What is the Endgame for Evangelical Christians and Trump?

What is the Endgame for Evangelical Christians and Trump? February 26, 2019

Okay I want to discuss something that is vexing to me. I try to understand where people are coming from. But I must admit that I fail to fully comprehend why there is continual evangelical support of Trump.

When I argued with my evangelical friends about their support of Trump I received many answers from them for why they were willing to provide such support. But one of the most common reasons given to me was that they were afraid of Clinton. One of the common statements I heard was that they knew Clinton was going to come after them. But Trump would leave them alone. Indeed, I must say that the way Clinton ran her campaign only fed into such fears.

Okay, so I get why some Christians voted for Trump. I think they are wrong, but for them it can be a matter of the lesser evil. Trump was the lesser of unpleasant choices. I understand because the choices were unpleasant for me as well. If a gun were put to my head and I had to pick one of the two, then I would have gone for Clinton. But that does not mean that I do not appreciate how loathsome of an option she would have represented. Fortunately for me, I found the American Solidarity Party, and I will probably stay with them until at least one of our political parties becomes sane.

So I am not vexed by the choice of many evangelicals to vote for Trump. I think it wrongheaded but I get why they did it. What vexes me is their continued support for Trump. Evangelicals have been his biggest supporters in his policies and seem to be the most loyal to him. They have ignored his immoralities and shortcomings in ways they clearly would not have done for Democrats. It is a blind loyalty that he is unworthy to receive.

My general inclination is that this is part of the same strategy to use political power to gain protection from Christianophobia that led them to support Trump in the first place. No one has to tell me of the reality of Christianophobia in the United States. I have done more academic work on this subject than any other researcher. So I do not begrudge Christians taking steps to deal with this type of bigotry. But if we are going to take steps, then they should be smart steps. The continued support of Trump is not a smart step.

One could argue that voting Trump into office may have delayed providing some Christianophobes power for at least a few years. But the continued linking of our Christian faith to Trump will eventually provide them with more power. This support will call our legitimacy into question which will provide those with Christianophobia the license they need to block Christians from the public square. Rather than using this temporary period of relief to prepare for a time after Trump, many Christians are merely digging a bigger hole for themselves with their blind support for him. And selfishly, they are creating that hole even for Christians like myself who do not like Trump.

Let me put it this way. What is the endgame to providing this unworthy support to Trump? Is there an endgame that goes beyond 2020? Okay let’s say that Trump wins reelection. Is there an endgame that goes beyond 2024? Is that endgame to simply support the next Republican and ride this gravy train as long as possible? If that is the endgame then it is very shortsighted and doomed to fail.

I need to remind these Christians that eventually we will have a Democrat president again. I know given some of the shenanigans some Democrats have engaged in (vilifying teenage boys was not the proudest moment for American progressives) that it is tempting to think that we will never see another Democrat as president. But of course that is not a realistic expectation. Eventually there will be another Democrat who will be our president and when that occurs, then all of the pent-up anger at those supporting our current race-baiting, sexist, man-child president will be let loose. I fear that as much as we had Christianophobia before, we will see nothing yet the next time a Democrat wins the presidency.

This potential reality can be used to justify even more support for Trump and the Republicans. But such a strategy only postpones the inevitable. I implore my fellow Christians to consider a more long-term plan to deal with Christianophobia. Riding and falling with political victories and defeats is not the sort of plan we should have and this type of approach makes it harder for us to not demonize our political opponents.

So what would be a better way? Building up our Christian communities is the proper long term approach for dealing with Christianophobia rather than political idolatry. If we have strong Christian communities, we can develop the ability to deliver powerful Christian values to our youth. We can create a role in the larger society where we can set examples that will lead us to be appreciated more and vilified less. We can support one another and recover the loss of touch that is so evident in this fractured online world. And we will not have to rely upon political leaders to sustain us. We can, by and large, sustain ourselves, as well as serve others.

I am not saying that Christians should not be involved in politics. Indeed, there will be a need to have a political front that allows us to have some protection from the worst impulses of some Christianophobes. But we must not live or die by the latest election. And we must remain independent enough so that we can criticize both major political parties as we see fit. A strong Christian community, rather than political power is the true key to withstanding the current anti-Christian mood of so many cultural elites today.

If the election of Trump has given us temporary safe harbor, then let’s use it wisely. Throwing our moral capital away defending Trump at almost every turn is not a wise way to use this time. Building up our economic and educational institutions is a wise use of our time. Finding creative ways to strengthen our kids for a post-Christian world is a wise use of our time. Working to impact the cultural institutions in our society, such as the arts, academia and the media, is a wise use of our time. The time may come when we are not as free to engage in such activities when the political tides turn. If that time comes then we will be quite unhappy that we wasted time supporting this president instead of building our communities.

I am willing to work with other Christians across denominations and racial groups to help strengthen our Christian communities. I am much more interested in doing that than in fighting the next political battle. I hope in time more Christians will consider the futility of this current long-term political plan and join those of us who are concerned with the development of Christian community. I think they will find that our arms are open to their contributions, and we will welcome their efforts to continue a viable long term preparation for the coming post-Christian society.

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  • Joslyn Renfrey

    When the soviets collapsed the german east front in world war 2, the germans fought twice as hard all the way back to berlin to hold them back compared to when they first invaded, because they knew what they had done to the russian towns they had taken, now devoid of life, and they knew the red army were furious, and that Nikita Khrushev would make them pay in blood.

    Just like the italians, your nominal allies against us, the catholic church, are now folding on themselves in the wake of the sexual abuse crisis. Make no mistake, Trump is your last hope, but not just for the once-slavers who will meet their retribution from the peoples they once trampled under foot, but the once-holy who executed us queer folk for the worse part of a thousand years. Most of your forces are baby boomers desperately clinging onto an already dead culture that are quickly going senile and dying off from old age.

    • *tears* I am a trans woman, so driven out of the Church a decade ago…

      • Joslyn Renfrey

        I mean there are many friendly denominations that trans people can go to; there are good church and good christians out there, but they often aren’t as evangelical.

        • Hi Joslyn, I have moved beyond Christianity as it is understood by most people…

          …It seems that the whole point of life is to learn to love others and to learn to be loved. I focus on this, and my bond with God has become deeper beyond my comprehension…

          …I am in a place of increasing non-duality where I have found that I can love even those who hate me. I have transcended Christianity, the faith that formed me spiritually, yet it is still a part of me; I still follow Christ, but my sense of Christ is both beyond and includes Jesus (think of the pre-incarnate Christ here). Christ is part of me, and ALL of humanity (and we are part of Christ), and Christ manifests in me in the way I treat others and myself in Love. And I am Beloved, and I clearly know this by mystical experience that is more substantive than any doctrine I once depended upon.

          Love, Blessings & Joy!!

      • Alan Drake

        I left the faith I was raised in, Southern Baptist, because of their past history (defense of slavery and semi-slavery Jim Crow stand out) and current promotion of evil (Dr. Land’s Letter calling out War of Aggression in Iraq a “Just War” & the 2007 (from memory) SBC resolution to do nothing at all about Climate Change plus a strident anti-LBGTQ position). After searching, I became convinced (not converted) to become a Quaker.

        As a Friend, I have developed a personal relationship with the Holy Spirit.

        Every Meeting is different, but I encourage you to attend a Meeting if there is one near you.

        Best Hopes and Love !

        • Thank You for your suggestion Alan. I have attended Meetings before, and I have discovered that I always had more in common with Quakers than the Southern Baptist Church (SBC) where I was first introduced to Christ as a young adult (by a friend/mentor)…

          …I have always had a strongly mystical-contemplative “side” which was deemed “suspect” in the SBC, even as people often said they saw Jesus in me.

          Where I am now spiritually, I could only visit with other followers of Jesus in various congregations, as I have transcended the (Christian) Church into an even larger Body that includes all of humanity, in the widest sense of Christ (of whom Jesus was one exemplar: think of the pre-incarnate Christ). My faith-family has now become incomprehensibly larger and cannot fit in a congregation, denomination, people-group, nation, religion, nor any other human division.

          Love, Blessings & Joy!!

  • Alpha 1

    I think most (white) evangelicals support Trump for the same reason republicans in general support Trump: because they like what he’s doing. They see the cruelty, resentment and bigotry of his movement and they want more of it, which is why his approval rating among evangelicals is consistently high. Dissenters are called baby-murdering heretics and are driven out of the church or forced to stay silent. So evangelicalism as a whole will keep radicalizing to the right. If it has any growth, it will come from conservatives who didn’t care about religion but see evangelicalism as a cultural expression in opposition to liberals, trans people, muslims, and “globalists.”

