What If it’s Christ Privilege and Not White Privilege?

What If it’s Christ Privilege and Not White Privilege? July 18, 2019
Photo by eberhard grossgasteiger on Unsplash

A rather necessary distinction is needed thanks to another week of scandalous tweets and insta-outrage. The distinction between Christ privilege and white privilege. The following words will not argue against the idea that white privilege exists, however.

I am not here to refute the claim that those with white skin have shields protecting them from suffering. No. My aim is simply to highlight some of the baffling things that many of us may be guilty of saying and what it truly reflects when we speak (or type) without thinking.

A charge has been levied against love itself.

A couple of months ago, my husband and I were having a discussion about what happens when love is offered in the face of hate. The Beatitudes came to mind, and a very particular verse was considered, along with a question posed: Do we persecute others for love? Is that what Jesus meant when he said that we would be persecuted because of him?

During Jesus’ preaching on the Sermon on the Mount, the Beatitudes are introduced. My particular focus in on verse 11, but for the sake of context—to avoid cherry-picking— I have included 3 preceding verses. Matthew 5:7-9, 11 reads:

Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called children of God…
Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me.
Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you. 

Here’s the thing, I believe that Jesus Christ and God are One. Jesus is God in flesh, made fully human, but also fully divine. Jehovah Witnesses would argue against such an extraordinary idea. At least, the Jehovah Witnesses that used to visit me often did. Nonetheless, I think most of us agree that Jesus and God are one.

But, if you need a little more convincing, the Gospel of John reiterates the position. John 1:1-4 states:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In his was life, and that life was the light of all mankind.         

Jesus is the Word and the Word was God. Therefore, Jesus is God.

And as 1 John 4:7-9 highlights, God is love.

Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him.

So, Jesus is the Word, the Word is God, and God is love. Jesus is love. Jesus’ name means love. And so, this adds evidence to my proposition that we shall be persecuted in the name of love, that is God.

Not exactly a new idea. Most of us know that God is love. But, do most of us believe that we will be persecuted for love, or rather that we would be persecuted for following Christ? Aren’t the two the same, anyway? Perhaps. But many Christians hold to the idea that they will be persecuted solely for their theological beliefs.

For the sake of word space, let’s agree that love will be persecuted. In fact, love has been persecuted, judiciously, even. Most of us are familiar with the story of Loving v. Virginia; Richard and Mildred Loving are one of the truest testaments that love faces persecution and prosecution.

Of course, this is not the only instance worthy of highlighting, but again, for the sake of space, I am going to cut to the chase.

Below, is a a portion of the screenshot. Yes, it is edited. I cut the remaining text out because it is inflammatory and not relevant to the point.

Of course I am conflicted. The very things condemned in this post are the very mantras that I apply to my own life.

Disney has supplied me with similar mantras that are staples in my own home.

via GIPHY

Dory taught me to “just keep swimming”. Moving forward and moving on is a good thing, or so I thought.

via GIPHY

Jesus taught to forgive—to show mercy— and also warned not to “cling.” Which I took as a sign to let go of the burdens and contempt of the past.
Jesus also taught: “Love the Lord your God with all of your heart and with all of your soul and with all of your mind and with all of your strength” but also to “love your neighbor as yourself.”

Richard Rohr taught me that “love is what we long for and were created for—in fact, love is what we are as an outpouring from God—but suffering often seems to be our opening to that need, that desire, and that identity.”

Martin Luther King Jr. taught me “Hate is rooted in fear, and the only cure for fear-hate is love.”

So I have to ask the question: What is it exactly about the idea of spreading love that deems it worthy of the label of “white privilege”?

Love is Universal

Love is the only transforming power that we have available to us. To all of us. Christ doesn’t play favorites. This universal message is available to all who are willing to receive it. Love is a universal language that doesn’t get lost in translation. Love in action is easily identifiable by all. So, the idea that spreading love is somehow not acceptable or a cause for condemnation perplexes me.

So, perhaps it is not white privilege so much as it is Christ privilege?

The privilege of Christ grants us the space to embrace the unknown. Christ privilege allows us to see all the suffering unfolding before our eyes as a temporary moment in a temporary time frame that will be remedied when we pass away from this world. That doesn’t mean that we don’t concern ourselves with injustice, or obvious oppression, or even racism. It simply means that, even if all of our efforts to alleviate the suffering of others doesn’t go according to our plan, that God will alleviate the suffering of all.

It doesn’t dismiss the very cruel evils that pervade our world.

But if we are getting caught up in the idea that unity, love, and moving forward are devices afforded only to those who are white; what does that say about the Good News? That it’s only available for white people? That love itself is a privilege that only white people will ever know?

I refuse to accept that.

Love is being persecuted. Love is being trampled upon. And if we don’t stand up for love, I would have to ask: what the hell are we willing to stand up for?

We can spread love, unify and come together, and move forward without dismissing the very true realities of evil that people face day in and day out. We can show mercy, we can be peacemakers, and we can get back to purity of the heart. It isn’t a privilege afforded just to white people. It is a privilege that Christ has offered all people, all over the world. Let’s stop segregating love. For truly, love sees no color.

 

** Edit**
I have been informed that much of this has been taken as inflammatory and insulting. I apologize, sincerely.
I am reflecting on many of the comments.

If you feel that there was a better way to present my message, please don’t hesitate to share your feedback (criticisms).
Thank you for allowing me the space to process and evolve. Thank you for your patience and grace. I know I have much more growth ahead.

Recorded Conversations is now available for your listening pleasure.

About Danielle Kingstrom
Danielle Kingstrom is a writer, podcaster, and leg-warmer aficionado. Host of "Recorded Conversations." Current work includes an upcoming book, "Enfleshed: Making Monogamous Relationships Real". You can read more about the author here.
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What Are Your Thoughts?leave a comment
  • Maine_Skeptic

    “Christ privilege allows us to see all the suffering unfolding before our eyes as a temporary moment in a temporary time frame that will be remedied when we pass away from this world…”

    I don’t know for sure where you’re coming from with this article, or to what suffering you’re referring. Please understand that I believe the problems we’re facing as a people are not Christian or Evangelical or white problems, they’re human ones. It would be a mistake for those who see the hypocrisy of Evangelicals and blame what is happening on Christianity itself. When history looks back on this period, I hope people remember that what the president’s supporters are doing today is not the result of any certain ideology but weaknesses that every human shares.

    There’s nothing wrong with encouraging people to love, to forgive, and move on, as long as the injustice has been dealth with. It’s one thing to tell those whose suffering is over that living well is the best revenge. It’s another thing when white Evangelicals dismiss what the president and his enablers are doing to refugees seeking asylum. Or when they’re okay the president uses power he won through corruption to incite violence against women and minorities in Congress and in our country.

