Trapping and Exposing Lies and Falsehoods

Fresh from denouncing the errors and gutless cowardice of such menaces as Fr. Father Robert Barron and such dangerous men as Karl Keating, Jimmy Akin, Al Kresta and similar wolves in sheep’s clothing serving the Church of Nice, Church Militant TV now leads its flock of highly discerning disciples in the unerring direction of TRVTH by promoting the rock solid science of geocentrism.  What could possibly be smarter and more deeply Catholic than helping raise the stock of people who have endorsed the unimpeachable fact that the Moon Landings were a hoax, that Roosevelt was a Jew, that Jews probably killed JFK, that “The infection of Judaism and Zionism has become the number one enemy for us”, that Jews are “slave masters”, that “it is becoming increasingly difficult to believe that six million Jews were killed in Nazi internment camps.”, that we should “stop blaming it on the nation who excised [the Jews] and start looking at what the Jewish people do to get themselves excised.” and that the Holocaust was that sad period in history when “the Jews turned on the Germans because they got a better deal from someone else.”  Clearly, I think all Real Catholics[TM] will do well to realize that this track record of sound Catholic teaching is so good that an apostolate whose entire mission is to “trap and expose” “lies and falsehoods” covers itself in glory by promoting such people and their work on geocentrism.  If there is anything that no well-formed Catholic can deny, it is that the  entire universe spins around a non-rotational earth every 24 hours and that Science is a gigantic conspiracy to deny that doctrine of the Faith.  Fans of Church Militant TV should wisely continue to say that any criticism of this latest decision to promote such people and their work is entirely due to the fact that CMTV alone–in the entire Church–is unafraid to tell it like it is and the Church of Nice is frightened and trying to shut up the boldest Truthtellers of our time.  Anybody suggesting that this is an epic demonstration of the corrosive effects that indulgence of pride and anger have on common sense only does so because they are jealous of the undeniable truth and beauty of everything CMTV does, due to the fact that they are members of the Church of Nice who hate God, babies, and adorable puppies. And they are also probably Jews.

  • Des Farrell

    It’s a shame that Michael chose to go down the paranoid road as he is quite a dynamic speaker. He jumped the shark for me by attacking Robert Barron who is completely orthodox. If he continues to support Holocaust deniers then what little support he now has will disappear. Perhaps it’s for the best if he does disappear and gets some help. It’s not my fight but I hate to see him destroy his life and drag down the lives of the people he works with. The best thing he could do would be to take a year or two off and get some real advice. Good luck to him.

    • Dan C

      He needs to work for a living at real labor. A janitor somewhere or a farmworker or something.

    • Illinidiva

      There is apparently good money in being a paranoid kook. Voris is just the Catholic version.

  • Elmwood

    Global warming has 97% acceptance that it’s man caused in climate papers. Do you think he rejects AGW too?

  • tj.nelson

    They get stranger and stranger.

    • HornOrSilk

      Just don’t give Voris a copy of Ficinos Three Books on Life…..

    • Koala

      The truth is stranger than the fiction everyone passes around as truth.

  • http://www.likelierthings.com/ Jon W

    Waitaholdit. I don’t have the patience or anything approaching the desire to watch that video. Are they promoting Sungenis or just geocentrism in general? Because it seems to me you can be a geocentrist without being anti-semitic. Or is Mark abandoning his contention that you can get ideas from someplace without contracting ritual impurity?

  • Dan C

    I love that they embrace geocentrism. In fact, what took them so long?

  • Jeep

    So mark. Question for u. What do u think of Rick Delano? Seemed very coherent.

    • chezami

      I have to admit I find it impossible to argue with his logic.

  • HornOrSilk

    I only briefly watched the intro video, and while it looks like it might be promoting physical geocentrism, I’m not sure if that is what it is doing. I am no fan of Voris, but I wonder if the issue is not physical but spiritual geocentrism: and many people point, the incarnation can be said to make the earth the spiritual center of the cosmos, whatever its physical state is. And what I saw on the trailer seemed it could be suggesting this: however, it is still kooks who use “geocentrism” for this in the modern age, because they know how easily it is to think of it in physical terms.

    • HornOrSilk

      Ok, looking at the comments of the full video above, which wasn’t there when I first looked, looks like they go into kook range (denying the Big Bang: really?)

      • Philosopher

        The Big Bang probably did not happen, because observing creation “as if” the Big Bang happened vs. the Big Bang happening is identical. We have no way of knowing if God didn’t create the world in such a way as to allow for a Big Bang interretation to delude atheists.