    With that in mind, I think the future of evangelicalism in America looks something like this: Because Trumpism is so culturally toxic, evangelicalism will lose whatever respectability or moral authority it had. Since they drove out dissenters, exist within the conservative media bubble, and resent the wider culture for not deferring to them and the social hierarchies they support, evangelicals will only double down on their right wing politics. The resulting movement may be large in absolute numbers, but it would be culturally marginalized at best and socially toxic outside of right-wing enclaves at worst. Post-Trump evangelicalism would probably exist as a radical but impotent reactionary movement, waiting for a new leader crush their enemies, put their lessers in their place, and bring them to the promised land of a white ethnostate. But when that leader comes, those radicalized evangelicals will serve him as faithfully as they served Trump.

    • Flint8ball

      Well said. Evangelicals seem to be quite far from the jesus in the bible. I’m painting with a broad brush, but I think their hate for gay people and abortion overrides everything. Once a child is born it’s value seems to diminish tho. Very strange.

      • Alpha 1

        I’m sure this has been said before, but they stop caring about babies once they’re born because it was never about fetuses. It’s been noted for years that if evangelicals really believed abortion was a modern holocaust, they would do more to stop it than vote republican and post about it. The anti-abortion movement makes more sense when you realize it’s a beta version of Pizzagate or QAnon. It’s a way to get mad and feel righteous without doing anything, and what better way to do that than pretending you’re a warrior for righteousness against baby-murdering, satan-worshipping nazis? It’s fun to talk about how the babies are being murdered, but actually caring for kids once they’re born takes effort and may raise their taxes.

        I think it’s also why anti-abortion politics seem to have been deprioritized under Trump, since they have harder drugs now. If evangelicals want to feel like warriors for a glorious cause, white nationalist politics like the migrant caravan panic let you pretend you’re a Spartan in 300, defending western civilization from “globalists” and their invading MS-13 hordes by… voting republican and posting! And if they want to double down on the baby-saving theme, conspiracies like Pizzagate and QAnon are way more visceral, intricate, and fun, because the research elements make them interactive. You can reveal that every public figure you don’t like is part of a deep state plot to get high by eating babies, all by… voting republican and posting! With politics like this, the old pro-life movement is obsolete.

      • David Camp

        Your argument is not with evangelicals but with God and Romans, chapter one. Very explicit. Judgment comes because of allowing gays to multiply. You don’t see that it would destroy the human race as procreation would end. Christians are for life. Period. Don’t think the nation angering Mr. Putin is not part of judgment that can fall upon us. Putin is more than ready to push the nuclear button or have you not been paying attention? We are not invulnerable without God. We have rejected Him to our detriment.

        • Flint8ball

          Yes, the bible is certainly inflammatory. Evangelicals take these things more seriously than other christians which is problematic in our society. It’s unfortunate that christianity has gotten so interwoven into politics on the right. Legislating behavior that you simply don’t agree with is not ok.

        • Dhammarato

          Actually, it is the ability to reason and think straight that you have rejected. God just is and he sees you and knows the Christians have lost the ability to think clearly. God is sad! Thank you Mr Putin for not nuking US while trump is watching fox sitting on the toilet.

    • David Sparks

      Reading your response reminds me of the word of a first century Rabbi: “Why do you see the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?” You accuse those who support the President as cruel, resentful and bigoted, when these are the dominant traits of the Democrat party who feast daily on such toxic waste. Democrat dissenters are called immoral and inhumane. Because Democrats are so so culturally toxic except among the Hollywood starlites and leftist media outlets, they have lost whatever respectability or moral authority it had. Since they drive out dissenters and resent the wider culture for not deferring to them and the social hierarchies they support, Democrat leftist will only double down on their morally bankrupt politics that keep the inner-cities in a perpetual slave state. The resulting movement may be large in absolute numbers, but it would be culturally marginalized at best and socially toxic outside of left-wing enclaves and echo-chambers. Leftist Democrats will probably exist as a radical but impotent reactionary movement, waiting for a new Stalinist leader to crush their enemies, put their lessers in their place, and bring them to the utopian green land of a elitist ethnostate. But when that leader comes, those bigoted, racist, elitist Democrats will blindly serve her.

    • David Camp

      ” They see the cruelty, resentment and bigotry of his movement”
      No, he is just trying to keep the nation and its laws intact.

      You are a globalist and have been indoctrinated to hate this nation, as it stands in the way of a new, global order that the clintons and obamas want.

      • Dhammarato

        David, you have no proof of these things, these are just republican talking points, a story that is as false as the story told in the churches. What fools these Christians are to believe two sets of lies and not just one.

      • Dhammarato

        as for globalist, we all live on planet earth, you should get out more, turn off fox and friends and take a trip. go spend a decade in Asia, grow up, see the world. then you too will be a globalist. But no, you see that as a dirty word because you have been told to think that way, you don’t think for yourself, you just believe the lies you have been told. Bet you never left the town you were born in, only those hate globalism.

        • David Camp

          I’m a Vietnam veteran and my wife worked many years for Eastern Airlines. I’ve seen all the world I need to.

          You’re going to get your one world, globalist government but you won’t like it. You better pray you live through it. It’s going to be a terror.

      • fractal

        “Nationalism is an infantile disease.
        It is the measles of mankind”

        Einstein

  • David Sparks

    We support the President for a host of reasons. Let me quickly name but a few. We are against the racist policies of the Democrat Party that perpetuates high unemployment levels among the African-American community and the Hispanic community. We are against their race-baiting rhetoric that stokes the destruction of inner-city communities such as Baltimore and looks blindly at the murder of over 1,000,000 black babies. The sexism of the Democrats is on full display as they continue to perpetuate the myth of patriarchy. Never has a party worked towards the personal destruction of men than the Democrats. Their bigotry is palpable from their newly elected anti-semitic congresspersons to their anti-religious litmus tests for federal appointees. Do I dare bring up their support of the destruction of not only the unborn, but the newly born? Do I dare bring up the personal wealth amassed by Democrats while they decry the success of others? The author disrespectfully labels the President as a “race-baiting, sexist, man-child president,” and then we are to believe that his is unbiased assessment? Sounds more like a end-run seeking to destroy an opportunity to celebrate the success of the administration for our vets, our inner-cities (unfortunately still slaving under Democrat control), our economy that has lifted countless people out of poverty, conservative judges, etc. Perhaps Yancey can’t celebrate the goodness of a flawed individual. Perhaps he should edit out King David, King Solomon, Isaac, Rahab, Tamar, etc.

    • Ron Swaren

      I would not attribute the demise of cities like Baltimore or Detroit all to political policies. Don’t forget—in the 1970’s those places lost big when foreign imports unseated their products. There is also the factor of the real estate market and deterioration of substandard architecture. These places are experiencing perfect storms. Combining with these downturns was that many impoverished blacks had sought better lives, because these cities had thriving industries (Called The Great Migration). I would agree with you that the Victim Narrative is getting wildly out of hand, and is a favorite card for certain politicians to play.

      • David Sparks

        I’m primarily thinking of the gutting of Baltimore as a result of the Freddie Gray riots and the race-baiting rhetoric by many Democrats Wikipedia:
        “Civil unrest continued with at least twenty police officers injured, at least 250 people arrested, 285 to 350 businesses damaged, 150 vehicle fires, 60 structure fires, 27 drugstores looted, thousands of police and Maryland National Guard troops deployed, and with a state of emergency declared in the city limits of Baltimore. Over forty South Korean-owned businesses had been damaged by the riots.[80] Chinese American and Arab American owned stores were also targeted, with looters directed by African American gangs towards those businesses.[81][82]”

        • Ron Swaren

          Perhaps you are right about Baltimore; it’s been so long ago, and I wasn’t paying that much attention anyway. And here in Portland we are seeing how the “liberal elite” is starting to seriously mismanage things. With the long term result being not good. One of the things I liked about Trump is that he is practically minded (building construction is apparently a forte, albeit from the greedy developer end of it) and nowadays the political class is far removed from real work.

          Just so you know, Over my last decade journey into the conservative political world I keep seeing a refrain about how cities like Detroit are a big mess ALL due to liberal policies. One thing I do know a lot about is old buildings! I’m sure what has happened in many cities is that—with the convergence of several negative economic factors–old real estate stopped penciling out for almost everyone. For example Portland, OR has many old 1900’s era grand residences, and they have been kept up and restored; go to Youngstown Ohio and you will see similar, vintage homes, but no one wants them at all. And many cities are that way. I’m just guessing—but I bet in Detroit once the auto industry declined these old buildings and single family houses simply weren’t worth any efforts to preserve. Old buildings are expensive to maintain and the economic incentives disappeared. And in many cities—particularly where blacks in the 1930’s had migrated to from the South—the same story has been repeated. I remember having a bus stop in Harrisburg PA about 1986—and seeing the old dilapidated housing just barely holding together. Hopeless, eyesores, wrecks. But it is basically a crash of the real estate inventory. No doubt, a lot of subsequent political choices didn’t help, either. But at least I can distinguish a material cause from a political one.

