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J. Krishnamurti – Conditioning – prisoners of the past – Video
J. Krishnamurti – Conditioning – prisoners of the past – Transcript
Beyond myth and tradition\sInclusion\sPrisoners of the past\sAB: What prevents radical change in our lives\sThe change we instinctively feel is necessary\sTo create a new way of life?\sWhy do we repeat the same models generation after generation?\sKrishnamurti points out\sThat the psychological conditioning of the past\s- What we received by parents colleagues\sOur education our work and social environment -\sThey can be iron bars that hold us.\sHe wonders about our symmetry\sSuch as a certain nationality religion or class.\sCan we go beyond our old educated responses in the past?\sAre we forever condemned to being prisoners of the past?\sKrishnamurti about the condition.\sK: That’s what I want to discuss:\sIf it is possible to change the human condition.\sAnd not accept it\sTo convey – as most philosophers have said existentialists and others -\s’Your human nature is conditioning\sYou can not change them you can edit them. ‘\sDo we accept that?\sOr do we have to check if it is possible\sChange this condition?\sRs: Yes I think we should check it out.\sK: If you say it can not be changed then the argument is over\sRas: Much of this conditioning is inherent in our biological nature.\sK: Well yes but can not this change too?\sI may have inherited – what? – Violence\sOf monkeys and so on and so on\sCan I change that?\sInherited biological requirements\sSurely that can be changed.\sRs: Well all communities are definitely seeking to switch\sThese biological motivations that we have\sAnd all measures for raising children in all societies\sSeeks to make these motives within the control of society.\sOtherwise you will have a huge mess.\sK: Sir why do you separate if I can ask between society and me\sSociety is something external\sWhich affects me and makes my chains.\sBut my father – my grandfather and so on from previous generations -\sThey created this community if I am part of this society.\sI am the community.\sI want to cancel this idea in the debate\sThis separation between me and society.\sI’m the community I’m the world\sI am the result of all these influences conditions\sWhether in the East West North or South\sThey are all part of the conditioning. Rs: Yes.\sK: If we attack the cures\sNot your birthplace east or west.\sTherefore I ask I am conditioned as such\sIt is not possible to be free from this to be free from my conditions?\sIf you say that is not possible then it is over.\sEducation is the adopted means of inciting the mind.\sBG: I started to make a distinction\sBetween brain and mind. K: Yes.\sBG: Can you separate?\sK: We’re saying that brain\sModal – at least some of it.\sThat condition happens through experiences.\sThat condition is knowledge\sAnd that’s a memory is a memory.\sExperience knowledge memory is limited\sHe has limited thinking.\sNow we are working within the circle of thought.\sBG: Yes.\sK: To discover something new there must be\sAt least temporarily or for a period\sWhen the thought is not in motion\sWhen thought is absent.\sBG: What is the mind then?\sK: The mind is yet completely different.\sWhich is not connected to thought.\sLet us be clear.\sThe brain whatever that part is modal.\sTime and thought time – thought.\sAs long as that condition is not possible.\sYou may have a temporary insight into something\sBut pure insight that means comprehension\sFor the total sum of things\s- Yes I will use the word “grand total” rather than “macro”\sBecause that word has now become widely used -\sIt is the realization of perfection.\sis not it?\sThat insight is not time-thought.\sSo that vision is part of that brain\sWhich is in a different dimension.\sInsight can only exist when there is freedom\sOf time and thought.\sBG: It’s the brain itself that listens to that.\sK: Yes he listens.\sAnd then what happens? one minute. what is happening?\sIf he listens he is quiet.\sBG: It’s quiet.\sK: It does not work because it does not work\s”God is on you which means” He does not gossip.\sIt is quiet. is not it?\sBG: Yes it’s quiet. K: Wait a moment.\sWhen it is actually not the updated-induced calm\sWhen he listens and there is calm\sThen be insightful.\sWhen you see the risk of conditioning\sAs if you see the danger of a cliff or a wild animal\sThen it falls without any effort.\sK: Could it not be conditional?\sWhat is the factor that makes you conditional?\sWhat causes the brain to be conditioned?\sAbove all there is demand for safety.\sWe do not support insecurity. Just listen to the full story.\sWe want safety both physical and natural.\sIf there is safety and that is not through time\s- is that clear? -\sWho is not through hope? Are you following?\sIs there a safety that is not made of desire?\sis not it?\sThe friend says “Yes there is absolute security\sFinal security “.\sDo you follow this?\sThe brain has been conditioned because of attachment.\sThere in that attachment is looking for safety\s- In my wife in my work\sIn a role model in one of the gods.\sTherefore when it is discovered that there is no safety in any of this\sWhat has happened to the brain?\sPlease continue watch it carefully.\sWhat has happened to your brain\sWhich is traditionally conditioned to have a hangover\sHoping to find safety in all this\sAnd suddenly he discovers that there is no safety in all this\s- What happens to the brain? Do you follow this?\sThere is a total change. Do you understand all this?\sAs long as you cling to a certain comfortable attachment\sIn that attachment I looked for safety\sAnd now found after the observation is very accurate\sThat there is no safety in it\sThe entire path has been kept away from him ..\sAnd then your brain will be unconditional.\sAnd that is not happening\sBecause you have seen the truth.\sThat in attachment there is no safety.