Awesome Comment Award: Emjb on how fetuses are made

I don’t awesome do this, but sometimes a commenter says something truly awesome that deserves repeating. Here is what emjb had to say after reading today’s post on the erasure of women in the rhetoric of the anti-abortion movement.

One thing that was powerful to me was when a pro-choice woman pointed out that a fetus doesn’t just grow *in* a woman’s body, it is *made from* a woman’s body. Fetuses literally use the blood, food, and energy of the woman to build their own bodies. They are not separate from the woman in any true sense until they leave the womb. They don’t even stop receiving her blood until the cord is cut/the placenta detaches from the uterus. We think of them as floating in her like an astronaut in a spaceship, but they are more like an extra organ of her body for much of the time they are in the womb.

This is something I intend to repeat, and often. Fetuses are not some sort of autonomous beings that just happen to have residence inside women’s bodies. They don’t simply grown in women, they grow on women.

About Libby Anne

Libby Anne grew up in a large evangelical homeschool family highly involved in the Christian Right. College turned her world upside down, and she is today an atheist, a feminist, and a progressive. She blogs about leaving religion, her experience with the Christian Patriarchy and Quiverfull movements, the detrimental effects of the "purity culture," the contradictions of conservative politics, and the importance of feminism.

  • http://www.facebook.com/lucrezaborgia Lucreza Borgia

    Pro-lifers also seem to be woefully ignorant of fetal development or they assume that those of us in the pro-choice camp have no idea about it.

  • Judy L.

    Indeed. I think, however, a better preposition than ‘on’ is ‘of’. A fetus is made of a woman’s body, and is part of her body. Fetuses exist not just in a woman’s a body, but of a woman’s body. :)

  • Judy L.

    Sorry, that smiley-face looks evil.

  • piny

    This is true, but I think the phrasing still gives the game away. The fetus doesn’t grow. It is grown: the woman’s body grows it. And it requires her active participation! Having a healthy baby means taking all kinds of daily measures large and small to support your pregnancy.

  • http://www.cleverbadger.net Jay

    “Fetuses literally use the blood, food, and energy of the woman to build their own bodies.”
    If a fetus was a different species than the mother, the term that would describe this relationship is “parasite”.

    • Uly

      Indeed, our bodies sometimes interpret them this way.

    • Emmers

      This is why pregnancy depresses your immune system, and why Rh- women with Rh+ partners have to take immune-suppressant drugs during their pregnancies. (If I understand the biology correctly, that is.)

      • http://momstinfoilhat.wordpress.com MomTFH

        No, sorry, you don’t. Rhogam isn’t really an immune suppression agent. It is more of a cloaking device for one very specific purpose – hiding Rh positive blood cells in the embryo or fetus from recognition as “foreign” by the Rh negative pregnant body. It does not suppress the general immune system. It is actually an immunoglobulin.

        But, your heart is in the right place. Pregnancy, even without Rh mismatch issues, is by no means a benign or risk free process. But, I wanted to post a response so no one potentially is nervous about receiving a necessary Rhogam shot because they are afraid of being vulnerable to infection.

  • emjb

    Aw shucks. Thanks Libby Anne! And I believe I first ran across this idea over at Amanda Marcotte’s Pandagon; not sure if it was her or a commenter at her blog.

  • http://jw-thoughts.blogspot.com JW

    I have noticed that when it comes to the fetus there is so much work in trying to show that the fetus really isn’t a baby and then it eventually forms into a baby at some point. I see it as a selfish attitude because when a girl is pregnant the usual attitude is ‘there is a life in there now’ no matter what state the pregnancy is in. This has been analyzed away so that when women have an abortion they don’t have the guilt trip knocking on their door as a result. Analyzing it away so that when the fetus is gone the woman doesn’t have to feel as if they just terminated a life, somehow.

    And then this quote:
    “Fetuses are not some sort of autonomous beings that just happen to have residence inside women’s bodies. They don’t simply grown in women, they grow on women”

    What does this mean exactly? It can mean different things depending upon the context. I believe that in the context of those who lean toward abortion it says that this fetus is like a virus that a woman needs to get rid of. They did choose for it to be there so ‘I’ need to get rid of it. A selfish act because the only way a fetus gets there is through sexual contact. The fetus is the consequence of an act which carries with it a responsibility in which some women don’t want to deal with. I see the whole thing as a selfish act and again, analyzing it away is the road I see many use to cover up the guilt in the soul.
    ( I wonder what kind of reaction this is going to cause.)

