The Assurance of Jesus Christ’s Return

The Assurance of Jesus Christ’s Return March 13, 2019

There are dozens of Bible verses about the return of God or of Jesus Christ, and the certainty of His second coming.

Mourning His Return

Most every believer I know of has a deep down desire for Jesus Christ to return…even today, and we have that assurance from Scripture, but what about those who have all their lives rejected Him? They won’t be thrilled as His return. The Apostle John wrote, “Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him, and all tribes of the earth will wail on account of him. Even so. Amen” (Rev 1:7). All tribes or nations will mourn His return, because in their hearts, they knew that God existed but rejected Him anyway. They simply denied His obvious existence (Rom 1:18-23), but denying the truth doesn’t make it go away, so even those who pierced Jesus’ side at Calvary will mourn His appearing, so depending on your relationship with Christ, you will either rejoice at His appearing or mourn because the Day of Judgment has come for you, and it surely will someday. Jesus says, “Watch therefore, for you know neither the day nor the hour” (Matt 25:13).

Thief in the Night

Truly, “the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed” (1 Pet 3:10). On that day, all “the haughtiness of man shall be humbled, and the lofty pride of men shall be brought low, and the LORD alone will be exalted in that day” (Isaiah 2:17). Every knee will bow…and that includes atheists, agnostics, and those in other religions of the world. Every knee will bow…count on it (Rom 14:11; Phil 2:10-11). Bow the knee today in humble submission to Christ and you will be saved…reject Him and you will be made to bow the knee. Either way, every human every created will bow the knee to Jesus Christ, so it’s better to do it today.

Signs of His Coming

Jesus Christ didn’t leave us to guess about the signs of His imminent return. He said in Luke 21:25-28 that “there will be signs in sun and moon and stars, and on the earth distress of nations in perplexity because of the roaring of the sea and the waves, people fainting with fear and with foreboding of what is coming on the world. For the powers of the heavens will be shaken. And then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. Now when these things begin to take place, straighten up and raise your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.” One other thing Jesus said in the context of the days leading up to His return, and in this chapter, leading up to the time of Jerusalem’s destruction (in 70 AD), and “because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold” (Matt 24:12). This seems to be very evident in the world today, just as “many false prophets will appear and will deceive many people” (Matt 24:11). We’ve also seen that “many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another” (Matt 24:10), and you don’t have to look very far to see hatred toward believers. It may show up in comments that people leave on articles or things they say to your face, but that’s to be expected. This should not surprise believers because Jesus said that “If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you” (John 15:18), so we will be (and are) hated for His name’s sake.

Caught by Surprise

I don’t think unbelievers will be the only ones who are shocked and surprised at Jesus’ return. Many have duped themselves into thinking that Jesus is a myth. Many have been proclaiming that He could appear at any moment, but many have been skeptical, and many today are asking, “Where is the promise of his coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things are continuing as they were from the beginning of creation” (2 Pet 3:4). There have been and always will be skeptics who don’t believe in Jesus and His second coming, but what they believe does not change what is true. The Apostle Paul told the church at Thessalonica that “you yourselves are fully aware that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night” (1 Thess 5:2), so just “as the lightning comes from the east and shines as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man” (Matt 24:27). That will leave sinners no time to repent.

Rewards Lost and Gained

The Last Judgment by Michelangel in the Sistine Chapel, 1541.

At the end of this age, Daniel prophesied about the final resurrection, writing that “many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And those who are wise shall shine like the brightness of the sky above; and those who turn many to righteousness, like the stars forever and ever” (Dan 12:2-3). As if trying to warn the church, Jesus said, “Behold, I am coming soon, bringing my recompense with me, to repay each one for what he has done” (Rev 22:12). That will be good for those who have trusted in Christ and done things for Him (Matt 25:40), but bad for those who have rejected Christ and done nothing at all. Many will claim to be the Lord’s, but these same many will be turned away for eternity by the Lord (Mat 7:21-23). The Apostle Paul knew he had rewards laid up for him, writing in his last letter, “Henceforth there is laid up for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, will award to me on that day, and not only to me but also to all who have loved his appearing” (2 Tim 4:8). Some will rejoice, knowing that they have been faithful in doing what Jesus commanded (Matt 25:35-36; 28:18-20, etc.), but others will not (Matt 25:41). Some who believe may even be ashamed when He returns as they have done little for Him and for His glory, so the Apostle John writes in this context, “And now, little children, abide in him, so that when he appears we may have confidence and not shrink from him in shame at his coming” (1 John 2:28). This shows that some will be ashamed at Jesus’ appearance for their negligence in serving Him, while others will rejoice and will hear, “Well done, good and faithful servant. You have been faithful over a little; I will set you over much. Enter into the joy of your master’” (Matt 25:23).

Conclusion

After Jesus’ ascension, and while the apostles “were gazing into heaven as he went, behold, two men stood by them in white robes, and said, “Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven” (Acts 1:10-11). Jesus Christ is coming again…and in the same manner that He ascended. When? We don’t know, but we do know He is coming, so I hope you’ll share this article about the assurance that Jesus Christ is coming again. Why not do it right now? Remember Jesus said, “concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only” (Matt 5:48).

Article by Jack Wellman

Jack Wellman is Pastor of the Mulvane Brethren Church in Mulvane Kansas. Jack is a writer at Christian Quotes and also the Senior Writer at What Christians Want To Know whose mission is to equip, encourage, and energize Christians and to address questions about the believer’s daily walk with God and the Bible. You can follow Jack on Christian Crier or check out his book Teaching Children the Gospel available on Amazon.

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  • Robert Landbeck

    While I too look forward to the return of Christ [or maybe he’s already here but yet to reveal himself] I have to doubt that this event is to confirm any existing ‘faith’ tradition. But like the last Incarnation, the purpose will be to expose error and offer correction to those with the humiity to comprehend just how far from G-d theology has taken the mind of man. And to demonstrate the folly of human intellectual and spiritual pretensions; that all is just chasing after wind!

    • Jack Wellman

      At least this event will confirm Jesus’ words, “And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also” (John 14:3). Jesus seems to have no doubt about His second coming being more than tradition, as it is sure to happen.

      • pud

        Demonstrate that any such storybook character ever existed….FAIL!

      • Robert Landbeck

        Yes but his words involve certain, unstated assumptions to the listener. but not necessarily, two thousands years on, to readers like ourselves that project a new set of bias and prejudice onto those words. No doubt, that in Jesus time, those apostles [and others] listening knew clearly what Jesus was talking about. Two millennia of theological dispute, schism, blood and gore, history is still no closer to agreeing on what Jesus revealed or taught then the early, pre-Nicea church with their host of competing claims.

        • pud

          “History” cannot demonstrate that any such “jesus” ever actually existed.

          • Robert Landbeck

            I agree. History has it’s limitations and it may simply be that the foundations of religion are a reflection of the extremes be human intellecutal vanity that pretend to more than it understands. The Bible may even be a ‘trap’ for that vanity and arrogance, so that one day, should that day ever arrive, that G-d makes himself known to the visible world, and exposes that dark side of human nature for what it is . . . nothing more than chasing after wind.

          • pud

            Humans don’t have a “dark side” that’s what the religious cling to when they peddle guilt and shame whilst offering a magical cure. We are animals, advanced primates doing the best we can and gaining ground all the time slow as it may be. Religion owes its origins to agriculture which in turn allowed for diverse tribes to gather into large communities. Those communities needed leadership and what better way to be the top dog than to invoke the blessing of an invisible undetectable deity who will rain hellfire on anyone questioning this authority figure…every king, emperor etc invoked a deity to justify his authority. It’s a sociological anthropological phenomenon that explains the delusion of religion very well. Add to that the innate human fear of death and the unknown and ta da! You’ve got yourself a “faith”

      • pud

        Wrong…there is no evidence for any “jesus” nor were there scribes following him around taking dictation. It is a STORYBOOK janitor jack…a made up narrative not a documentary

      • Rational Human

        Right Jack, Jesus had no doubt about his second coming..in fact he told those living in 33CE that some of them would live to see it. It’s right there in red letters. Care to elaborate on Jesus narrowing down the timeframe to a specific generation, one which died off 2000 years ago?

        Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.“ (Matthew 16: 27, 28)

        Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.“ (Matthew 24: 25-34)

        Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place…“ (Mark 13:26-30)

        Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place.“ (Luke 21:27-32).

        Only in Christianity does “soon” not mean soon, “quickly” not mean quickly, ” anything you ask” have unwritten qualifiers and limitations, and “you will do these miracles and greater miracles” be just a big misunderstanding.

        • Matthew 22:37

          Did you see this verse that Pastor Wellman pointed out. It speaks of the end of the Age. It is believed by some Christians that we are currently living in the Pentecostal Age but on the cusp of a new age and the Bible does predict a future kingdom. How come you don’t know about the millenial kingdom?

          Here’s the verse:
          Young’s Literal Translation
          teaching them to observe all, whatever I did command you,) and lo, I am with you all the days — till the full end of the age.’

          Please stop being cocky on the Bible and seek help from an ethical Bible tutor if you cannot heed Pastor Wellman.

          I have been watching unbelievers make a mess of interpreting the scriptures for years. You don’t have the Holy Spirit as your tutor without the gift of faith you know.

          Plus read the natural man versus the spiritual man passage.

          1 Corinthian 2:14, New American Standard Bible
          But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised.

          You’re acting like an authority on the scriptures when you don’t have the faith or the spirit to make things plain to you.

          So to understand God’s perspective you are going to need an attitude change plus some help for a while interpreting the scriptures.

    • pud

      Death cult..whoo hooo! Can’t wait for the blood up to the bridles!

  • Powerglide

    When someone is late for an appointment, I always give them at least 15 to 30 minutes. After they’re 30 minutes late, I’m pretty sure they’renot coming. When someone is nearly 2000 years late, I’m frankly not expecting them.

    • Matthew 22:37

      Obviously, you don’t know the parable Jesus gave as a sign of his coming. You assumed or heard from someone else who assumed and does not know the parables.

      • Powerglide

        I do know that he repeatedly indicated that he predicted it would happen in the lifetime of his immediate followers. Didn’t happen. He’s not coming.

        • Matthew 22:37

          I think you misinterpreted.

          Have a good day.

        • Matthew 22:37

          Be sure to read my quote on the Parable of the Fig Tree from a bible teacher.

          It’s in my response to Rational Human in this thread topic.

        • Matthew 22:37

          Be sure to study David’s example, too.

          Gotquestions dot org explains a lot of things if you have questions.

          Look at this on David:

          How could David be considered a man after God’s own heart?

          Answer: To understand why David was a man after God’s own heart, we need to see what characteristics he had to qualify for such an exalted description. In the book of Acts, the apostle Paul speaks of God’s feelings about King David: “After removing Saul, he made David their king. He testified concerning him: ‘I have found David son of Jesse, a man after my own heart; he will do everything I want him to do’” (Acts 13:22). The answer to why David was considered a man after God’s own heart is found right in the verse: David did whatever God wanted him to do. An obvious question is how could God still call David a man after His own heart when David committed such terrible sins, including adultery and murder?

          We learn much of David’s character in the book of Psalms as he opened up his life for all to examine. David’s life was a portrait of success and failure, and the biblical record highlights the fact that David was far from perfect. But what made David a cut above the rest was that his heart was pointed toward God. He had a deep desire to follow God’s will and do “everything” God wanted him to do. He was a man after God’s own heart. Let’s look at some characteristics of David’s life to discover what that entails:

          Part of why David is called a man after God’s own heart is that he had absolute faith in God. Nowhere in Scripture is this point better illustrated than in 1 Samuel 17 where David as a young shepherd boy fearlessly slew the Philistine, Goliath. Shortly before the duel, we see direct evidence of David’s faith when David says, “‘The LORD who delivered me from the paw of the lion and from the paw of the bear will deliver me from the hand of this Philistine.’ And Saul said to David, ‘Go, and the LORD be with you!’” (verse 37). David was fully aware that God was in control of his life, and he had faith that God would deliver him from impending danger. How else would one venture into a potentially fatal situation with such calm and confidence? David knew early on in life that God was to be trusted and obeyed. As we see in Scripture, David’s faith pleased God, and God rewards David for his faithfulness.

          Another reason David was a man after God’s own heart is that he absolutely loved God’s Law. Of the 150 psalms in the Bible, David is credited for writing over half of them. Writing at various and often troubling times in his life, David repeatedly mentioned how much he loved God’s perfect Word. We find a beautiful example of this in Psalm 119:47–48: “For I delight in your commands because I love them. I lift up my hands to your commands, which I love, and I meditate on your decrees.” It is not hard to see his complete adoration for God’s Word. Also notice how David “meditates” on God’s statutes. God granted David understanding and wisdom through daily meditation. We would do well to not only read God’s Word but also think about it throughout the day, for God loves us to think about Him. “Blessed are they who keep his statutes and seek him with all their heart. They do nothing wrong; they walk in his ways” (Psalm 119:2–3).

          David was a man after God’s own heart in that he was truly thankful. “I wash my hands in innocence, and go about your altar, O LORD, proclaiming aloud your praise and telling of all your wonderful deeds” (Psalm 26:6–7). David’s life was marked by seasons of great peace and prosperity as well as times of fear and despair. But through all of the seasons in his life, he never forgot to thank the Lord for everything that he had. It is truly one of David’s finest characteristics. “Enter his gates with thanksgiving, and his courts with praise! Give thanks to him; bless his name!” (Psalm 100:4, ESV). As followers of Jesus Christ, we would do well to follow David’s lead of offering praise through thanksgiving to our Lord.

          After he sinned, David was truly repentant. David’s sin with Bathsheba is recorded in 2 Samuel 11:2–5. The mighty fall hard, and David’s fall included adultery, lying, and murder. He had sinned against God, and he admits it in 2 Samuel 12:13: “David said to Nathan, ‘I have sinned against the LORD.’ And Nathan said to David, ‘The LORD also has put away your sin; you shall not die.’” But admitting our sin and asking for forgiveness is only half of the equation. The other half is repentance, and David did that as well. Psalm 51 is David’s prayer of repentance to God: “Have mercy on me, O God, according to your steadfast love; according to your abundant mercy blot out my transgressions. Wash me thoroughly from my iniquity, and cleanse me from my sin!” (Psalm 51:1–2).

          In conclusion, David was a man after God’s own heart because he demonstrated his faith and was committed to following the Lord. Yes, his faith was tested on a grand scale, and he failed at times. But after his sin he sought and received the Lord’s forgiveness. In the final analysis, David loved God’s Law and sought to follow it exactly. As a man after God’s own heart, David is a role model for all of us.

    • Matthew 22:37

      I don’t know what you are doing look for contradictions in the Bible from which you try to disprove the existence of God when you are not a bible scholar and not a master of the ancient languages the Bible is written in.

      Got questions dot org on how the word “generation” is used in the Bible.

      How long is a generation in the Bible?

      Answer: The Bible uses the term generation in some different ways. Normally, the word generation refers to all the people living at the same time—i.e., the word in the Bible has the same definition that we are used to in modern usage when we speak of Generation X or the Millennial Generation. Normally, a generation is about thirty years; one generation raises the next. However, in some biblical contexts, a “generation” can refer to a longer age or a group of people spanning a longer period of time.

      In Genesis 2:4, “generations of the heavens and the earth” (ESV) seems to include all of human history—the era begun by the creation of the universe. In Exodus 1:6 the “generation” who die refers to everyone who had been alive during the time that Joseph and his brothers lived. In Numbers 32:13, the “generation” is limited to Israelites—the group of them, twenty years old and older, at the time of their refusal to enter the Promised Land. That one generation was doomed to wander in the wilderness until they all died, except for Joshua and Caleb. When the plural word generations occurs in the Bible, as in Isaiah 51:9 and Acts 14:16, it refers to an indefinite period of time—many successive generations.

