Quoting Quiverfull: What it Means to Be Biblically Submissive?

Quoting Quiverfull: What it Means to Be Biblically Submissive? May 2, 2015

quotingquiverfullFound on Minthegap (Is This Modest.com Adam Gregorin) blog leading to Ken Ham’s Answers In Genesis – A Girl Named Ruth

Editor’s note: Ham complains that most Christian children’s books depict the mother with the open Bible reading to the children. This is because even in those ‘sold-out’ Quiverfull Evangelical Fundamentalist extremist homes the fathers don’t do reading to the children, or anything involving teaching or homeschooling. It’s a realistic depiction. Perhaps you need to teach your wonderful Christian males that they need to parent too before blaming it on feminism or overbearing women.

Fathers are to be the overall spiritual head. Whenever and wherever possible, the father’s leadership should be as obvious to the children as it is to the wife. The task of raising godly children in an ungodly world takes teamwork. My wife and I do this together when I am home, and Mally covers for me when I’m on the road ministering. Overall, our children know and observe that I take on the headship role and Mally takes on the helpmate role.

That is the way we were created to function, but in the modern world we often see the opposite; where the mother is leading and the dad is following. This is even reinforced by most Christian children’s books I have seen where mention of spiritual leadership is made. Many of these books will picture a mother with the Bible open reading it to her children, or they will instruct the children to tell their mother something, or ask for her advice. Look closely at the books you have for your children and I am sure you will see that this is a characteristic of many children’s materials available for the Christian market today.

On top of this, more women are becoming increasingly domineering as they take over the position as head of the home. The more I travel and meet families around the world, the more obvious it appears to me that the feminist movement has affected many women in our churches—and this affects the whole family structure.

We are growing up in a world that emphasizes everyone has a right to their own opinions. We are indoctrinated through the public education system and the media that we have our rights. I remember one of the female teachers at a school I taught at in Australia telling the girls in her class “Remember, if you get married, or just live with a guy, you have your rights—you are an individual.” This contradicts God’s design for a husband and wife to be “one,” and this mindset can create serious confusion in the home.

QUOTING QUIVERFULL is a regular feature of NLQ – we present the actual words of noted Quiverfull leaders, cultural enforcers and those that seek to keep women submitted to men and ask our readers: What do you think? Agree? Disagree? This is the place to state your opinion. Please, let’s keep it respectful – but at the same time, we encourage readers to examine the ideas of Quiverfull and Spiritual Abuse honestly and thoughtfully.

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NLQ Recommended Reading …

Quiverfull: Inside the Christian Patriarchy Movement by Kathryn Joyce

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  • SAO

    So, the wife isn’t supposed to be an individual, she is “one” with her husband, who is the head and makes decisions. I think that’s saying that after marriage, the wife disappears.

  • Julia Childress

    He had to go all the way to Australia to find a teacher who told female students that they still have rights, even when in a relationship with a man?

  • Evelyn

    That is exactly what it is saying. I was taught this very openly within CP. God wants women to be non-people unless they give up marriage and children, in which case they are at least individuals with autonomy, just second class citizens.

  • Mel

    No. The disturbing part to me that he was teaching in a public school. I question his ability to educate students effectively equally when he believes women are always subordinate to men. OFC, that probably limited his career within the system b/c that attitude creeps out and slowly eliminates your allies for promotion and increases the number of people looking to hasten your departure. The best part is he wouldn’t necessarily be fired-that could lead to a discrimination lawsuit. No, he’d just be given the most rambunctious classes in subjects he dislikes while being turned down for every request to change…..

  • “We are growing up in a world that emphasizes everyone has right to their own opinions.”
    How terrible. We really should stamp that nonsense out. Clearly white, middle class, Christian men have a right to their own opinion, and everyone else should draw straws to see which righteous patriarch they need to follow.

  • Rebecca Horne

    Um, I’m pretty sure that the reason most children’s books present the mother as the parent the child should go to when they have a question or need something is because mothers are traditionally thought of as the “nice,” “comforting” parent who’s safe to talk to.

    In contrast to the father, who, for at least a handful of decades was generally portrayed as the parent who’s gone all day at work, and who children need to respect, obey and fear.
    “Father knows best,” “don’t bother your father. He’s had a long day at work,” “go to your room and wait until your father comes home!”

    This is not feminism’s fault.

  • Yes. In Ham’s mind, as in Victorian times, the husband and wife are one, and that one is HIM. A woman apparently doesn’t even have the right to her own opinion.

  • Hannah

    Yes, women have rights. How dare we! We fought long and hard for those rights, and you, nor anyone else is going to take them away from us without a fight! Anyway, do these people ever think about who is going to lead the family if the husband dies? Is the wife supposed to just give up and not bother? This dude is an idiot. I would say he wants to drag us back to the Dark Ages but women had more rights then than in later years!

  • Plain English

    What an asshole this guy is… the very best thing for his family is that he is often on the road ruining other families. At least then, he is not around to ruin them. God is merciful! /snark

  • Plain English

    Amen! Opinions are clearly a highway to Hell! Imagine everyone having an opinion!!! Why, we would never get to do laundry or cook dinner and good, God-fearing men all over would despair and stray into, well, everything!