          What this means is that many, many blacks are caught in this cycle. It is not really their fault. But I keep saying that neither the politicians or the theologians are going to lead them out of this wilderness, either. But sadly they are going to try, and will probably just make things worse. And I will have to say on this blog we are seeing a lot of repeating of the same, foolish, political carping. I don’t see a lot of hope ahead. The middle class that is doing well are the ones for whom higher education has parlayed into a real decent job with a sound retirement plan. It’s a pretty big group, but they are elites.

    • Dhammarato

      wow you are so confused, you are the kind who need to be tested before allow to vote. You have been lied to, and you are too stupid to know it. Every item you complain about dems is actually a fault of the republicans. You are confused and need to read a map. Dems on left and Republicans down the toilet and Christians on a trail of tears leading them to hell.

  • I’m not a Evangelical, but it looks simple to me. Voting against the Democrats is the rational option against big government control of the US economy and institutions. You can feel virtuous by voting for a third-party candidate, but it’s not a rational choice. The choice is binary.

    • Dhammarato

      So you preference is Republica’s running an even bigger government, one that tramples human rights and polices the hospitals and clinics to make sure no medical procedures are allowed without permission. You want a small government and a police state? it might be a big police state. Republicans are like that and you know it. Your hatred of dems is just racism and bigotry and foolishness. Republican who vote are fools and so old they are too senile to think. Ban the vote from those over 75.

      • “Medical procedures”= Infanticide. Let’s stop pussyfooting around the fact that the Democrats have become genocidal maniacs, no different than Hitler, but vastly more efficient in killing their 60 million.

        • Dhammarato

          Not same as Hitler. He wanted to get rid of Jews. you want to stuff (mostly black) babies back into cunts where you think you know where they belong (you racist pig). Then you make up stories to justify your sick racist behavior. You have no right to tell a girl what to do when she has this kind of trouble, you are a sick pussy-grabbing freak who has no value in allowing folks to make their own choices. This right to life idea that is so wide spread in the churches will divide the church and bring it down. enjoy the show, you sick monster.

          • What I want is all to survive- unlike you who wants to kill the poor, to tell the girl she has no hope, instead of telling her the truth- that she is already a mother, and mother is more powerful than any pitiful president of the United States. The hand that rocks the cradle, rules the world.

          • Dhammarato

            Sometime the cradle is full of rocks, often donated by whitey red-neck. Some times the girl needs help getting the rocks out of her own cradle, before YOU force her to add a new cradle full of rocks (and you make sure the rocks are hard.) Christianity has lost its compassion and has added new rules and laws to make up for their lack of compassion.

          • That doesn’t change the fact that motherhood is the most powerful calling any human being can do. Many of our most accomplished people were raised in just the same circumstances. But your bigotry, your racism, would have us kill all the blacks instead of even attempting to help.

            I have NO respect for the point of view that all African Americans should commit racial suicide by killing their children. It’s a defeatist attitude, born out of selfishness and greed.

            Yes, life is hard- yes, life is pain. You know you are alive because of the pain. But that is all the more reason to live. The harder the rocks you overcome, the more strength you gain. That which does not kill you, only makes you stronger.

          • Dhammarato

            wow try to turn the table with the old projection thingy, turmp is so fond of, what ever bad things there are about you, you blame the other with it. Calling we racist is a pitiful joke, but I still laugh at you and your sick Christian racism and bigotry. May we be free from the republican lies you’ve been told. Glad to see that what the Christians are doing is making them weaker not stronger and we smile watching Christianity and all its badness die. The “rightolife” is an old hate-joke, most have moved onto better anger points, like caravans, But you are stuck in an old tired argument, even you are the worse for the ware and tare of your failed efforts. just go home and sleep it off.

          • Trump isn’t the problem. Or the solution. The real solution lies in us, in our ability to repent and convert, in our ability to turn evil into good.

            You are quite the racist and bigot speaking about Christianity. I bet you’d love to just put on a white hood and go out and lynch some Christians, now wouldn’t you? But you’re too busy lynching your own children in the womb to do so.

          • Dhammarato

            No, dear I’m not. and it is not polite to ask a fat girl if she is with child. Its really funny now how the Christians have picked up the bad habit of projection, they have learned from trump. What ever is wrong and bad within, blame the other and call them the names you yourself ware within. Freud knew all about this 125 years ago, you and ignorant trump do not seen to know that we all know all about you and laugh at your projections, the whole rubber and glue show. and it sure sticks well to you. The KKK etc is all yours. ware your past history and present actions well. And stuff those babies back into the pussies you are grabbing, have at it, old timer.

          • Don’t call me dear, and don’t pretend you aren’t a hate filled genocidal maniac after you’ve already admitted to being one.

            You are no different than any other racist idiot out there. Not at all.

            Oh, and Freud was a racist idiot too. No different than you.

          • Dhammarato

            “hate filled genocidal maniac ” well you seem to have now over used trumps main defense, projection. Now what ever facts fit you, you scream those words into the dark night hoping against hope that yelling out laud what you try to keep secrete in you dirty heart, will some how deflect the incoming. watch closely now. INCOMING! “Racist” now is the retards favorite word, but it bounces off us happily and returns to stick to you like glue. You RACIST MONSTER. But the worst word that really puts you down, puts you in your place, happily shows you what low class trash you rally are is to call you Christian, That’s the dirties word I know and the funny thing is that you cant project that attack back on us. It sticks to you so hard that you cant even though it at us. Ha ha got you there, your a christian and that makes you loose every argument,

          • https://youtu.be/I6XfU8KVkzI

            The fact that you defend the maafa, is proof that your genocidal mania has nothing to do with Trump, only your own hatred of black people, just like every other pro-choice genocidal maniac.

          • Gen. Francisco Villa

            Yet white Christians did not have a problem with genociding my Indigenous ancestors.

            Christians are pro-murder as per their “Just War” concept, which gives the power of any agrieved party to kill other humans for any perceived reason of being “wronged.”

            The stupid Christians and their concern for human life is purely B.S.

          • Actually, white Catholics did- specifically St. Katherine Drexel, the black robed Jesuits (back when they actually were the ones *feeding, clothing, and sheltering* natives in both North and South America), Christopher Columbus’s fight against his own sailors in the Caribbean (which you’d know if you had ever *actually* read his logbooks and letters), Archbishop Blanchet’s Salish Stick, etc. You sure are ignorant of your own history.

          • Gen. Francisco Villa

            As if pointing obscure (Catholics like obscurantism) points justifies genocide.

            In that case the abortionists have a point.

            On with genocide as long as you can come up with some obscure examples of meaningless events that will distract from the genocide itself.

          • The abortionists *are* genocidal maniacs who have killed more people since 1973 than the Spanish Inquisition did in the previous 1000 years. They’ve killed 10x more people than Hitler.

            The genocide is going on right now- and since you support it, this is my last message to you.

          • Gen. Francisco Villa

            “Burn a few crosses at Catholic churches, just like the KKK did in the old days?”

            What a pedantic little snowflake, which is typical of many Christians since their religion was founded on pure lies and fake martyrdom myths. Now they try to escape from their past including the KKK which was, and is, a Christian organization. The burning of the cross is an old Christian ritual of celebrating the light of Jesus on the cross that brings salvation to mainly white male Christians, like the KKK.

            And the fascist Catholic church was not the main opponent of the KKK. The KKK killed blacks, jews, atheists, and communists. Most Catholics were found of the KKK, in particular during the last incarnation, when they kept Catholic neighborhoods free from blacks and Mexicans. When that failed in the end the Catholics initiated the white flight.

          • In Oregon, it was the “fascist Catholic Church” that was the main target of the KKK, with the KKK-controlled Democratic government already having taken care of the Blacks with State-constitution mandated whippings every six months until they moved.

            oh, and Mexicans are Catholics. Viva Christo Rey.

          • Gen. Francisco Villa

            Again, your’re drowning in a cup of water. Catholic fascists were not the main target of the KKK. The KKK, a white Christian organization, was formed to terrorize blacks. Speaks volumes that you do not want to admit that obvious historical point.

            Yes, Mexico is a primarily Catholic country. No wonder it is all messed up today.

  • Ron Swaren

    Hatred of Christianity has been building for a long time. They are out for blood. Get out of your safe space and visit some liberal city and you will see how they really operate. In fact I could easily pick through scores of comments from this website that indicate how much venom they have. I am not excusing the failings of either religious or political conservatism, either. In our city we just got a new police chief who is African American and female and they are still screaming out about ‘injustice.” You have to see it to believe it; people are unhinged. And Dems will try to outdo each other in the rhetoric that they think will gain them support—-and then try to deliver on it when they are in control. It will be scapegoating of a new magnitude—-but no real solutions. Obama had no solutions—but his rhetoric did resonate.