      The original languages of the Bible used at least three different words that are translated “generation” in English. The Hebrew dor can refer to a normal, physical generation, as in Exodus 1:6. But it can also be used metaphorically to identify people of a distinguishable type. For example, Psalm 78:8 says, “They should not be like their fathers, a stubborn and rebellious generation, a generation whose heart was not steadfast, whose spirit was not faithful to God” (ESV). Here the word dor is used twice to refer to a group of people through a long period of time who were characterized by rebellion and sin. The “generation” in Psalm 78:8 is not limited to a normal thirty-year period but stretches back through the history of Israel to include all who were stubborn against God.

      The other Hebrew word we translate as “generation” is toledot. This doesn’t refer to the character of a group or an age but to how that age was generated. So the “generations of the heavens and the earth” in Genesis 2:4 refers to the time periods that started with creation and continued organically from that point. The “generations of Adam” in Genesis 5:1 means the civilization of people that began with him. The next “generation” is that of Noah, to include the flood and the civilizations that came after. Shem’s influence is marked as a “generation” as he was the father of the Semites (Genesis 11:10). And Terah’s, because he left Ur with his son Abram (Genesis 11:27). Later, Ishmael (Genesis 25:12) and Isaac (Genesis 25:19) were the source of new generations. In each case, the men either experienced or caused a significant event that changed the course of their family line. They generated a culture-altering event.

      In the New Testament, the Greek genea is the source of generation. It is similar to both Hebrew words. Literally, it means “fathered, birthed, nativity,” referring to a genetic line. But it can be used as both the time frame characterized by a specific cultural attitude and the people in that culture. In Matthew 1:17, the generations are marked off by significant events and people—Abraham, David, Babylonian captivity—like the Hebrew toledot. But when Jesus calls the Pharisees and scribes a “wicked and perverse generation,” He is referring to the culture that they lived in and encouraged (Matthew 12:39; see also Matthew 17:17 and Acts 2:40).

      So, when we read “generation” in the Bible, we have to consider the context. Usually, a generation in the Bible is roughly thirty years long or the people living during that time, the same as what we understand a generation to be in everyday talk. But there are times when generation is used poetically to refer to a class of people demarked by something other than age.

  • Once a Lost Seeker

    2 Peter 3:9

  • The return of Jesus Christ presupposes that he is alive today and therefore rose from the grave after his crucifixion in the late 20’s of the first century CE.

    The 4 canonical Gospels were written approximately from about 40 to 70 years after Jesus’ death. And Paul’s letter 1 Corinthians was probably written about 25 years after Jesus death. Jesus was supposed to have been raised on the 3rd.day after his death.

    The NT is permeated with references to the return of Jesus Christ at the “last day”. So it assumes the resurrection of Jesus and this is the key “event” that Christians need to defend, otherwise their faith is futile. Atheists do not believe that the story of the resurrection of Jesus is credible and that the evidence for it is weak. Hence they think that is highly unlikely that Jesus will come again. If you wish to convince atheists, you will need to present convincing evidence for the resurrection.

    • pud

      Don’t hold your breath! Janitor jack doesn’t give a rat shit about evidence

    • Matthew 22:37

      God changes people every day. That is clear and convincing evidence unless you have determined in your heart to reject the evidence.

      You should be repenting and asking God to create a clean heart in you.

      If your heart is in disarray how can you judge evidence accurately?

      Why overrule the subjective with the objective? You cannot establish a relationship with God by sabotaging your internal order to try to dismiss Him y’know.

      Peter never dismissed Jesus. He acknowledged him as the Son of God.

      So why aren’t you more loyal to God instead of letting the devil prompt you to doubt all the time?

      You can indiscriminately trade the spiritual for the earthly if you want but some people are more discriminating and don’t let fallible men or their methodologies control everything and dictate to them. If you won’t obey God then Satan rules you.

      Paul made that plain as God’s representative in the New Testament.

      If you want to continue to rebel then I will have to leave this blog or block you until you regain good judgment.

      Bad company destroys good character and you let Bart Ehrman communicate error to you.

      • How and why is a subjective experience of God or Jesus evidence that he rose bodily from the dead ? If he did not rise bodily from the dead, how is he able to come back again? isn’t the claim that Jesus rose bodily from the grave meant to be a time-space event and therefore physical event for which objective evidence could possibly be obtained?

        People who die remain dead. So if this one person rose bodily from the grave, this would be an extraordinary event. Don’t extraordinary events require extraordinary evidence for rational people to accept them as likely? If the Muslim claims that Mohammed flew into heaven on a winged horse, would you accept this if he or she said that they have an inner subjective experience or inner certainty from God that Mohammed did so? Would you not ask them to provide objective evidence? I hope that you wouldn’t accept their view just on the basis that they claim to have an experience with God who revealed this truth to them in the Koran. Wouldn’t you say that they were deluding themselves?

        • Matthew 22:37

          Take a look at Galatians 1. God already anticipated people claiming to bring angelic revisions of the Bible and said not to believe them.

          I believe Jesus is who he says he is. I don’t believe people correcting God’s account to change Jesus’ status. Who is great enough to correct God? Certainly no angel is.

          “Extraordinary claims requires extraordinary evidence” is a deceptive maxim. All evidence is evaluated subjectively and “extraordinary” is subjective as well.

          When you hear that maxim someone is playing a game with you and wants you to devalue your own God given mind in favor of some unknown subjective standard that is controlled by another person.

          Refuse to play the individually shifting shell game and use your own mind to decide on God’s Testimony.

          I would never risk my relationship with God or devalue my own hearing/perception of God’s Witness to play a shell game with someone else.

          Why is another person’s subjective evaluation of evidence greater than my own?

          God did not set this standard that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

          He said faith is by hearing. So my own mind and judgment must be good enough unless I am willing to be deceived out of using it.

          Have a nice day.

          • Well if all evidence is subjective, then you can believe anything. Many followers of Zeus, Jupiter, Thor etc. claimed a subjective experience of their god, so does that mean that these gods exist? How does a subjective experience of Jesus mean that Jesus is still alive bodily? How can Jesus return bodily at the end of the age if he only is alive in your heart? Might your experience of Jesus be delusional? How can you tell if “all evidence is subjective”? Might you not be deceived into believing all this stuff, if there is no objective evidence?

          • Matthew 22:37

            I didn’t say all evidence was subjective. I said the evaluation of it is subjective.
            So nobody gets to put his subjective evaluation over your own while claiming he’s objective.

            We have historical evidence for Jesus.

            I am done here because I am tired of the insanity. Believers are not delusional because they analyzed things differently from an atheist.

            An atheist just goes around saying extraordinary evidence requires extraordinary claims without realizing what that means.

            Read a few Christian apologetics logic geeks on it. They will explain the hidden logical error in that one.

            I am not arguing it when you can research it.

            And nobody is meddling with my mind by making deceptive statements that appear reasonable on the surface to force their logic over my mind.

            You should go to an apologetics site like Turek’s Cross Examined site or debate dot org if you want to debate this.

            Thats where you are more likely to meet your Christian logic afficionados.

            I am just a Christian who trusts their own mind and I am not crazy because some biological evolutionist or internet douchebag tells me I am.

          • pud

            There is NO historical evidence for the “most important” figure in human history…NONE! There is ONLY your man made ancient story book…FACT

          • Do you claim that Jesus rose bodily from the grave or is he just “alive” in your heart? If the former, what evidence do you offer for such an event? If the latter, then Jesus is not alive (except in your “heart”) and so he ‘s dead and not coming back again. Subjective experiences, or subjective evaluation of claimed objective events, cannot establish time-space events that supposedly happened in history.

          • “We have historical evidence for Jesus”.

            The evidence for Jesus is mainly found in the 4 canonical gospels, but these were written about some 40 to 70 years after Jesus’ death. Legends probably grew up about him in the 40 years or so after his death. Agnostic Bart Ehrman believes that Jesus existed but the gospels have miracle stories that grew up around Jesus’ life that are very probably myths. Mythicists believe that the whole story of Jesus is mythical.