  • Marthe Lépine

    That movie that they are promoting is starting with a couple of erroneous assumptions. One of the first sentences in the video seems doubtful to me: What they said seemed to mean that God created the earth in order to bring the plan of salvation to humanity, and it sounded to me like they assumed that the Fall was already a certainty before Creation. Then they claimed that the story of Galileo makes it sound like the Church had been wrong, and if the Church was wrong in that matter it might suggest that Scripture could be wrong too, therefore they had to prove that the Church had been correct. However I did a little research on line, and found a good story of Galileo in the Catholic Encyclopedia that explained that the Church had not condemned Galileo’s ideas, but only stated that the theory he maintained was only a plausible hypothesis and should not be presented as definitely true, while Galileo continued to teach it as a definitive fact and thus brought a condemnation upon himself for disobeying. I may be wrong, but it is what I understood, and if I am correct, it seems that the whole purpose of the movie they have been working on might be shaky.

    • HornOrSilk

      Well, Galileo was wrong, in that, he tried to suggest the sun is the center of the universe, which more or less, is geocentrism in relation to what we know of the universe today.

      We don’t know the size of the universe. Is it infinite? If it is, then, Nicholas of Cusa, long before Galileo, is apropos: he suggested that every point in the universe would then be the “center,” which is true, when dealing with an infinite universe. And this is more correct than Galileo or earlier forms of geocentrism.

      The ancient cosmology had two aspects which merged. On the one hand, there was the spiritual cosmology, which sees the earth as center because of the incarnation. As far as we know, this is still correct (of course, God can have other spiritual work going on in the rest of the universe we do not know). The physical cosmology, however, which saw the earth as center came from the understanding that we are the physical point in the universe, where everything “falls” towards, making us the center. This of course was due to poor physics understanding. The two merged and many confused a criticism of the physical as a criticism of the spiritual, leading to all kinds of primitive defenses of the old order. Now only kooks do that…

    • Athanasius

      “it sounded to me like they assumed that the Fall was already a certainty before Creation.”

      Since the Son was begotten of the Father before Creation, as was the Virgin Mary in the Mind of God (Proverbs), from and to all eternity, predestination is a fact. God is not describable or definable, He is ineffable and incomprehensible. So, yes, the Fall was a fact at the time of Creation. God is not limited by a linear concept of time like we are, with out pitifully limited intelligence. “Science” in our day is synonymous with materialistic reductionism. As if by reducing matter to smaller and smaller particles, they will “understand” being! Only God possesses Being, His name is “I AM Who Am.” The confusion these days is because the Thomistic metaphysics that explains the difference between Being (substance) and accident has been rejected by atheistic materialist science, which is the only politically correct science we have these days, and forgotten by “Catholic” educators. Geo-centrism seems pretty far out, though. I wouldn’t wast too much time thinking about it.

  • f

    “A fool takes no pleasure in understanding but only in airing an opinion.” 18:2. If a person feels qualified to make a statement without having watched the video…..there is a problem with learning in this country

  • Rosemarie

    +J.M.J+

    A number of years ago, I read an exchange on a (secular) scientific message board about Sungenis’s geocentrism. That discussion annoyed me because the scientists on the board assumed that geocentrism = Ptolemaic system, so they were all refuting that. Sungenis, however, believes the Tychonic system instead, so most of their refutations did not apply, as his supporter there kept pointing out.

    If this movie comes out, it could provide scientists an opportunity to really debunk this nonsense. Then again, maybe they’ll just refuse to dignify it with an answer.

  • Kevin O’Brien

    Of course we will have commenters claiming that there is a distinction between Galileo, Copernicus and Brahe that morons like us can’t appreciate, that the geocentrists are not as crazy as the evil “professional Catholic” Mark Shea makes them sound, that in fact it’s quite reasonable to consider that the Jews are behind the problems of our society and that those who close their eyes to the latest lights of the conservative mind – new insights such as the demonstrably false claims of ancient science and the 4,000 year old thing called antisemitism – that those who close their eyes to these wonderful insights are the real bigots.

    But the fact is that Voris has been fueling the fires of schism, fanning the flames of the irrational, and feeding the furnace of wrath for years now. His engine keeps chugging along, but the track leads nowhere.

  • ChGPe

    You’ll hear no defense from me of geocentrism, but to recklessly throw out the anti-antisemitism card every time you feel it necessary to criticize Voris is really uncalled for. This is poison, as Mark is often fond of saying.

    • chezami

      I said nothing whatsoever about Voris being anti-semitic. I did document that he has chosen (twice) to do puff piece interviews with people who are on record saying outrageous things about Jews and has offered his viewers and his interviewees no challenge at all to these remarks. If his mission is to trap and expose lies and falsehood, you’d kinda think that he say something about Holocaust Denial when he’s got somebody in the room with him who has made the statements I mention above.