    • Dhammarato

      Lets all hope that the Dems kill off the Republicans, totally wipe them out, Lets hope that Christianity is the biggest victim of all in the 2020 election. Lets hope all Christian Preachers run for office and get caught in election fraud. May their congregations all die off while they are jailed for 10 yeas each.

      • Ron Swaren

        Oh, so you think it’s a joke do you? You have to see how liberal Dems and their courtroom cronies (ACLU, etc) wield lawsuits to achieve political power. This has nothing to do with civil order anymore.

        • Dhammarato

          You are right, while the dems work in civil courts to do fair justice, the retards put a criminal in office to destroy the civil order. So happy to have the ability to snicker and laugh right out laud in the faces of right- wing gun-nuts, racist pigs, bigoted, brutal UGLY Americans who have lost the American way and fallen under the spell of big money. Retards all, sick greedy racist fools all of you. But now the worse name I can think of to really put you down and in your pace is to call you Christian, that’s the dirtiest word I know.

    • Gen. Francisco Villa

      It has been proven that the stories of Christians being fed to the lions by the Romans was pure BS and propaganda to get fake sympathy. And we’re seeing the same lie repeated again. It is Christian Taqiya.

      The problem is that many people have not been duped by Christian lies and propaganda anymore. That is the real problem you have. Everything else is just white noise.

      • Ron Swaren

        I understand the Romans enslaved 60k Jews after the siege of Jerusalem and made them build the Coliseum. Were you there and maybe you can let me know if this is also a falsehood? T.Y.

  • ounbbl

    Vote for Demoncrats – Government of the people, by the people, and for the people. You don’t have to worry about security. Just live with you doors open. Everything will be taken care of free; just make sure you open your wallet for tax collectors.

    • Dhammarato

      Don’t you wish the right wing upper crust would do that, Its hi time they stop fighting over taxes and paid their fair share. And you are right to stop the fear mongering they are doing: keeping good folks like you all upset and confused. May you sleep well tonight knowing the dems are coming.

      • ounbbl

        Oops. It’s “people of the Big Government, by the Foul Government, and for the Fat Government”. Demons are coming, demonkrats are coming, and rats are coming.

  • Alan Drake

    Rev. Mark Harris, former pastor of First Baptist of Charlotte & former head of North Carolina SBC, is the first person to ever have his federal election reversed for election fraud.

    This one SBC preacher may exemplify the broader movement. His son testified that he advised his father not to commit election fraud, but his desire to win lead Brother Harris to override his son. Ethics, morality, respect for our democracy and even legality lost to Brother Harris’s desire for power.

    The same motives and morality appear to be motivating the broader evangelical political movement. And the same disasterous results – disasterous in many dimensions – likely await evangelicals. And rightly and justly so.

    • David Camp

      Jesus’ biggest enemies were the leaders of the synagogues and the Temple.

      • Dhammarato

        same is true today, the names were changed to protect the guilty. Now they call m churches.

  • Jacob

    I read the comments on here form Christians and I don’t wonder why I left the faith after 40 years, I wonder what took me so long…and btw…nobody picked om young boys, I watched the long video and the fact that the author of this piece can defend those vile little heathens tells me that he is no different than the Christians he is writing about… so glad I left and so glad that evangelicals hypocrisy and racism is being exposed to the light….

    • Wesley

      i do not think the author was even defend the teenagers at the center of the March for Life media controversy, but instead using it as an example of why “Evangelicals” need to come up with an endgame with Trump for a post-Trump presidency. when that story first broke after seeing the picture i thought the one guy was dumb for wearing one of those MAGA hats at the rally for it was like wearing a billboard saying come attack me. those hats are much like the Confederate flag as it might mean one thing to them, but it means something totally different to their opposition.

      • Jacob

        Wesley…fair enough …I interpreted it differently…

    • georgeyancey

      The narrative you are pushing has been thoroughly debunked. And when leftist talk about assaulting the boys and doxing them, then yeah it is not a good day for leftist. If you support calls to hit the boys and dox them then I have no faith in your assessment of my moral position.

      • Jacob

        debunked,,where Faux News…the long video makes it even worse…no one said anything about hitting the poor little racist Hitler youth,,,that’s what you evangelical christian republicans do…and doxing them..lol..please…they were in public, being pigs and they were exposed and then hired a high dollar pr firm to cover their ass…and the best part an evangelical Trumptard like your self talking about the moral position..you gave up that ground when you voted for the con man in the big house…

  • Wesley

    i am like the author what is their endgame? given that the leaders of Trump’s Evangelical supporters are strong dispensationalists i would guess it is all about surviving until the “rapture of the church” these boomer leaders have been taught their entire life. unfortunately they really never questioned their eschatological assumptions. the goalposts keep moving to redefine what “this generation” means. right after World War I it was that war’s generation, which survivors all over one hundred years old now. after the birth of modern-day Israel it was the generation that saw its birth. as 1980 approached they started getting antsy about that being the date to move to 1967 for the six-day war. we are nearly fifty-two years from that date longer than the forty for a biblical generation. now they are back to redefining it to longer to until the last person from born before the six-day war dies. one would have thought by now they would have decided it was time to start thinking long term, but unfortunately they do not seem to have learned yet. when i tell Trump supporters that it was not Trump who beat Hilary in 2016, but Bernie Sanders they refused to acknowledge the argument.

    • David Sparks

      Silliness. What a huge jump! Even Dallas Seminary has moved away from dispensationalism. Where have you been the last 40 years?
      Thank you Bernie Sanders. “Well, let me – that’s not a hard question for me to answer. Look, any objective assessment in the last year or a year-and-a-half, or how long it was, will tell you that Donald Trump did something extraordinary. Something that nobody, but nobody, thought that he could do. Trump took on the Republican establishment, took on the Democratic establishment, took on the media establishment, and he ended up winning the election to become President of the United States. That is an extraordinary accomplishment. So, I give, you know, Donald Trump his due. And I think any fair-minded person has got to.” Bernie Sanders

      • Dhammarato

        TRUMP IS A CRIMINAL, A MOB BOSS. What credit do you give him that does not reflect badly on you personally. You too are a criminal now because you give full support to a known criminal. Time for Christians to wake up to the fact that they all voted for a mobster and they are responsible for his bad deeds.

  • Randall Lowe

    You do realize us mortal humans have fallen right? There is only one perfect person. Have you even read the Bible? God uses lots of undeserving men in the Bible to serve a greater purpose. You would vote for Hillary???? The most evil woman to ever walk upon the earth? Have you not read all the facts about her?
    She should be in prison!!! How could you vote for such an evil Satanic person? You might want to check your Christianity if were thinking about voting for Hillary.
    I don’t believe you could even be saved or have the Holy Spirit in you if you were thinking about voting for such an evil demon possessed person. Americans are tired of the status queue. All the politicians making promises and never keeping them. Stealing are hard earned money and giving it to our enemies. We have had nothing but traitors in the office for over 50 years. It was time for a change. I believe God put Trump in office. God is giving us one last chance to get things right. He is not perfect, but he can’t be bought.

    • Alan Drake

      Hillary Clinton is a good Methodist that actually reads and follows Matthew 25:31 et al.

      Millions of children grow up healthy, and some even live to adulthood because of CHiP (health Insurance for children). Sen Kennedy said that CHiP could not have passed without her.

      and much more great good she has done.

      • David Sparks

        And indeed President Trump has accomplished much is a short span of time. Unemployment in Black communities is at an all time low, allowing millions of children to grow up healthy, and some even will live to adulthood because of a better income. I’m sure Sen Kennedy would applaud such efforts. And there is much more “great good” he has done.

        • Alan Drake

          I disagree. Trump just benefited from trends established by Obama after recovering from the Great GOP Recession of 2008.

          On a personal level of morality, I have knowingly talked with another person, face to face, as profoundly evil as Donald J, Trump.

          • David Sparks

            But I thought that the vast majority of Democrat economist insisted that the Trump administration would tank the economy? I guess the below didn’t understand that President Obama had already saved the economy! How silly they didn’t recognize the trends and where they were leading!

            “If Donald Trump were elected president and put in his stated policies, the United States would experience a lengthy recession, enormous job losses, much higher interest rates and diminished long-term growth prospects. At least, that is the conclusion of economists from Moody’s Analytics, a recent analysis highlighted by Hillary Clinton in a speech Tuesday.” New York Times By Neil Irwin, June 21, 2016.

            “We are very probably looking at a global recession, with no end in sight.” By Paul Krugman. New York Times.