    JW

    • Niemand

      when a girl is pregnant the usual attitude is ‘there is a life in there now’ no matter what state the pregnancy is in.

      If a girl is pregnant then she has been raped. Did you by any chance mean “when a woman is pregnant”? Your word choice is indicative of your apparent belief that women are not worth much.

      Apart from that, you don’t seem to understand much about biology. Do you believe that oocytes and sperm aren’t alive? All life comes from life under current conditions on earth. When a boy has cancer, there is a life in him, no matter what its state.

      I see the whole thing as a selfish act and again, analyzing it away is the road I see many use to cover up the guilt in the soul.

      This is typical of the nasty projection used by “pro-lifers” to cover up their own guilt. First, a man who will tell a woman what to do with her uterus will tell her what to do with her vagina. In short, the anti-choice movement is made up of rapists, whether they complete the deed personally or not. Second, pregnancy kills. You know that. There is no way around it: you’re promoting the tortuous deaths of many young women to satisfy your need to control. Finally, I’ve never met a “pro-life” advocate who really believes that a fetus is a baby. How do I know this? Because they are universally indifferent to miscarriage, even late miscarriage. No sane person is indifferent to the death of a baby. Indifference to miscarriage and lack of willingness to so much as spend a few cents for better medical care to prevent miscarriage is indicative of how little the “pr0-life” movement cares about the actual LIVES of fetuses. Again, it’s not about the fetus, it’s about the ability to control women.

      So, do you want to face your god, if you have one, with that kind of guilt on your soul? Knowing that you’re promoting rape, slavery, and murder? You can deny it to me-I’m no one that needs to judge you. But can you deny it to yourself?

    • ScottInOH

      I appreciate your comment, JW. It is not always that someone makes it so clear what motivates him or her. You disapprove of women having sex without wanting a baby, and you have said so out loud. Thank you.

      • http://jw-thoughts.blogspot.com JW

        You are funny. Nope, never said anything about disapproving of women having sex. You are putting that in my mouth. Our actions have consequences. For a women to get pregnant it means she had sex. What I am seeing and saying is that it seems that women who get pregnant want the sex but the pregnancy just gets in the way so abortion is the way to go. To end the life in the womb for various reasons. If a woman is going to have sex and doesn’t want to get pregnant than use a condom that is water based. Oil based will break it. I saw that in a Planned Parenthood meeting at a college. Blew 2 condoms up and one was oil based and one was water based and the oil based on blew up. The water based one never did. btw, I have never used a condom.

      • Kodie

        Sounds like it.

      • “Rebecca”

        JW, if your objection to abortion is that it’s dodging responsibility for sex, I assume you find it acceptable to abort in cases where the woman didn’t consent to sex?

      • Rosie

        JW, have you ever known a man who wanted to have sex without becoming a father? Would you give him the same advice you give women who don’t want to become pregnant?

      • Emmers

        The nesting is too deep, but JW @ 2:23′s comment about condoms is misphrased. Condoms themselves aren’t “oil based” or “water based” — s/he has probably heard the (correct) information that if one is using a latex condom, oil-based lubricant may cause it to break, while water-based lubricant is generally safe. More here (and all over the Internet): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_lubricant#Oil-based

    • Malitia

      Oh. Because getting an abortion is not taking responsibility? I see. You know the only choice I ever saw about a pregnancy that I consider truly evil is a birth & adoption combination “pro-life”rs seem to be that fond of. (I was working near a school for disabled children, I met the boy there. I know it’s anecdotal so isn’t proof, but it’s certainly an example) That child has fetal alcohol syndrome and schizophrenia his adoptive parents cope with workaholism (mother) and alcoholism (father). That irresponsible woman destroyed three lives.

      • http://jw-thoughts.blogspot.com JW

        Getting an abortion is not taking responsibility for an act that produced the life inside, YES. This refers to those who are teenagers and adults who are out having a good time and choose to have sex no matter if they were drunk or totally sober. Those who are for abortion seem to always want to tilt the issue to the bad elements of society and use it to justify termination of an infant so that the infant doesn’t live their lives addicted to something.

        If this boy was adopted by parents who have their own major issues than that sounds as if it is a state issue because adoption happens through agencies. I am guessing these agencies are run by the state so the state has failed the little boy. Why blame his mom for not aborting him? That is SICK!!

