‘The arguments sounded so similar … that I got them confused’

Bravo Phil Snyder. This is nicely done:


* * * * * * * * *

Christianity Today reports: “Silver Lining for Churches in Second Circuit Deciding DOMA Is Unconstitutional.”

Apparently, for CT, every ray of sunshine has a silver lining. Or something.

It’s pretty amazing when a Christian news-outlet announces a step toward legal equality for minorities by assuring readers that it’s not all bad news. There might still be a “silver lining.”

* * * * * * * * *

Southern Baptist “ethics” spokesman Richard Land says that his emphasis on opposing legal abortion and LGBT rights is just like Martin Luther King Jr.’s emphasis on “racial reconciliation and racial justice.”

I guess what Land means is that the Southern Baptist Convention is as determined now to champion immorality and cruel oppression as it was during the Civil Rights movement of the 1960s. OK then.

* * * * * * * * *

Evangelicals stand for “absolute truth” and “objective truth.” They decry “postmodernism” as an insidious evil that threatens God’s righteousness, the authority of scripture, family values, truth, justice and the American way.

Postmodernism? They’re against it.

Except for when it comes to “The Romney campaign’s postmodern approach to policy.”

”There are all these studies out there,” Romney says. Like, you’ve got your truth, and I’ve got mine, man. It’s the most postmodern thing I’ve seen since I was an undergraduate at UC Santa Cruz.

This is how the Romney campaign has treated numbers in general. … What matters isn’t whether the Romney campaign’s numbers add up. It’s whether they’ve got a bunch of numbers to throw at the Obama campaign’s numbers, and at the analyses from independent experts. “There are all these studies out there.” And who knows? Maybe they’re right. Maybe all voters take away is that there are all these studies out there, and the only ones you should trust are the ones you agree with.

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  • http://apocalypsereview.wordpress.com/ Invisible Neutrino

    A transcript of Phil Snyder’s speech.

    Very nicely done, indeed!

  • http://twitter.com/shutsumon Becka Sutton

     And of course someone in the comments completely misses the point. All the points.

  • http://apocalypsereview.wordpress.com/ Invisible Neutrino

    Oh geez, I just read the comments. D-X

    There is no palm large enough to encompass the magnitude of my facepalm.

  • Matri

    Will these two suffice as an inadequate substitute?

  • Matri

    Bah. Stupid HTML.

  • Loki100

    Christianity Today acts like this is some sort of stunning new revelation, rather than something that has always been known. Seriously, always. All the way back to the beginning of the nation.

  • Blahblah

    Exactly. Pretty much this is all that gay couples (and supporters) ask. Separation of civil and religious marriage. It is the anti-gay side which has been trying to illegally impose their religious rules on civil laws.

  • reynard61

    From my Facebook page:

    Okay; I’ve been using the word “fuck” a lot lately, usually with such modifiers as “actual” and “everloving”. But I’m going to have to do it again: WHAT IN THE ACTUAL, EVERLOVING FUCK?!?!?!

    First of all: “(Frank) Wright, President and Chief Executive Officer of the National Religious Broadcasters, warned that the choice of the next president would determine whether the Bible can be freely preached in America because ‘there is legislation pending on Capitol Hill today, even as we sit here in your studio, that could so constrain your free speech rights and the rights ultimately of all Americans that the Bible will be something that is referred to only in part because there will be parts of it that are untouchable’ out of fear of government persecution(…)”

    Okay, I’m calling “shenanigans”. Such a bill is, on it’s face, unconstitutional and would never get past the Republican-controlled House. (Assuming that the Republicans in the House actually did their jobs — which we haven’t seen a lot of lately…) Also, If it *is* true, then what’s the bill number and who are it’s sponsors? Just saying “There’s this bill that will…” doesn’t make it so. In other words, “Proof or it didn’t happen.”