            “Donald Trump’s first gift to the world will be another financial crisis.” — Headline in the U.K. Independent. “He gives every impression that he will soon be hustling America — and possibly the entire world — in the direction of another catastrophic financial crisis.”

            • “Under Trump, I would expect a protracted recession to begin within 18 months. The damage would be felt far beyond the United States.” — Former Clinton and Obama chief economist Larry Summers, June 2016

            • “Trump would likely cause the stock market to crash and plunge the world into recession.” —Simon Johnson, MIT economics professor, in The New York Times, November 2016.

            • “Citigroup: A Trump Victory in November Could Cause a Global Recession” — Bloomberg Financial News headline, August 2016.

            • “I have never seen an election in which the markets have so strong of a view as to what was good and bad about the outcome. And what you saw was the markets rallying yesterday because of the FBI thing on Sunday. And the reason I mention this particularly is if the likely event happens and Trump wins you will see a market crash of historic proportions, I think … The markets are terrified of him.” — Steve Rattner, MSNBC economic guru, October 2016.

            • “Wall Street is set up for a major crash if Donald Trump shocks the world on Election Day and wins the White House. New research out on Friday suggests that financial markets strongly prefer a Hillary Clinton presidency and could react with panicked selling should Trump defy the polls and deliver a shocking upset on Nov. 8.” — Ben White, Politico, October 2016.

            • “A President Trump Could Destroy the World Economy” — Title of a Washington Post editorial, October 2016

            Oooops! Never mind.

          • David Sparks

            How could this possibly be the trend of the Obama administration when all the Obama supporters predict economic doom*!
            Did they not see the trend? If so, surely they would have predicted the success of Obama during the Trump administration. You want to have it both ways–If Trump is elected, there will be economic doom. If Trump is elected, there will be 3% GDP due to Obama. You’ve got to make up your mind.

            *”Now comes the mother of all adverse effects — and what it brings with it is a regime that will be ignorant of economic policy and hostile to any effort to make it work,” Krugman wrote. “So we are very probably looking at a global recession, with no end in sight. I suppose we could get lucky somehow. But on economics, as on everything else, a terrible thing has just happened.” NY Times Paul Krugman.

            “Donald Trump’s first gift to the world will be another financial crisis.” Headline in the U.K. Independent. “(He) gives every impression that he will soon be hustling America — and possibly the entire world — in the direction of another catastrophic financial crisis.”

            “Under Trump, I would expect a protracted recession to begin within 18 months. The damage would be felt far beyond the United States.” Former Clinton and Obama chief economist Larry Summers, June 2016.

            “Trump would likely cause the stock market to crash and plunge the world into recession.” Simon Johnson, MIT economics professor, in The New York Times, November 2016.

            “Citigroup: A Trump Victory in November Could Cause a Global Recession”, Bloomberg Financial News headline, August 2016.

            “I have never seen an election in which the markets have so strong of a view as to what was good and bad about the outcome. And what you saw was the markets rallying yesterday because of the FBI thing on Sunday. And the reason I mention this particularly is if the likely event happens and Trump wins you will see a market crash of historic proportions, I think…The markets are terrified of him.” Steve Rattner, MSNBC economics guru and former Obama Car Czar, October, 2016.

            “Wall Street is set up for a major crash if Donald Trump shocks the world on Election Day and wins the White House. New research out on Friday suggests that financial markets strongly prefer a Hillary Clinton presidency and could react with panicked selling should Trump defy the polls and deliver a shocking upset on Nov. 8.” Ben White, Politico, October 2016.

            And finally, and most unambiguously:

            “A President Trump Could Destroy the World Economy”, headline of Washington Post editorial, October 2016.

          • Randall Lowe

            LOL!!!! LOL!!! Right!!!Eight years in office and nothing improved. Trump is in two years and things are getting better. You need to take off the rose colored glasses and get off the Demoncrat plantation brother. Who started the KKK? I am neither Demoncrat or Republican. I am a Constitutionist. I believe in small government according to the law of our land.

          • Alan Drake

            Facts do not support your assertion.

            https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth

            Click “10 year” and compare Trump vs Obama.

            White southern racists were Democrats till LBJ signed Civil Rights Acts and Nixon’s Southern Strategy. Today, white racists are all Republicans, including David Duke & Donald Trump.

          • Randall Lowe

            Check your sources. Republicans fought against slavery. Democrats fought to keep it. Europeans whites were made slaves by invasions of Muslims. I am not a racist. I believe in true equality. That means if one race can have a school with just their race attending then so should other races have the same rights. If one race can’t have a school for just one race then neither should any other be allowed to do so. Equal rights means equal to all races not special rights for certain races. That is the very meaning of racism. Giving one race more rights that the others is racism.

          • Dhammarato

            Randal, you are racist. So you are deluded or a flat out liar. Not knowing what happened in the late 60’s you reference the 1860’s. Cheap shot, liar. You want to keep the status quo, and that proves you are a racist as well as a liar.

          • Dhammarato

            We can also say that all Republicans are Racist. For sure the money bags ruling the party are all racist and they Lie non-stop to Christians who are all fools. The rich know who to lie too, and the Christians are the most gullible, they will believe anything. If they believe the Christian story, they will believe every lie ever told.

          • Dhammarato

            “Trump is in two years and things are getting better. ” Really? what KKK office do you sit in?

          • Just look at the unemployment rate of Blacks right now.

        • Jacob

          do you really believe what you posted…lol…wow…

          • Dhammarato

            must not, it seems David has removed his lies. Good on you David, stop the lies.

        • Dhammarato

          Just another right wing lie that has captured the pea sized brains of Christianity. David you are such a fool, you should know better then repeating this lie, you know it to be a lie.

      • Randall Lowe

        I am sorry but you have been misinformed. She has murdered and molested children. Protected and defended pediphiles
        Defended Bill Clinton who has also raped women and profited from Drug sales.
        She is a very evil and Santanic person.

        • CroneEver

          I’m sorry that you have listened with such rapture to Alex Jones, Rush Limbaugh, Pat Robertson, who have all been lying to you, repeatedly, because that’s their job. To make money off of people like you by lying to you, making you afraid, angry, and ready to do whatever they want you to. Such as vote for a non-stop grifter like Donald Trump. None of what you said about Hillary Clinton is true. And, deep in your heart, you know it’s not true. Prayers and blessings to you.

          • So you’re saying that Hillary Clinton supported Monica Lewinski? After all, all women must be believed when charging a man with rape, right?

          • CroneEver

            Monica Lewinsky never charged Bill Clinton with rape. In fact, Monica bragged on national TV in an interview with Barbara Walters about how she flirted with Bill Clinton by flipping up her skirt and showing him her thong underwear. I remember it clearly.

          • As I remember, there were a parade of women who charged him with rape. And certainly, any sexual flirtation with an intern destroys consent, and thus, is rape.

            Consent is always impossible between a superior and an inferior in the workplace.

        • Dhammarato

          Ranall hahahahahaha what a fool you are. You believe only lies and hide from real facts. you would make a good preacher. But one thing is for sure, the years long smear campaign that the retardians did on her really worked. you sir are a clear example of a fool who loves the lies you have been told. You are the reason why Republicans target Christians, they will believe every lie they hear.

          • Randall Lowe

            I believe you are the one who believes in lies. Prove me wrong. Send me facts. I will send you facts to support what I say.

          • Dhammarato

            no Rush and info wars propaganda, please! And I don’t need to prove whats in plain sight you’ll just miss it all again, due to a blind spot. And it is a joy to see you have played into trumps game of projection, what ever is wrong within just blame the other for it. We will call you projection Lowe. How Low can you go?

        • Dhammarato

          Randell, my dear fool, you have no proof of these things, these are just republican talking points, a story that is as false as the story told in the churches. What fools these Christians are to believe two sets of lies and not just one. And you have allowed these lies to stir you up inside, now the devil is in your mind. You are looking in a mirror and boy are you pissed off at what you see and don;t see.

          • Randall Lowe

            Sorry only a fool believes there is no God! You will soon see!! For Christ will return. You will not be able to hide. Satan will be destroyed and all who say there is no God!! Satan is no match for Jesus. I look in the mirror and I smile. God blessed me with handsomeness, wisdom and many other talents.
            I have joy and happiness.
            I will live for eternity with my Lord Jesus in the new city of Jerusalem.

          • Dhammarato

            you corps will rot and you will die. get over it. your happiness is hollow and based on lies. and you will surly die. yut, stop, expire, no need to fear total death, it will come fear or not. Wait, wait, you say: “God blessed me with handsomeness, wisdom and many other talents. I have joy and happiness.” ha ha ha ha hahahahaha rofl. you stink, your ugly and you are stupid just like every one else, you are human, get over it. That’s all delusional crap. But saying you are happy is just a lie. you are a liar and you have been caught and pull up by the heals.