            Even if we have historical evidence for the existence of Jesus, this is different from saying that we have convincing evidence for his bodily resurrection. Jesus is not going to return in power and glory at the last day, unless he rose bodily from the grave and is therefore alive bodily and is faithful to his word.

          • An atheist knows very well what “extraordinary events require extraordinary evidence” means. To believe extraordinary events whose probability is almost zero means that far greater evidence is required for such events to have a reasonable probability of occurring, than ordinary events which recur and have a high probability of occurring.

          • The big problem with Christian apologists is that they assume
            (1). That God exists.
            (2). That God has revealed God’s self.
            (3). That there is a general revelation of God in nature, but that it is not sufficient to lead people to “salvation”.
            (4). That there is special revelation in many and various ways in “times past” (under the Old Covenant and mainly to the people of Israel after the founding of the nation, but to some others prior to Abraham) and in Jesus Christ in these “last days” (first coming of Jesus till his alleged second coming).
            (5). There is no new special revelation today, since it was complete with the writing of the NT.

            Christian apologists then develop arguments for the existence of the Christian God, but make all or most of the assumptions above. Even when you think that they are arguing for Jesus’ resurrection on empirical grounds, they are not really doing this. They are presupposing that the bible text is inspired by God and using that presupposition to then develop their argument. It’s called making circular arguments.

          • Matthew 22:37

            IIRC, Whateley wrote an essay tearing this “extraordinary claims requires extraordinary evidence” maxim apart in his essay in which he explains if this maxim applies then we cannot believe that Napoleon Bonaparte existed.

            Google it. There may be a link to his essay on his wiki bio page.

          • If extraordinary claims do not require extraordinary evidence, then the evidence (if there is any) is pretty weak. If someone claimed a miraculous healing, you would require very strong evidence to accept such a claim, would you not? Would you not look at all natural explanations first and if any of them can explain the healing, why would you resort to a miracle as the explanation? If the evidence was not very strong for the miracle explanation rational people, who base their views on evidence, would reject the explanation.

            A man rising bodily from the grave after his death would be an extraordinary event. Wouldn’t the evidence for such an event need to be a lot stronger than for events that we know occur on a regular basis? So rational people who go by empirical evidence would require extraordinary evidence for such an extraordinary event? The probability that such an event would likely occur is almost zero.

          • Matthew 22:37

            I am putting you on block to let you research it and I am taking a break from this board.

            I don’t debate. There is always somebody much better at logic on the Net that can answer these arguments better than me and I suggest you find them if you truly want to challenge your logic.

            I am not as competitive as I used to be. Besides why should I be responsible for correcting everyone when they can research their own logical errors.

            Most of these arguments have been done a lot already.

            All you have to do is look for the counter argument online and the counter is almost always better than these superficial assumptions masquerading as maxims.

            I am tired of reading people trying to claim they are merely being objective when a subjective element entering into an evidence evaluation is inevitable.

            Be more skeptical of those pat learned replies. Somebody else who actually examined the maxim in depth is some where in this world and will usually have the argument that overturns it and is willing to share that info with you if you are willing to not settle for the pat reply and get to the bottom of the truth.

          • It is you who presents pat learned replies from your Christian apologists. I don’t present pat learned replies but use logic and evidence, unlike you. You don’t even know how to present evidence for anything, judging by your replies. You don’t seem to know how proofs are constructed nor how evidence is presented.

            Mathematics uses proofs of theorems using things like propositional logic, predicate logic, proof by contradiction, proof by mathematical induction, algebraic proofs, set theory proofs, trigonometric proofs etc. A proof does not necessarily mean that something exists in reality. For example, one of the premises may be without empirical evidence. It just means that it is logical, given the premises.

            Statistics is a branch of applied mathematics which includes hypothesis testing by gathering data from random samples and obtaining test statistics. The p-value shows the probability of making a type 1 error. You reject the null hypothesis in favour of the alternative hypothesis if the p-value is too high. Usually the p-value required to reject the null hypothesis is below 5%. This does not necessarily mean that the alternative hypothesis is true but only that there is insufficient evidence at the 5% level of significance to reject the null hypothesis.

          • Is the alleged resurrection of Jesus a space-time event or is it something that just occurs within your heart without any bodily resurrection? If it is a time-space event that occurred in history, how is subjective evaluation of this event or the supposed evidence for this event going to be able to tell anyone that Jesus rose bodily?

  • pud

    CUZ DA BUYBULL TELL ME SO!

    Demonstrate that any “jesus” ever existed. FAIL

    You do NOT KNOW ANYTHING! You mindlessly and gullibly “BELIEVE” and there is nothing too ridiculous that it can’t be “believed” by a credulous, stupid gullible tool like you who makes his living lying to children

    • Matthew 22:37

      A heart like your’s God
      https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PmprgCQXR1M

      Maslow calls spirituality “transcendence” on his pyramid of hierarchy of human needs.

      But it could be some people grow too blind and hard hearted to realize they need whole new hearts so some people like David in Psalm 51 are aware of their own failure and need and not too proud to repent and ask God to change them.

    • Matthew 22:37

      A heart like your’s God
      https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PmprgCQXR1M

      Maslow calls spirituality “transcendence” on his pyramid of hierarchy of human needs.

      But it could be some people grow too blind and hard hearted to realize they need whole new hearts so some people like David in Psalm 51 are aware of their own failure and need and not too proud to repent and ask God to change them.

      • pud

        Demonstrate that Hanuman the monkey god exists….

        • Matthew 22:37

          Why do I have to when so many people claim that God changed them?

          Submit to Him and let Him change you or stop displaying your hard heartedness disguised as scientific objectivity all over this blog.

          Have you no compassion for people who desire to achieve spiritual transcendence and act like Jesus?

          Jesus never hurt anyone. He helped as many as turned to him.

          Stop focusing on spiritual failure and let God turn you into a spiritual success for a change.

          • pud

            No. I have pity for the gullible people who buy your snake oil and contempt for those of you who sell it.

            Demonstrate that any “him” exists

            Demonstrate that any “jesus” ever existed

            Demonstrate that any such thing as “spirit” exists

          • Matthew 22:37

            Seek out some people in real life and ask them how God changed them.

            I know people God changed and I know He changes me. Because I am a better person than I was and I did not improve on my own. There is still more improving to do but at least I am progressing.

          • pud

            Book a ticket to India and seek out the millions whose lives have been transformed by their belief in the monkey god. They have been changed!

            You are delusional…willfully self delusional…nothing more, nothing less

          • Matthew 22:37

            They were changed?

            But changed to what and how?

            You are full of self deceit always focusing on the negative and never really comparing things fully and accurately.

            I am blocking you now.

            Bad company destroys good character and you won’t even allow God to correct you.

            No wonder you are so depraved.

            Why don’t you stick to your own kind on an atheist blog where you belong. Those people are likeminded to you.

            Why do you come over here and constantly show your bad side?

            You have no self control. That’s why.

            You’re rebellious and unruly and like to communicate spiritual and social error.

            Go ahead let your error rule you like the devil but you are not ruling me.

            Goodbye.

        • Matthew 22:37

          Matthew 16, NASB

          3Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, He was asking His disciples, “Who do people say that the Son of Man is?” 14And they said, “Some say John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; but still others, Jeremiah, or one of the prophets.” 15He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” 16Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17And Jesus said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

          Why do I have to prove something to someone hard hearted when I can accept God’s witness from heaven and so can you?

          Are you going to keep putting God on trial on this blog, pud, for mankind’s inhumanity to man?

          That ought to reveal to you that people have a sin nature.

          Why do you want to destroy the world’s spiritual progress when you need a whole new heart and can’t accurately determine things enough for yourself internally to accept God’s witness?

          Why are you acting like the devil trying to spiritually and socially reverse people when you need a change of heart and human nature yourself?

          Stop acting like the devil and let God get real with you so you can make some personal spiritual and social progress for a change.