    Second: “(Southern Baptist Convention Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission President Richard) Land then asserted that Christians would continue to be involved in politics so long as abortion remained legal and efforts to expand marriage equality existed, saying that criticizing the Religious Right for fighting this issues is ‘like attacking Dr. [Martin Luther] King for making a priority out of racial reconciliation and racial justice'(…)”

    No, sorry, dick. MLK’s priority was to *expand* Civil (and Human) Rights and racial reconciliation and justice. Your priority seems to be to deprive anyone who doesn’t hew to your narrow definition of marriage of the right to all of the benefits (and possible heartbreak) of same and impose your will on the rest of us while clutching your pearls and whining about how your Christian hegemony is being “persecuted” by the filthy Heathen-folk. Well, screw that and screw you! You have every right to complain about Teh Ghey all you want. (It’s not like you won’t anyway…) But to compare your efforts to deprive same-sex couples of the same rights that heterosexual couples can expect *by default* is a horrible, monstrous — and, yes, *dickish* — insult to both Dr. King’s name and the cause that he fought for and was assassinated for.

  • http://www.facebook.com/jrandyowens Randy Owens

    So, obviously, the sensible thing for Frank Wright to do is suggest that his followers donate heavily to the ACLU.  Right?  That’s what he recommended, isn’t it?

    Edit: Damn, I’m spelling like a Tea Party signmaker today!

  • Amaryllis

    Spotted on someone’s T-shirt this morning: “Vote God 2012.”

    I don’t know what district that guy votes in, but the Name That Is Above All Other Names wasn’t on my sample ballot.

  • http://www.facebook.com/jrandyowens Randy Owens

    Didn’t you look at the top of the list?  That’s the one, obviously.  Or The One, if you prefer.

  • Amaryllis

     * snicker *

    I … never thought of that.

  • http://www.facebook.com/jrandyowens Randy Owens

    To be fair, I’d never heard of “the Name That Is Above All Other Names,” myself.  That’s probably why the other interpretation came to me right away.

  • http://apocalypsereview.wordpress.com/ Invisible Neutrino

    Romney used that terminology; I didn’t know if it was unique to Mormons or not, but I am guessing it is?

  • Lori

     It’s not unique to Mormons. I know that it gets used, or at least mentioned, periodically in the Church of Christ.

  • Lunch Meat

    It’s from the Bible, in a passage that’s quoted fairly commonly, so as far as I know every denomination uses it. Philippians 2:9: “Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name.”

  • Randall M

     But . . . was God born in the US to American parents?  If not, he’s not eligible, as I understand it (we know he’s old enough).

  • EllieMurasaki

    Either ‘born in the US’ or ‘to at least one US parent’ will do. Or ‘citizen of the US at the time of the signing of the Constitution’, or some other date in that general vicinity, which is probably what they’d slide him in under.

  • Launcifer

    I suppose it’s too much to hope that they’d want to see a birth certificate on this one, isn’t it?

  • http://stealingcommas.blogspot.com/ chris the cynic

    Yeah, write in candidates have no chance.

    Did they at least tell you what office God was running for?

  • Jane

     He’s actually running for Comptroller of Platts County, Tennessee.

  • 2-D Man

    I’d like to see God’s birth certificate.

  • Tricksterson

    Well, we know he was born in Isreal so obviously he’s disqualified.

  • reynard61

    “So, obviously, the sensible thing for Frank Wright to do is suggest that his followers donate heavily to the ACLU.  Right?  That’s what he recommended, isn’t it?”

