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As the police state evolves, more of these people find an ecological niche in police work:
A post-Christian state is going to feature more and more of this kind of authoritarian violence against the weak.
The response is telling, “Well, she struck first.” Because this is obviously a playground.
(Who grabs anyone from behind/out of sight without notice for a legitimate purpose, unless it’s rescuing them from danger? This girl was walking down the hall. For what purpose was she grabbed to begin with? Yes, she lashed out after being grabbed, but I probably would, too.)
The cop said the girl struck first….really!?!? So that makes it ok to slug her? You can restrain someone without hitting them. If this was some thug from the street, the ACLU would be all over this.
The ACLU would only be interested in this if the cop was white.
The fact we are rapidly slipping into a police state I won’t
dispute. The evidence is plentiful.
Is this a good example of that? I don’t think so.
In a perfect world we would invite Mark, the public defenders,
and the news reporters into the mental health facility, pay them minimum wage and allow them to show us mouthbreathers how to run the show.
Did you notice that the public defenders and the news media
were critical of both physical and medical restraints? How would they handle out of control mental patients? How would you Mark?
I guess you could just let them go. Then when they wander out into traffic and get killed, their parents, who didn’t bother to visit the child on thanksgiving or
Christmas are suing the center and all the staff for negligence.
The cop should have shown more restraint, but that situation was going to get violent one way or another. I have more respect for him than those passing judgment for how he handled a difficult situation.
It is easy to sit on the sidelines, not ever get involved in
any situation like this, and then become critics of those who have no choice
but to get involved.
I challenge any of you who agree with the tone of this story
to go and volunteer at a mental health facility. Tell them you want to be hands on direct contact staff.
See how you handle a 300 pound 15 year old who is slinging his feces all over the place because he isn’t allowed to play the X-box until he takes a shower.
Show us how to handle such a case nonviolently without physical or medical restraints.
You’ve got a point. But psychiatric nurses are trained in using restraint that involves the least possible damage or danger. It doesn’t look as if this cop was, and that could be a problem. Here in Britain, we have had several cases of healthy adults just suddenly dying while being restrained by the police. So personally I worry.
It is good to be concerned, but a lot of assumptions are being made here. Why were the cops called in the first place? Why isn’t that information provided? The cops handled it their way, which certainly isn’t the best way. Like you said, they aren’t trained in best way to handle such situations, and I am not saying this is a best practice. Cops are wired to react quickly, instinctively against violence. It isn’t that easy to turn on and off. BTW, I would love to see the restraint some of these other posters would actually show if they were the ones being punched, even if by a 14 year old mental patient.
Let me get this straight you have more respect for a cop who grabs a metally ill 15 year old girl from behind – obviously scaring her – and then proceeds to punch her full in the mouth when she swats at him, than you do for people who say such behavior it wrong? You stay classy Mo!
But then again, we had people here yesterday defending the the incineration of innocents so I guess it shouldn’t surprise me that someone would show up to defend punching 15 year old girls in the mouth today!
Yes, as it stands right now, with the information I currently have, and 10 years experience working with mentally disturbed youth. I absolutely have more respect for the cop who punched that girl than I do for you.
Do the rest of us in the field a favor and find a new career path, Mo.
Have you ever been responsible for physically stopping one human being from harming another? Or harming themselves?
No one likes to see violence against a child, but the fact is everyday mental health professionals find themselves in situations where they have to physically intervene to protect mental patients from other mental patients. Even with the best training and most experienced staff, physically controlling another person is a violent act. It is also dangerous for both the patient and staff members. Restraint beds and chemical restraints are much safer for a patient than having to constantly physically restrain the same patient over and over again. I don’t know if the laws are the same everywhere, but a nurse had to be present to supervise either use of restraint bed on chemical restraint, and these situations were very rare, The place I worked probably should have used them more, because injury is less likely to occur in those situations than in a situation where you have 2 or 3 staff having to constantly wrestle with a patient. It exhausts both staff and patients, and makes the other residents less safe because they can’t be properly supervised when all the staff are trying to physically control a patient.