  • Paranoid

    Actually, LBJ killed JFK. Mac Wallace pulled the trigger.

  • JP2 is not a saint

    Bump for truth because we disagree with your sarcasm and believe the earth is the center of the universe and that Sun-worshipping pagans tried to obscure this theological fact with “scientific” hypotheses

  • Jim Condit Jr.

    What are these panicked attacks on The Principle Movie? If it is that absurd, it will fall on its own. The Trailer (we use to call it a preview!) looks great, and it looks like a thought-provoking movie. Don’t most people need to consider that the earth is a very special place that supports life — unlike every other place and planet we know of in the universe? Mark Shea, who wrote the article above seems more interested in defending the diabolical modern Talmudic Jewish establishment — than in defending Catholicism. Mark, you are unaware that the Talmud says Jesus dies five deaths everyday in Hell? You are unaware that the Jewish Lobby (AIPAC and allies) control Congress with an iron fist? that the Jewish network controls every major TV and radio station, all big city daily newspapers in the USA? That every Federal Reserve Chairman since 1970 has been Jewish? 3% of the population leads “our” nation’s money-issuing entity 100% of the time since 1970? that there were not even six million Jews in Europe during WW II, and that the existing of homicidal gas chambers have already been disproven (German soldiers could not have gotten the bodies in and out at thousands a day without dying themselves?) You are unaware that Nazism was itself a creation of, and funded by, the top Jewish bankers? to round up the everyday Jews and force them to Palestine for the planned takeover of that poor country, which happened in 1948? Please get a grip, my brainwashed friend.

    • HornOrSilk

      Oh yes, here comes the typical spin: if you see something is stupid, and you don’t want Catholicism to be equated with such stupidity, it’s a “panic attack.” And here you see the anti-Semitism thrown in to defend the stupid.

      • MaryC

        Don’t try to refute Jim Condit’s (true) points; instead throw out the time worn, er, honoured “anti-semitic” slur.

    • Des Farrell

      “You are unaware that Nazism was itself a creation of, and funded by, the top Jewish bankers? to round up the everyday Jews and force them to Palestine for the planned takeover of that poor country, which happened in 1948? Please get a grip, my brainwashed friend.”

      Please visit Germany. If I were Mark Shea I would delete this garbage but he is a wiser man than me and allows others to see what can happen to an intelligent mind destroyed by paranoia.

  • Jim Condit Jr.

    Also, in “FDR: My Exploited Father-in Law”, author Curtis B. Dall says that the Roosevelt family were a Jewish descended family which was called the Rosenfelds in Holland. FDR claimed to be an Episcopalian, which may have been true, or may have been the kind of religious cover many Jews used even up to today. Either way, Roosevelt was somewhat racially Jewish, which would explain his packing the government with Jews once he took office. — Michael Collins Piper’s book, “Final Judgment” — makes a strong case that the Mossad was the moving force behind the JFK assassination, because JFK was absolutely denying Israel the nuclear bomb. This is also advanced in Gary Wean’s book, “There’s a Fish in the Courthouse”. Wean was movie star Audie Murphy’s body guard, and a detective with the LAPD, after serving as a beat cop for many years.

    • chezami

      Is it hard to type while you are rolling those little steel balls in your hand?

  • Jeff9

    “Fresh from denouncing the errors and gutless cowardice of such menaces as Fr. Father Robert Barron…. ”

    Excuse me?

    How would you defend Fr. Barron?

    Fr. Barron put forward Balthazar’s

    “I claim nothing more than this: that these statements [i.e., those of the New Testament which speak of hell] give us a right to have hope for all men, which simultaneously implies that I see no need to take the step from the threats to the positing of a hell occupied by our brothers and sisters, through which our hopes would come to naught.”

    as if it were acceptable doctrine.

    It is not! It is heresy. Plain and simple.

    Don’t attack Voris for calling out Fr. Barron. You should comend him!

    While Fr. Barron is an excellent speaker and one just naturally likes his manner, he is not speaking for the Church when he steps outside the deposit of faith. He is mis-leading thousands of Catholics.

    Unfortunately, most of the people who listen to Fr. Barron are so poorly catechized that they can’t identify heresy when confronted with it. Many of Fr. Barron’s listeners have substituted their visceral liking of the Barron’s personality for critical thinking about what he preaches.

    If Voris keeps one Catholic from accepting Barron’s heresy, he is doing a necessary job.


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