      • http://www.facebook.com/lucrezaborgia Lucreza Borgia

        Getting an abortion is not taking responsibility to you. Not other people. We don’t base laws on your opinions thankfully.

        You have no idea how adoption is run in this country, I bet. Homestudies are not on par with psych evals and almost anyone can keep it together long enough to pass the pathetic classes required to adopt. Heck, we went through a homestudy 2 years ago (stepdaughter is in foster care and we are trying to get her out) and all they were concerned about was if we had running water, adequate shelter, and no convictions for certain crimes.

        Adopters are not automatically selfless people out to save children from being aborted. Many of them view the biological parents as trash and the infants they produce as products to solve their own infertility. Some adoption contracts allow them to back out of the child is in any way damaged.

        http://adoptiveparentsspeak.wordpress.com/

    • Kay

      “( I wonder what kind of reaction this is going to cause.)”

      I doubt you “wonder” as much as you say…I think more you are “happily looking forward” to what kind of a reaction this is going to cause. I mean, this is a liberal blog where the host and vast majority of commentors are pro-choice. I’m not sure it’s even possible to “wonder” what kind of a reaction you’ll get with a post calling pro-choice women “selfish girls”.

    • Anat

      I see it as a selfish attitude because when a girl is pregnant the usual attitude is ‘there is a life in there now’ no matter what state the pregnancy is in.

      As Niemand said, a *girl* should never ever be pregnant. In a moral world, only women who want to should be pregnant. (And men who want to, technology allowing.) And I don’t know where the usual attitude is ‘there is a life there now’ – nobody speaks like that where I hang out. The woman was alive, her body part were alive, all along. What people do say is that, if she is planning to bring the pregnancy to term, she will be ‘eating for two’ and similar expressions.

      What does this mean exactly? It can mean different things depending upon the context. I believe that in the context of those who lean toward abortion it says that this fetus is like a virus that a woman needs to get rid of.

      It means the fetus is deriving its energy, its nutrients, its building blocks, from the woman. And the presence of the fetus has a significant, often major, impact on the woman.

      A selfish act because the only way a fetus gets there is through sexual contact. The fetus is the consequence of an act which carries with it a responsibility in which some women don’t want to deal with.

      The women have no choice but to deal with the fetus. One way of dealing with it is by removing it from the uterus.

      People drive, and cross streets, knowing they might end up in an accident despite efforts to the contrary. People have sex knowing they might end up conceiving or contributing to conception, despite their efforts to the contrary. In both situations it is completely responsible to act to undo the unwanted outcomes of one’s actions.

    • Anat

      Oh, JW, just stop giving contraception advice. You sound condescending. Every method of contraception short of hysterectomy has some failure rate. The rate can be very small, as with vasectomy, but still existent. If enough millions of people use said method or combination of methods enough times eventually it will fail for someone. Don’t assume that because a woman is pregnant she did not use contraception or was too ignorant to use it correctly.

      • http://www.facebook.com/lucrezaborgia Lucreza Borgia

        JW really keeps illustrating for us how it’s about control, doesn’t he?

      • http://jw-thoughts.blogspot.com JW

        You and others who are commenting on this board are very condenscending and sarcastic. It is apparent to that those who post on this blog of like mind and in agreement are the choir of the ‘liberal’ argument. If someone comes in with a different view then that person is shouted down and ‘crucified’ because their words are not in agreement with the rest of the posters. Then the argument becomes that posters such as I are ‘uninformed’. It makes me shake me head in humor. Sometimes I post something just to get you charged up because it becomes a comedy act. Yeah, a comedy act. Sad isn’t it?

        I get a kick out of all of the assumptions and judgments made about and against me. Yet this is the same thing said about people who called themselves Conservatives and so it would show that you are no better than they are, correct?

        Go back to my original post and read over it. I think nearly everyone who has said something in response to me needs to take a chill pill. read my post and give calm answers. Is it really that hard? I am not here to debate and argument ideas. I would rather discuss ideas but on a liberal board THAT cannot even be done because if I disagree with something than THAT is not cool with anyone posting because it doesn’t fit into your box. Just hiliarious……..

      • http://patheos.com/blogs/lovejoyfeminism Libby Anne

        JW – You are in fragrant violation of my comment policy which clearly states no trolling. There are several kinds of trolling, the most basic of which is making comments in an attempt to rile people up instead of with a desire to actually have a conversation. You admitted to doing exactly that when you said the following:

        Sometimes I post something just to get you charged up because it becomes a comedy act.

