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Daughters of Eve Contributor, Nouvelle Noir Goddess, offers her view on the current debate:
I’ve read numerous thought provoking and inspiring personal testimony by individuals thought on referencing themselves Pagan, Polytheist, or the likes. Each contributor to the debate gave me insight on how at times one feels alienated or together with Pagan community as a collective whole.
In my experience with the African Traditionalist “community” there are even debates on what individuals prefer to call themselves: Yoruba based religions, African Traditional Religion, Pagan, our exact religion name (Ifa, Vodou, Hoodoo, Batuque, ect). We also don’t come into an agreement with names of practitioners (Bruja/Brujos or Curanderas for Spanish speaking practitioners, mainly Mexico, for an example). Even in my native familial country of Haiti there is many divination of what Vodou is. Some believe that monotheism best describes the religion. Since there is a Supreme Deity, who is remote or “active” pending on the practitioner. Monotheism doesn’t have negative connotations for many Haitians. Similar to Catholicism is seen as Monotheist with saints as intermediaries. So, it is with the concept of monotheism in Vodou (and its many forms: Vodun, Vodu, Voodoo,ect) or Fon Religion (Vodou is Fon based not Yoruba based). Nevertheless, there are individual practitioners who find comfort with using the terminology of polytheism/polytheist for they don’t feel the connection with the Supreme deity. At times, the Supreme deity can be “out of sight out of mind.”
There is another growing use of the terminology of “Pagan” and “Wiccan” with many immigrants from Latin American society who still holds onto their indigenous practices. For many immigrants identifying themselves as “Wiccan” is away to inform “the others” who are not of their practice that their religion is “peaceful” and “nature based.” I’ve actually heard Santeria practitioners tell others that they are Wiccan. Their intention is not degrade the actual Wiccans but to inform U.S. unknowledgeable “spectators” that they are not sinister, since Wicca is a religion that most “mainstream” Abraham followers at least heard of or know of. Believe it or not, it does hold less negative stigma to refer oneself as Wiccan than hougan, mambo, Vodou/Santeria practitioners, and the likes. I’m sure Wiccans born in the states and raised in the states may not believe it. Yet, it is these individuals truth. So, many times when I tell individuals that I am Pagan, who are not Pagan, jump into the next question of, “Are you Wiccan?” Wiccan is not seen as a “threat” than being from a religion that is not indigenous or known in the U.S. Yes, there is more awareness of Wicca than any other “Pagan” denominations/faith. This is were I can appreciate non-Wiccans sentiments in feeling alienated by the media.
On the other hand, one thing is for sure within the African Religion based communities: no matter what we call ourselves we are still one. If a Vodou practitioner, not all but for the most part the majority, hear anything negative with their cousin religion of Santeria they will unite as one. For all in all we do share a common ground: being a minority religion, similar but different concepts, similar but different rituals, similar but different history, and an overall sense of appreciation, respect, and understanding.
This I’ve seen within the Christian community, as well. Individual Christian denomination and followers disputing their “Christendom” but when “outsiders” say something…they unite. When it comes to issues they share in common, they unite. Currently there is a debate of Mormons not being a Christian and/or Mormons are Christians. Nevertheless when Mormons were the biggest factor in the opposition for California prop 8 nobody questioned Mormons Christianity. For that brief moment “they” were all Christians. One analogy can I use is family bickering back and forth: cousins, aunts, uncles, siblings, and parents. Yet, if an outsider states anything “foul” about one of the family members—they unite against that outsider. Even if the outsider may state verbatim what an individual family stated… “not ok. They are family! So “I can say whatever I like. YOU can’t” mentality erupts.
This is how I personally feel about the debate currently going on. Yes, it is insightful and a much needed discussion on how individuals feel with the being labeled “Pagan” There is a lesson we can learn from it. Yet, when push comes to shove—we are just any other family. We will unite. We will set our indifferences aside to promote awareness, tolerance, education, and eradicate hatred from those who are “outside” of us. I believe we should at least acknowledge that and embrace it.
The reason people can’t find one name to group all practitioners under or agree upon one name for their beliefs is that they are, for the most part, all independent.
Even when you look back at the roots for most of these practices, there were pretty clear dividing lines between different villages, tribes, etc. We may look back at it and view them all as one “community” of Africans, for instance, but that doesn’t make it true.
I try to stay informed of what’s going on, but not because we are all religious “brothers and singers” and want us all to sing Kumbaya around the campfire. I do it because there is often an overlap in how the practices are treated legislatively and how they are viewed by “mainstream” America. Overall religious awareness and education is important for individual religious survival.
