows and milk, assuming you had it for free on demand all the time would still be wrong.

  • Nightshade

    This view of the Bible isn’t good for wives or husbands. Teach a man that he needs sex, that any thought of sex outside marriage is sin, that a woman’s purpose in marriage is to provide sex anytime he wants it, and you’ve created grossly unrealistic expectations. Then teach a woman that she must submit to her husband’s demands for sex, that she doesn’t even own her own body, that she belongs to her husband. Is it any wonder that he doesn’t really get it when the words ‘marital rape’ are mentioned? Don’t get me wrong, I’m absolutely not defending husbands who do that, it’s wrong and needs to stop…but then you get guys like this who openly encourage men to rape their wives because Bible. Ick.

  • Nightshade

    This man is selfish, petty, manipulative, childish, and disgusting. No man owns me, I’m not a cow, and he can take his eight selfish, petty, manipulative, childish, and disgusting steps and stick ’em where the sun don’t shine.

    Step 7 is particularly offensive IMO. If this poor woman has no other funding she is dependent on him for everything and he’s basically saying if she won’t give him sex then quit paying her to be his wife??! If that’s not long-term prostitution I don’t know what is.

  • ShaLaLa

    Not wanting to have sex IS a legitimate reason to avoid sex. Having sex with your wife when she only grudgingly agreed to, you have coerced your lartner into sex, and that’s rape, which you should ABSOLUTELY feel guilty about (or, better, DON’T DO IT).

    Consent cannot be contracted. Your partner does not owe you sex. Wheedling, pressuring, coercing, spiritually manipulating, guilting, these are all ways of getting an unwilling partner to submit to unwanted sexual activity, which means these are all ways to rape your partner while pretending that’s not what you did.

    There is literally no point in even trying to have a conversation about sexual ethics until you get it through your head that grudging consent is not consent, and that sex without consent is rape.

  • AB

    If you are a member of the ELCA (Evangelical Lutheran Church in America) like I am, we’re not really considered evangelicals in the same sense as it’s being used in the comment you’re objecting to. The ELCA is actually the least “evangelical” of the Lutheran denominations (using the word as the author means it) and actually is considered a mainline Protestant denomination, not an evangelical one. The “evangelical” in our name comes from the predecessor churches that eventually merged into the ELCA (and even goes back to the Lutheran churches founded by immigrants to the USA in the 1800s) so our use of the word predates the more fundamentalist “evangelical” groups that have taken it over in recent years. (It’s confusing, I know.)

  • Mrs. Sunshine

    Well, if my husband equated me with a cow he owned, that would kill the mood.

  • gimpi1

    Interestingly enough, this was part of the Mormon defense for polygamy. Since they felt that men (but not women) need sex, and they viewed sex where conception was not possible as a sin, they didn’t think a husband should ‘force himself’ on an unwilling wife who was pregnant or recovering from childbirth and nursing, having multiple wives was seen as a solution.

  • gimpi1

    Well-spotted, Blue.

  • teaisbetterthanthis

    So, basically what he’s saying is, as long as the husband doesn’t beat his wife into submission and then hold her down, it’s not rape.

    And even if he DOES, it’s only rape if her usual response is to lie back and look at the flowers; if she is in the habit of putting him off, she deserves it.

    And now I’m going to scream and barf.

  • Wiel

    He misses the main point: even if (IF) she should not refuse her husband sex, HE CANNOT MAKE HER TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR HER PART IN THE MARRIAGE!!! Christianity is NEVER about getting what you’re owed! So even if he’s right about his right to sex, it doesn’t follow that he can demand it…

    In the end, it’s not about her, but about him getting what he wants.

  • Hannah

    Having read some of this guy’s blog (through do no link so he wouldn’t get the hits off it) he thinks polygamy is a splendid idea and if his wife didn’t disapprove of it so much (to the extent she’d divorce him if he tried it,) he’d go right ahead and do it. I bet you he thinks Mormons who practice polygamy (and Mormons in general,) are heretics who are going to hell though. (He also thinks polyandry is totally evil, which is typical and hypocritical as far as I’m concerned.)