    *snerk* Yeah, let’s go with that…

  • Victor Savard

    Listen here Fred! I’ve asked “The Avengers” and “The Alien gods incharge of this earth” to co-operate and long story short, in the spirit of The U>S election, they’ll let me speak to a few of your powerful cells in reality, so they say! Anyway, “I’M” talking to number “ONE” of your human cells in this century! Right? “I” hope so cause “I’M” getting very tired of this little retardo Victor Savard who NOW calls himself V.S. in the twenty-first century and sometime, he even brings “IT” down to v.s. butt I’ll have ya know Fred that “IT” is still the same god darn thing. THEY’RE STILL THE SAME, YOU HERE ME? Long story short Fred, we took some of Victor’s Egor, I mean ego cells to a Canadian Hockey Game in Ottawa Canada in our time machine expecting his cells to show U>S (usual sinners) how powerful Victor really was butt wouldn’t you know “IT”,  a hockey game broke out instead!?
    “I” basically want to ask you, I mean your smart cells that is, to please control your imaginary spiritual reality cells of the twenty-first century or else we’ll have to do “IT” for ya if ya know what “I” mean? WE CAN’T give this LITTLE VS RETARDO excuses to continually keep crying to his so called GOD (Good Old Dad) EVERY TIME HE’S SAD, SO STOP “IT” Right NOW?
    Come on Fred, you and your cells know what “I’M” talking about cause Victor actually believes in HIM and you of all human Christian cells should know about “The Power of Possitive Thinking” and the damage “IT” can do or “I’M” “I” just talking “Orally” Hear Fred?
    “STOP” “IT” NOW! THIS “END” OF MAN, I mean “HIM” can only bring U>S (usual sinners) to the beginning of “MAN” and we  “The aliens” won’t stand for “IT” without a good christian fight, IF YA KNOW WHAT WE gods MEAN? 
    Forgive me for being a little UP SET and yelling butt buddy, you see Fred, you must end “IT” NOW before “IT” really is too late for all of U>S.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdNCuoTD3-E I see that some of your brave cells of the twenty first century are playing their “Ignorant Card” just like in the days of old where……?                      ?
    Just a second Fred! Here comes Victor and don’t forget we are only talking “Shake Speer” when “I” tell v.s to go break a leg somewhere!
    So you UP to no good again sinner vic and what are you doing here in the year of 1814? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50_iRIcxsz0
    To be honest with ya V.S. our destination was actually 1066 in the battle of Ace sting but someone played an early Halloween joke on U>S and NOW our cells find ourselves having to talk to one of  Johnny Horton cells butt what are you doing here vs?
    Go Figure!  http://www.variety.com/article/VR1118061012 Maybe me, myself and i came for an Odd Dish sin? :)

  • Grey Seer


    OK, is it just me, or has Victor been getting progressively more incomprehensible?

  • Lori

    OK, is it just me, or has Victor been getting progressively more incomprehensible?  

    Just you, at least if you take a long enough view. Victor’s level of sense-making varies quite a bit.

  • Victor

     Thank you Lori! I think?

    Hey she was talking about U>S Victor!

    Sorry sinner vic. :)


  • http://www.facebook.com/jrandyowens Randy Owens

    Is it odd that sockpuppeting is where I suddenly want to finally draw the line?  (Not that it necessarily qualifies as sockpuppeting per se.)

  • MaryKaye

    People who say “write in candidates have no chance” should note the recent Alaskan congressional election where Lisa Murkowski, who was too moderate for her (R) party’s primary nomination, ran as write-in and won.  It was an unusual race–a three-way between her, R and D nominees–and she had a number of advantages in name recognition, but still, clearly it can be done.

  • http://stealingcommas.blogspot.com/ chris the cynic

    That race was actually on my mind when I wrote my post, but it’s such a special case that it seemed like a thing not worth including in a discussion of God’s undeclared candidacy for an unspecified office for which he/she/it will be a write in candidate in 2012.

  • http://www.blogger.com/home?pli=1 Coleslaw

    We don’t have the option of writing in candidates in Louisiana, or in Arkansas, Hawaii, Mississippi, Nevada, Oklahoma, South Carolina, and South Dakota,

  • http://www.blogger.com/home?pli=1 Coleslaw

    Sorry, double post.

  • Here

    Actually I’d almost like to see what happened if God won an election as a write-in.  Would the government be obligated to track him down? Would a court ruling be required on the validity of god as a person, citizen or electable official?

    The proceedings would be interesting, methinks.