I’ve never heard a practitioner from an ATR refer to themselves as “Pagan” or “Wiccan” as a way of gaining acceptance… That’s kind of entertaining.
It isn’t like the old days where people are going stone you to death for
not following their beliefs. I find it hard to believe that it would an effective technique, though… I someone you
deal with is intimidated by an ATR, I doubt they would be put at-ease because by calling it Wicca instead. lol.
My personal experience has been that people simply don’t
care… They don’t want to know the religious views of other
people. But, then again, I also try to avoid drawing attention to my religion in settings that aren’t really suited for it (like the workplace, for instance).
@ Year of White: This is Nouvelle Noir Goddess. African Traditionalist Religion practitioners are prideful of their religion (if they are immigrants their culture which religion becomes their culture/way of life). Calling oneself “Pagan” and/or “Wiccan” is new. I first became aware of the use about a year and year ½ ago. I was watching the news (Miami Florida: while visiting) regarding Santeria offerings left in a cemetery. One of the practitioners that they interviewed did refer himself as “Wiccan” who practiced Santeria. I was shocked and I did “look” deeply into it and amazed that the title are the norm for immigrants who come upon our shores. You’ll find the use of such label in Miami and Boston.
Many ATR do attend state and/or national Pagan Pride events and/or Awareness. The concept of all of us “keep to ourselves” is not true. Many of “us” are integrating outside the immigrate community. When my parents came into the U.S they refused to raise us in Haitian communities (since we lived in Mass: Boston, Mattapan, Dorchester, Jamaica Plains) ect. So we integrated with the general public. By integrated we would educate others (only if we trust them) of our practices. They refused to raise us there for they felt coming to America also meant to experience the “melting pot” Moving to America to simply remain in a community like our home defeated the purpose. Granted we did visit friends who came to America and lived in the predominately Haitian community. Anyways, my point is—it is not about being a shame of cultural and religious heritage. It is about finding a correlation (give an example) that the others are familiar of so they can understand our belief. I know I have correlated Catholic saints to Catholic Americans and/or Christians who are familiar with Catholic saints to explain to them what the lwa/loa (lwa is French loa is Creole) roles are (intermediaries). Does not mean I am stating that I am Catholic—just makes it easier for individuals to say, “Ok, I get it” Does that make sense?
Thanks for the response, Jacquie.
I do get what you’re saying. …or at least I think I do
And perhaps my original response was due to a misunderstanding on my part (wouldn’t be the first time 
Putting it in terms of similarities makes sense for explanations. If you were explaining the Iwa/Loa to me, you’d probably compare them to the Orisha. I get that.
I guess what I have an issue with is when it goes from explanations of “likeness” to ones of “sameness”. I just feel like sometimes the lines get a bit blurred at times. Catholic Saints are Catholic Saints. Orisha are Orisha.
I guess I might just be a bit too opinionated for my own good, though, too
@ Year in White: Voicing your opinion is good! For it allows individuals to clear up any misconceptions. I’m glad you voiced your opinion for I can go into the issue deeper. It could possibly be how I explained it seemed too vague. Yes, orishas are orishas and saints are saints. The lines will be blurred with some immigrants explaining (I’ve noticed) due to language barriers and words in one language are not easily translated into the next (at times there are no words for a word: or the word looses value when translated into the next). That is why it’s very important for individuals like myself (1st generation 2nd generation who are familiar with their “native tongue” and “new tongue”) to assist on the translation. I’ve noticed that even the English language many individuals take things out of context or not its original meaning. Example: “Person of Interest” in criminology means that a person that may know of something or someone. A person who may give more insight. Yet, I do find that some people take the phrase “person of interest” as “suspect” and/or “guilty one”
So I can see where “foreign base” practitioners explanation and get distorted. Another example: “Just like Wiccans. We are nature-based” can be interpreted to another as “exactly alike. Which means they are the same” Anyways, I can go on but I think you know what I’m getting at (smile).
I just wanted to let you know that I enjoyed reading your insights on the cultural experiences of Haitians and others of similar backgrounds, and how they differ or are similar to each other and American practices. It is very enlightening. Thank you for sharing.
You’re most welcome, Rua Lupa! Delighted to express my thoughts and edify. BB
The reason people can’t find one name to group all practitioners under or agree upon one name for their beliefs is that they are, for the most part, all independent.
Even when you look back at the roots for most of these practices, there were pretty clear dividing lines between different villages, tribes, etc. We may look back at it and view them all as one “community” of Africans, for instance, but that doesn’t make it true.