    At this point in history, the suffering of actual thinking, breathing people is being inflicted by partisans and politicians who consider you, as an Evangelical, their base. My hope is that you are speaking clearly and loudly to your brethren about the corruption their votes enabled, and demanding that the injustices they endorsed are ended. If on the other hand, your “eternal view” on suffering causes you to ignore that suffering while you contribute to and campaign for corrupt politicians, then it doesn’t matter what you call it. You are complicit.

  • Jack Jones

    Rape cover-ups by Jehovah’s Witnesses as exposed on NBC Dateline:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbKXj8R4_X8

  • Well, for one, I wouldn’t say it is anyone’s “job” to forgive. At least, I sure hope I didn’t word it like that. If I did, I shouldn’t have.
    Forgiveness and how it works requires a lengthy response. I shall save that for later.

    I think ultimately, we probably both believe that Christianity has been manipulated and perverted. So, no arguments here.
    I am not familiar with much of Billy Graham’s work. I never subscribed to his form of theology. He wasn’t ever on my radar as an influence over my beliefs.

    Did I call myself a Christian anywhere in this blog? I don’t refer to myself as a Christian. More than anything, I am a human. A human that follows the practices of Christ and Buddhism.

    You tried to compare other people who have attached the Christian name to themselves with me. For what purpose? Do you believe that one individual represents a whole? DO you believe that what Billy Graham says is something I agree with?
    If I were to make an assumption about you, as you did with me, repeatedly, I would offer this: Your theology is bad. Please don’t compare me to other people. I am not other people. I am only me.
    If you want to attack my arguments, then do so without bringing in outside information that has nothing to do with what I am sharing.
    As always, thanks for your contribution!

  • swbarnes2

    I think ultimately, we probably both believe that Christianity has been manipulated and perverted.

    No, I don’t think that.

    Christianity had a choice. To become powerful it had to side with the powerful. For almost 2000 years, what’s what Christianity chose, that’s what millions of Christians, praying for (and presumably you believe, receiving) divine guidance, chose too.

    That is what Christianity is, it’s what it has long since chosen to be. It is what the great majority of its adherents want it to be. There will be no returning to a more correct Christianity. There is no such thing.

    I am not familiar with much of Billy Graham’s work. I never subscribed to his form of theology. He wasn’t ever on my radar as an influence over my beliefs.

    DO you believe that what Billy Graham says is something I agree with?

    No. But I will not dismiss his interpretation of Christianity just because I personally dislike it. Nor will I pretend that millions of Christians do not accept his theology. I certainly will not label him and those millions of followers as not Christians just because I don’t like what they believe, and I certainly will not say that “real” Christianity by definition has to comport with what I want it to.

    Did I call myself a Christian anywhere in this blog?

    Really? This is a serious argument? The vast majority of non-Christians do not go on and on and on about what Christ means to them. Or say things like “Jesus is the Word”, or how Jesus Christ and God are one.

    If you are sincerely trying to communicate that you are not a Christian, saying things like that makes it pretty impossible for anyone to draw that conclusion.

    Are you sincerely trying to communicate here, on the Progressive Christian channel, that you are not Christian?

    Your theology is bad.

    Theology:the study of God and of God’s relation to the world

    You really can’t observe that I don’t have a theology?

    And of course you really have nothing at all to say about how your wonderful theology of “it’s bad when people don’t get over their hurts as fast as I want them to; they should shut up and keep swimming” leads to such charming outcomes as I documented in my first post.

  • So, you want me to hold some form of accountability for all of Christianity, all of Billy Graham’s teaching, and all that you have been misinformed on?
    No thanks.
    But thanks for continuing to engage and for the continued support of my blog.
    I appreciate the views.
    🙂
    Peace

  • Pastor Hank

    Thank you, Danielle, for opening this can of worms (maybe maggots). Regarding “Christian privilege” when Christians are persecuted for Christ-like action – love in action – not their theological positions (where there is so much diversity in the Christian tradition), that is where I bring in Matthew 5:11. As for white privilege, as I posted on my Facebook page, “Privilege is when you think something is not a problem because it is not a problem to you personally.” As a white American, I can easily think much of the suffering in our nation and around the world is not really a problem because it is not my problem, or because, being white, I can easily find a solution. That is my white privilege. I do not believe Jesus will be pleased with that kind of thinking by me. Rather, following Matthew 25:35ff, my Christ privilege compels me to respond with love to the suffering around me (perhaps at risk of my eternal destiny, but that is another discussion). Thanks for the thoughts. Peace.

  • It is not at all clear what this article is referring to. You go to great lengths to elucidate your Bible quotes and then you paste this one isolated quote in there. I don’t know what your point is.

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/ac64d5affe9cc63e9f71f71e2f1fa71a05a5ced2bcd318c8f45cba02db39cb54.jpg

  • I am sorry you didn’t understand. Did you try reading it again? Sometimes I get a better picture of the perspective of other writers after I have read it more than once.

  • Shirley Blake

    I’m going to have to agree with others your post is incoherent and rambling. Of course love is important, it’s important to more than Christ followers. But righteous anger as exemplified by the Christ also has its place and yes, white privilege talks easily of love without ever sharing the struggles that those without must go through daily, moment to moment.

  • James Elliott

    There is so much in this blog, and not enough space to comment! I think it is important to keep in mind that Love incarnate was crucified. Corrupt politics and religion came together with fear and hatred to nail God to the cross. The expression of love in its fullest sense does not mean it will be accepted. Christ’s disciples have no other choice, though, if they wish to follow in Christ’s way. Recently, Eva Kor died. She was a survivor of the infamous Nazi “twin experiments” under Adolf Hitler. One of her remarkable legacies is the nature of forgiveness and how to move forward. She didn’t learn it right away, but those who knew her have expressed the change it made for her.

    I appreciate the reference to the tweet/Disney memes about moving forward. Eva Kor demonstrated what that means, as only those who have known suffering can.

  • KingstonJack

    Perhaps the most patronising response I’ve read all week! If Karen goes to the trouble of admitting she doesn’t understand your point, wouldn’t some further explanation be helpful?

  • Ocelot Aardvark

    Amen! A Thousand Thumbs Up.

  • KingstonJack

    As someone who is a Christian, please allow me to respond. You can’t have it both ways. You can’t say “I’m a follower of Christ” and “I’m not like all the other followers of Christ”. To all those on the outside of Christianity, like SWBarnes2, that is just hypocrisy. If we choose Christianity as our life, then we have to shoulder the blame for Christianity’s sins. Because we are part of the edifice then we are complicit.

    Personally, I hate that reality. I do not want to be associated with the attitudes and actions of conservative, white, evangelicals, but I can’t duck the flak by bleating, “I’m not like that”. And I certainly can’t wriggle out of the mess Christianity is in by imploring others to “move on, keep swimming, forgive”.

