Quoting Quiverfull: Sexual Predators Must Be Put To Death?

Quoting Quiverfull: Sexual Predators Must Be Put To Death? September 12, 2015

quotingquiverfullby Tim Bayly of Bayly Blog – The Pastoral Care of Men and Women Who Are Sexual Predators Against Children

Editor’s note: What is absolutely fascinating about this piece and Bayly is that he is clearly calling for the death penalty for pedophiles and predators, yet when called out for it by another pastor in a blog he starts immediately back tracking in another blog posting saying that’s not what he said at all. He’s referring to the awful situation of Doug Wilson supporting a child molester in many of these posts. What is comical about all of this is that if you look at Bayly’s page, starting at the bottom read the articles it’s like this one followed by the bit posted here last night, awful assertion and attack followed by retracting the words he said the very next day. Jeez, pick a position and stick to it dude..what does it say in the Bible about a double minded man?

Let us assume a case in which an adult man1 who confesses faith in Jesus Christ is found guilty in civil and church courts of multiple acts of predatory sexual violence over several years time against minor children unrelated to him by blood or marriage. Regardless of whether this man confessed Christian faith or appeared to be remorseful and repentant, Christians of sound spiritual judgment would, I believe, not condemn the penal codes of many centuries of Christendom which put such a man under sentence of death. We would agree that capital punishment of this crime against children is just to all concerned, from the sinner himself, to his victims and their families, to the church and her members, and society at large. Our Lord warned…

it would be better for a man to have a millstone hung on his neck and be thrown into the sea than to commit such terrible wickedness:

QUOTING QUIVERFULL is a regular feature of NLQ – we present the actual words of noted Quiverfull leaders, cultural enforcers and those that seek to keep women submitted to men and ask our readers: What do you think? Agree? Disagree? This is the place to state your opinion. Please, let’s keep it respectful – but at the same time, we encourage readers to examine the ideas of Quiverfull and Spiritual Abuse honestly and thoughtfully.

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  • As a victim of childhood sexual abuse, I wholeheartedly agree that the perpetrators should be killed.

  • Suzanne Harper Titkemeyer

    I was sexually abused between the ages of 7 and 9 and yeah, I feel the same way… except I’m not sure killing anyone is a deterrent to others doing the same thing.

  • Mel

    I cannot support the death penalty – even when my feelings want to put a perpetrator to death.

    In the USA, the death penalty has never been applied evenly across race, gender, adult age, religion and socioeconomic lines. Bayley can support the death penalty freely because as a white, Christian older male of middle-class SES, it’s highly unlikely that he’d ever be given the death penalty regardless of his crime. On the flip side, if he was a young African-American male who was Muslim and poor, he’d be up against the death penalty.

    The irreversibility of the death penalty also gives me pause. The Innocence Project has found so many cases where people who are on death row are probably or actually innocent.

    To my thinking, a long (multiple decades – 40 years or more without parole or work release) would be suitable punishment. The perpetrator cannot hurt children if they are in jail. Their life in jail will be a living hell. Many of the will not live long enough to be released due to old age or disease. And, in the rare case of false conviction, the person can be freed.

  • SAO

    Obviously, I’m against predatory pedophiles, but problems often arise when trying to define this type of thing. Legally, a minor is under 18. So if we have an 18 yo guy who over the course of a few years dates and sleeps with several 16 and 17 yos, does he get put to death?

    I think the more severe the punishment, the more likely people close to the matter are to not turn the predator in. A typical situation is when a relative is molesting a minor. Let’s say an uncle is molesting his niece who tells her aunt. Now, imagine the aunt — she might think the girl is *probably* telling the truth, but to turn the uncle over to the authorities means his death and he might be innocent. So, what is the aunt going to do? My bet is that she is not going to immediately call the police. She might get there, but that’s not the first thing she’ll do.

    Next, the victim is likely to be told that reporting the molester will cause his death. That’s a lot to have on her conscious, particularly when the victims are often told that they caused the problem. Think of all the upright evangelical leaders who were led astray by teenaged girls.

    In Maya Angelou’s biography, ‘I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings’ she’s raped when she’s 8 by her mother’s boyfriend and her uncles kill the man when she identifies him. She’s so traumatized that she stops speaking at all for a year or more, because her words had the power to kill someone.

