When it comes to abortion, prolife people get that “legal” does not equal “moral”

But let terrified children show up at the border and suddenly rules, regulations and paperwork become the most important thing in the world and we discover man was made for the law, not the law for man.

Dr. Jeff Mirus debunks this mentality soundly:

The Immigration Paradox: Blindness is Forbidden

 The Sovereignty Myth: On the Limits of Political Authority

Immigration: the Contested Principle

“Illegals” are not “Immorals”: A Persistent Immigration Fallacy

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  • Andy

    Thank you for sharing these links – I had not encountered Dr. Mirus and his work before. It was for me a breath of fresh air.

  • Andy

    That is an excellent point. We decry as unjust (rightly) when it suits our agenda. But, welp, rules are rules when it benefits us. No wonder that ridiculous line from the left about not caring about children outside the womb.

  • Joejoe

    Something I noted a while back as well. People don’t like to hear it! (They don’t like to hear “pray for your enemies” or “give away your possessions and follow me” either.)

  • Deacon Nathan Allen

    It’s also not clear these children are illegal migrants, since many of them are fleeing horrific conditions in their home villages where their lives are in danger. Many of them have a plausible claim for asylum under US (and international) law, and if that’s true, they aren’t illegal at all, since ‘illegal’ means contrary to the law. It isn’t, therefore, until there has been a court hearing and a determination that a particular minor is not a bona fide refugee that we can definitively say he is here illegally. But it’s precisely the right to an evidentiary hearing to determine legal status that the President and Congress are talking about eliminating.

  • Eve Fisher

    Whether the immigrants are legal or illegal, lining up to scream at buses full of frightened children is not the moral, kind, compassionate, or patriotic thing to do.

    • I think they’re mostly yelling at the government employees driving the buses and actually making the decisions as to where the kids go.

      • Eve Fisher

        I hope you’re right; but even so, all they’re doing is scaring the kids to death. And the bus drivers aren’t the ones making the decisions, so it’s a lot of hate and fear being directed at the powerless, not the powerful. I just heard, on another blog, from someone who KNOWS that these kids are being bused to be put into private homes, so someone out there in the media is feeding them a whole lot of lies.

        • Try and get a copy of mau mauing the flak catcher by Tom Wolfe. It’s pretty short and worth your time. You’ll never look at a political protest the same way again.

          The whole affair, beginning to end, is low intensity warfare. We’re in a cold war between left and right in this country. The best we can do at the moment is try not to let it get hot.

  • Mike Blackadder

    Mark, there are two situations here:
    1) First a proper response to the emergency situation; providing food, health care, a place to stay.
    2) A determination of the status of these individuals and whether they have a legitimate claim to asylum in the US.
    So which law are you talking about as being a barrier to helping these people? Are you talking about laws that would prevent us providing humanitarian aid, or are you talking about laws that objectively determine the legal status of those landed here?

  • Rebecca Fuentes

    I have a lot of thoughts on this and have just as much trouble organizing them. When people (on either side of politics) throw out the term “Immigration reform” they don’t actually mean that. They usually mean, “Do something about illegal immigration” as if there is nothing wrong with people waiting years and years to be allowed to immigrate legally. Our system to legally immigrate needs help.
    Crossing the border illegally isn’t, I think, intrinsically immoral. It might involve immoral things, but people crossing without doing anything else immoral is not immoral. With that being said, a lot of danger and nastiness comes across our southern border, and we need to do something about that. We need border security, not to keep out kids seeking refuge and not to keep out people seeking work, a better life, and better education for their kids. We need it because of the drug and human trafficking that crosses our border. And frankly, I think it would benefit the US to do something to help stabilize the countries in Central and South America. The drug cartels are as much of a threat and have done as much damage as terrorists.
    I and sick of the quips and memes going around that imply or outright say we shouldn’t do anything about these kids because the money should be going to veterans, to the poor here, to cause x, y or z. It’s not either/or. It’s not that we should take care of our veterans or take care of these kids. It’s both. We can do both and we ought to do both, but other than prayer and donations, there’s not much I can do about either situation. That frustrates me.
    We shouldn’t just fling open the doors to the country and let everyone in willy-nilly, but people who want to stay and work, even if they are unskilled or poorly educated or brown or speak Spanish, should be allowed to immigrate, and the process for them immigrating shouldn’t be so long, involved and complicated that it’s impossible.
    I’m tired of the immigration issue being used to score political points by both sides. It’s another form of objectification, turning people, people who have no power, and little of anything else into a fear, or a pressure or votes (or potential votes).

    • Andy


    • Mike Blackadder

      “Crossing the border illegally isn’t, I think, intrinsically immoral.”
      I totally agree. And as you point out it is not inherently immoral to recognize the necessity of immigration law. It is also not inherently immoral to caution against operating outside the laws of the country, that there are consequences of the precedent set by our actions.

  • Mike Blackadder

    Mark, if you thought about it, do you think maybe this is an example where your ability to be rational is giving way to typical ‘progressive relativism’?
    I find it hard to swallow that you would conflate the inherent immorality of abortion with immigration law. Arguing that abortion is morally unjust despite legal justification is nothing at all like the adoption of anarchy as a form of border control.

    You may as well say that since abortion is legal yet immoral that Catholics should feel free to openly oppose every law that we have. That simply does not square with any of the social teaching of the church. This seems to be a flailing partisan argument that doesn’t do justice to the intellectualism that you are capable of applying to your posts.

  • You’re advocating a travesty of what the Church actually teaches here which is a balanced support of refugees and also a support for the immigration control system. Separating minor children from their parents to make dangerous international journeys where not all of them make it is breathtakingly destructive of the family, of community, and is normally an emergency measure that happens in the worst of situations. Nothing has changed in Central America. The change that has brought two orders of magnitude more people to our borders is here and to halt the destruction that we’re causing in Central America we absolutely need to change.

    Through our political messaging, we’ve created an attractive nuisance that is tearing apart families, both socially, and physically. There really is only one cure to the harsh realities of “the beast” (the Mexican freight train so popular and so deadly for migrants), which is renewed border enforcement to the point where these central americans get the message that the risk isn’t worth it.

    The risks are real and don’t start at the US border. They start a few miles out of their home towns and last for hundreds and thousands of miles before they ever hit US soil. People are getting hurt, getting raped, getting sold into slavery, and getting killed. If you have a solution to those problems other than border enforcement or an invasion of Mexico I’m all ears.