        I am not here to debate and argument ideas.

        Another kind of trolling is called “tone trolling,” and it involves focusing the conversation on the tone of your opponents, arguing that they are being too harsh, or condescending, or angry, rather than engaging in the actual substance of what is being discussed. You have done a great deal of this in this thread, but you have also done it on other posts in the past months.

        You keep accusing your the other commenters of not engaging with you in good faith, but you do not always engage in good faith yourself. Furthermore, for all of your protesting most of the other commenters here have long been bending over backwards to respond to your arguments and to ask for further clarification from you.

        I have no problem with you commenting here, JW, as you’ve been doing for a year now. However, if you wish to continue commenting I must insist that you abide by my comment policy. This means (a) you must engage with other commenters in good faith, and not simply with the intent of riling them up and (b) you must cease your constant tone trolling and engage arguments rather than whining about the tone other commenters take when they respond to you. And this means no more painting yourself as a victim, by the way, and no more talk of being “crucified.” If you think your opponents are unfairly misrepresenting your position, then further explain your position. If you think a response to one of your arguments is inadequate, then make your case.

        Finally, this is not a “board.” It’s my blog. My space. My home. Not yours. While you are here you are here because I invite you here, just like any other commenter. And while you are here, you have to abide by my rules.

    • piny

      JW, you say you’ve never used a condom, you know nothing about safe sex practices, and you also talk about sexual violence and pregnancy with cavalier insensitivity.

      How old are you?

    • http://momstinfoilhat.wordpress.com MomTFH

      The most common reason women choose to have an abortion is because they cannot afford to have a baby. How is this a selfish act? How is this irresponsible? Sounds very responsible to me. Half of these women are already mothers. Most of the rest will become mothers eventually, when the timing is better.

      You blame women who choose to terminate a pregnancy of some sort of mental acrobatics to justify their decisions, but you seem to be the one oversimplifying and twisting reality to fit in with your worldview.

      • http://www.facebook.com/lucrezaborgia Lucreza Borgia

        It’s selfish because the woman should do the right thing and hand that baby over to a more deserving and wealthy couple who just so happen to be hetero, married, and in good church standing of whatever denomination they are a part of. IE, adoption! *gag*

        Given how few women choose to surrender their children due to deciding to abort or parent, I gotta wonder how those CPC/adoption agencies are gonna get their hands on more products (see interview with a Gladney director. Dang thing reads like a business interview!: http://adoptionsbygladney.com/about/faqfrank ) without pushing abortion as a moral failing. Roll this into the current adoption craze in Evangelical culture and you get a firestorm of epic proportions.

  • http://thechurchproject.me Tracey

    JW,
    You are still treating sex as though its always consensual. Do you suggest a woman take responsibility for an act she did not choose? How are we to deal with discrepancy of responsibility intrinsic to the man being unable to carry the pregnancy?

    Many people do not see abortion in the terms you see it. Because you find it immoral does not mean everyone is being morally lazy in order to have good sex. I suppose it’s possible it may work that way for someone, but clearly not all if the many comments on this blog are any indicator.

    • http://jw-thoughts.blogspot.com JW

      Is the answer to a rape always to get an abortion? I agree that there are some men out there that are pure trash who do rape women but does the act of rape suggest that a woman must use abortion to get of the kid growing inside of her? I realize it is a very touchy subject and the product of rape can be a reminder of the incident but does that mean the unborn has to be terminated in the woman doesn’t want the kid because of the rape? Or because she cannot take care of the baby? Is termination of the baby always the answer? That just seems so one dimensional.

      Many people do not see abortion as you see it either so there has to be a truce somewhere in there.

      • Rosie

        Truce: you live by your morals and let me live by mine. I won’t force you to get an abortion; you don’t force me to carry a pregnancy. End of story.

      • “Rebecca”

        No one is saying that a woman who gets pregnant from rape must automatically get an abortion. What pro-choicers think is that it should be up to her to make that decision, based on her own feelings and circumstances. There are numerous options available to her, such as abortion, adoption, or raising the resulting child. There is nothing one-dimensional about that.

      • Kubrick’s Rube

        does the act of rape suggest that a woman must use abortion?

        “Must” is an odd word to throw at pro-choicers.