    It’s also disingenuous to suggest that you’ve never subscribed to Billy Graham’s teaching. That one man’s influence on Western 20th century Christianity is all-pervasive. None of us is free of the taint of his personal salvation theology. I have been influenced, indirectly, by the BG parade, but I now choose to reject its claims. Instead, I choose to commit myself to a world shaped by Christ’s vision in Luke 4:18-19: good news for the poor, the oppressed, the captive. But I’m still a Christian and have to accept responsibility for the mess we’re in.

  • Dianne McArthur Adams

    It looks like you’re being called out for ignoring a problem. Move on, move forward, stop spreading hate, show more love, be united are great responses to someone else’s problem. When it’s you, your loved ones, your neighbors who are *continuing* to suffer injustices, your blithe cliches show your privilege, and your distance from the suffering. This is the appalling silence of the good people.

  • Paul Tyler

    If this is what you consider theological interpretation, then leave me out. This is just meaningless blather. An apology for your own privilege, because you have good intentions.

  • Paula Rushing Kordell

    This article drips with the white privilege it claims to decry… very disappointed that Patheos decided to print it…

  • Thanks for your contribution!

  • Thanks for your contribution!
    I

  • Or maybe I am a bit exhausted of it always being a problem, perpetuated by fallacy?
    I shall try to do a better job of explaining myself in the next blog. I hope you’ll subscribe, so you can continue to add to commentary! Thanks for your contribution.

  • Isn’t it more disingenuous to suggest to know what I do and do not subscribe to, being that you don’t know me ?

    I never called myself a Christian. Is that what you are searching for? For me to label myself?
    I follow a path of centered on the teachings of the Christ, but I don’t nee a label. Do you? It kind of sounds like you do.
    I have written about labels before. I encourage you to subscribe to my blog to stay up to date.
    Thanks for your contribution.

  • Mary Pamela Ella Williams

    God calls us to forgive. Not forget. The difference is huge.
    People who say move on are not saying to forgive they are saying to forget.

    You are showing your white privilege in the ability to try and live those mantras. Visit an AME church, do not talk to the people there, ask them to talk to you, take notes. Leave this attitude that you are more Christian than them at the door. They can show you more about living the bible than you have gotten from reading it.

  • Dianne Adams

    What ‘fallacy?’ If you’re exhausted, can you imagine how exhausted the victims are?

  • Jeff

    As I read this article the 3rd time a few thoughts come to mind:
    1. I am afraid to comment. I feel like I have been silenced. I also feel like if I say something negative as a Person of Colour, that you may misconstrue me for all People of Colour and that instead of dialogue, I will be met with silence and giving up on all BIPOC’s and saying “that’s it, I give up.. I can’t say anything.” That I even had to type that makes me sad.

    2. The last sentence love sees no colour is problematic because God doesn’t love me in spite of my colour. God loves me including my colour.

    3. I wish there was more inclusion of BIPOC voices who support what you are saying. I actually do not think you will find as much. Referring to not quotes but work done by people like: Sadhu Sundar Singh, MLK’s life, Gandhi, Archbishop Desmond Tutu, etc. There are many examples.

    So now some questions:

    1. In what ways were you able to acknowledge your privilege in this article?

    2. What ways have you closed down conversation with others with this article? What ways can you now encourage dialogue with others?

    3. What BIPOC Christ following voices/stories do I need to listen to and learn from to talk about white privilege and acknowledge that my own understanding of Christ from a Western lived view is also steeped in white privilege?

    4. What can I do now to encourage friendships and dialogue with BIPOC that is open?

    5. How does using Christ privilege (when there is also Christian biases) not resonate when talking about white privilege?

    As a Christian myself I recognize how my Christian privilege is actually a thing. And it has been so important to acknowledge it without trampling down my faith in Christ.

    I hope to be able to dialogue.

  • Cynthia Brown Christ

    Excellent comment. I can honestly say I have no idea what the writer is trying to convey with this article. You mentioned a couple of alternative ideas, and I appreciate that.

  • Cynthia Brown Christ

    The writer should also thus imagine how exhausted it was to attempt to read a blog which went on and on with no clear point.

    To quote bible verse after bible verse and then admonish people who call her christian – really got under my goat. If you quote bible verses galore, you must assume people will call you a christian, unless you also offer up the fact that you are not a christian, but rather a person who follows the bible.

    Otherwise you sound like nonsense, like a hypocrite that is all over the board, trying blatantly to confuse people, rather than teach them, or share cognizant ideas.

  • Cynthia Brown Christ

    Good, accurate comment. I wholeheartedly agree with you.

  • You questions and your statements are filled with many assumptions.

    I imagine God is so utterly pleased with the way in which we demand others qualify their positions only by means in which a POC is referenced to qualify said position. Such was the way it was not so long ago when a POC could only be qualified by a white person. An eye for an eye, I suppose?
    How trite.

  • How about stop assuming all POC are victims?
    Maybe start there.
    Yeah, that would be nice.
    I don’t see brown skin an instantly think “Oh, they must be a victim”. Why do you?

  • Where did I imply forgiveness means forgetting?

    I am showing my white skin. That’s the only thing you are judging me on.
    Thanks for that.

  • You don’t understand what I wrote so doesn’t that mean if you don’t understand, you shouldn’t judge?
    Just an idea.
    Although, maybe you take comfort in ignorantly judging others? I try to not judge what I DO NOT understand, and here, you like to do the opposite.
    Clearly, we think differently. So, thanks again for participating with the commentary and for reading my blog.

  • Jeff

    Hi Danielle,

    I look forward to hearing your other responses to some of the questions I have. Would you be willing to elaborate where my questions and statements are filled with assumptions? It’d be great to have a dialogue.

    By saying “how trite”, I feel like dialogue has been closed off after this lengthy article was written instead of inviting open dialogue. Help me understand your viewpoint and if either one of us is wrong, I hope we have the grace to say so. By saying “how trite”, for me at this point feels like you are confirming my first point.

  • Spencer Holland

    I’ve been stewing on this blog post for several days. Normally I would have blown it off but there are 3 reasons I didn’t do that;

    1. I completely disagree with what I perceive is the writer’s message.
    2. I recognize the writer from another group I follow, which is disappointing
    3. The writer’s reactions to the comments were defensive and unprofessional

    You’re white. Just like me, you don’t get to decide when the race conversation is over. It’s not up to you. And attempting to play off reactions to “move on” as attacks on love is offensive. Leave Jesus out of it. Telling a person of color to move on does not come from a place of love. It comes from white people being uncomfortable with the conversation.

    Your defensiveness shows that you didn’t think this one through. It seems like you didn’t run this by anyone who might have a differing a opinion. When you received pushback, instead of continuing the dialogue, you lashed out.

    It’s disappointing this post was labeled under “Progressive Christian”. It’s disappointing this post was approved by Patheos at all.

