Or how about instead, IRS, you go to hell? Yeah. I like that better. Go to hell.

A bureaucracy, like a corporation, has no soul, so you can wish it to perdition all you like when it becomes an agent of evil.  And when the IRS says to a pro-life group: We’ll approve your application if you promise not to “protest or picket outside of Planned Parenthood” it can go to hell.

How’s that for reporting the content of my prayers, IRS?

This stuff is, at the *very* least, a massive failure of oversight by Obama, with whom the buck stops.  What remains to be seen is whether it’s more than that.  If this is not merely the IRS going rogue in response to the corporate culture of the Obama White House and is, instead, enacting policy on order from the White House, then Obama should be impeached.

  • Andy

    Mark
    - What if it is neither? What if it is the laws surround 501c.. is so badly written that there is no way to really oversee those who apply? No to minimize the infringement of rights – merely to say that like everything that comes out of Washington is so convoluted that it makes enforcement and oversight all but fairly impossible.

    • dabhidh

      I don’t believe this. When the IRS asks a private agency to refrain from public criticism of another private agency as a condition of receiving tax-exempt status, that is not the result of a poorly-written law. That is the IRS or at least an individual within the IRS attempting to intimidate a private agency. The IRS should not have to be told that their authority doesn’t trump the 1st Amendment. If they do need to be told that, then they are either a corrupt or an incompetent organization.

      • Andy

        Yet many people are forbidden from expressing their displeasure in a public forum if they are too near an elected official. Having said that I was raising a question – one that has a follow-up then – was the IRS appropriate in threatening a church for making statements from the pulpit which questioned the need for the Iraq war. When this happened I did not hear the howls of protest.
        I would rather guess that the law is at best murky, I do not think that to immediately lay this at Obama’s doorstep is either wise nor is it Christian. By the way we have a statement in an article, that says the letter requires the groups to do something. I would love to the letter.

        • dabhidh

          I must confess that I don’t know what you mean by, “many people are forbidden from expressing their displeasure in a public forum if they are too near an elected official.”

          Assuming that the IRS did threaten a church over statements made about the Iraq war, that was wrong too. I don’t see how your not hearing sufficient “howls of protest” over that incident (I’ve never heard of it, frankly, but I don’t doubt that it happened) excuses the IRS targeting conservative groups one iota.

          And for my part, nothing that I have said has anything to do with “laying the blame at Obama’s doorstep.” Obama’s involvement or non-involvement in this situation will become clear in time, I am sure.

          • Sherry

            I believe it is rather obvious what Mark is saying, no to the misbegotten highly illegal and immoral attempt to coerce people into denying their faith out of fear of the full wrath of a government bureaucracy capable of destroying anyone and everyone economically it choses to attack. Go back to hell might be more accurate.

  • Dr. Eric

    St. Joseph Baltimore Catechism (the little gray paperback version)

    “232. What is cursing?

    Cursing is the calling down of some evil on a person, place, or thing.

    To wish that someone would lose his soul or would suffer some bodily harm is against the love we owe our neighbor.”

    From the little purple book on Examination of Conscience by Fr. Robert Altier:

    Section on Mortal Sins, Second Commandment: “-Seriously wishing evil upon another”

    CCC:

    2302 By recalling the commandment, “You shall not kill,”94 our Lord asked for peace of heart and denounced murderous anger and hatred as immoral.

    Anger is a desire for revenge. “To desire vengeance in order to do evil to someone who should be punished is illicit,” but it is praiseworthy to impose restitution “to correct vices and maintain justice.”95 If anger reaches the point of a deliberate desire to kill or seriously wound a neighbor, it is gravely against charity; it is a mortal sin. The Lord says, “Everyone who is angry with his brother shall be liable to judgment.”96

    2303 Deliberate hatred is contrary to charity. Hatred of the neighbor is a sin when one deliberately wishes him evil. Hatred of the neighbor is a grave sin when one deliberately desires him grave harm. “But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven.”97

    • Dr. Eric

      Mark, you’re very good at pointing out how Live Action’s actions violate the 8th Commandment. In fraternal charity, I’m asking you to examine your curses against corporations. They are still made up of people. This is why I no longer curse the insurance companies. I used to tell my patients that they could all go to hell, but after teaching my children their catechism lessons, I realized that I was violating the 2nd and 5th Commandments by cursing the insurance companies.

      • http://www.facebook.com/dillon.mccameron Dillon T. McCameron

        Doesn’t it seem, Dr, that after explaining what a curse is (calling evil down on persons, places, or things) all that follows is a condemnation of the hatred of neighbors, that is, of the first example: people?

        What I mean is, do you reckon it possible that I am to love my enemy, but not necessarily his organization or country? (To love the gangster but hate the mafia, say?)

        • Dr. Eric

          To fight against someone in legitimate self defense is not hating the attacker, only defending oneself. If you want to kill someone to send him to hell, then yes, you have violated the 5th Commandment.

          You can think that what the mafia wants to do is evil, but you can’t wish them to “go to hell.” That’s a curse.

          You can point out that what they do is evil. You can warn them that they are risking the fires of hell by doing their evil deeds, but you can’t wish that they go to hell.

          • http://www.facebook.com/dillon.mccameron Dillon T. McCameron

            Yes, but a person is not the club, company, cult, or nation they belong to. Drug Cartels, human trafficking rings, abortion mills, these are infernal institutions. Hell already has them. Hating a wicked institution is akin to hating an occasion of sin. One could hate Playboy magazine and hope all involved in its production make it to Heaven.

            Couldn’t they?

      • Paul

        “In fraternal charity, I’m asking you to examine your curses against corporations. They are still made up of people.”

        No they aren’t. A corporation’s existence is entirely separate and distinct from the people who control it, profit from it, or employed by it.


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