Michael Lindsay, “View from the Top”

D. Michael Lindsay is the president of Gordon College.  A well-respected sociologist, Lindsay is the author of the Pulitzer-nominated Faith in the Halls of Power (Oxford University Press).  His recent book, View from the Top: An Inside Look at How People in Power See and Shape the World framed the following conversation.

David George Moore conducted the interview.  Dave blogs at www.twocities.org.

Moore: View from the Top represents a herculean effort.  There are many books on leadership, but has there ever been a study done like this one?

Lindsay: There has not.  I had lots of extra data on leadership from my previous book, Faith in the Halls of Power.  There was a large study done on leadership in 1970 by a team of researchers at Columbia University.  I learned that they had interviewed 545 senior leaders, so my goal became 546.  In the end, I completed 550 interviews, representing the largest study of its kind.

Moore: Many, and probably most, leadership books give various ideas of how one gets from point A to B.  While reading the blockbuster, The Leadership Challenge by Kouzes and Posner, they said they could offer the right direction as long as people had the will to learn.  It struck me again how mysterious leadership, or even more broadly, positive change occurs.  Why is it some have the will and others continue to struggle, even when they both come from similar backgrounds?  I’ve read many leadership books, but no one wants to tackle that one.  After all your research and thinking about leadership, what one or two things still mystify you about the subject of leadership?

Lindsay: I would say leadership can be elusive, but it’s not mysterious.  With this large-scale social science research we were able to compare the kinds of leaders who differentiate themselves.  For instance, we found that 22% of the study’s informants really were different from the others; we call these individuals “platinum leaders.”  They are among the most talented leaders in the world.

Two major factors we found were these leaders are change agents who know how to get things done.  But that was only part of the reason for their success.  Environment is also a big factor.  For example, a person may be a very good leader in one context, but not well suited for another.  One person may be effective as president of Harvard while the same job at the University of Texas would yield different results.  Thad Allen is a good example.  He was commandant of the US Coast Guard.  He is an edgy, physical leader, which works well in the Coast Guard.  In other contexts he would not be as effective as a leader.

So being the head of the American Red Cross is going to take a different type of leader than being the CEO of Exxon.  It is the right leader at the right time in the right place.  This is what makes for maximal influence.

Moore: I have asked many Christian business leaders if they have ever heard a sermon on the dual commands of Jesus to be “shrewd as serpents, innocent as doves.”  Most said they’ve heard nothing on the first command, but plenty on the second part.  Why is that?

Lindsay: American Christians are uncomfortable with power.  We are willing to talk openly about how to steward money, but addressing the stewardship of power is something we tend to avoid.

Andy Crouch’s book, Playing God, does a good job of addressing both the perils and possibilities of power.

Moore: Leadership looks sexy from the outside, but it is fraught with many challenges.  Describe some of those for us.

Lindsay: Leadership involves things that many never see, such as keeping bad things from getting worse, or working on good things that never materialize.  It may look glamorous to outsiders, but there are indeed many challenges.

My life as a sociology professor at Rice was somewhat intense.  Expectations were demanding.  I typically worked between 50-60 hours per week.  The pressure was great to publish along with the push to secure external research grants.  It was intense, but I had an active family and church life.

Being a college president is overwhelming.  Working 70-80 hours per week is standard.  I start around 7:30 am and end late into the evenings; I also usually work on Saturdays.  I make it a priority to put my girls in bed every night when I’m in town, but I have little time for hobbies or other activities.

There are a range of responsibilities which make being president both challenging and stimulating.  I get involved in personnel issues, strategy, institutional finance, marketing, and lots of people work.  It is not too dissimilar from leadership in government or business.  You wear many hats.  Some liken a college president to the challenges a pastor of a megachurh might have.  It has also been compared to being the head of a research hospital.  Our alumni and faculty may have different expectations for me.  Because of these demands, I have little extra time.  I work hard, however, to maintain regular Sabbath-keeping, which helps maintain guardrails that serve as a good check on my ambition.

Moore: Noted colonial historian, Gordon Wood, said many people helped Franklin early on in his life.  Wood went on to comment that there really are no “self-made” men or women.  From reading your book, it seems you would concur.

Lindsay: Absolutely.  “Self-made” is a figment of our cultural imagination.  We are born into particular communities.    We draw on their cultural benefits.  Even those without privileged social contexts have many influences which are formative later in life.

Moore: In 2007, The New York Times featured a piece called “C.E.O. Libraries Reveal Keys to Success.”  Among the various insights was this from “Sidney Harman, founder of Harman Industries: ‘I used to tell my senior staff to get me poets as managers,’ says Sidney Harman, founder of Harman Industries, a $3 billion producer of sound systems for luxury cars, theaters and airports.”  You have a few things to say about the value of reading widely, especially in the liberal arts.  Would you unpack that a bit for us?

Lindsay: I love the fact that you mention that article.  A liberal arts approach to life is crucial for effective leadership.  Intellectual curiosity helps you to be a better relational entrepreneur.  I encourage Gordon students to read widely.

I do not have much time in my present responsibilities as president for reading.  I take advantage of holidays and breaks from school.  I try to stretch myself by reading in a diverse amount of areas.  Recently, I read about ten or twelve books on human sexuality.  It’s an important topic for anyone who cares about Christianity’s engagement with culture today.  Daniel Kahneman’s book, Thinking, Fast and Slow was a recent read that I also benefitted from.

Varied experiences are also invaluable.  A few months ago I was invited to the Goddard Space Center.  I don’t know much about astrophysics, but it is important for a college president to be conversant in many subjects.  I learned a lot, and I’m confident those kind of mind-stretching experiences help me lead better.

Moore: Why do you believe leaders within established institutions usually make the greatest impact?

Lindsay: I am a big supporter of entrepreneurial adventures, so I do not want to diminish them.  However, social science demonstrates conclusively that Fortune 500 companies set the agenda in the marketplace, that the federal government sets the policy agendas of states and local municipalities.  The fact of the matter is simply that big institutions have a disproportionate influence.

Moore: What are a few things you hope your readers would takeaway from View from the Top?

Lindsay: There are three.  First, to remember that it is important to “think institutionally and act personally.”  It is easy to be cynical about big institutions, but personal relationships are key.

Second, we tend to overestimate what happens to us before the age of twenty and downplay the impact of what occurs between twenty and forty.  Those are critical years for leadership formation.

Last, Gospel-centered leaders can succeed in pluralistic environments.  Mike Ullman of JC Penney is a good example.  He is probably the most successful CEO in retail who is alive today.  He has worked for some of the most celebrated companies like Louis Vuitton and Macy’s.  And he’s done a tremendous job of leading with faithful integrity in the midst of a pluralistic context.  He’s a model for me, and I hope for my readers as well.