  • Dianne Adams

    I never said that all POC are victims. All we’re talking about is the unaware white privilege displayed in your post. You’re getting defensive and really snarky, which leads me to believe that you’re more aware than you were an hour ago. It’s uncomfortable. That’s party of the process. I hope other white people will continue to guide you until you’re ready to really listen.

  • Ginger Edwards

    EXCERPT: “We can spread love, unify and come together, and move forward without dismissing the very true realities of evil that people face day in and day out.” The problem with this is that when someone says within the context of racism that we should just “move on,” they mean “Racism is mostly gone, so just ignore the fact that it’s still happening today and maybe it will eventually go away on its own and I won’t have to deal with it in the meantime.” They are actually dismissing the “very true reality” that it hasn’t gone away and is wounding people still today.

  • Dianne Adams

    You implied that forgiveness means forgetting with ‘move on’ and ‘move forward’ and ‘stop spreading hate.’ Would you say these things to a child whose lunch money is being repeatedly stolen by the schoolyard bully? He needs lunch, not platitudes.

    And no, it’s not your skin. It’s your words. Really.

  • We see things differently. That’s how most people are. We all have different perspectives. If you believe that you’re justified in judging others for having a different perspective than you, then go ahead and cling to that.
    You came onto my blog to insult and belittle me and you have the audacity to then suggest I am the one who needs to change.
    Sister, look in the mirror. Speck meet plank.
    My blog did not insult anyone. I didn’t belittle anyone. I didn’t demean or condescend. I tried to paint a different picture that looks beyond societal constructs.
    Again, thanks for your contribution and be sure to subscribe to my blog so that you will know that next time I publish so that you can hop on and criticize my work.
    I am sure you love when others do the same.

    Brene’ Brown says something in her talks that I really appreciate and resonates in this particular instance… I am paraphrasing…

    If you aren’t in the arena with me, if you’re just sitting on the sidelines spectating, you are the last person I would consider taking criticism from.

  • You can infer whatever you want . That’s the beauty of free thought.
    Furthermore, I don’t expect you to have the same perspective as me, nor do I expect you to understand. Why? Because you are too caught up in your own beliefs and your own ideology that you never gave my perspective the pause necessary to rationalize a challenge to your own line of thinking.
    Anyway, thanks for your commentary. Be sure to subscribe so you can always be up to date at taking jabs at my work while you are spectating from the sidelines.

  • Great. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Just as I did on my blog.
    Take care.

  • Why on earth would I run my own work by someone who has a differing perspective than me? It’s my perspective. I never told a POC to move on from racism.
    Do you ever notice that most people only comment to judge and condemn other people and not to edify?
    Thanks for sharing your opinions. Be sure to subscribe to my blog so that you can take the first shots at doing it again!
    Peace.

  • You are set on determining who is wrong. Why would I want to engage with anyone who has that mentality?
    This isn’t math. There are no “right” or “wrong” answers.
    I shared my perspective. You disagree with it. OK then.
    Why are you so hell-bent on ensuring that one of our perspectives is deemed right and the other wrong?
    If we do that, then we have to break down objective and subjective truth.
    Further from that, we would need to define terms.
    And finally, you already feel confirmed based on your judgment of my word choice. So, excuse me while I decide to extend my energy elsewhere.
    But be sure to subscribe so that you can continue to look for ways to confirm your own biases and label me as you will.
    Peace

  • Ginger Edwards

    That was quite a jab right back from you about “spectating from the sidelines,” which only demonstrates that you know nothing about me or my life. I’m not “caught up in ideology.” I’ve grown up surrounded by people who just want everyone to look the other way and “move on” rather than actually engaging in trying to rid the world of systemic racism. I don’t know you, but I know many people who use the same words you used in this article and it’s just an excuse to cover up their own unwillingness to join in the struggle. People are called to different ministries and I don’t fault anyone for not being involved in helping communities that have fallen victim to institutional oppression because they are called to love their neighbor in other ways, with other Christian work. Having said that, we also shouldn’t urge people away from these ministries by saying, “we need to move on” when the work here isn’t near done yet.

  • Cool. Then get your own blog and share your opinions that way.
    Thanks again.

  • Ginger Edwards

    From your responses to me and others on this comment page, you seem unable to respond in a civil and courteous way to negative feedback. Perhaps you shouldn’t be giving out blog advice to others.

  • Jeff

    This is hillarious. Wow. This is condescending, shows your white privilege, and lack of empathy for someone who actually enjoyed your article and then wanted to clarify. Easy to walk out of a conversation when you have been called multiple times on your white privilege and your lack of acknowlesgement that you are in fact wrong. BIPOC can’t walk out on their skin colour. Nice for you to walk out and not engage. Shows you have not at all understood exactly what you were trying to communicate. Lots of mixed messaging.

    If you aren’t willing to engage in dialogue on something you wrote and posted why even post? It shows that you didn’t think this through. It’s okay. At some point I hope you realize how much your words have caused pain to BIPOC.

    Also there are right and wrong answers. Especially since your article is speaking about white privilege. Aka. Racism is wrong. Nazism is wrong. Ableism is wrong. So there is that. But please educate me more about how when someone talks about white privilege there is no right or wrong answers.

    Oh I will continue to engage in calling out your lies surrounding this veiled (not so veiled) white superiority you seem to show forth.

  • Look, you didn’t get your way, so you came at me with attacks.
    One thing that I recall reading that really hit me spoke to this idea:
    If you aren’t willing to take no for an answer, if you aren’t willing to not get what you want, then you aren’t ready for any truths nor are you actually willing to understand.

    If you want to hit me up on social media, reach out. I will even shoot you my Marco Polo contact info and we can do this face to face in recorded video messages. But I am not going to go back and forth with you in this forum.
    Show your face, identify yourself. But otherwise, I will chalk this up to another troll episode.
    Peace

  • Jeff

    That eye for an eye thing… seems like you live by it since you couldn’t take a criticism or answer questions it shows me where you really are at. And let’s not forget my first post said how afraid I was to comment. As a person of colour I don’t want to have to worry more about your retaliations and no I won’t show my face because of my fear of your white privilege. You haven’t made any space for dialogue with any other commenters. You’re a clanging cymbal saying: listen to me world…but I won’t listen back.

    I am glad that quote stuck with you. Maybe it’s time to live it?

    Thanks for playing this round of: white privilege at its finest.