      • Anat

        If the woman does not want to be pregnant she should be able to terminate the pregnancy, no matter the circumstances under which the pregnancy started. And if a woman wants to bring a pregnancy to term, she should be allowed to do so no matter under what circumstances the pregnancy started. That’s what we mean by ‘choice’. For any situation, some people will disagree or disapprove of her choice (whether it is to terminate or to bring to term), but regardless, it is not their choice to make but hers.

      • Petticoat Philosopher

        “I agree that there are some men out there that are pure trash who do rape women”

        Awww, you agree that rape happens? You agree with reality? How novel! I think we’re getting somewhere.

        “Is the answer to a rape always to get an abortion?”

        Nope, only when the woman chooses it. Hence “pro-choice.” Are you starting to get it yet?

      • smrnda

        Ever been raped? Being raped is pretty traumatic; it’s the type of experience you would like to put behind you, and having a reminder every day that you’ve been raped inside of you is pretty traumatic. I mean, pregnancy is a pretty major thing – do you think a woman is going to what, feel great knowing that a rapist’s baby is inside of her, making her sick, day in and day out? I mean, if someone wants to keep the baby, they can choose to do so, but I don’t think rapists should have a right to impregnate women.

        The other thing is getting raped isn’t the type of thing you want to just broadcast to the whole world. Imagine a single women who is pregnant from rape. Everybody is going to notice she’s pregnant, probably ask her about it, and then (wow, sounds like fun) she can tell everybody about how she’s pregnant from getting raped.

        Also, even if I thought abortion was murder, the woman didn’t create the situation and the entire blame is on the rapist.

  • Malitia

    Today I learned that JW thinks that:
    1) Everybody lives in America (I live in Hungary).
    2) Somehow poor adoptive parents who do everything in their might aren’t victims in this.
    3) An irresponsible alcoholic is somehow a responsible human being just by not getting an abortion. (But what she did was drinking (a lot) while pregnant, this is what fetal alcohol syndrome means. If you know you have such problems the responsible thing is to not bearing children. So yes. I blame the mother because: she didn’t stop drinking, didn’t aborted, and after birth gave the child up for adoption and by this willingly caused pain and suffering to people who only wanted a child. So yes. Irresponsible, heartless and soulless.)

    • sara maimon

      Abortion is a very responsible decision for some people, whileas for certain people staying pregnant and rearing the child is very irresponsible.

    • Sgaile-beairt

      …he also thinks there are ‘oil based’ and ‘water based’ condoms, which means, he doesnt know the difference between condoms, & lube….!!

      • Malitia

        *facepalm* Yeah. That explains a lot.

      • http://jw-thoughts.blogspot.com JW

        Talk to your local Planned Parenthood rep. and ask them to do a demonstration on condoms. I am sure you will learn something since your sarcasm is that of a teenager. You don’t mean to be, I hope, but it smells to high heaven.

      • http://www.facebook.com/lucrezaborgia Lucreza Borgia

        You said “Blew 2 condoms up and one was oil based and one was water based and the oil based on blew up. The water based one never did. btw, I have never used a condom.”

        There are no oil based condoms. Condoms are either latex, sheepskin, or polyurethane.

        There actually isn’t even oil based lube as it is known to be destructive to latex. Lube is either water based or silicone based.

      • http://www.facebook.com/lucrezaborgia Lucreza Borgia

        Actually, I take the oil-based lubes back. They are available, but not nearly as common as water and silicone. Plus, they typically say with big letters “NOT FOR LATEX CONDOM USE”

        I find it spurious that you think it is OK to lecture people on condom use when you clearly do not know what you are talking about and have never actually used one.

    • http://jw-thoughts.blogspot.com JW

      You have alot of learning to do because you got the first one right and everything else WRONG. Try again. I can help you if you want me to. You might just learn something about me after all that is if you are open to learning?

      • Carys Birch

        You *do* think everyone lives in America? Wasn’t that her first point?

        /scratches head

      • Malitia

        So you do believe that everybody lives in America. Then you have nothing to teach. :D

  • http://thechurchproject.me Tracey

    JW,

    “Sometimes I post something just to get you charged up because it becomes a comedy act.”?

    You are telling us that you aren’t here to have reasonable discourse, only to annoy at best and anger at worst. You just lost my respect.

