even atheists are redeemed… NOT!

even atheists are redeemed… NOT! May 25, 2013
even atheists are redeemed not cartoon by nakedpastor david hayward
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There was quite a buzz last week when Pope Francis said that even atheists could be redeemed.

So atheists were not only redeemed, but also impressed.

But it wasn’t too long before a Vatican spokesman came out with a corrective: people who know about the Catholic church can’t be saved if they refuse to enter it or remain in it.

It just proves again that we aren’t just dealing with people, but also with systems. Even the most powerful and influential Christian in the world, the pope, is subject to a system called the church.

It takes individual courage, patience and persistence for truth and justice to prevail.

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  • Adam Julians

    This pope sounds like a good guy! 🙂

  • God forbid we let “them” join our group…we’re not like them! (Rolls eyeballs)

  • Ignatz

    No, he didn’t say “atheists still go to hell. Read the second paragraph.

    The church believes that “The Church” exists in heaven as well as on earth. Heaven actually IS “The Church.”

    The Rev. Thomas Rosica, a Vatican spokesman, said that people who
    aware of the Catholic church “cannot be saved” if they “refuse to enter
    her or remain in her.”

    At the same time, Rosica writes, “every man or woman, whatever their
    situation, can be saved. Even non-Christians can respond to this saving
    action of the Spirit. No person is excluded from salvation simply
    because of so-called original sin.”

  • Few points:

    (1) The Media

    Liberal media was all about having the Pope as inclusive — sort of a stab at conservatives and not at all trying to understand what the Pope said. The media is not our friend, we must be skeptical there too. People will use the Pope as a puppet, at the drop of a hat. Much as has been done with Jesus from the beginning. Who knows what the Pope really intended to say. Who cares! Not me.

    (2) What is the Point?

    When someone said something to the effect “If atheists are saved, what is the point?” They nailed down one of the major reasons atheists are such a threat.

    (3) What counts as “Atheist”?

    Since the vast majority of believers are theological naive, biblically naive and can be easily be shown to hold heretical ideas in their theological confusion, they are very atheist like in that they don’t believe what they are suppose to but just happen to call themselves “Christians” — to them it is a tribe, a club, a signals to others that “you can trust me, I belong.”

  • Sounds like the world needs a Good Guy Pope Meme

  • Things are a bit more complicated than this post (or the CNN link) make it out to be.

    Frustratingly, CNN does not reproduce the entirety of Fr. Rosica’s statement—nor does it appear to be available anywhere else online. Instead, CNN paraphrases the most essential portion of the statement:

    The Rev. Thomas Rosica, a Vatican spokesman, said that people who aware of the Catholic church “cannot be saved” if they “refuse to enter her or remain in her.”

    The issue here is what is meant by “awareness of the Catholic church.” In the absence of Fr. Rosica’s full statement, we’ll have to have recourse to the Catechism. In a section entitled “Outside the Church there is no salvation,” the Catechism provides a citation from the Vatican II document Lumen Gentium which reads: “Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it” (CCC 846, my emphasis).

    It appears—in this context—that knowledge of the Church involves not simply knowledge of its existence (as the CNN article seems to imply) but, in fact, knowledge of its truth. Whether Fr. Rosica makes this clear or not in his own statement—which certainly does reproduce some of the language of Lumen Gentium—remains, unfortunately, unclear due to CNN’s editing of the statement.

  • Literal Hell is on it’s way out.


  • Dawn

    Because ignorant people take words out of context and twist them to their own interpretation, it’s the Church’s fault? How does that work exactly?

    CCC 1026 says “By his death and Resurrection, Jesus Christ has “opened” heaven to us.”

    Just because the door is open doesn’t mean that everyone will make it inside. That is up to God.

  • “Redeemed” doesn’t mean what you seem to think it means: http://coolingtwilight.com/universal-pope/

  • randomfactor

    There are two types of Christians: Those who believe in a literal Hell, and the good kind.

  • Alexandr Sasha Flek

    Poor journalism. The Rev. Thomas Rosica, is NOT “a Vatican spokesman”. He wrote his own theological mussings, but, of course, ever fancied to speak for the whole church and “correct the pope”. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Rosica