  • I didn’t show you who I am. I showed you who you already believed I am. There is a difference.
    I don’t reveal my truest self to many people. But guess what, you don’t either. We aren’t naturally vulnerable, and when we try to be, look what happens!
    I was vulnerable about how I was feeling, I put it to words, in a blog and I knew and expected criticism. I am doing the best I can with what I have, just like everyone else. But, yeah, the Golden rule goes right out the window if someone has already formed an opinion about me. Why let you down with your expectation of me?
    I am not sure what you want? Do you want me to agree with you? Do you think you are going to change my mind?
    If you would like to track me down on social media, by all means, do so. I welcome it.
    But otherwise, stop. Nothing productive is performed when two complete strangers are both set on maintaining their own positions. It’s like literally one of the most natural, ego-controlled demonstrations of humanity. Why do you have such high expectations for me to be better than the rest?
    You already went out of your way to tell me you considered me least of most. So, now you want me to apologize for proving you right? I thought that’s what you were after all along?

  • Ginger Edwards

    You deleted my responses? How very mature. If you can’t take the heat of a little negative feedback, perhaps blogging isn’t for you.

  • Paul Tyler

    I guess one of my big problems with this article is equating persecution with bad-mouthing. Having your feelings hurt because someone disagrees with you or says something bad about you is not persecution. Persecution is being stopped by cops and having no certainty that the worst outcome will be a traffic ticket or a trip to court . . . because of the color of your skin. Persecution is showing up at the border seeking refuge and having your young child torn from your arms and kept in appalling conditions . . . because of the color of your skin or your country of origin. Claiming that someone said something bad about you because you tried to show Christian love is just as tragic, well, that’s ready made for a poster about white privilege. This is “cry me a river,” cringe-worthy.

    I’m sorry if you feel persecuted. But all it really is is criticism. Your life is not in danger. Nor are your physical or financial well-being. Christians in the US have got to drop, not just redefine, the persecution language.

  • It’s not so much that I feel persecuted. It’s that I see love being persecuted…

    I asked someone (who is not white) to read my blog and provide me with feedback. More so, I asked him to critique it and let me know where the problems of my message are. He did so. From his feedback, I can now understand where many of my flaws are in this blog.

    I appreciate your approach to offering your criticism of this blog. In truth, much of the commentary left was directed in a manner that was hard for me to remain open to because so much of it was filled with accusation and assumption.
    Which made me want to dig my heels in and defend my position.
    I took time to reflect on the other comments, and that’s why I did reach out to a black man to ask him for his honest opinion. I believe someone in this comment thread suggested I do so and I felt challenged initially and refused to consider such an idea.
    I can now see that it was wrong of me to do.
    I suppose much of that has to do with the method of the message delivery. I am not willing to receive messages so readily if I infer outright belittlement.
    (I am sure I am not the only one who responds in such a way to direct criticism.)

    Nonetheless, I do appreciate your view and your criticism. In hindsight, I know many people were reacting emotively and I should have considered that before reacting just as emotively.

    Thanks.

  • Instead of telling me all the ways in which you think I failed in my delivery, do you think it would be more helpful to be more constructive with your criticism by sharing what I could have done to relay a more positive message?

    I typically do not run my blogs by anyone else. They are from my perspective and my experience. I also cannot grow as a writer if I don’t have space to fumble. I cannot grow as a person if I don’t have space to think things out and speak to them, even if they aren’t agreeable for all people.
    My intent was never to insult anyone, nor condemn anyone, but the intentions in most of these comments are just that- to insult, condemn, criticize , shame, and attack. How is that helpful?
    I often wonder why people can so easily hurl insults at people they don’t know without considering that such launching will only repel connection, not create it.
    So, my advice for you and all other commentators would be this:
    If you can’t offer me actual constructive criticism, if you can’t actually consider that I am a child of God, doing the best I can with what I have- how on earth can you expect me to have the same regard for you?

    If there is a way you believe I could have delivered a message about the idea of love being persecuted, without

  • (sorry, I don’t know what happened to my last sentence and I honestly don’t remember where I was going with that)…

  • Paul Tyler

    I appreciate your openness. It is hard to be criticized.

  • It really is, and at the same time, it’s one of the few expectations that I hold on to. I realize that if I write during my evolution that many people are going to brutally criticize my process. Yet, we all seem so willing to heap criticism on others, no matter what they do or say. It’s life. We mess up and we try again.
    Thank you for your words. I needed them.

  • Spencer Holland

    Danielle, I remember your interview as Heretic Of The Week on HHH and I thought “wow, that person is awesome, can’t wait to read her and Destefano’s book” . That was one of the reasons I read this post at all, because it had your name on it. I was disappointed because the message I received was that by continuing the race conversation we’re rejecting love (and/or Jesus). I’ve been in conversations with people of color about this topic several times and those conversations all came to conclusion that white people dont get to dictate it. I’m sorry I was insulting. I do see you as a child of God, doing good work. This post, in my opinion, missed the mark and came across as insensitive. If you’re really asking how to communicate the message better, I would add more actual experiences and conversations you’ve had where love has been persecuted and how you dealt with it. My remark about getting differing opinions wasn’t clear, I’m sorry. What I meant was did you run this by people of color to see where it stands? I hope we can continue this conversation, thanks

  • I did run this by someone last night , after all of these comments took a toll on me.
    Despite my egotistical reactions, I do take to heart much of the criticisms I receive. I spent too long being told by everyone that I was the problem and hearing other people tell me that they were the problem. Something in my heart was never able to sit with such an idea. I was the problem and that forced me to change my ways.

    Stemming from that realization, I know that when people insult me and condemn me, I have to look deeper than the surface of superficial castigating. I just don’t always do it promptly. (Another lesson for me .)

    Truth be told, I have shed a lot of layers over the last few years and instead of remaining naked, I opted to put more robes on as a way to self-identify my beliefs. And then I rejected my own adorning and started stripping down again. Instead of offering myself patience to process and reflect, I took aim at ideals that betrayed me. Or rather, I took aim at the “types” of people that I felt betrayed me. For a time, I was acting like your typical “social justice warrior”- the cliche that all but demolishes any real progress toward justice. And I think I wanted to attack what I was rejecting.
    Who knows? I am still trying to understand myself.

    Nonetheless, you and many others were right. I didn’t consider that some of what I was writing was inflammatory. I won’t edit what I have produced. I can’t do that because it wouldn’t be fair for the history of the commentary. I can only start again. Which I will try to do.

    So, thank you for giving me an opportunity to repent.

  • It was immature of me, wasn’t it?
    I apologize. I should have been more willing to dig deeper with you in a discussion.
    I took these comments as attacks against me and between these critiques and personal stuff I am dealing with, I just wanted to shut off all the negativity.

  • Not listening will not get me far. I hear that.

  • Jeff

    Danielle. I was upset last night when I saw how all my comments were deleted. Especially because I rarely commenton things like this. Let me say that as I read the title of your article I had hope.

    But then I noticed others comments were deleted too. That was upsetting.

    What brought me hope was seeing my comments undeleted and your apologies to people and you saying today even if it was for 1 line: you heard me. You posting the edit at the end. Acknowledging. It’s freeing and amazing. And you even had someone of colour read your article. I don’t say this lightly or sarcastically: great job.