      • “Hillary Clinton is a good Methodist”

        Which makes her a pretty bad Christian. Methodists are nothing more than Morally Therapeutic Deists, expecting God to bow to their favorite sins, and to support their homosexuality and genocide. Luckily, worldwide, Africa is gaining in power over that denomination. Black people are more moral than white liberals.

        • Alan Drake

          Despite whatever faults Methodists may have, they are morally superior to Southern Baptists.

          • Barely. All Protestants suffer from baked in moral relativism.

          • Dhammarato

            That there relativism is not morality, its all skin color.
            And you are quite correct, All Protestants suffer and they have been protesting for so long. Maybe they should stop protesting and fix their own minds. Find happiness within as JC recommends and stop fighting among yourselves.

          • Skin color is an irrational criteria for deciding anything at all.

        • Randall Lowe

          Actually blacks kill more blacks. Go look at the FBI statistics. There are more black on black crimes . Whites are attacked far more by blacks then the other way around. Whites are killed more by police than blacks are. Do the research before posting lies!!! More white people have died in wars fighting for your rights and freedoms.

          • Your FBI statistics do not take the violence of the White-Feminist run Planned Parenthood into account.

        • Dhammarato

          Good boy, do that divide and conquer thingy, divide it, slice it and dice it: pound it into mush. Today we will all hate the Methodist, Tomorrow SBC. They are all pretty bad Christians, do you know of even one good one? “Black people are more moral than whitey” you got that right, so get your whitey police out there and kill a few more. Even the odds.

          • Not to mention the white controlled Planned Parenthood. The leading cause of deaths among African Americans is abortion- racial suicide- an genocide caused by pro- choice white people forcing abortion on the black community, promoting contraception and abortion as draconian population control in Africa.

    • Jacob

      Saudi Aribia and Russia bought and paid for your traitor a long time ago and that is fact…

      • David Sparks

        Sounds like the rantings of a pitiful person.

    • Dhammarato

      You have no right and no proof to blame Hillary. You only know the right wing claptrap you were raised on. Why are all Christians Republicans? Are they all that stupid? Do they all believe the right wing lies they have been told all these years now? When if ever will they wake up to see that they live their whole lives based on a set of lies. Christianity is based on lies, Republican party is based on lies. they go together so well.

      • Randall Lowe

        So who created the earth and the solar systems?

        • Dhammarato

          you do, every time you think about it you re-create it. Wow, aren’t you a big tough god.

          • Randall Lowe

            I feel sorry for you. So do you actually think that the moon is in the sky just because you think its there? LOL!!! You need to get off the drugs brother. So the Sun is only there because we think it is??? LOL!! Talk about insanity. WOW!!!

          • Dhammarato

            yes you do feel sorry, but not for me,snicker. No, we think the moon is in the sky because we know it is there. In that case thought matches reality. Thoughts of the story of Christianity do not match with reality. You have not sent men to it, nor left scientific equipment for NASA and friends to monitor. With such profound lack of evidence the whole story looses credibility, but it is all in your mind. and ALL in the mind is correct. without a mind to consciously conceive, there is nothing to conceive, You live in a mind made world and you suffer whenever your mental world does not match up with the actual real world. In that case “be here now” is superior to lost in thoughts of sweet Jesus.

    • Ulf Turkewitsch

      Judgement is the Lord’s. Not ours.

      • Randall Lowe

        Ever hear of the word discernment? The Bible speaks of it throughout. We are to use discernment in our decisions we make on a daily bases.

        • Dhammarato

          “Ever hear of the word discernment? The Bible speaks of it throughout.” Please provide 100 references to the word “discernment”. using only KJV. More likely the word “wisdom” is more frequent. So you use the word discernment to justify you right-wing gun-nut, racist bigoted pussy-grabbing mind set? If so then we can do without your discernment, it sounds downright racist.

          • Randall Lowe

            Faith is not a race so that kills your Satanic use of the the word racist. Having your own mind and making the right and sound decisions is not hate or racism. The state should never be a God.
            How did that workout for Hitler or Staulin??? You see God destroyed them. Just like he will destroy anybody that harms his family. Satan and his followers will all be destroyed. The creator owns everything and he will bring judgment on all who refuse to believe in him.

    • David Camp

      I believe she is the second evil one, right after Jezebel. She is of the same spirit.

      Jezebel ruled in her husband Ahab’s kingdom, was the great enemy of God’s people, was always scheming and conniving against them.

      God raised up Jehu to destroy her. Was Trump raised up to do the same to her contemporary?

      • Dhammarato

        Actually, NO! Trump was raised up to give Putin what he wanted, It was Putin who hated Hillary. God is gobsmacked.

        • Randall Lowe

          The Mueller report has been released. No Russian collusion. The American patriots have won again! God is with Trump!!! You see all lies!! Just the people here who are blind and too afraid to admit that God exist! More proof God exist!! False realities belong to Satan!! Save yourselves before its too late!!!

  • NorrinRadd

    I would never, ever vote for a Pro-Choice candidate or party. That automatically rules out virtually all Democrats and most Libertarians. Even given the availability of a Pro-Life Libertarian, one would have to consider the *practical* consideration of having the perfect be the enemy of the good.

    I hated the way Trump behaved during the campaign, especially the primaries. I voted for Lyin’ Ted.

    I had a tough time in the general election. I prayed, of course. You may think it impossible that God could ever lead a Christian to vote for Trump. I believe it is impossible that God would ever lead a Christian to vote for Crooked Hil, even with a gun to the Christian’s head.

    Yes, absolutely we are now ignoring his horn-dog past. We never should have clung to Slick Willy’s past after he got elected, except that his little cigar-dipping trysts made prior conduct fair game. As long as Trumpy Bear behaves while in office, all is fine. We don’t see anything in his post-election behavior that reveals him as a “race-baiting, sexist man-child”; certainly much less of a race-baiter than BHO, who could reasonably also be recognized as a “man-child” of a different sort.

    Since we don’t see him doing anything particularly immoral or improper, there is no reason for us NOT to continue to support him.

    • Dhammarato

      NorrinRadd. You are a bad man, you have no right to be a pussy grabber like Donny trump. Yet you personally do far more damage to the pussy you grad with your anti right to life stance, only you want to take lives of young women away, you want to grab them by the pussy and force them to keep a baby they do not want. You sir are a horrible something less than human. If Christians are all pussy grabbers like you, then may Christianity die. Let modern medicine proceed without your backward anti humanity position.

      • NorrinRadd

        Cute.

        FTR, I believe DJT was literally a pussy-grabber in the same way he literally shot a guy dead on Fifth Avenue.

  • Alan Drake

    The final endgame for white evangelicals are elderly congregations and then closed churches. Once Trump is discredited, the ramifications may well be existincal.

    Forfeiting moral standing for an institution focused on morality can be deadly.

  • Dhammarato

    Why should anyone like whats trump is doing? He is not doing anything now but waiting to be caught and tried as a criminal. If You still support trump for any reason then you are a criminal too. Gosh you Christians are so greedy you will sell your birthright for a mess of trump pottage. And all you got were two very bad and possible impeachable court justices, both criminals too. Good that Jesus was a criminal or you all would be seen as hypocrites. But USA in lucky we will be free from Trump soon and if lucky all of Christianity will fold along with him.

  • Robert Hopgood

    I object to your repeated use of Christianophobe.
    What you are referring to is people saying ENOUGH to conservative Christians trying to SHOVE their beliefs down everyone else throats. Non Christians are now demanding the SAME RIGHTS as Christians and you are feeling persecuted by your lose of authority and PRIVILEGE.
    Maybe if more Christians actually walked their talk AND FOLLOWED the teachings of the Christ, there would not be the hostility you are feeling toward Christianity. Republicans sure are not doing that.

    • David Sparks

      So no one was hostile to Christ? Perhaps you missed the part where the authorities had him put to death. To quote a first century rabbi, “If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.”

      • Robert Hopgood

        It is NOT the Christ I have issues with.
        It is the intolerant followers who have perverted his teachings

        • David Sparks

          Ahhh. I see. So Jesus was put to death because he was what? My guess it was because he was intolerant of the policies of the political elite.

          • Robert Hopgood

            Learn to read
            I did NOT say that the Christ was to blame
            It is people like YOU who turned his teachings into crap
            I truly believe he would be disgusted with your attitudes

          • David Sparks

            I know how to read…perhaps you should try it yourself. I notice you did not answer the question as to why Jesus was put to death. Instead you do what so many leftist do…you resort to personal attack. Nothing new. Rather typical.

          • Robert Hopgood

            And I said what matter IS YOUR BEAHAVIOUR
            Which you continue to prove that you do NOT FOLLOW his teachings

          • David Sparks

            lm

          • Dhammarato

            He sure was disgusted with the priest and politicians. bet he’d be disgusted with Christianity today, and he would join us to fire bomb churches.