I try to stay informed of what’s going on, but not because we are all religious “brothers and singers” and want us all to sing Kumbaya around the campfire. I do it because there is often an overlap in how the practices are treated legislatively and how they are viewed by “mainstream” America. Overall religious awareness and education is important for individual religious survival.
I’ve never heard a practitioner from an ATR refer to themselves as “Pagan” or “Wiccan” as a way of gaining acceptance… That’s kind of entertaining.
It isn’t like the old days where people are going stone you to death for
not following their beliefs. I find it hard to believe that it would an effective technique, though… I someone you
deal with is intimidated by an ATR, I doubt they would be put at-ease because by calling it Wicca instead. lol.
My personal experience has been that people simply don’t
care… They don’t want to know the religious views of other
people. But, then again, I also try to avoid drawing attention to my religion in settings that aren’t really suited for it (like the workplace, for instance).
@ Year of White: This is Nouvelle Noir Goddess. African Traditionalist Religion practitioners are prideful of their religion (if they are immigrants their culture which religion becomes their culture/way of life). Calling oneself “Pagan” and/or “Wiccan” is new. I first became aware of the use about a year and year ½ ago. I was watching the news (Miami Florida: while visiting) regarding Santeria offerings left in a cemetery. One of the practitioners that they interviewed did refer himself as “Wiccan” who practiced Santeria. I was shocked and I did “look” deeply into it and amazed that the title are the norm for immigrants who come upon our shores. You’ll find the use of such label in Miami and Boston.
Many ATR do attend state and/or national Pagan Pride events and/or Awareness. The concept of all of us “keep to ourselves” is not true. Many of “us” are integrating outside the immigrate community. When my parents came into the U.S they refused to raise us in Haitian communities (since we lived in Mass: Boston, Mattapan, Dorchester, Jamaica Plains) ect. So we integrated with the general public. By integrated we would educate others (only if we trust them) of our practices. They refused to raise us there for they felt coming to America also meant to experience the “melting pot” Moving to America to simply remain in a community like our home defeated the purpose. Granted we did visit friends who came to America and lived in the predominately Haitian community. Anyways, my point is—it is not about being a shame of cultural and religious heritage. It is about finding a correlation (give an example) that the others are familiar of so they can understand our belief. I know I have correlated Catholic saints to Catholic Americans and/or Christians who are familiar with Catholic saints to explain to them what the lwa/loa (lwa is French loa is Creole) roles are (intermediaries). Does not mean I am stating that I am Catholic—just makes it easier for individuals to say, “Ok, I get it” Does that make sense?
Thanks for the response, Jacquie.
I do get what you’re saying. …or at least I think I do
And perhaps my original response was due to a misunderstanding on my part (wouldn’t be the first time 
Putting it in terms of similarities makes sense for explanations. If you were explaining the Iwa/Loa to me, you’d probably compare them to the Orisha. I get that.
I guess what I have an issue with is when it goes from explanations of “likeness” to ones of “sameness”. I just feel like sometimes the lines get a bit blurred at times. Catholic Saints are Catholic Saints. Orisha are Orisha.
I guess I might just be a bit too opinionated for my own good, though, too
@ Year in White: Voicing your opinion is good! For it allows individuals to clear up any misconceptions. I’m glad you voiced your opinion for I can go into the issue deeper. It could possibly be how I explained it seemed too vague. Yes, orishas are orishas and saints are saints. The lines will be blurred with some immigrants explaining (I’ve noticed) due to language barriers and words in one language are not easily translated into the next (at times there are no words for a word: or the word looses value when translated into the next). That is why it’s very important for individuals like myself (1st generation 2nd generation who are familiar with their “native tongue” and “new tongue”) to assist on the translation. I’ve noticed that even the English language many individuals take things out of context or not its original meaning. Example: “Person of Interest” in criminology means that a person that may know of something or someone. A person who may give more insight. Yet, I do find that some people take the phrase “person of interest” as “suspect” and/or “guilty one”
So I can see where “foreign base” practitioners explanation and get distorted. Another example: “Just like Wiccans. We are nature-based” can be interpreted to another as “exactly alike. Which means they are the same” Anyways, I can go on but I think you know what I’m getting at (smile).
I just wanted to let you know that I enjoyed reading your insights on the cultural experiences of Haitians and others of similar backgrounds, and how they differ or are similar to each other and American practices. It is very enlightening. Thank you for sharing.
You’re most welcome, Rua Lupa! Delighted to express my thoughts and edify. BB
*Agrees with Nouvelle Noir Goddess*
*Agrees with Nouvelle Noir Goddess*