  • Mel

    I have not been abused, but my gut feelings want to put the person to death. Myself. With messy, drawn out methods.

    The problem for me comes in the history of the death penalty in the USA. We’d end up killing African-American offenders for statutory rape cases where the 17-year old white “victim” doesn’t want to press charges on her 19 year-old boyfriend/perpetrator, but her parents do while white men of means like Jack Hyles would be given a minimal prison sentence for repeated rape.

  • Age of consent laws vary from state to state and even minors over a certain age are presumed to be able to give consent in all but a handful of states. See this link:


    Only 12 states* make 18 the age of consent. In over half the states (30 plus the District of Columbia)*, 16 is the age of consent. (Sixteen is also the age of consent in all of Canada.) In the other eight states* (for instance, Louisiana, where I live), 17 is the age of consent. Over half the states also have age gap provisions that make it either legal or less of a crime for a 19 year old to have a 17 year old girl or boy friend, as in the example above.

    I wish people would not conflate the age of majority and the age of consent, because they are frequently not the same age, and the age of majority also varies by state in the US. See this link: http://contests.about.com/od/sweepstakes101/a/agemajoristate.htm

    *unless I counted wrong

  • Brennan

    The qualification that he puts on his hypothetical situation are kind of disturbing to me. Are we to assume that he would advocate a lesser punishment if the victims happened to be the perpetrator’s own children or step-children? And if not, then why mention it?

  • Saraquill

    Though I may entertain vengeful thoughts, I can’t support the idea in practice. The thought of a wrongly accused person getting executed is horrifying. Worse, too many cases of lynching went “I think that black guy wants to rape our white rightful property women! Let’s torture him to death and make a public party of it!”

  • SAO

    Well, I thought the blog post referred to “minor” not someone under the age of consent. It’s probably a moot point since who knows what’s in the head of the guy who posted it.

  • Nea

    He very likely would, and there has been more than one attempt to get what is in essence a religious exemption to child abuse laws.

    The reasoning is to make sure that spanking, medical neglect, and withholding food aren’t criminalized.

  • RetroPam

    “Unrelated to him by blood or marriage?”

    Is he saying that it’s less serious when it’s incestuous? Or is he covering his own bases?

    Wondering minds need not wonder too hard, I think. Besides, children, like wives, are just property, right?

  • Joy

    Well said. If even one innocent person is put to death… well, that’s one too many for me.

    I would far rather my tax dollars go to pay for someone to stay in prison for decades. That way, if someone is found to be innocent, they can be freed even if the time that they have unjustly served cannot be given back to them. At least they haven’t lost their life.

    Fortunately, I live in Canada – a country without the death penalty.

  • Joy

    Shockingly, the age of consent used to be 14 in Canada. It was raised to 16 in 2008.

  • Sameera Sheikh

    I was abused by an uncle when I was younger and I still don’t agree with the death penalty- lock them up for life- I’d be happy with that
    Even though we went to the police nothing happened because back then in the UK at least the police had a hands off approach- it was” let them deal with it, it’s part of their culture “which seems unbelievable now

  • gimpi1

    “Let us assume a case in which an adult man who confesses faith in Jesus Christ is found guilty in civil and church courts of multiple acts of predatory sexual violence over several years time against minor children unrelated to him by blood or marriage. “ (Emphasis mine.)

    OK, is anyone else weirded out about the “unrelated by blood or marriage” line? Really, is sexual abuse of your own kids or your wife’s sister’s kids OK? Is that really what he’s implying? Why is abuse of a child unrelated to you worse? Not getting that at all…

    Abuse is evil. It causes great harm that’s darn hard to fix. That harm is not somehow less because a child knew their abuser. Why the caveat?

  • gimpi1

    Good point. I, personally, don’t favor the death penalty in almost any case, because of just what you mention. Our justice system is no where near good enough, error-proof enough, to invoke punishments that we can’t at least attempt to make good on if it turns out that we’re wrong. We can pay someone for time stolen when a wrongful conviction is overturned. Dead is hard to fix.

    The only exceptions I would have is for a Bundy-style of serial killer who had escaped prison. He’s proven that he’s a killer, and that we can’t successfully confine him. In that case, for the safety of everyone, I think we can justify the death penalty.

  • Catherine

    So we’re gonna start with Josh Duggar?