          • Robert Hopgood

            WTF are you talking about???
            And who the hell are you referring to???

      • Dhammarato

        Actually in our context Christianity is the world. Why Because Christianity is not Jesus To leave the world is to leave the culture and the culture is Christian, so to find Jesus, one must leave Christianity and find him elsewhere.

    • georgeyancey

      The Supreme Court seems to disagree with you in the Masterpiece decision. And I did not know that to not be fired for my religious belief was a privilege. Google Eric Walsh. So you can object all you want. Your objections does not change reality.

      • Robert Hopgood

        “And I did not know that to not be fired for my religious belief was a privilege.”
        Tell that to any pagan.

        • georgeyancey

          And it is wrong if it happens to a pagan too. Especially if we are talking about government job.

  • Alan

    “Building up our Christian communities is the proper long term approach for dealing with Christianophobia rather than political idolatry.” No, just please no. Honestly, I’m a Christian but I have a lot of non-Christian coworkers and friends and family, and “Christianophobia” is mostly in the minds of Christians. The average person on the street really doesn’t care what religious beliefs you have. Some are mildly curious but most are indifferent. What triggers these people is when Christians focus on their own self-preservation at the expense of non-Christians around them, or when they’re apathetic to the welfare of people unlike themselves. Once you realize that, you can see that “building up our Christian communities” is just more self-preservation. The proper way to deal with Christianophobia is to trust God to preserve His church, and to go out into the world and show the non-Christian world some real Christian values. Being pro-life is a great start, but it needs to be followed up with speaking out against other societal ills: poverty, homelessness, racism, etc. And I know as soon as people read those words, a lot moved on to the next comment. Because too many Christians don’t really care about those things. They don’t think they’re real problems. One evangelical friend dismissed it lately as “Jesus will fix it all when He comes back.” But until Christians show that they care about their neighbor, they’re not going to make any dents in Christiophobia.

    • Ron Swaren

      Evangelical Christianity seems, IMO, to be making the greatest strides in other countries. Missions have blossomed in the last half century from being a very specialized focus of individual churches to broad based philanthropic outreaches involving thousands of short term volunteers and leadership handed over to local personnel. In all, Americans contribute about $70 billion, privately, to foreign philanthropy each year. More goes out via governmental aid.

      Should they be concerned about these other things you mention? Maybe. Some are. But for younger people, jumping on to some earth shaking cause is their prime outlet for meaning. I wouldn’t judge these two groups in our society by the standards of the other.

  • “Christophobia?” Honestly???

    Evangelical Christians (ECs) have a long-standing persecution and martyr complex that is almost completely unfounded (at least in the developed, western world). I know this, I was one for several decades including as a missionary.

    “Perfect love casts out all fear.” This is at the root of where ECs are today. Their fear has become their god, and they pay lip service to Jesus. In fact, their fear causes them to condemn and marginalize people who actually manifest Jesus in their lives much more & better than they do; I find *many* examples of such people among the queer community whom ECs demonize with particular ferocity.

    When my fellow Christians are finally able to humble themselves, turn from their fear, and *really* trust Christ, they will find that they have been set free…from themselves, their own worst enemy.

    Love, Blessings & Joy!!

    • David Sparks

      “If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.”

    • fractal

      AMEN!

  • Stefan Stackhouse

    Trumpist Evangelicals have gotten the part about being wise as serpents, but have totally missed the part about being innocent as doves.

  • douglas kraeger

    George, you wrote, “Finding creative ways to strengthen our kids for a post-Christian world is a wise use of our time.” I have a suggestion for that.
    Question 1. What are the essential, fundamental attributes, actions, attitudes, or desires of the heart, of a truly living faith in God, that God wants all to desire with their whole heart to acquire and that HE uses to judge whether or not a person has a truly living faith or a dead or dying faith and the devil wants all to not dwell on and not to practice?
    Starting “given”; People are more likely see when they fail to practice essential attributes and actions of a truly living faith, when they have internalized an accurate list of those attributes that God wants all to desire with their whole heart so as to avoid having a dead or dying “faith”, and therefore, it seems self-evident that all people of goodwill (especially all ministers of all faiths) should do all they can to encourage and help all to find, internalize and practice, such a list of attributes and actions that God wants all to desire, and to practice, for a truly living faith and to conclude that they do not have a truly living faith, if they consciously choose not to honestly pray for the graces, and work, to acquire all the essential attributes and actions of a truly living faith.
    Question 2: Should not all ministers of all faiths be encouraged to join together and publicly encourage all to honestly seek all the attributes and actions of a truly living faith and should not the ministers each put on their web site a list of what they believe are these essential attributes?
    question 3: Will you encourage all to do this?

  • Ulf Turkewitsch

    Fear, and love of power are the two driving forces in the Evangelical movement today.

  • David Camp

    “Building up our Christian communities is the proper long term approach
    for dealing with Christianophobia rather than political idolatry.”

    Are you saying that you could do that better under a demonrat administration (a party that just voted lock-step to kill babies that survive abortions – or infanticide)?

    Are you going to write about what you have been doing to build up Christian communities and your ideas?

    • georgeyancey

      I would argue that political victories are short sighted. We need to have an impact on our culture and that is harder now that we are linked to Trump. Clinton at her worst could attack us from the outside. Our alliances with Trump can destroy us from within and I think is much more dangerous to us.

      I actually am working on a book about Christian community. I will blog on that topic from time to time but my real statement on community will be in that book. Thanks for asking.

      • David Camp

        Thanks, George for your reply. I’m trying, at this moment to publish my second book on CreateSpace. Don’t know how I published my first one and I did a great job. It had to be the Lord!
        I’m glad Trump is there. I believe the Lord put him there as mercy for His children. I know the Clintons, especially slick willy. His time is coming again. Can’t stop it but Trump did slow him down. I guess until the mark and everything is ready; catalyst and everything else in prophecy. I try not to get involved in the kingdom of darkness which is politics, hollywierd, etc. The devil’s realm, liars everywhere, all sides.

        • Dhammarato

          David all we ever get from you is politics and its your own personal darkness that is you mental state, non stop hate filled politics, Why don’t you sick-os give Clintons a rest. They are gone and only you keep them alive in your own sick minds, Shut up about turmp, shut up about abortion. find something to post that will heal your fears and worries and hate. Go write another stupid book, but nothing about abortion and nothing about trump. Bet you can;t. Bet your mind is so warped…not a drop of joy and good humor, not one joke, just non stop hate, now that’s a modern Christian for you.

          • David Camp

            Do you think this is “good humor”? Hate filled diatribe.

          • Dhammarato

            David if it gives you pause. If it makes you stop and think, If it makes you see how wrong you are and how stinky your mind has become, then we can all call it good humor. But if you ever post about hating Clinton then we both know that my post have failed to wake you up and that you remain a low class racist pile of republican turds. Stinky stinky stinky, David’s mind is stinky with a rotting Clinton for a cerebellum, and a slick willy for a frontal lobe. Go take a mental bath, you stink.

    • Dhammarato

      Never mind Those communities (with armed guards?), We all will be better off with the dems in. And you righttolifers can all take a hike. Have you not figured out that most of us think you are off limits and out of line when you want to tell young women what to do. You Swine, you pig, you heartless piece of rightotlifer who stand outside clinics to kill Drs. You are all violent fools made fearful by and angry god, known as fox,. This is a very old tired argument and you have lost so many times, please just go home and rest in piece, cry yourself to sleep. Just shut up about it looser.

  • likejiujitsu

    Trump is a Christian. Period. You may ask, ‘look at his past – where’s the fruit?’ I say, Has he continued in his past? No.
    Look at how he has taken up Christian causes even when it brought firestorms on him. He could easily compromise to make things easier for himself, but he hasn’t.

    • georgeyancey

      According to the lastest information Trump still lies with tremendous regularity. Sorry but I do not see a regenerate soul there. It is not my place to say if he is saved or not. But Christians are fooling themselves if they think he is one of them based on his policies.

      • Alan Drake

        Donald Trump did autograph the covers of a number of Bibles in Alabama yesterday.

        I will leave the theological implications of that to others – other than he shows none of the outward manifestations of being a Christian IMHO.

        • Dhammarato

          Trump is the new Christian, yet another turn to the right and now they are going backwards. He is the new christian and they will follow him well whatever road he trods. They already have his lies down pretty well, the next will be when Christians inflate their assets. Soon they will be pissing on old matrices in Moscow. Just imagine a room with 1000’s of them jumping and peeing on the beds all in worship of lard Trump.

    • Dhammarato

      he’s mad about his base, and he knows as we do that his base is a base of fools. Gotta give them fools a bone to pick or they will start howling.