          God Bless you and keep you.

          • pud

            Demonstrate that any such “devil” exists

            You see gullible stupid person who will believe nearly anything….rational people do not start out with blind belief they require that “claims” have actual empirical evidence before they accept those “claims” and “assertions” as true.

            You have no such requirement because you are irrational. You, like the other simple minded dysfunctional religious types, simply start with the presuppostiion and then spend your entire lives trying to pound the square peg in the round hole.

            You demonstrate that ANY of your mythical magical invisible undetectable claims are in fact true and we’ll talk…seeing as NO ONE ever has I doubt you’ll succeed where they have FAILED

          • Matthew 22:37

            No, I don’t believe just anything. God is holy and I would not accept Buddhism or Hinduism or any other religion ahead of Jesus.

            How can you say a Christian is gullible when he perceived Jesus is the Son of God like Peter did and tossed all the other false religions out?

            Christianity is the one true way because it has the only true God which Christ came to reveal to the world.

            Christianity isn’t even a religion. It is a discipline. A way of life that a Christian practices not a false religion.

            You need help in distinguishing the truth from error.

            Start by comparing the life of Jesus to Mohammed and Buddha. He comes out on top every time.

            The Pharisees were just too hardened in their hearts when he came along so they refused to acknowledge him while he did miracles in their midst.

            Who trades in a relationship with God for mere tradition and earthly benefits? But that’s what the Pharisees and a lot of people do.

            I hope you start seeking and succeeding at spiritual success for a change. You know God loves everyone all the time. We give up on Him and fail Him before He gives up on us.
            But you can persevere while He changes you day by day.

          • pud

            You “believe” what you’ve been indoctrinated to “believe” If you had been born in India you would be praising the monkey god or if born in Iran you would be bowing to Mecca 5 times a day. Gullible people do what the herd does…you are the consummate herd animal. You bore this shit out of me too. cheers!

          • Matthew 22:37

            God knew me before the foundation of the world and decided long ago my circumstances of family, birth, etc. I had no control of that. He did.

            Read the Bible. He’s our Creator and 1 Corinthians says He “saves each in his own order”. He put me into the godly Christian order where I am just like He determined the Levites would be priests in the Old Testament.

            Well I hate to impose on you and bore you the way you impose on this blog. So back on block you go.

            You’re a godless man and don’t seem to know what you are doing spiritually at all but you keep getting verbally offensive and rejecting correction from people that actually fully surrendered to God so what is left for you but prayer.

            You can cooperate with God or get stuck with the devil.

            You seem pretty upset. You might be subconsciously seeking the truth then choosing to consciously reject it so I would say the devil is having a field day in your psyche because you never shut him out at all.

            How can you shut the devil up if you don’t have Jesus and learn God’s ways and how to put on the full armor of God.

            God tells you how to do all that but you prefer to let spiritual chaos reign in your life.

            Think about it. If you can’t even love, honor and obey God enough to follow His directions then how can you get the devil out of your thoughtlife and establish control over yourself and your words and actions?

            The more you follow Jesus the more godly you get.

            I hope you see the light some day.

          • Matthew 22:37

            The devil exists. Go read the story of the feral child Genie Wiley and then explain to me how the devil doesn’t try to live in human nature.

            If you rationalize this then you let the devil off the hook.

          • pud

            Aliens exist…go read all the STORIES about alien abduction! Must be true!! You are THE most gullible human being I’ve ever encountered in my life

          • Matthew 22:37

            You were still wrong. If I were as gullible as you assume I would have deconverted a long time ago after dialoging with approximately 400 atheists and working on dissecting various religions.

            Instead I still see all the truth in the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob’s favor.

            Obviously I am not the gullible one. I even had the good sense to psychoanalyze you before falling for your traps that you like to disguise as arguments.

            Deprogram me? I don’t think so.

            I was taught by the Most High God to do His will. Thanks be to God.

            You’re the gullible one. You opted to stay a slave to sin.

            I hope you repent. Until then have a blessed day!

          • pud

            How about you STFU now?

          • Matthew 22:37

            LOL. Why? How many hundreds of times did you get away with calling me gullible.

            This is the first time I corrected you on that error.

            What were you suppose to be allowed to go on making that mistake at my expense?

          • pud

            Because you’re a boring psychotic gullible delusional mentally deranged batshit crazy loon that’s why

          • Matthew 22:37

            Bye rude dude. You couldn’t even figure out that you are the slave of sin and sin is like leaven. It takes over a host organism.

            Look at all the profanity you spill like someone totally out of control of himself. Read the Book of James on how hard it is to tame the tongue.

          • pud

            Get behind me satan! LOL Run along now…time to pray for forgiveness for jacking off.

          • Matthew 22:37

            Blocking you for profanity now.

          • pud

            OH NO!!! NOT the BLOCK again!! 55 times and counting…yeah, you’re not psychotic…not you! lol

  • Rational Human

    It’s so weird how you didn’t use these quotes Jack, why not?

    Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.“ (Matthew 16: 27, 28)

    Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.“ (Matthew 24: 25-34)

    Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place…“ (Mark 13:26-30)

    Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place.“ (Luke 21:27-32)

    https://blacknonbelievers.wordpress.com/jesus-failed-prophecy-about-his-return/

    • Matthew 22:37

      Obviously, you never heard the correct interpretation of that chapter. Such a shame.

      Consult a bible scholar on it while you still have time.

      • pud

        RIGHT! The “perfect word” needs massive interpretation by scholars no less! Brilliant authorship “god” LOL

      • Rational Human

        Is love to hear the “correct” interpretation of these verses, appearing in 3 different gospels.

        Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.“ (Matthew 16: 27, 28)

        Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.“ (Matthew 24: 25-34)

        Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place…“ (Mark 13:26-30)

        Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place.“ (Luke 21:27-32).

        Only in Christianity does “soon” not mean soon, “quickly” not mean quickly, ” anything you ask” have unwritten qualifiers and limitations, and “you will do these miracles and greater miracles” be just a big misunderstanding.

        What need would a living, omniscient and loving god have of interpreters and apologists to speak on his behalf and confuse his flock? Use your head.

        • Matthew 22:37

          First I would like to say that you will have to forgive me because I have been told I have a snarky streak. It comes out too much when people want to debate religion more than they want to understand it.

          Atheists might be at a disadvantage when it comes to understanding Christianity because Christianity isn’t like science. It is a lot more subjective than objective in my opinion and you need to learn to be careful and exercise discernment when people approach you on religion and insist their opinions are right or of paramount importance.

          Really on Christianity the only opinion that counts is God’s perspective.

          There is this presumption that anyone can pick up a Bible read it and understand it but in my experience that is not true. Why do I say that? Because I have seen so many unbelievers engaging in eisegesis critical of God. Casting aspersions on His character as if He was Satan that that is truly disturbing and says to me that they have an interpretive problem.

          Also after roaming around Patheos a bit I came across Progressive Christians. I didn’t know they existed until a few years back. I already knew Christianity was riddled with denominationalism usually based on doctrinal variations and disputes but the Progressive groups can be even more radically different than the older more orthodox groups are from each other. Some of the Progressives aren’t Christ centered and some make up alternate interpretations of the Bible where the Bible is not considered divinely inspired in contradiction to what the Bible has to say itself about being inspired.

          Then there are these thousands of non-Christian religions.

          What in the world is going on?

          Read what Edersheim wrote about some understanding the parables and others not understanding.

          I believe it comes down to a question of the heart or inner being of a person.

          Our hearts are the interpretive organ and in them we decide whether or not we will seriously heed God or not and learn His perspective. Many refuse to learn it. Many learn to create false ideas to supplant the ones in scripture. Some people have personal issues or issues they learned from others that they are projecting onto God. Things that never should have been conceived about Him much less mentioned. He’s not a philosophical problem to debate or a Rubix cube that you can twist and turn until you got Him where you want Him.

          Christianity is no different from math or science. In the sense that it is a subject that people learn about. Initially many Christians are taught about it after spending some time in the culture coming into contact with various Christian ideas.