    • http://jw-thoughts.blogspot.com JW

      Tracey, much of the time I post I am serious. I have posted maybe twice in which I wasn’t really serious and that was only because I thought the topic was just silly. Yet, it seems this is held against me as well? I am really in shock that I had your respect. I am serious with that because so many of the words that have responded back to me have been anything but disrespectful yet I just deal with it because of the nature of the topic as well as the audience.
      I am guessing that on Libby’s blog it is only for serious comments? That can make alot of tension all the time and can lead to health issues. Serious about that!! I have to watch my own self as well.

      • http://patheos.com/blogs/lovejoyfeminism Libby Anne

        I said no tone trolling. This is tone trolling:

        I am really in shock that I had your respect. I am serious with that because so many of the words that have responded back to me have been anything but disrespectful yet I just deal with it because of the nature of the topic as well as the audience.

        Respect is something that is earned, not demanded, and I told you that if you want to continue commenting here you need to stop going on and on about how “mean” and “disrespectful” everyone supposedly is to you. That’s tone trolling and it is against the commenting rules I have made for my blog.

        I am guessing that on Libby’s blog it is only for serious comments?

        Yes, that is correct. That is stated clearly in my comment policy.

  • http://jw-thoughts.blogspot.com JW

    Lucreza
    As I said before. go talk to Planned Parenthood about condoms. This rep had 2 people blow up condoms like a balloon. One had an oil based lube on it and the other had a water based lube on it. Her intention was to show that oil based lube breaks and therefore should not be used. The oil based condom blew up with the water based one got bigger until the guy decided to stop blowing it up.
    I actually wrote a blog about my experience with it. First time I had been in any kind of Planned Parenthood thing. I went because I wanted to see what they were going to show. Soon as I walked in the door I got a condom to which I just started laughing to myself. I thought, boy you guys really are bold aren’t you? I would go to more Planned Parenthood seminars and ask questions if I saw meetings posted. Curious to see what else they are doing.

    • Noelle

      It’s not a secret that oil-based products like Vaseline aren’t meant for use with condoms. Says so right on the box of condoms. And yes, a reproductive health care facility would be expected to teach topics involving reproductive health. It’s not bold. It’s what they do. Kinda like saying it’s bold of McDonald’s to ask if you want fries with that. What else is PP going to teach? Gardening? Harmonica lessons?

      I’m glad PP has classes for JW and others who are behind, but this is basics. All young people should be learning this stuff in school. I missed what the condom story had to do with the topic.

      • Malitia

        On the other hand poor JW’s reaction to the gift condom is weird… I mean there is not only one use for them as my high-school physics teacher can attest. The school was fairly poor so she routinely repurposed the SexEd gift samples for experiments. Hilarity Ensued. :3

  • http://jw-thoughts.blogspot.com JW

    Farewell. Seems that my posts have no place on Libby’s blogs and so I will no longer post anymore. I will also unsubscribe to the blog. No need for a round of applause. I officially leave…….

    • Naked anthropologist

      Thank you. This is the first rational, respectful, and information based comment I have seen you make. Farewell, and may Osiris grant you a safe journey.

  • Meggie

    To go back to the original post by Libby Anne, this is a wonderful quote. My pregnancy history includes two rounds of pre-eclampsia, gestational diabetes with every pregnancy, major juggling of my normal medications (I have epilepsy and my regular medication causes birth defects), severe vitamin deficiencies even with supplements. Two of my deliveries were particularly difficult. The doctor actually apologised after one, saying they really should have done a caesarian. I would have loved more kids but I knew there was no way my body could take it. None of my children were floating in me “like an astronaut in a spaceship” but that is definately the impression that pro-life like to give.

    Should JW return to this thread, let me say I had an unplanned pregnancy which I terminated. Do I feel guilty? No. Do I feel like I killed anything? No. Do I feel anything at all? No. Never actually think about it until someone makes a stupid comment. Did you know that if you have too much orange juice it can make the birth control pill ineffective? I didn’t know that until I got pregnant.

  • James Healey

    Yes, an unborn child not only resides in the mother, he or she develops from the mother, but that doesn’t change the fact that the child is a completely unique individual. Otherwise, women possess 23 extra chromosomes (half of the child’s), a second brain, a second set of kidneys, extra genalitia, etc. if the child is part of the woman’s body. Rather, the child is his or her own body that simply resides off the mother and develops from her.

    • Malitia

      And if that unborn thing wasn’t the same species than the one “carrying” it (so in this case human) what you described would be called parasitism. Just saying.

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