    You had a bad day. We all get those. When you have those walk away from here. Give yourself the space to breathe and not respond. Let the comment sit. That way you can come back to it when you are ready to respond. I hope you are able to sit/walk/work through your personal stuff. That stuff is so hard. And whatever it is… I wish you well and grace on that journey.

    That being said, I know you have given me pause if I as a BIPOC should respond to other white people in the future, because I may be silenced again. I said I was afraid. Instead of believing me, I was belittled and attacked.

    Today someone posted this on Twitter and I agree with it: when people of colour tell you a person is racist believe them. I do not think you are racist. But I do think these responses you had before today, made me wonder if you were. That made it hard to hear your story and anything you said and see only white privilege. Privilege is different than racism. And I do believe you were showing privilege by deleting, silencing, and denying. I see you moving away from this by undeleting, listening, and acknowledging.

    I wish you health, hope, joy, wisdom, and peace on your evolving journey.

  • Thank you for your grace. 🙂

  • Jeff
  • disqus_VydtYrLuTv

    So why don’t you just clarify? What if she judged you, you can still clarify and be the bigger person instead of attacking her back. Someone else screenshot your conversation with him and I saw it, the whole time it’s all about who you think he is, what kind of attitude he has, but you never answered his actual question once. why can’t you just stay to the point and actually answer what they are asking you

  • davidt

    Agape without Kairos leads to Eros with chronos peceptually Into a completely confused mess over multiple generations.

    In the 20th century it came as a shock to science that time as we understood it chronos was subjective.it is today the only way we actually understand time.

    Kairos is radically the absence of human measurement . Thus say a forest fire or a weather pattern is seen not based on time but a factor of all conditions and not dependent on time.

    Jesus and Socrates are the two who taught Kairos and agape. Socrates was a clear headed seer, Jesus a heart unbounded. Agape is the quality of love not a measurable. Kairos is a view of seeing nature unfiltered undefined.

    A cloud is not defective. A cloud has no sin. A unicorn will be spotted in the clouds before either is true. We rotate and look into the world and behold in religion sin every where eros/chronos. in science it’s a genetic defects birth defects riddled world. Eros/chronos.

    We have a very serious Eros/chronos issue of sight.

    I turn to the clouds and look perfection ,I cannot turn and condemn. We live in the perfection with no vision.

    St Hildegard debingen said, “we cannot live in an interpreted world for an interpreted world is not home.”

    Pure genius she is, not was.Agape knows no bounds. Eros lives with and embraces all boundaries as its fact. My daughter who cannot walk or talk is more qualified to teach the new testament than all phds combined. Thomas Aquinas caught a glimpse of her view and considered everything he wrote as straw. He saw the clouds as they are he saw humanity as it is. I call my defective riddled and apparently sinned filled child Mary prankster. A leaf bug to the eye. She is always pranking everyone, her father sees no defects her father sees no sin. Her father sees her, not what the world loves to pretend. I see her through her eyes nd she sees me back. There is no condemnation in her. Eyes, she is Mary prankster hiding from Eros/chronos in the open. Jokes on us. Mother Mary prankster, Mary prankster magdelene understood the world with clarity. And over time the pranksters became the pranked. And so here we are today the pranked trying to understand the pranksters. Good luck Eros/chronos.An interesting rotation that is.

  • Yeah

  • “Moving on” is not “spreading love.”

    Being the person that somebody else targets for violence is not “focusing on the bad stuff.”

    Being a victim of systemic violence does not make somebody unloving. Processing that trauma does not make somebody unloving. Demanding justice, like the widow before the unjust judge, is not unloving. Black Americans and many other people are living out love, even as their lives are currently and radically impacted by long-running social traditions of oppression.

    Calling out evil in the world is the privilege of Christ followers. Demanding repentance is the privilege of Christ followers. Recognizing that wealth and consumption belong to Caesar is the privilege of Christ followers. What does Christ tell us to “move on” from? From . . . our families. From . . . our jobs. From our security, our income, the respect we have in the community. What we are supposed to get over, Christ tells us, is our terror of the future. Christ doesn’t offer comfort or an escape from violence. Christ leads his followers right to Jerusalem and offers them a night of bad sleep in the Garden of Gethsemane before his public execution.

    The verse you cite (John 20:17) is Jesus’ instruction to Mary Magdalene, Apostle to the Apostles. He tells her not to “cling” to him, but instead to go start preaching. Is Jesus a burden, or something from the past that we hold in contempt?

    “Christ privilege allows us to see all the suffering unfolding before our eyes as a temporary moment in a temporary time frame that will be remedied when we pass away from this world. That doesn’t mean that we don’t concern ourselves with injustice, or obvious oppression, or even racism. It simply means that, even if all of our efforts to alleviate the suffering of others doesn’t go according to our plan, that God will alleviate the suffering of all.”

    Our suffering isn’t meaningless. Our suffering changes us. Heaven isn’t a form of compassionate euthanasia to get us out of a painful life. Suffering is a profound and soul-altering experience, and God walks right down into it with us. Somewhere overlooking the valley are the privileged people, those people watching our suffering unfold and feeling real bad about it and making plans to alleviate the suffering of “others”. Those people don’t *get* suffering. And God isn’t up there with them; God’s down here with us.

  • I appreciate your commentary from your perspective.

  • Jesse H

    Danielle you advocate a message of love, mercy and forgiveness. Of moving beyond. You don’t need to apologize for this. You very clearly say love is universal. Those who are misunderstanding you seem to want to advocate identity politics above universal love. Again, don’t apologize.

  • Jesse H

    Danielle very clearly presents a message of universal love. It’s astonishing that people would have a problem with this idea.

  • Jesse H

    This is complete nonsense. Minorities are having a great time in Trump’s administration. And Trump has repeatedly called out the problems with white supremacy. Trump voters are not racist, he got 30% of the Hispanic and Asian vote, and his present day support among blacks is also around 30%.

  • Jesse H

    Interesting article, but there are a ton of problems in it. For one thing, the writer defaults to the race card far too often. People who are more intelligent than others are often brought down by others. Not everyone gets into an Ivy league school. And then there are examples where it’s a matter of class, not race, and intellectual snobbery, not race. And which person has never had a boss who has belittled them? There are examples of white trash criminals as well as black ghetto criminals. This isn’t to say race isn’t an issue, but my children go to school where they are white minorities. If we are only ever defaulting to playing the race card, we are denying the complex status of human existence, which is of the mind, body, intelligence, gender, social class, religious and worldview makeup, and yes, also race.

