Eve: The Motion Picture

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From Saturday Night Live, via Hemant Mehta.

What struck me most was the parental nature of God as depicted in the sketch. Disobedience wasn't something surprising, and Eve is not told “Get out of this house, you disobeyed my rules” or something authoritarian like that, but rather than she was going to need to move out on her own sooner or later. I think much of that is true to the symbolism of the story. Human beings are not meant to live in Eden – in childlike innocence – forever. We are supposed to grow up, figuring things out, make mistakes, and become mature.

Also on Adam and Eve, Mike Bird shared a video with Alister McGrath, which is definitely in a different genre than a Saturday Night Like skit.

 

  • http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship Censored

    “Don’t apple-shame me!” LOL! Good stuff.

    Human beings are not meant to live in Eden – in childlike innocence – forever.

    So “original sin” is equivalent to”human Progress?” Thank goodness Eve defied a foolish deity who tried to throttle human development!

    Indeed, such interpretation would be “The progressivist party line” (Diamond, 1987) about the Agricultural revolution as “as an inevitable evolutionary progression,” (Heinberg, 1995) rather than acknowledging that, Biblically, “agricultural labor is portrayed as antithetical to the divine will in the Fall story.” (Myers, 2005)

    So, answer me, Dr. McGrath, with my agricultural degree, am I a vector for original sin or progress—or perhaps they are they one and the same? ;)

    ____________________

    Jared Diamond (May 1987) The Worst Mistake In The History Of The Human Race. Discover Magazine. pp. 64-66. discovermagazine.com/1987/may/02-the-worst-mistake-in-the-history-of-the-human-race

    Richard Heinberg (1995) The Primitivist Critique of Civilization. 24th annual meeting of the International Society for the Comparative Study of Civilizations. Wright State University, Dayton, Ohio. primitivism.com/primitivist-critique.htm

    Ched Myers (2005) The Fall & Anarcho-Primitivism and the Bible. Encyclopedia of Religion and Nature. Edited by Bron Taylor. NY: Continuum. chedmyers.org/articles/ecology-faith/%E2%80%9C-fall%E2%80%9D-and-%E2%80%9Canarcho-primitivism-and-bible

    • Gary

      But nothing was mentioned of “original sin”. I think the term is used by fundamentalists. For me, picking fruit is both fun, and healthful.

      • Gary

        I should have mentioned, for some reason, I don’t think the SNL video is too fundamentalist. Although, perhaps the Republican solution to healthcare is revealed in the skit, “an apple a day, keeps the doctor away…you can’t afford it anyway”…as spoken by Yahweh… err…Rush. Apple-shame, I love it.

      • http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship Censored

        > But nothing was mentioned of “original sin”.

        Best Line: “I know I committed original sin, but at least it’s original and I think I deserve some credit for that.”

        > I think the term is used by fundamentalists.

        Oh, come on now, you’re pulling a Ken Ham.

        BBC – Religions – Christianity: Original sin
        bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/christianity/beliefs/originalsin_1.shtml‎

        CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Original Sin
        newadvent.org/cathen/11312a.htm

        • Gary

          I guess I should have said my definition of fundamentalists. I think, my definition, is if you are sitting in a church pew, and you get it hit over your head. Even Catholics aren’t that bad. If the preacher is telling you all the things you shouldn’t be going, instead of telling you what you should be doing…I don’t know….you have to have been there. Maybe you have.

          • http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship Censored

            Yes, I’ve been there. :) Long time ago.

            Although I did go to Christmas with the neighbors a couple years ago. I was hoping it would just be some singing and reading the traditional stuff, but they have to get in that evangelism dig about coming to church more than Christmas if you’re going to be a good person. f7u12! If it hadn’t been Christmas, I would have just stood up, said “That’s bullshit” and walked out.

            • Gary

              I’ve walked out a few times. But I don’t have the guts to say what I’m thinking, other than whispering to my wife, “I’m out of here”

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/exploringourmatrix/ James F. McGrath

      I think that is present to a greater degree in the Cain and Abel story. In Genesis 3, I see something that is universal in humans – becoming aware of nakedness, becoming responsible for discerning between good and evil, and the sense of lost innocence that accompanies this part of human maturation.

      • http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship Censored

        If loss of innocence is human maturation, then moving beyond the need of salvation is also human maturation.

        “We are as gods and might as well get good at it.” ~Stewart Brand (1968) Whole Earth Catalog

  • Michael Wilson

    I have noted the similarity of the position of Adam and Eve and the dilemma of growing up that children experience, and certainly allows for continued use of this story at a time where being knowledgeable doesn’t seem so bad. I don’t think the Old Testament writers had this in mind, I think the point they wanted to convey was that people die, that sucks, and this is why. Of course its irony is that that we are doomed by the one thing that we think makes humans special, intellect. That’s a pretty common theme in myths, that taking some device of the gods, wisdom or fire, leads to the poverty of the human condition. The Mesopotamians seemed to have a preference for the gods using dirty tricks and impossible test to get to the same spot. writings from the time of J don’t seem to give much hope for reversal, so I don’t think any silver linings are intended for this event, it is just a tragedy that breaks the gods plan for a perfect world free from the corruption of time.

  • stuart32

    When a lion invades another lion’s territory and takes over, the first thing it does is to kill all the cubs sired by the defeated male. Because lions have no sense of right and wrong this is not a sinful act. Sin doesn’t exist in a lion’s world. This raises an interesting question: if lions were to follow an evolutionary path that gave them the kind of sentience that humans have, would they realise at some point that killing cubs is wrong? Presumably they would. At this point sin would enter the lion’s world. This would be the moment when lions experienced their own “Fall”.

    The Fall does not involve any change in the world itself; rather, it is the change in awareness that occurs when a creature reaches a certain level of sentience.

    • Gary

      I hate to be a wet blanket, but the “Numbers” shows that lions and humans are perhaps similar. Except that lions don’t blame it on God. “Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. 18But all the women-children, that have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.”
      The outcome sounds the same for the lions and the humans.

  • stuart32

    Is there a problem with some of the comments? I can see Gary’s comment on the list of recent comments but it isn’t appearing on this thread. I’ve noticed that some of my comments on another thread have disappeared as well.

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/exploringourmatrix/ James F. McGrath

      Which comment can you not see? I see one directly above yours which should be now above mine. Have you set Disqus to order comments differently? Where have your comments disappeared? Let me know and I will look into it.

    • Gary

      I can see all the replies, but I’m not using Disqus.
      “When a lion invades another lion’s territory and takes over, the first thing it does is to kill all the cubs sired by the defeated male.”
      Israelites invade and conquer another’s territory, then find their males cavorting with the wrong females, Peor plague, kill all the females, males, children. Saving some choice virgins.
      Except plague actually caused by God in the first place.Actually, now that I think about it, the lions have a higher moral standing than the humans, or Yahweh!

      • stuart32

        Hello, Gary. I’m not sure if I still exist but I’ll have a go at replying. Now don’t you think you’re being just a little bit cynical? :-)

        • Gary

          Stuart, of course I am being cynical. No need to reply. I am just expressing my cynical opinion.

  • stuart32

    I think what’s happening is that when I’m logged in on disqus I can’t see any replies to my own comments. Presumably, everyone else can see them. It must be something to do with my own access. This is strange.


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