          So be careful of the people trying to push you around on religion who didn’t understand God’s will, plan, etc. at all. You can tell they didn’t understand because there are far too many questions demonstrating a lack of certainty or knowledge. Sometimes downright confusion.

          Do they have the right to get frustrated and take over class like many do here on this blog? Really does confusion have to reign in another person’s understanding because it reigns in another confused person?

          If the confusion does reign and you never understand God’s perspective or seek to know it outside of this blog comments section then you are the loser. The casualty of certain people’s carelessness and lack of understanding that they never admitted to.

          People have a spiritual right to be born again. A right Jesus died on the Cross to give you. See John 3 on it. What right is more basic and more important than the human spiritual right to be born again? But if some confused person succeeds in subjecting you into confused agreement with him then you cannot receive this right. You may not even realize this right has been given to you by God through Jesus. Christianity doesn’t have attorneys explaining to people about being born again. We have Christians and Christian teachers that explain it. The world does not understand it well enough to teach it to you or tell you what it means so why do people listen to the world instead of the people who know God and His teachings on it?

          When I was in 4th grade. I was poor at math. The teacher didn’t let me take over the class though and misteach everyone else. No, she sent me to a nearby college for tutoring.

          Be sure to locate the good bible teacher with the really good character to learn from but be aware that they are human. I read Bible teachers all the time. Most of them will make a mistake here or there. Then there are the false teachers as well so it means you have to become as biblically literate as possible to identify them and avoid their false teachings. Plus there are the angry people with their axes to grind against God who like to blame Him for everything and communicate this attitude to you.

          Isn’t all this confusion symptomatic of people having heart issues? The heart is a huge issue in the Bible. Evil and sin proceeds from the human heart. David who was a man after God’s own heart had to ask God for a whole clean new heart.

          In the Bible holiness is like cleanliness and has to be maintained.

          Anyways, the Parables in Jesus’ time and even today are not understood by everyone. But that doesn’t stop certain people from mocking what they never truly understood or admitting they never understood it.

          So seek out the most knowledgable teacher you can find with the best character and learn from him until you are saved and become proficient in the Bible yourself. Because that is what a child of God does. He is serious and soberminded and studies to be God’s approved man.

          Who cares what the world that the devil is still trying to rule thinks?

          Get your heart right with God. Make your peace with Him then ask Him for the discernment and the good teachings so you can truly understand.

          This is your spiritual identity and destiny the Bible is talking about.

          Make sure you understand it before surrendering your mind and the promises of God. Who gives up his eternal life without fighting to understand?

          And learn to take all your questions to God so one day you can surpass your teachers in wisdom and spirit and knowledge.

    • pud

      Janitor jack ALWAYS avoids those verses in the buybull that cast his cult in a delusional deranged light.

    • Matthew 22:37

      Is there not a parable in Matthew 16? Why would you listen to atheistic eisegesis on the scriptures?

      WHY DID JESUS TEACH IN PARABLES?
      ALFRED EDERSHEIM
      Compared to His earlier teaching during the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus’s turn to parables might seem odd. He’d used clear instruction to teach His followers how to live and about the Kingdom of God, and He’d exhibited the Kingdom in a tangible way through His miracles. But suddenly, when the crowds come to hear Him, He hops into a boat and speaks in parables, stories about sowing seeds and gathering wheat (Matthew 13).
      When the disciples ask Him why, since they obviously noticed the change, His answer may seem even more astonishing: “To you it has been granted to know the mysteries of the Kingdom of Heaven, but to them it has not been granted” (Matthew 13:11). In other words, the parables are meant to divide the crowd. While this may seem as if Jesus denied some people access, the difference He means is not in the message—but in the response.
      The parables themselves present clear stories from everyday events that many in the crowd would recognize. Jesus did not code His teaching to prevent some people from understanding, since all equally would understand the imagery. All those gathered there certainly comprehended the aspects of the stories related to their everyday lives. Instead, His teaching divided the listeners into two groups based on their own responses.
      His miracles had attracted many, and others had perhaps been astonished by His earlier teaching. But the parables themselves, just as in the story of the seed falling on various places (Matthew 13:3-9), revealed the true nature of their responses and their real decisions. Those committed to the Kingdom of God would seek and find further understanding. But those uncommitted—perhaps listening only because of the initial excitement—would reject the teaching as unintelligible.
      Adapted from The Life and Times of Jesus the Messiah by Alfred Edersheim (Book III, Chapter XXIII).

    • Matthew 22:37

      Read John 12 verses 27 to 50.

      Google the verses on “spiritual blindness” on openbible dot com.

      Derek Prince, the worldwide evangelist, claimed to have been an atheist at one time. Read his book Gifts of the Spirit.

      But he was motivated to seek God and God rewards seekers. In his book Prince reveals how by reading and using the Bible God led him out of spiritual blindness.

      Prince was an atheist born into a Christian family who had a philosophy degree from Kings College but he never let anything stop him on his search for God until God gave him his faith.

      Why would anyone walk in the darkness when he can walk in the light with Jesus if he gets motivated.

      So I hope you start seeking. Don’t let the people who lack interpretive ability due to their spiritual blindness hold you back, Rational Human.

      You go right on seeking until God gives you the gift of faith and the light dawns in your dark world.

      God makes the rain fall on the good and the evil because he loves everyone including unbelievers.
      You show Him that you won’t be too stubborn to seek Him and learn everything about Him and His ways.
      There is no reason you should stay mentally in the dark if you can get spiritually motivated by accepting Jesus and acknowledging him as it says to do in Romans 10:9.

      Have a blessed day. Hope this helps! It’s time for you to get out of the spiritual curse of darkness that comes with unbelief and walk in the light. All you have to do is repent, acknowledge Jesus and get baptized.

      Prince did it. So get motivated and seeking if you want to get enlightened. Seek help from enlightened people if you need it but do it with a good attitude not this bad one unmotivated people want to communicate to you.

      Are you an independent thinker or aren’t you?

      Why let someone else’s error and confusion keep you in darkness? God rewards seekers.

      • Rational Human

        That’s a whole lot of blah blah blah, but no answers to my simple questions. I am seeking the truth here, so when Jesus says “Truly I say to you…” I expect it to be clear unambiguous truth. I have no need of a “gift” of faith, or a bible scholar to interpret, or an evangelist to tell me more lies, I just need Jesus’s yes to be yes and no to be no. In plain English, Jesus or the gospel writers lied about his return.

        Once you figure those lies out, here’s another whopper…
        “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes in Me, the works that I do, he will do also; and greater works than these he will do; because I go to the Father.”

        so tell me…when was the last time you raised the dead? Walked on water? Moved a mountain by faith? How about…moved even one grain of sand by faith alone? And don’t give me some nonsense about how “a changed life” or “salvation” is the greater work. Jesus told people to believe because of the miracles, and that his followers would do the same miracles and greater. Put up or shut up.

        • Matthew 22:37

          Like I said. You need a good Bible teacher to help you understand. You most likely are no good at figurative language.

          Why is it you have to understand everything literally? Why are you seeking out contradictions. Don’t you want to have a unified understanding of God’s perspective and what He is doing in this world?

          You didn’t understand Jesus’ parable in the Matthew chapter you brought up.

          You are letting the people with disunified thinking direct your thinking.

          You have the personal ability to seek out the truth or settle for other people’s errors.

          Why are you trying to find flaws in God’s thinking. Nitpicking His ideas instead of understanding the whole picture. There is the personal picture. What He does in a human’s life. Then there’s the big picture. That is God’s plan for the whole world.

          Look at one explanation of what an actual bible teacher says about the parable in the Matthew chapter that you mentioned.

          Here it is:

          Jesus Prophesies of Modern Zionism

          In Matt. 24:32 and 33, Jesus gave His interpretation of the fig tree near the time of His second appearance:

          32 Now learn the parable from the fig tree; when its branch has already become tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near; 33 even so you, too, when you see all these things, recognize that He is near, right at the door.