  • Ocelot Aardvark

    Try explaining that “great time” to the Hispanic people shot down in El Paso and Dayton, by TЯ

  • Ginger Edwards

    Where in the world does the author come off defining “white privilege” as “spreading love”? You won’t find that definition in any dictionary I’ve ever seen. Telling people that they should just move on when racism is still alive and well in this nation is not “universal love” in any sense of the word. And it doesn’t correct the problem. It allows the hate to spread as those who ought to be fighting it look the other way.

  • Jesse H

    So you are equating the idea of moving forward as against universal love? Moving forward does correct the problem. Moving forward moves beyond hate. Sammy Davis Jr. was a great entertainer who married a Swedish woman, was the first to kiss a white woman on stage, kissed Archie Bunker on the cheek in “All in the Family”, was a member of the Rat Pack performing equally with 4 white men in the 60s. Yet many considered him an Uncle Tom–he was too much like whites.Yet he illustrates the problem. When we are always trying to see race we are stuck in the past, we are stuck in the problem. Sammy was a great entertainer, singer, dancer, impressionist, he was a great human, beyond black or white.

    We should absolutely move forward. This doesn’t mean we will be colorblind, we will always see differences, but when we move forward and see humanity as beyond race, then we can truly be spreading love. It’s like when a child doesn’t like the neighbor next door because of a perceived slight, moving beyond doesn’t minimize whatever bad thing was done, it just optimizes the future and the good, friendship and forgiveness is better than focusing on racial differences and perceived or real conflicts.

  • Jesse H

    The facts go against you. I’m going to let your objections speak for themselves.

  • Ginger Edwards

    I’m not “always trying to see race.” I am actively engaged in fighting racism in this country. When it is eradicated, only then should we”move on” to something else. Yes, we have made progress, but the fight goes on. For example, just last month in suburban Birmingham, the real estate sign of an interracial couple was vandalized with a hateful slur. Racism is alive and well in this country.

  • Jesse H

    No doubt we have episodic racism. I think you are misunderstanding what “move on” means. It doesn’t mean denying that there are examples of racism, but it does mean not always pointing to them. So I stand with you against hateful slurs. But the way we move on is not in constantly pointing out where there is racism. The way we move on is in making those examples UN-newsworthy. Racists are ignorant idiots. Why give them any press?

    To be focused on healthiness means being focused on mindfulness, nutrition, exercise and spirituality. When we focus on the times we were depressed, or ate all those donuts, or watched tv instead of exercising, or focused on our harmful emotions rather than the positive, we are not moving forward towards healthiness. Do you see the difference? Only by focusing on the positive can we truly focus on eliminating the negative. One never eliminates the bad by focusing on it, one can only eliminate the bad by focusing on the good.

    And here’s the truth. We will NEVER truly get rid of racism. Just like we will never truly get rid of evil. But what we can do is to so focus on the good that examples of evil like racism look small and ignorant in comparison.

  • Jane Ravenswood

    The false belief that only Christians have love or deserve love is typically Christian. Happily, people of other religions and no religion at all have love.

  • sg

    I think the desire to move on comes from there being no clarity as to what anyone wants when they complain of stuff like white privilege.

    People think that it is just endless griping with no measurable cause or objectives, so it can never be fixed ad infinitum. So, reasonable people just shrug it off because it isn’t clear or comprehensible. It is undefined.

  • Ginger Edwards

    Are you aware that you just equated hate crimes perpetrated on someone with self-indulgent behaviour like over-eating, as if the victim brought this on themselves? I guess if the victims would have only focused on good, that mean old racist would have left them alone? Are you serious? People need protection from racism. “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” ~Edmund Burke

  • sg

    It is hard to share in struggle that you are not aware of because people don’t explain the struggles, they just complain vaguely that white people have no struggles which would make any listener want to move on. Everyone has struggles. That is just life. You can’t expect someone to sympathize with things that aren’t even described.

  • sg

    “As a white American, I can easily think much of the suffering in our
    nation and around the world is not really a problem because it is not my
    problem, or because, being white, I can easily find a solution.”

    This is the kind of statement that makes people want to move on because they have no idea what it is referring to.

    Now, if a specific example were offered, perhaps people could relate to it and sympathize, but as written, people are just confused and disinterested.

    So, really there is no conversation, just vague accusations. No path to improvement or reconciliation, so no interest in working on it.

  • Jesse H

    Thank you for the wonderful example of (purposefully?) misframing an opponent’s argument. I can’t tell if you are aware of it or if you just didn’t understand. I’m going to give you the benefit of the doubt and try again.

    My point was that as a society we need to focus on the good. If as a society we are always focusing on racism then we aren’t focusing on all the ways that our society isn’t racist. There are plenty of examples of this, any example of racism can be prosecuted. Yet we have overwhelming examples of all races being educated and succeeding.

    How do we protect someone against racism? We can’t control the actions of everyone, each one of us will experience oppression in some ways, be it intellectual, economic, social, vocational or racial. The way to overcome racism is certainly to condemn it when we see it, but more importantly to just celebrate the many ways in which society is not racist. In this way the culture and attitudes of racism will inevitably decrease.

    But as it is, we are so hyped up about racism that we look for it when it isn’t even there. For instance, Trump is not a white supremacist, wanting to have border security isn’t radical racism, and saying that we should move forward isn’t against universal love.

  • That Which You Gaze Upon, You Become…

    “He who fights with monsters should be careful lest he thereby become a monster. And if thou gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will also gaze into thee.”
    Friedrich Nietzsche

  • Ginger Edwards

    Friedrich Nietzsche is the last person I’m going to go to for advice. The idea that we should not fight against evil because it might make us evil is false and it goes against Scripture. Romans 12:21 Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

  • Ginger Edwards

    I didn’t mischaracterize your position, but perhaps you did. No one has suggested we should only and always be focused on racism. However, as you said, one of the ways to overcome racism is [not to just move on, but] to condemn it when we see it. And perhaps it isn’t appropriate to label Trump as a racist. Technically he is xenophobic.

  • Ginger Edwards

    There is more than enough literature out there documenting systemic and institutional racism and the havoc it has wrought for people of colour for anyone who is interested in pursuing the topic. If you are without understanding, it is due to your own failure to obtain and read the research. Just saying… You could start with real estate practices in Chicago during the Jim Crow era.

  • Ginger Edwards

    White privilege is a general term used to describe the advantages and benefits a person derives due to being Caucasian and thereby avoiding the detrimental effects of systemic and institutional racism. There is plenty of information out there documenting these biases. They don’t all date back to slave labour. One place to begin is with the real estate practices in Chicago and elsewhere during the Jim Crow era.

  • Ginger Edwards

    Okay, here is one example. Black homebuyers in Chicago lost at least $3.2 billion in today’s dollars because of racist real estate policies and predatory contracts between 1950 and 1970, according to a report published [May 16, 2019] by Duke University.