\sSeeing that there is no security in the illusion is intelligence.\sThat intelligence the beginning that gives you absolute security.\s- In intelligence not in attachment.\sUntil liberation from the condition\sFreedom from the movement of thought\sWhich has great problems\sThese problems can not be solved.\sK: There was a division between consciousness and unconsciousness.\sThe subconscious is all past all inherited.\sAll human memories for thousands of years.\sis not it?\sUnconsciously you may have memories that you are conditioned\sThat you are a Protestant a Hindu etc.\sTwo thousand years of Christianity and propaganda\sHas deeply rooted fear of paradise and hell\sSavior\s- It exists deeply.\sIf you go to the Islamic world it also exists\sThe Hindu world and so on.\sSo the subconscious is the movement of the past. is not it?\sTechnically see how much energy has been harnessed in technology.\sOur brain is limited modal\sWith extensive experience knowledge – it is conditional.\sBut to discover the quality of the brain which is unconditional\sThus has unlimited capacity.\sBut it is now conditional. – Being a British French\sI believe I do not believe I believe in God he is my teacher\sThat teacher is better than this teacher\sAll this nonsense is happening.\sTherefore as long as it is conditional its potential – its capabilities are limited\sAnd only when the total liberation from that condition.\sThat means no faith no fear – do you follow? -\sNot attached of any kind and anything.\sSo is it possible for the brain to be unconditional?\sWhich means is it possible for the brain\sTo be free of the known?\sAlthough I should know how to go home\sWhat way should I go what language I speak\sI should know there is no knowledge.\sBut to psychologically free ie\sThe brain has been conditioned conditioned by knowledge\s- To be free of that -\sAnd then he has enormous potential.\sThen we say: What is reason?\sis that clear? We are talking about awareness\sBrain and mind.\sWhen the brain is completely free of that knowledge at the psychological level.\sThen the brain is the mind\sBecause the mind is infinite.\sOur human brain is a mechanical process.\sMind-Thought is a material process\sThat mind has been conditioned to think\sAs a Hindu as a Hindu.\sIs it possible to be free from that condition?\sK: I’m really not an expert\sIn the structure of the brain and all those kinds of things\sBut one can observe the activity of his personal brain\sWhich really looks like a computer\sIn terms of being programmed and remembered.\sIt is conditional. B: Yes.\sK: conditioned by past generations by society\sNewspapers Magazines\sAll external events and pressures.\sBD: But it is the conditioning that determines the ego\sWhich determines … K: Self.\sBD: You call her self.\sK: Let’s call it self now instead of ego.\sBD: ego self. That is the condition\sIs what you are talking about.\sThat may not only be unnecessary but harmful.\sK: Yes. That’s what we were also discussing.\sThat self-focus as we do now\sGiving importance to the ego\sCreates great harm in the world.\sBut the brain condition as I see it\sInvolves an illusion which we call ego.\sK: That’s right. That is right.\sCan this condition be dissipated? That is the whole question ..\sB: Yes. It must really be dissipated\sFrom some physical chemical and neurological-physiological aspects.\sBut the brain it seems to me works alone\sThrough his own program. is not it?\sK: Yes it’s more like a computer running under its own program.\sB: Now basically what he asks\sThat the brain should really respond to the mind.\sK: That response can only occur if it is free\sOf thought which is limited.\sBD: We say the mind … In fact even the brain is not divided\sBecause we say that we all\sWe are not only similar in essence but actually connected.\sAnd then we say behind all this the indivisible mind at all.\sK: It’s unconditional.\sB: Yes it will seem barely applied then\sSo far as a person feels that he is a separate object\sHe has little contact with reason. Right?\sK: It’s quite true so we say.\sBD: As if there is no mind.\sK: So it’s very important to understand\sNot mind but my condition.\sWhether it is my condition or the human condition\sCan be solved. That is the real issue.\sThe ego self is the movement in knowledge a series of memories.\sThen the question arises:\sIs it possible to live psychologically?\sWithout even a single memory?\sK: Is there an act?\sAbsolutely free of all conditions?\sThe requirement is to have a model\sYou then copy it\sOr trying to impose it on “what you are.”\sis not it?\sInclusion is the surrounding environment\sInclusion is religions\sAccording to what one read\sTeacher etc. – the requirement.\sIf the problem is: Can the mind …\s… Can the mind be free of all conditions to do?\sThis requires a great deal of attention\sA great deal of watching\sBe aware that he is modeling\sAnd that he would be subject to his actions accordingly:\s”I am this I must become that\sWhich is called self-development.\sBeautiful words!\sThat is self which is selfish\sTrying to develop itself;\sTo become more selfish.\sSo can we set aside all this\sAnd to actually see what we are and do?\sis that clear?\sWhat is enlightenment?\sWho is enlightened?\sIlluminations of what?\sIlluminating what? Are you following?\sInevitably a mind has been enlightened\sFree of all conditions.\sCan man be enlightened?\sWhen he is afraid\sWhen he is looking for power position\sCollect money in the name of enlightenment?\sLighting is not over time.\sIt is not a process.\sIt is not something that can be accessed by gradualization.\sTo be free of all conditions\sWhich also includes being the light for yourself fully\sAnd do not rely on anyone any opinion any teacher.\sBe the light for yourself fully\sAnd from that light shall be the act.\s
J. Krishnamurti – Conditioning – prisoners of the past – Notes
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