by Mel cross posted from her blog When Cows and Kids Collide
Quotes from the book in blue text.
Quick refresher before we hit the boys. According to the Botkin Sisters, girls should:
- Treat all young guys as they would treat their brother…kind of.
- Don’t flirt, joke, tease, or have deeply personal conversations with boys.
- Be more reserved around guys than girls.
- Realize guys are imperfect and treat them with understanding and charity.
- Have “family friends” rather than individual guy friends.
From James, producer:
- I find the Botkin disapproval of “having fun” annoying as hell.
- I’m curious about the large projects that are neither community-based nor businesses. Are they starting a cult? Creating their own arsenal?
- I call a bullshit on “starting businesses”. Show me one business that the Botkins have successfully run with a woman outside of the family. (Yes, I know that requires showing a successfully run business first; I think TRex Arms is the only one that’s actually gotten off the ground.)
From Paul, missionary:
- I can work with most of this quote.
- The only weird bit is that he studies his flesh-and-blood sisters. That’s an odd way of describing interacting with family.
- Ah….now the crazy comes out. Remember how girls are supposed to interact with gentleness and charity towards imperfect guys? Clearly, this guy doesn’t believe that goes both ways.
- I’m guessing that the “shyness” that Paul finds in girls is probably closer to “Oh, shit. Make this self-righteous ass go away.”
- This does not bode well for his “missionary” career. (Aren’t the Botkin Family anti-missionary to start with?)
- Yeesh. My bet is that Paul is between 17 and 23 years of age and unmarried. This entire quote reeks of self-important theology mixed with no life experience.
From Philip, chef:
Pray for us. Ask the Lord to make us mighty men of faith who will trust and obey Him in all things. We really appreciate when you talk to us, ask us questions, and are willing to patiently listen to us. This shows us you care about us and what we think. Hearing a woman’s perspective is so valuable to us. Your friendship helps us understand how to relate to other girls as your sisters in Christ in all purity (1 Tim. 5:2). Your respect and encouragement inspires us with confidence to be the humble servant-leaders we need to be. And they encourage us to treat you as we ought with more kindness, respect, thoughtfulness, affection and understanding.” (pg 60).
- Phillip was either a hellion as a child or had some messed up younger brothers. If a child is behaving “evilly”, do not pander to their bad behavior. You will be doing him a favor by teaching him that women deserve respect as men do.
- On the flip side, if your younger brother is doing well at a behavior that he’s struggled with, do not start quoting Scripture at him as a reward. I’d recommend a comic book or a small toy if you want to reward him. (My husband opines that you could stop quoting Scripture at him as a reward for good behavior.)
- The second paragraph is the first portion of any quote that shows genuine respect for women.
From Robert, entrepreneur:
But though men will judge her on these relationships, it’s not for marriage that she should have strong relationships. Marriage isn’t enough to motivate a girl to long-term sanctification. While marriage can be a motivator, it shouldn’t be the motivator, and it will not be a redeemer.” (pg. 57)
- I can see how a woman acts in relationships could be a sign of character – as long as she can act unconstrained by societal pressures. I have no idea how that would show if she’s saved or what her calling is. Wait, I thought all women were called to be wives and mothers so what else could she be?
- The fruits of righteousness are knowledge and full insight according to Philippians 1. That feels a bit forced in a family situation. Perhaps he meant “fruits of the Spirit” and got confused.
- The last paragraph is a Bapto-Calvinist mad-lib. The words have meaning and the sentences have syntax, but the net outcome has no cogent meaning.
- Slate magazine recently published an article that was originally titled “If you don’t like small talk, you’re probably bad at it. Robert should read it.
- You will generally see a different side of people who are hungry than well-fed – but that’s not an excuse for passing up social niceties either. Jane Austen said it best:
“I should like balls infinitely better,’ [Caroline Bingly] replied, ‘if they were carried on in a different manner; but there is something insufferably tedious in the usual process of such a meeting. It would surely be much more rational if conversation instead of dancing were made the order of the day.’
‘Much more rational, my dear Caroline, I dare say, but it would not be near so much like a ball.”
- Query: Do men have any responsibility for being good brothers who sharpen women? Do women merely exist as tools for men’s spiritual advancement. Geez, I forgot what book I was reading, didn’t I…..
- Isn’t orthopraxy a sub-discipline of theology?
- God knows that when I want to impress a guy I read up on history to blow his mind…..
- The number of businesses started by “girls” and “boys” that exist 5 years after starting the business is around 50% according to the US government.
- Well, he does seem to kind of appreciate women’s viewpoints.
- I wonder if the Botkins mean Timothy is a shepherd as in a tender of sheep and/or goats or shepherd as in spiritual leader.
- Dude, you are setting up some agonizingly boring conversations. “So, Timothy, how do you feel about healing lepers?” “I’m glad you asked, Peggy Sue…….”
- It’s really strange to me that your sisters in Christ encourage you to be better friends with your siblings when you are presumably old enough to figure that out on your own.
- The purpose of a conversation between non-related men and women are for the women to act as meek sounding boards for the men’s ideas.
- The woman should say “God” or “Jesus” a lot and try to keep conversations as high-minded – a fancy term for stilted and boring – as possible. Conversations should occur while surrounded by your family members and working on a massive project of long-term importance.
- Women might feel self-conscious about being judged by men. Feeling self-conscious about male judgement is a sign of a weak relationship with God on the part of the woman – not immaturity on the part of the man.
Total Quote Count by pseudonym:
Jack – 2
James – 3
Edward – 1
Paul – 3
Philip – 1
Robert – 3
Timothy – 2
Mel is a science teacher who works with at-risk teens and lives on a dairy farm with her husband. She blogs at When Cows and Kids Collide She is also an very valuable source of scientific information for us here at NLQ. Mel is also blessed with the ability to look at the issues of Quiverfull with a rational mind and break them down to their most basic of elements.
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