  • Why is there always the presumption that one simply doesn’t pursue the topic enough when one opposes the information?
    Have you ever read Discrimination and Disparities by Thomas Sowell? He provides sound economic evidence that suggests that the narratives and ideals that purport systemic racism and systemic racial inequality are false. (He’s a prestigious economist, and he’s also a black man who was raised in Harlem, NY).

    I have read Diangelo’s “White Fragility” I have consumed much of what Ta Nehisi Coates has written (I subscribed to The Atlantic because of his intellectual writing skills). I have dog-eared, post-it tabbed, and highlighted the heck out of Ibram X. Kendi’s “Stamped from the Beginning.” One of my favorite compilations is “A Testament of Hope” by Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. I have been a fan of Malcolm X since I was a tween. Angela Davis, bell hooks, Kiese Laymon, Kiende Andrews, Willie Jennings, James Cone, Booker T. Washington, W.E.B.DuBois, and so many more brilliant writers, speakers and poets have swept me away.
    I don’t speak out of ignorance. I don’t write from an unwillingness to understand. But how foolish of any of us to say that we understand anything and everything absolutely. What an illusion!
    It would be more conducive to everyone if you left your assumptions and expectations out of the discussions. If you don’t know, don’t assume. If you want to know, pose a question.
    But please don’t insult my intelligence, nor anyone else’s . If you are entering into a dialogue merely to belittle others, then find the exit.
    But, if you are entering into a discussion because you really do want to understand another perspective, then don’t enter in thinking you can’t learn anything from it. And if you think you have more to offer, then lay it out. Say it for yourself. Reiterate what you have learned in a way that doesn’t put everyone else on the defense who may disagree with you.
    I mean, isn’t that what you initially attacked me for?

    Isn’t it interesting that, that which we gaze upon, we become?
    Don’t fight against oppression by becoming an oppressor in this exchange.

  • I have only just begun to dive into Nietzsche in the last 18 months. He has been a delightful inspiration to many others that I am influenced by. His positions against religion have actually made me appreciate my faith more. The way he can break down concepts to reveal the fallacies behind much of fundamentalism is mind boggling.
    Anyway, so, because his work has been revered by so many other influential writers and speakers in my life, I am comfortable with using his words. I won’t apologize for that. I also don’t expect everyone else to fully grasp what he offered the world.

    Romans is often misunderstood. And since we have yet to compare our theological influences, I think that coming to any sort of conclusion is just fantasy.

    You have made your point. You disagree with my perspective as well as the perspective of other commentators on this thread. We all get it. You disagree.
    But what I cannot understand is why you continue to bark your opinions in the manner that you do and honestly expect anyone to concede and agree with you? You are beating a dead horse.
    If you feel the need to label people, that is your choice. Have at it. But take it elsewhere.
    There are plenty of other bloggers on Patheos that I am sure are just dying to have you comment on their content.
    But as for me, I am beginning to regret unblocking you.
    Leave well enough alone. Be at peace. You made your statements. You have had responses. What more do you want?
    Because for me, I am not going to agree with you. Soon, I won’t even acknowledge you. This is tired and you’re merely repeating the same stuff over and over and alas, no one has changed their mind.
    I mean, is this how you overcome evil? By badgering people with the same rhetoric? Let’s just bid our adieus and be done.
    Peace.

  • Ginger Edwards

    I’m sorry you found my comments unwelcome. However, this is a comment section and I didn’t “badger” anyone by simply responding to their comments. In fact most of the other comments are aligned with mine. Rather than continue the dialogue, however, I will respect your request to withdraw from the conversation. Perhaps you should consider not even having a comment section.

  • Jesse H

    We can always get good from great thinkers. Nietszche was prescient for sure. But of course that doesn’t mean we have to agree with him on everything.

    I agree we overcome evil with good. We should also abstain from every form of evil. 1Thess5:22 Perhaps this is where we have differing perspectives. Because in combating racism we must both condemn it when we see it, and affirm acceptance as the antidote. It’s actually easier to simply condemn, it’s much harder to overcome evil than it is to just condemn it. Just as it is easier to condemn eating bad things, than it is to actually eat good things and even to crave them. (I’m trying to show why my previous analogy still works.)

  • davidt

    “money is the root of all evil”

    “In love we trust”

    You have correctly linked god and lover. So when you place that word on money it reveals where modern religions heart is. Money.

    All we are talking about is a right and fight over money as a culture. Atheists want that removed from money. Religion should have been outraged.

    God is an interesting word. Very rorscashian.

  • I really do appreciate when others share their disagreement. We don’t need to agree with one another in order to find value in what the other says, nor do we need to agree for either of us to find value in each other as a human being.
    My whole mission is to challenge others, and in turn, to have others challenge me.
    I won’t reconsider the comment section because I want others to know that I value their input even if it does not line up with my point of view. The thing is, I am never going to be able to expand my point of view if I don’t give space to others to share their point of view. Does that make sense?
    Sometimes (and I include myself in this generalization), people like to just keep on keeping on for the sake of making themselves look principled in their positions. I know it’s hard to change your mind, especially with an audience. But I am not afraid of doing that. I think I have demonstrated that both within the comments of many of my blogs and within my blogs themselves.
    But, if it looks like there is going to be no change, if it looks like it’s only about someone else making themselves look “right” in the exchange, I think it’s best to just stop.
    I don’t write to make myself look right or to tell others they are wrong. I write to give people more to chew on. Plain and simple. I welcome you to continue sharing your views on future blogs.
    🙂

  • GLE 312

    Danielle, you asked me to stop commenting and I did. Then you waited a couple of days and posted this self-serving ad hominem attack? And signed it with a smiley face? Very unprofessional. If you want to debate the meaning of white privilege, go ahead, because I’m done. But personal attacks are uncalled for. Especially when you asked me to stop commenting and I did, until this.

  • sg

    “real estate practices in Chicago and elsewhere during the Jim Crow era.”

    That was a really long time ago. That ended before I was born and I am in my 50’s.

  • sg

    Okay. fair. But that was 59–79 years ago. The vast majority of those people are dead assuming they were at least 18 years old at the time because they were adults able to enter contracts. It seems to have little bearing on what is going on now.

  • I am really confused as to how anything I said was ad hominem? Where did I personally attack you or your character?
    Here’s my advice, don’t comment on my stuff then. You are constantly looking for way to continue this fight. I thought it was unprofessional to not comment at all. But it seems that you just want to deem everything I do unprofessional. I got it. You don’t like me (despite not knowing me) nor anything I write. So WHY BOTHER with me then?
    Or maybe you just want the last word? If that’s the case, by all means. But fine, I won’t grant you any more attention. Take care and thanks again.

  • GLE 312

    It has a huge bearing on families and their children and their children’s children through the generations. This isn’t a topic that be explained in a short social media post. But the effects of this sort of thing, the lost income and assets, are exponential through the years.