  • http://profiles.google.com/marc.k.mielke Marc Mielke

    Given the divine’s responsibility for disasters and the like, one could argue that He is a hostile foreign power. If enough people wrote in “Adolph Hitler” or “Moammar Qadafi”, would they not be disqualified on similar grounds? God’s killed far more Americans than both of those guys combined!

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charity-Brighton/100002974813787 Charity Brighton

     I think if “causing the death of American citizens” was a
    disqualification for being President, Mitt Romney would win the next
    election by default, wouldn’t he?

  • http://profiles.google.com/marc.k.mielke Marc Mielke

    Nice. Mind you, they were jihadi shitheads, so their national affiliation is sort of academic in my mind. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=659001961 Brad Ellison

    That rule would rule out most incumbents I can think of, to say nothing of Eisenhower, Grant, Tyler, and Washington.

  • Lori

    I think there’s a significant difference between ordering someone executed with no due process and sending the armed forces into situations in which some of them get killed.

  • Lori


      I think if “causing the death of American citizens” was a
    disqualification for being President, Mitt Romney would win the next
    election by default, wouldn’t he?   

    Depends on how you define “caused the death of”. A lot of people lost their health insurance when Bain shipped their jobs to China. Some of those people no doubt had health conditions that they could then no longer afford to treat, or had dependents who they had previously covered on their insurance who did. Some of those people have probably died. Others have probably dies due to conditions caused or exacerbated by the stress of losing their livelihoods and savings.

  • Matri

    No birth certificate.

  • Joshua

    I suspect it would be like that time someone was denied insurance because it was an “Act of God” and then tried to sue God. The suit was dismissed because the claimant couldn’t supply a valid mailing address with which to serve notice.

  • EllieMurasaki

    …isn’t the point of insurance to have some recourse in case of major random misfortune such as is termed ‘act of God’?

  • Joshua

    Yes. I’m just going from a memory that is several years old, so I may have misremembered the details, but some insurance companies do like nonsensical excuses.

  • Lori

      …isn’t the point of insurance to have some recourse in case of major random misfortune such as is termed ‘act of God’?  

    It depends on the policy. “Acts of God” has an actual, technical meaning in insurance speak—damage due to natural causes that could not have been prevented by use of reasonable foresight or caution. Most standard insurance polices don’t cover them, which is why you have to have separate (very carefully worded) policies for things like floods and earthquakes. 

    Word to the wise: If you live in an area prone to natural disasters make sure you know what your insurance will and will not cover. You don’t want to get the answer to the question after your car has been rendered unrecognizable by hail or the foundation of your house had cracked in an earthquake or all your worldly possessions end up spread all over the country by a tornado.

  • Albanaeon

    Is it bad that I am tempted to encourage the people who I think would write in “God” to go ahead and do so?

  • http://www.facebook.com/jrandyowens Randy Owens

    Albanaeon, if encouraging them to write God in is wrong, I don’t wanna be right.

  • Lori


    Is it bad that I am tempted to encourage the people who I think would write in “God” to go ahead and do so?  


    I hope that Bill Keller is not exaggerating his influence and that a substantial portion of his followers live in swing states.


    Note: I think Bill Keller is exaggerating and that to the extent he has actual followers very few of them live in swing states.

  • http://twitter.com/FearlessSon FearlessSon

    Evangelicals stand for “absolute truth” and “objective truth.” They decry “postmodernism” as an insidious evil that threatens God’s righteousness, the authority of scripture, family values, truth, justice and the American way.

    If Evangelicals believe in objective truth, then that is something I have in common with them.  However, I think where we diverge is that, as much “absolute” truth as might be out there, I do not claim to know nearly all of it.  I believe I know the truth insofar as I can observe and determine, but my knowledge of the truth is incomplete, while Evangelicals claim that the Bible tells them everything (or at least trumps all other knowledge it might intersect with.)  

    I believe it was Stephen Hawking who said,

    The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge.

  • Hawker40

    “The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge”

    It’s not what you don’t know, it’s what you know that ain’t so. (Mark Twain, I believe)