          This “fig tree” is recognized by many Bible teachers as referring to the modern Jewish State. Thus, even they believe that Jesus prophesied of this State being formed in the latter days when Jesus second coming is “near, right at the door.” I fully agree with this interpretation.

          But Jesus said nothing about this fig tree bringing forth FRUIT. He only says that it will bring forth more leaves. In other words, it will come to life, and the Jewish State will indeed be established—but it will not bear fruit that would save it from being cut down once again. If it bears no fruit, it is fit only to be cut down, Jesus said.

          Modern evangelical and pentecostal teaching says that the Jews will soon repent, and God will save them at the last minute. Then their Jewish State will become the headquarters of Christ’s Kingdom on the earth. They say Jesus Christ will rule from a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem (after the Antichrist has vacated it, of course).

          Here I absolutely disagree. If the nation were to repent, it would bear the fruits of repentance that John and Jesus required from the beginning. But if it should bear fruit, then Jesus’ prophecy would fail, for He said in Matt. 21:19, “No longer shall there ever be any fruit from you.”

          If we do not believe Jesus’ words here, then why should we believe anything else that He said? – end quote

          The Bible is much much too involved a book for you to call it into question on a message board trying to refute God.

          Not when you didn’t try to gain a masterful understanding of the subject matter.

          I hope you start seeking to know and understand God more personally. How are you going to understand Him without seeking to know Him yourself?

          Just remember there is a lot of room for interpretive error of the Bible until you start to develop the skills and ability to interpret the book on your own.

          Faith is a relationship with God. That relationship is based on foundational knowledge and acquiring foundational knowledge requires work.

          Yes, a believer has a relationship with God but some people have better relationships than others.

          I hope this helps. You need to get some help on the Bible. You need tutoring. So stop trying to argue things you never understood.

          Remember Jesus loves everyone. Don’t let the world make you hate him. See John 3:16.

        • Matthew 22:37

          From gotquestions dot org on the word “generation”.

          How long is a generation in the Bible?

          Answer: The Bible uses the term generation in some different ways. Normally, the word generation refers to all the people living at the same time—i.e., the word in the Bible has the same definition that we are used to in modern usage when we speak of Generation X or the Millennial Generation. Normally, a generation is about thirty years; one generation raises the next. However, in some biblical contexts, a “generation” can refer to a longer age or a group of people spanning a longer period of time.

          In Genesis 2:4, “generations of the heavens and the earth” (ESV) seems to include all of human history—the era begun by the creation of the universe. In Exodus 1:6 the “generation” who die refers to everyone who had been alive during the time that Joseph and his brothers lived. In Numbers 32:13, the “generation” is limited to Israelites—the group of them, twenty years old and older, at the time of their refusal to enter the Promised Land. That one generation was doomed to wander in the wilderness until they all died, except for Joshua and Caleb. When the plural word generations occurs in the Bible, as in Isaiah 51:9 and Acts 14:16, it refers to an indefinite period of time—many successive generations.

          The original languages of the Bible used at least three different words that are translated “generation” in English. The Hebrew dor can refer to a normal, physical generation, as in Exodus 1:6. But it can also be used metaphorically to identify people of a distinguishable type. For example, Psalm 78:8 says, “They should not be like their fathers, a stubborn and rebellious generation, a generation whose heart was not steadfast, whose spirit was not faithful to God” (ESV). Here the word dor is used twice to refer to a group of people through a long period of time who were characterized by rebellion and sin. The “generation” in Psalm 78:8 is not limited to a normal thirty-year period but stretches back through the history of Israel to include all who were stubborn against God.

          The other Hebrew word we translate as “generation” is toledot. This doesn’t refer to the character of a group or an age but to how that age was generated. So the “generations of the heavens and the earth” in Genesis 2:4 refers to the time periods that started with creation and continued organically from that point. The “generations of Adam” in Genesis 5:1 means the civilization of people that began with him. The next “generation” is that of Noah, to include the flood and the civilizations that came after. Shem’s influence is marked as a “generation” as he was the father of the Semites (Genesis 11:10). And Terah’s, because he left Ur with his son Abram (Genesis 11:27). Later, Ishmael (Genesis 25:12) and Isaac (Genesis 25:19) were the source of new generations. In each case, the men either experienced or caused a significant event that changed the course of their family line. They generated a culture-altering event.

          In the New Testament, the Greek genea is the source of generation. It is similar to both Hebrew words. Literally, it means “fathered, birthed, nativity,” referring to a genetic line. But it can be used as both the time frame characterized by a specific cultural attitude and the people in that culture. In Matthew 1:17, the generations are marked off by significant events and people—Abraham, David, Babylonian captivity—like the Hebrew toledot. But when Jesus calls the Pharisees and scribes a “wicked and perverse generation,” He is referring to the culture that they lived in and encouraged (Matthew 12:39; see also Matthew 17:17 and Acts 2:40).

          So, when we read “generation” in the Bible, we have to consider the context. Usually, a generation in the Bible is roughly thirty years long or the people living during that time, the same as what we understand a generation to be in everyday talk. But there are times when generation is used poetically to refer to a class of people demarked by something other than age.

        • Matthew 22:37

          Blah, blah, blah is how you talk to someone you don’t know on the Internet?

          Why didn’t you do your own independent research before looking for a contradiction?

          Do you want God to be wrong? If so then your heart is not right with God.

          Why didn’t you study to become an approved man more thoroughly like God urges people to do.

          Look at what this Bible Scholars site says. I just found this site today because I am still seeking knowledge:

          Bible Scholars

          Bible Scholars is concerned with information of a religious nature, although we are certainly not limited to religious studies in the strictest sense of the word.
          Our focus encompasses information from all disciplines that will illuminate and educate…therein lies our principle goal: to educate and inform. Hosea 4:6 states, “My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge.” The lack of knowledge is the reason that there are ten or more basic religious systems and, in Christianity, hundreds of warring denominations, sects, and cults. It is obvious something is wrong. Not everyone can be right but, could everyone be wrong?
          The purpose of Bible Scholars is to try to separate fact from fiction, truth from error, and to assist those searching after truth in finding purpose and meaning in their lives.
          I personally have read dozens of statements of faith, creeds, denominational statements…and found all of them lacking. The doctrinal statement of biblescholars.org is quite simple. We have none.
          Scholars associated with Bible Scholars are just that – scholars – most holding PhDs in their field.
          The quest of the true scholar is for truth. The true scholar is one who has no “creed.” He espouses no traditions he considers so sacred that he is not willing to change or make adjustments when confronted with truth.
          Our purpose is simply to bring to you, our reader, the best, the most up-to-date, relevant information that will illuminate, educate and assist you in your quest for truth.
          biblical studies
          science & the bible
          world’s great religions
          biblical languages
          biblical history
          archaeology of bible lands
          contemporary events
          current issues
          Although most scholars associated with Bible Scholars have academic degrees, it does not mean that we believe ourselves to be infallible. Those things we believe, or espouse today may be discarded, changed, or modified in view of additional information, archaeological finds, or scientific discoveries.
          Our collective cry must be: “Question the Answers.”-end quote

          I regret today that nobody raised me in Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic because it puts me at an educational disadvantage so I am always seeking to learn from the best Bible teachers and scholars and there are a lot of them in the world if you will just make the effort to find them.

          Why would you publicly rebel against God on a public message board with a substandard understanding of the scriptures.

          How many people who have never repented and got their hearts right with God are doing this? I have talked to several hundred now and it makes no sense.

          Get your heart right with God before verbally and publicly alleging things that may not be true.

          You are calling into question 2,000 years of Biblical Scholarship from a position of ignorance.

          If you give up seeking spiritual knowledge and answers from God then you are spiritually dead in your trespasses just like the Bible says.

          So try living for and learning from God for a change.

          • Rational Human

            You are delusional. Why would a living God who wants people to be saved speak his book in only archaic dead languages, in an ignorant period of history, to an ignorant and superstitious people, and expect modern Americans to take it seriously? Why would you need to study Aramaic and koine Greek to understand the word of this omniscient living being? It. Makes. No. Sense.