  • Allison the Great

    I remember one of the female teachers at a school I taught at in Australia telling the girls in her class “Remember, if you get married, or just live with a guy, you have your rights—you are an individual. This contradicts God’s design for a husband and wife to be “one,” and this mindset can create serious confusion in the home.

    Yeah, because women aren’t people! They’re the help! We can’t let them have their own opinions! They’re supposed to obey!

  • Plain English

    Now you listen here! You are expressing an opinion and that proves that you don’t know God from Claude. And feminism is full of opinions! By golly, Rebecca Horne, you’re putting good men on the Cross all over again by talking and having opinions. Can’t you just play with the children and make dinner without talking and thinking and all that Satanic stuff?

  • Allison the Great

    I really hope that he was not a science teacher. He is an absolute idiot who doesn’t know the first thing about science. Remember when he tried to “debate” Bill Nye? His only rebuttal was “because bible”. He couldn’t defend his position for shit.

  • Plain English

    And after this dim-wit finishes disrespecting women, he will start on the children. You know, even kids get IDEAS and have OPINIONS. You have to watch that, counsel them to stop all that and if they don’t, count to three and go get the heavy belt! Beat the little sinners for Jesus! Beat them in love until they stay quiet and know God!

  • Olivia

    The worst part about this, well besides everything, is the way he literally blames women for men not being the leaders that they should be. If a man was such a a natural born leader wouldn’t he be able to assume that role without much of a struggle? And yet when men aren’t being leaders that is womens fault for taking it from them.
    I can’t even tell you how often I hear my Evangelical friends complaining about their husbands not being the “spiritual leaders” they are supposed to be. What are they supposed to do? There is no effective strategy to make someone or pray someone into being something they aren’t.

  • Saraquill

    Does this mean that in order to reproduce, Ham should have someone take an ax to his head? Then again, that’s probably too pagan for him.

  • Mel

    It turns out he has four (count’em:4) books on how to refute all modern science arguments on evolution, space and plate tectonics. I’ve order all four used (because I don’t want to pay him directly – although I find him less disturbing than the Pearls, I still don’t like paying him.) I’ve only got 2.5 chapters of “Preparing to Be a Help Meet” left so I’ve been looking for something that appeals to a wide audience without being as emotionally draining as the Pearls.

  • Anonyme

    Plate tectonics? Is that unBiblical now*, too? I mean, plate tectonics?

  • Anonyme

    “We are growing up in a world that emphasizes everyone has a right to their own opinions.”

    I thought God gave us free will, which means our opinions do affect our choices…

  • Allison the Great

    He wrote 4 books about refuting modern evolution, yet he couldn’t use a single one of them against Bill Nye. Interesting!

  • Nicole

    Of course. Earthquakes aren’t the result of moving plates- they are the wrath of god!

  • Petticoat Philosopher

    Yep, that’s how it worked. And here’s the thing: The very same people who wholeheartedly supported the law of coverture in marriage would not have balked even a little at an image of a mother reading the bible to her children. That’s a very classic Victorian sentimental image and nobody would have seen it as being in conflict with a wife’s “proper role.” Religious and moral instruction of children was considered to be the mother’s duty, since the private sphere of the home was seen as women’s domain. Ham doesn’t even want women to have that much! Forget actual feminists, he makes Victorian social conservatives look like radicals!

  • The way to solve this problem is not to allow women to read, have access to books, or learn to read.

  • Kitty

    He doesn’t think that everyone has the right to their own opinions, but he thinks that he has the right to his own facts. Adorable.

  • Yes, true. The idea seems to be that the husband gets the responsibility for both of the “two spheres,” with the wife simply as his deputy in the home sphere. Thus, he is supposed to do everything important, like Bible reading, while she is relegated only to housework and child care. Oh, and homeschooling. . . Hmm. How’s she supposed to do Christianity-promoting homeschooling if she’s not supposed to read the Bible to her kids?

  • Hah. Women who don’t choose marriage and children are considered selfish, and are basically ignored in church. They are not second-class citizens, they are hardly citizens at all– mostly ignored and silenced as having nothing to contribute.

  • gimpi1

    Well, all I can say is that Mr. Ham – who has turned having an outlier opinion (one not supported by any facts at all) into an avocation and career has some pretty big brass ones to condemn ‘the world’ because it, ” … emphasizes everyone has a right to their own opinions.”

    Oh, and the egalitarian ‘mindset’ has not created any confusion in my home. We’re doing fine, thank you. Better than most, in fact. Quite likely better than many families living under patriarchy.

  • gimpi1

    Absolutely. plate tectonics clearly demonstrate the earth’s real age, and it’s not 6,000 years. With a young earth, we couldn’t have had Pangea or Gondwana, the continents wouldn’t have had time to move to their current positions. Additionally, the speed at which they move can’t have been significantly faster than it is now, or that would show in the geologic record. (I’m married to a geologist. Can you tell?)

    Really, there’s no aspect of science that fits with a strict, literal interpretation of the Bible. Astronomy, geology, physics, biology, none of it works with Mr. Ham’s “Answers in Genesis.” Unfortunately, he doesn’t give a damn.

  • gimpi1

    I tried to say the same thing, Kitty, but you said it much more succinctly and better. Well done!

  • EdCoulterStableGenius

    What I find amusing is that people want Ken Ham interfering with their home lives rather than “the gubmint”. At least NASA isn’t trying to tell us people rode dinosaurs to work a few thousand years ago.