It is a violent job, very, very stressful, and I was being paid less the 7 dollars an hour for doing it. At least I only had to do it for 8 hours shifts, some facilities were so short staffed that they worked 60 to 80 hour work weeks.
But Thank you for your support.
Please show me where in your policies for restraint is included the option to punch a child in the face.
I hope a cop grabs you from behind and punches you in the face.
ETA: I don’t literally want that. But if you think it’s okay for cops to grab people from behind and punch them in the face, you shouldn’t mind being grabbed from behind and punched in the face.
Physical restraints are one thing. I could see a justification to physically RESTRAIN a severely disturbed person, especially if he/she was a threat to themselves or others. But to punch to a teen for what I just saw?!! Uhhh…no. The only thing that child was threatening was that “mouthbreather’s” ego. Please remember. These people are at such facilities because they need help. Workers here are supposed to be serving these patients and helping them. Tough grueling thankless work, I know. But punching someone until they listen to you is not what these poor souls need. I have nothing but the most respect for people that work in psychiatric wards. I have a family member that does, who often expresses how hard it can be. But I’ve never heard of some child getting punched in the face. Shame on that cop!
“Punching someone till they listen to you” ? Really? That’s what you saw? Someone working on a psych ward would rarely throw a punch, and probably never throw a punch if a child was involved, but they are trained in ways to restrain someone to try and minimize risk of injury to patient and staff, but it is still a violent thing to have to physically get control another person, even a child. The police on the other hand are not trained in this way. They probably should be. I just ask you not to be too quick to judge. A very good person could react violently to being punched, especially if they are under a lot of stress. I have seen it more than once. They cop seemed to over react, and in a dangerous way, but it was a split second reaction to being hit. It you fail to take that into account then you just aren’t being realistic.
Cops these days don’t seem very manly. A real man probably wouldn’t care if a 14-year-old girl struck him. Seriously, why don’t these guys man up?
Whether or not the officer was in the right, this is ridiculous. It is possible for a 14 year old to commit violence that requires a response. It is possible for a 14 year old to commit murder.
While it doesn’t look to me like this is a case where the officer responded properly, it’s the bulk strength, and intent that is much more important than the age.
Our police are becoming increasingly violent because our populace is becoming increasingly violent. Most of us don’t live in Mayberry and there is a reason cops don’t act like Andy. The increasingly violent work environment has the downside of attracting cops who can tolerate it and harden themselves to it and a downward cycle commences. The same thing has happened to staff in our prison systems and mental hospitals. I have even seen a similar shift in hospitals where the inpatient care is so heavy and intense due to cutbacks that nurses and other healthcare workers are becoming increasingly hardened emotionally.
Another problem being compounded is lack of respect for the authority of the police. Many people are getting hurt or even killed because they think they don’t have to do what they are told to do in the heat of the moment and will fight back. People who respect the job of the police will work with them, not against them, even when a misunderstanding occurs knowing it can be sorted out later when the situation has settled down. These people don’t find themselves pulled out of cars and thrown to the pavement with a gun behind their ear and a foot on their neck because they’d never give the cop a reason to do it, right or wrong.
Your argument is beyond ridiculous. Violent crime has been declining in America for at least five years, and property crime has been declining for ten years.
It’s not ridiculous at all. You just haven’t picked the right population from which to quote your statistics.
I’ll ignore the fact that you ignored the increase in lethality of the weapons and ammunition criminals use against police, such as assault weapons. That was a game changer for police departments.
The statistics you need to look at are crimes against the police. Violent crime has been around a long, long time but the use of force against the police themselves is a newer and rising trend.
Do you even read your own sources? Trace your third-hand Yahoo! opinion piece of garbage back to its original source for the hard data:
Total LEO Fatalities Nationwide:
2013: 61 (as of August 9, 2013)
So no, violence against law-enforcement officers has NOT been increasing over the last five years at all. There was an anomalous rise in 2010-2011, that disrupted an overall DECLINE for at least the past TEN years.