            Wake T.F. Up. It took me 25 years, but I was able to escape the mental bondage of Christianity, and so can you.

          • Matthew 22:37

            Uh, because He wants you to seek Him.

            I doubt you ever made a sincere effort to seek him Mr. Claim to Think Critically.

            What if nobody can be an independent thinker on his own.

            You can break free of God in your thought life but that leaves you chained to the devil as his slave.

            I would rather be God’s servant than a slave to sin and the devil.

            Didn’t you read the verse in the Bible where it said to work out your faith with fear and trembling?

            Change is terrifying to some people. But spiritual change is social progress.

            So stop acting like you lost all your social intelligence and get your heart right with God.

            Today is the day of salvation so try letting God own you in your thoughtlife instead of the devil for a change. God will make a whole new man out of you. Hallelujah. Praise and all glory to Him.

            I could have stayed a moral coward and a weak slave to sin if it were not for Jesus and his mighty example.

            Have a blessed day! Jesus loves you so take that fact to heart because the Bible which is God’s Word tells you so. With that self knowledge you can break away from Satan, repent and rejoin Jesus.

          • Matthew 22:37

            God’s logic is strewn through out the Bible for a genuine seeker to put together the verses and receive God’s thinking/ pictures.

            All of God’s logic is love based because that is God’s nature. God is love.

            If you are so irrational as to turn your back on God’s love without repenting and seeking His favor then you have allowed something to corrupt your heart and mind.

            I am not going to respect your corruption. I am going to point it out so you can acknowledge your sinful error exists. Take Jesus’ hand and leave it. Once and for all time.

            Get Jesus and let him make a new man out of you. One day at a time. You will have to persevere through all the trials and tests though. Those trials and tests come to us all whether we want them or not but Jesus can make you face them like a winner instead of like a cry baby, complaining loser.

          • Matthew 22:37

            Here is a good song to meditate to and understand God’s truth.

            Everything to Me
            https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ywzlq2AiAuM

          • Matthew 22:37

            You didn’t escape mental bondage if you are mentally giving in to sin.

            From gotquestions. org:

            How can I take control of my thoughts?

            Answer: Many Christians struggle with this issue, especially in our highly technological world, but taking control of our thoughts is essential. Proverbs 4:23 states, “Above all else, guard your heart, for it is the wellspring of life.” The “heart” includes the mind and all that proceeds from it. Someone said that every sin we commit, we commit twice, once in our thoughts and again when we act upon those thoughts. It is easier to rid our lives of sin if we attack it at this fundamental thought level rather than waiting for it to become rooted in our lives by our actions and then try to pull it out.

            There is also a difference between being tempted (a thought entering into the mind) and sinning (dwelling upon an evil thought and wallowing in it). It is important to understand that when a thought enters our mind, we examine it based upon God’s Word and determine if we should continue down that path or reject the thought and replace it with another thought. If we have already allowed a habit to form in our thought lives, it becomes more difficult to change the path of our thoughts, even as it is hard to get a car out of a deep rut and onto a new track. Here are some biblical suggestions for taking control of our thoughts and getting rid of wrong thoughts:

            1. Be in God’s Word so that when a sinful thought enters our mind (a temptation), we will be able to recognize it for what it is and know what course to take. Jesus in the wilderness (Matthew 4) responded to each of Satan’s temptations with Scripture that applied to the direction He knew His mind should take instead of beginning down the path of the sinful thought. When tempted to meet His physical need (turn stone into bread), He recited the passage about the importance of relying upon God. When tempted to serve Satan in order to obtain the glory of the world, He brought up the passage that says we are to serve and worship God alone and speak of the glory that belongs to Him and those who are His. When tempted to test God (to see if God was really there and would keep His promises), Jesus responded with passages that stress the importance of believing God without having to see Him demonstrate His presence.

            Quoting Scripture in a time of temptation is not a talisman, but rather serves the purpose of getting our minds onto a biblical track, but we need to know the Word of God AHEAD of time in order to accomplish this. Thus, a daily habit of being in the Word in a meaningful way is essential. If we are aware of a certain area of constant temptation (worry, lust, anger, etc.), we need to study and memorize key passages that deal with those issues. Looking for both what we are to avoid (negative) and how we are to properly respond (positive) to tempting thoughts and situations—before they are upon us—will go a long way to giving us victory over them.

            2. Live in dependence upon the Holy Spirit, chiefly through seeking His strength through prayer (Matthew 26:41). If we rely upon our own strength, we will fail (Proverbs 28:26;Jeremiah 17:9; Matthew 26:33).

            3. We are not to feed our minds with that which will promote sinful thoughts. This is the idea of Proverbs 4:23. We are to guard our hearts—what we allow into them and what we allow them to dwell on. Job 31:1 states, “I have made a covenant with my eyes; Why then should I look upon a young woman” (NKJV). Romans 13:14 states, “But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to fulfill its lusts.” Thus, we are to avoid periodicals, videos, websites, conversations and situations that will set us up for a fall. We should also avoid spending time with those who would encourage us down these wrong paths.

            4. We are to pursue hard after God, replacing sinful thoughts with godly pursuits and mindsets. This is the principle of replacement. When tempted to hate someone, we replace those hateful thoughts with godly actions: we do good to them, speak well of them, and pray for them (Matthew 5:44). Instead of stealing, we should work hard to earn money so we can look for opportunities to give to others in need (Ephesians 4:28). When tempted to lust after a woman, we turn our gaze, praise God for the way He has made us—male and female—and pray for the woman (for example: “Lord, help this young woman to come to know you if she does not, and to know the joy of walking with you”), then think of her as a sister (1 Timothy 5:2). The Bible often speaks of “putting off” wrong actions and thoughts but then “putting on” godly actions and thoughts (Ephesians 4:22-32). Merely seeking to put off sinful thoughts without replacing those thoughts with godly ones leaves an empty field for Satan to come along and sow his weeds (Matthew 12:43-45).

            5. We can use fellowship with other Christians the way God intended. Hebrews 10:24-25 states, “And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds. Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.” Fellow Christians who will encourage us in the changes we desire (best if of the same gender), who will pray for and with us, who will ask us in love how we are doing, and who will hold us accountable in avoiding the old ways, are valuable friends indeed.

            Last and most important, these methods will be of no value unless we have placed our faith in Christ as Savior from our sin. This is where we absolutely must start! Without this, there can be no victory over sinful thoughts and temptations, and God’s promises for His children are not for us, nor is the Holy Spirit’s power available to us!

            God will bless those who seek to honor Him with what matters most to Him: who we are inside and not just what we appear to be to others. May God make Jesus’ description of Nathanael true also of us—a man [or woman] in whom there is no guile (John 1:47).

  • pud

    “Mourning His Return Most every believer I know of has a deep down desire for Jesus Christ to return”

    Wish thinking…and proof that you’re all a sick death blood cult who just can’t wait for the “end of days”

    Every essay you pen janitor jack is more stupid, delusional, warped and deranged than the last.

  • Matthew 22:37

    The other day pud, the Satanist, asked me why I didn’t worship some kind of Indian monkey God.

    Well he could never reason his way to the right God so how could he follow my reasoning for not worshipping Hanumam or whatever that monkey god’s name is.

    Perhaps, Satan is making a monkey out of him.

    Why people are not more discerning about who they listen to about God, I don’t know.

    But if the charismatic Andrew Strom is right in his youtube video “Kundalini Warning” on youtube then there is definitely a good reason for not messing around in false religions.

    Why would I want to identify with a monkey when I can identify with Jesus.

    Pud you are on block for Satanist tendencies to control people so don’t bother replying. I just wanted to give people more to think about on this false god question of your’s. Really why should your confusion over who the real god is control anybody else’s reasoning?

    Try being an independent thinker before you attempt to control other people’s thinking, pud, if you are reading.

    God is a better thinker than you.

    God bless everyone reading!