  • You completely miss how Trump supporters think. You’re battling a straw man. The issue isn’t just preserving our Christian community. And no, it’s simply not possible for us to create such a beautiful community that the ungodly will respect us. If that were possible then Jesus and the Apostles would have won over all Israel.

    Trump supporters also care about the nation. We are not so self-centered as to care only about our comfort. We know what is best for the country, too, and want a decent nation for everyone, especially our children and grandchildren. You did not mention once the Supreme Court. That was one of the top issues for evangelical supporters of Trump. It wasn’t just fear of Hillary; it was more like loathing, anyway, not fear. We are hoping that good Supreme Court justices, real conservatives, will provide a bulwark against the rising tide of anti-Christian legislation coming out of Congress. Trump has picked two good ones and he might have another left to make. That alone is enough to justify supporting him and make his peccadillos of the past insignificant. His corporate tax cuts and reductions in the output of new regulations have also been good accomplishments.

    • georgeyancey

      You are trading short term political gain for long term respect. One day that will bite all of us in the butt. There will be a Democrat president in the future who will undo most of what Trump has done. What will you do then when you no longer have any cultural capital to use?

      • How do you figure justices are short term? They have their jobs for life. I don’t see that voting for Hillary would have gained us any respect. The trend of nominal Christians leaving is 50 years old. It didn’t begin with Trump.

        • Alan Drake

          It appears that Justice Kavanaugh can be impeached for perjury during his confirmation hearings.

          60 D Senators and a D POTUS can expand SCOTUS by two justices to balance the stolen seat occupied by Justice Gorsuch.

          • Not likely.

          • Dhammarato

            it depends on 2020 election, All in all Christians have nothing to be smug about and many things to be ashamed of, especially voting records.

        • georgeyancey

          There is no long term political solution without cultural change. Christians forfeited an opportunity to build cultural influence to support Trump. SC Justices are nice but even they die. If the culture is lost long-term, and it may be with this last presidential election, then ultimately even gaining SC Justices is only a short term solution.

          • As I wrote Christianity began declining long before Trump was born. It’s silly to think support for him made any difference. According to Jesus people reject him because they love evil. But I agree the long run requires a revival of Christianity.

          • Dhammarato

            more likely its deep decline into nothing much. and we need that time soon. Will Rodgers use to say he never met a man he didn’t like, but he did not live long enough to me a modern Christian.

        • Dhammarato

          No way for Christianity to gain any respect, but there are many ways to loose it and now you are trying them all. Your hate for Hillary will continue to loose respect. And its not about Hillary, it about your hateful mindset. The supreme court is dirty, done by Mitch and friends. The court is dirty with dirty politicians and politicians who packed them in. And times will change, spring is coming, and you will get whats coming to you while I stand by and laugh. And the funny thing is, that retards don’t have Hillary to kick around anymore and they hate that too. So now you spend time kicking around a straw woman and we just laugh at your foolishness.

      • gimpi1

        I have to say you’re right, Mr. Yancey. Just reading these comments, I see people lying, dehumanizing those who disagree with them, using slurs and embracing an obviously marginal person.

        I’m sure they care about this country and believe in the principles they declare, but why can’t they do that without assuming the absolute worst about me? Why can’t someone discuss their beliefs about, oh, say abortion, without calling me a baby-killer? Why are people continuing to make up Pizzagate-style lies?

        I don’t want to see people I disagree with as unworthy of trust, but it’s hard to imagine being able to trust people who buy into Q-Anon conspiracy-theory stuff. It’s hard to respect a group that claims to be moral arbitrators, but embraces a person whose only morality appears to be self interest.

        I’m an outsider to your faith. I’m the person you’re talking about. And, you’re right, I do notice the hypocrisy. What do you think I should think?

  • Alan Drake

    I strongly suspect that most white evangelicals do not understand how quickly their political power will fade – even before factoring in the coming disgrace of Donald Trump.

    My rough estimate is that 8% to 9% of the 2016 Trump voters (when he got 46.x% of the popular vote) will be dead or senile by November 2020.

    Few new voters – those turning age 18 or new citizens – will replace them.

    Add to that the reduced turnout differential between D and R.

    The 2016 to 2018 shift should be doubled (or more) in 2020.

    The 2022 election, after the 2020 census, will reflect the intrastate shift of population from rural to urban and shift many state legislatures towards D by reapportionment. Plus four more years of demographic shifts.

  • Silverwolf13

    We’re not talking about real Christianity here, we’re talking about a diminishing group of people who want to impose their pietism on everybody else. They want their prayers recited at every public gathering, their religious symbols in public parks, and their schools subsidized by the government. And they want these things not to promote real Christianity but to demonstrate the power of their group.

    Instead, why don’t we talk about imitating Jesus? Why don’t we become a nation of Samaritans, providing health care for all? Why not pick up our brothers and sisters when they’re down on their luck and homeless, instead of looking away as we walk by them on the street and trying to get their camps moved to where we can’t see them?

    And remember that Jesus said not one word about abortion, which was legal and practiced in Israel, nor did he say one word about homosexuality. He was concerned that we care for one another.

  • Bungarra

    Many years ago while at Uni one occasionally heard the expression “Come the Revolution” Some times by those attracted to the Revolutions of Mao, etc, other times by those frustrated by the system. Watching the outcomes of the Royal Commission into Child Abuse – sexual and other wise in Australia together with recent reports of similar abuse across the USA in interdependent Christian Churches that reads like the Royal Commission report, one begins to think “Reformation”.

    If we were to respond a Christ suggested to those who drive children away from him, we would pollute our seas with Millstones. Like wise the gender issues, and racism and LGBT issues. Are we humans all equal before God?

    I would suggest that what we need now is a “Revolutionary Reformation”. So for example rather than attack women who wish to abort, suggest that the partner who provided half the genetic material for the child is also equally responsible for contributing to managing the out comes. To claim such ‘Holiness’ in condemning abortion while not providing the child with post birth care, food and education to its full capacity – freely, as well as universal health care is a total mockery of ‘Caring for the Poor.’ The issue of the powers of the 0.5% also needs to be addressed.

    “Come the Revolutionary Reformation!!!”

    • fractal

      Please.

      Women who abort most often do so because they don’t want to be Pregnant.
      All the $$ in the world doesn’t change the fact that women know in their guts if it is the right time to reproduce or not.
      Trust women.

      If you want a real reformation, then every man who impregnates a woman who does not wish to be preggers, should be required to get a vasectomy with no reversal for 10 years.

      Let’s focus on men’s reproductive organs for a change, and see what happens.

  • Why would there be an endgame past 2024? Once Trump is out of office, and cannot run again, he becomes useless to the cause of protecting Christianity.

  • BlueBeetle

    Your conundrum goes away if you just realize that Evangelicals were morally bankrupt before Trump office. Trump is just highlighting that fact.

  • Neecyj

    Please excuse me but who made you the judge, ruler and jury over God’s people? How is it that what you think about the President and how other people vote or who they support is significant and the overriding principle for all people? This article leaves much to be desired. Read your Bible its say’s “And he changes the times and the seasons: he removes kings and sets up Kings”; (Dan 2:21) and “Fear God. Honor the emperor”. (1 Ptr. 2:17), and “Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God.” “Therefore, whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment” (Rom 13:1-2). Those who profess to be Christians should understand that a sitting President is there because God has placed him there- he did not place Hilary there. I personally could not vote for either person during the election cycle, but surely, I could not vote for someone who thinks it’s proper to Kill babies, lock people into un-biblical relationships, and think it’s just fine for grown men to use the same bathroom as little girls. Donald Trump is the President and should be respected as such-you or I don’t have to like him, but you do have to pray for him-and wish him God’s Speed-That is biblical; this is Christian. SMH

  • fractal

    Every misogynist is also a racist.
    They go together like milk and cookies.

    It’s a tribal, patriarchal thingy.
    My genes are better than your genes, and I control the genes of our women…

  • gimpi1

    OK, the Democratic party does not support socialism by any realistic definition of the word. Nor do they support infanticide or the destruction of Isreal. The only firearms regulations they currently support are universal background checks and magazine size limits, neither is registration. No one is calling for children to be raised by any ‘system,’ whatever that is. They do call for a more progressive tax system, with the wealthy seeing higher tax rates, so that’s one accurate statement in with a bunch of hyperbole and falsehoods.

    Really, why can’t you make your points honestly? If you don’t believe in governmental pensions, poverty aid, single-payer health insurance or assistance in paying for education, say so, rather than lying by calling ideas like this ‘socialism.’ If you want to discuss your objections to abortion, make your case, don’t lie and call it infanticide. Make your case on firearms, taxes, or parenting honestly, don’t misrepresent the views of those you disagree with.

    You’re literally bearing false witness. Don’t you have rules about that?