And even if your assertion were true–which it most definitely is not–that still wouldn’t justify a cop punching an UNARMED 14-YEAR OLD GIRL in the face.
You are presenting an example of the archetypal modern-day Pharisee mentality: subservient deference to the Strong & Powerful, and dismissive scorn for the Weak & Persecuted. Such an attitude is the exact OPPOSITE of what Jesus preached and exactly what keeps me far from any modern “Christian” church.
did you look at the breakdown of death by cause?
2008 40 gsw, 3 assault
2009 47 gsw, 1 assault
2010 59 gsw, 6 assault
2011 67 gsw, 5 assault
The numbers of gsw start decreasing in 2012, Perhaps because police were going on the offense earlier in response to rising agressiveness in their encounters with criminals.
So the kid had it coming?
I don’t know because the video you posted tells us nothing about what led up to the encounter (and the summoning of the police) or how much the 14 yr old knows about right and wrong behavior. I’m not willing to throw the cop under the bus, who may have acted completely within reason, just to score a point.
Sorry there is simply no excuse for the punch that cop threw. No. Excuse.
That is your opinion only. Reasonable people can disagree that justification was impossible. You know nothing, or at least offered nothing about the situation, the cop’s reasoning, or the girl’s state of mind – all of which can make a difference in judging the appropriateness of the cop’s actions. Maybe she just beat another ‘inmate’ into unconsciousness.
Does it not seem that your stretching to imagine the circumstances where this particular act of brutality might be mitigated?
Why reach for a libelous, “Maybe she beat someone into unconsciousness,” when a very plain and brutal enough reality is placed before us.
Here is the research you should have done to give the whole story, not just the part that fits your narrative on the emerging police state.
At this point, the “riot” was over. She was walking down the hall, and the cop grabbed her from behind. Unless she was quickly given a fair trial and sentenced to getting grabbed from behind and punched in the face, this still fits the narrative on the emerging police state.
The video does not have audio. My guess is the cop called to her to stop repeatedly and she ignored him before he laid a hand on her. If so, that makes her response very intentional and she deserved being taken down as quickly as possible after assaulting the officer and then trying to run away.
Bottom line for me – I will assume the best of a cop until proven otherwise because I think there is good reason to give a cop the benefit of the doubt over a 14 yr old who is locked up in a mental institution. Do any of you realize what it takes to get locked up these days? My guess is that girl is seriously dangerous and has a history of criminal behavior.
I’ll assume the best of a cop when cops assume the best of the 14 year old girl whose face they’re punching. Why does the cop deserve any more benefit of the doubt than he gave that girl?
Because she’s locked up for a reason and he puts his life on the line for people like you everytime he goes to work. If you can’t tell the difference that’s your problem.
Who’s life was on the line when he was beating up that girl? Not his.
Cops can either get credit for risking their lives, or they can beat up everyone who’s conceivably a threat. They can’t do both; you’re not a brave hero putting your life on the line if you’re beating up 14 year old girls to protect yourself.
He doesn’t have to suffer bodily injury either just because he’s a cop and she is a 14 year old girl. But then you already know that don’t you? When was the last time you had a job where everytime you went to work it was questionable if you would come home again? I thought not. You’re probably just an angry armchair critic.
Next time you need one of these evil policemen to come and save you from a criminal, please think twice and be sure the criminal is really going to kill you first. Anything else is apparently not a just cause for police violence in your opinion and you shouldn’t contribute to this horrible problem.
When was any threat posed to the cop? He came up from behind and grabbed her. Was he in danger when he was walking behind her? Was he in danger when she hit him in his shoulder? Was he in danger between the first and second time he punched her in the face? Was he in danger when he was macing her?
The cop was never in danger. He had another cop and two orderlies or nurses. He approaches the girl from behind and then takes two hits (apparently) to the shoulder. Unless this girl was Black Widow or Buffy the vampire slayer, he faced as much threat as I face right now. Unlike him, I’m not beating up a teenage girl.
ETA: If a cop is that threatened by a fourteen year old girl when he outnumbers her 4:1, then he needs more training before we put him out on the streets – What if he only outnumbered her 3:1, or she was 15?
Hey, people like you don’t deserve to be called a nurse. You only care about who was the mentally stable one in the situation. Maybe there was a good reason for they way he first responded. You can not argue that all of that was ok. Maybe she put herself in the hospital to seek help for her mental disabilities, she may have reached for his gun and that’s not ok either! But who do you think you are to judge a situation like that. Btw it doesn’t take a lot to get locked up these days. I would know, I was locked up for a year, I put myself in there because I wanted what was best for me. I was 13 when I went in and I’m 14 now! Just because she’s not the most stable person in the situation doesn’t mean she is at fault. How can you call yourself a nurse? You don’t care about anyone but yourself! There are several different possible reasons that could have lead up to this event that we don’t know! ” we are entitled to our own opinions, not our own facts” is something that a staff told me once! Maybe you should start looking for a new job, maybe you can go work at mcdonalds where no ones wants to hear what think about them, get lost jerk!
The punch was brutal and dangerous, but it was a split second reaction, to being hit. I don’t think it was premeditated or vengeful. The macing? Maybe that was vengeful. Not a good week for the police, It seems like they are imposing themselves in situations more and more where they have no business. In this case though, I believe the police were called, and if things were so bad the police had to be called, it was probably a bad situation. Remember, the police have a tough job.
If cops can’t have better split-second reactions, we shouldn’t trust them with the power that they have. No one made the poor little nervous police officer become a cop. If his job is too tough for him, he should find a new line of work.
It’s not something they have control over jroberts. Maybe with training they could learn more restraint. There are people who would naturally restrain themselves in these situations, these are the people that we need policing us. Unfortunately, it seems people like that aren’t attracted to police work.
I’d rather take my chances with an undersupply of cops than with an oversupply of cops with bad nerves.
If authority is randomly grabbing people from behind and punching them in the face, authority doesn’t deserve respect.
So that’s what happened? The cops showed up at this place out of the blue? We’re they just driving by the center and thought, hey, lets us go in here and have some fun? They go in, the cop “randomly” sees this kid and tries to grab her? What a joke! Have you even considered that maybe the police were called there to arrest that specific kid? She was charged with resisting arrest.
The cop tried to grab a kid, she threw two punches at him and he reacted. That’s what actually happened. On one hand I can understand you wanting to be protective of a mentally ill patient, You can criticize the policeman for over reacting to being punched. Don’t misrepresent what actually happened just so you can hate.
The girl’s being escorted down the hall by two orderlies or nurses. One is standing immediately behind her, possibly touching her already. One is in front of her. There’s another cop a few feet behind and to the right. If the cop was there to arrest her, the cop can do so without suddenly grabbing her.
I wonder why there might be growing lack of respect for the authority of the police? I wonder if it might have something to do with stories like this one. For many folks, “Protect and Serve” is slowing becoming “Obey or Else.”
As a parent of a 12 year old boy who has severe autism and behavioral problems I side heavily against the cop here. He was/is poorly trained for this scenario and anyone with that kind of hair trigger with respect to someone who is mentally ill, let alone a mentally ill child needs serious retraining or reassignment. I can assure you if you put your hands on my son in the same manner he’d wack you too. It is reflexive as he has serious stimulus problems that are beyond his control. The cop, according to the story used 4 closed fisted blows to the girl’s face. Four. Then, when she was down, he maced her for good measure. If a man that size, backed up by three other officers cannot handle this child he is in the wrong line of work. She was being escorted by orderlies and the cop should have simply told the orderlies he needed her to go here or there or that she was being detained. They very likely would have instructed the officer on the best way to reach a successful conclusion. Nope, can’t have that. Let’s not use our brains here, let’s just open the manual to page one where it says “every citizen is a criminal so overwhelming force is always appropriate.” Line two of the manual says things like “officer safety” and “thought she was going for my gun” and “resisting arrest”. I am pro-cop as the next guy but if you can’t manage your brute force when dealing with mentally ill children when do you think you’d be able to do so? Fluffy bunnies and kittens maybe?