“I expect the crowd in power to destroy everything…”

Over at Instapundit, Glenn Reynolds posts, amid a wall of discouraging stuff, two especially grim bits:

FOLLOW-UP ON FOOD PRICES:

I just wanted to weigh in on the food inflation issue with a local data point. I live in Southern Iowa and have a small flock of sheep (12) that I use for weed control in my vineyard. I feed grass/alfalfa hay in the winter months (roughly early November through mid-March), and typically start planning in early summer . . .People are scrambling everywhere to get hay lined up for this winter, and not just cattle operators. Craigslist is loaded with horses for sale at fire sale prices because people are having trouble lining up enough hay for this winter, at a price they can afford.

Read the whole thing. Back in the day, my parents had a freezer and would go in with a friend on buying half or a quarter of cow, depending on the finances. Stocking up sounds a good idea.

Except of course, you need electricity (or at least a generator) to see to all of that. Another Insty post from another reader:

GOING JEAN GALT? Patrick Carroll writes:

I decided to take six months off this year. I sold stock and did what I wanted for a blissful six months. I read books, drank good wine, watched my garden, got out my high-powered binocs and looked at the planets, hiked, cooked, ate well, just lived. I did so because I expect the crowd in power to destroy everything, so I thought I’d take a break before the deluge…I also bought guns (rifle, shotgun, pistol each for the wife and I), and have contracted with a local landscaping company to build a highly-defensible, nice-looking (fence/hedge combination) perimeter for my property.

Oh, and I bought water barrels. And a propane tank. And a generator.

What’s interesting is that I am hearing similarly discomfited talk around me, and seeing it in my emails. In the past few weeks I’ve heard some surprising people admit they’ve been arming themselves and purchasing ammunition — one such discussion happened all around me at the hairdresser’s while I sat and listened. The stylist and his boss, they’re storing food and arming themselves. The chiropractor who popped in to say hello while taking his afternoon stroll said he is armed, too: “never in my life thought I’d have a gun in the house, now we have two.”

They’re arming, they say, because they “see it all going bad.” These same folks who voted for Barack Obama in 2008 were now asserting an idea the far-left had floated around before that election, but instead of “Bush is going to install martial law and suspend elections.” they’re saying it of Obama. “He paid off his friends and did nothing to create jobs and he wants it all to go bad, because then he can stay in power and dictate.”

Yeah, it seems as paranoid and nuts as it did when it was said about Bush, but this stuff is not being said in an extremist corner of the internet — it’s being said in a middle-class suburban salon in an area where 30% (or more) of the businesses are now shuttered, and houses are being foreclosed upon and then re-occupied seemingly overnight, creating what the stylist called “a neighborhood full of changes and no hope. Forget about new small businesses,” he said, gesturing across the street, where a small food shop’s “opening soon” banner had become sun-faded and worn, even as the door remained locked. “That guy is never going to open.”

“I can’t get a loan,” the woman in the next chair told me. “I want to consolidate my kid’s college loans into one loan, and the credit union says they don’t give loans to consolidate student loans. I told them, I have job-security and excellent credit — what if I just want a loan for myself, a personal loan?” She was in high dudgeon and her voice grew louder in a perfect arc of Long Island umbrage-taking. “They said they’d need to know what it was for. I said, ‘it’s my personal business what the loan is for! Maybe I want to go on vacation, throw a wedding, pay off college loans, why do you have to know?’, and they said, no, they had to know what the money was for, because they’d be paying it out for me — like I’m a child who can’t be trusted with money! So, I figure, okay, it’s a credit union, I’ll try my bank. They said they don’t make personal loans anymore! It shook me up. I felt like maybe I didn’t realize how bad things are.”

There is an absolute collapse of faith in our systems and in the guy they helped put into office. These folks who were so quick to believe the press in ’08 and to believe in “hope and change” are now willfully believing the absolute worst. While I was getting my grey washed away I heard about local goings-on that I won’t write about here until I check it out for myself, because I don’t know what is real and what is paranoid fantasy or conspiracy theory. But the thing is, the anxiety is real, the doubt is real, as is the willingness to believe the absolute worst of all of our institutions — the press, the churches, the government. These folks are utterly convinced that the only thing that is going to be installed come next January is chaos and oppression. They’ll vote for Romney (“assuming there is an election and we’re allowed to vote and the vote is actually counted…”) simply because he’s not Obama, but they’re convinced that America’s best days are over.

“Soon, it’s going to be every man for himself, mark my words” said the salon owner. “I’m telling you, get a gun. Get a generator, now, because in six months you won’t be able to. Stock up.”

Honestly, what I thought was, “I need to get a new salon…” Because that was a miserable way to spend 90 minutes and my hard-earned cash.

When I met up with some friends later that weekend, one announced that her husband is talking about getting a gun, too. “I told him, over my dead body. He says he wants a rifle to go hunting! Please. This man doesn’t like to be outside, where there is dirt, now he wants to go hunting? Baloney. He thinks there is going to be some kind of revolution, and I’m saying, ‘what, you’re going to fend off revolution with a rifle you don’t know how to shoot and your barbecue grill?’ Everything is going to be fine. People need to calm down.”

So, let me ask you, readers — do you also “expect the crowd in power to destroy everything”? Are you arming yourselves, stocking up on food and buying generators? Or do you think everything is going to be fine, and we all need to take a breath?

Or are you, like me, just a tad wary but still hoping that the nation can pull itself together?

About Elizabeth Scalia
  • Nate Whilk

    ‘Although I am uneasy, I am not “preparing.” I’m not sure than anything I would do would make a difference, anyway, so I’ll just keep praying for the best. For all of us. -admin’

    I’m apprehensive, but I’m not preparing in a major way. However, even a small amount of preparing will leave you better off than none. If you aren’t prepared for a minor emergency (say, power out for a week), at least have enough water and canned food for that.

    Pray, by all means. But remember the saying (which actually goes back to ancient Greece): “God helps those who help themselves”.

  • Big Boy

    Ammunition. Lots of ammunition. If the SHTF, it will be worth more than gold.
    Try buying bread with a 1 oz. Krugerand. You can do it more easily with 2 rounds of .22 long rifle ammo.

  • Marty

    I don’t think it’ll be quite as bad as all that, depending on where you live.

    But if Obama is behind in October, watch for some subtle, and some not so subtle hints that if he loses there will be violence from his disappointed supporters, AND IT WILL BE UNDERSTANDABLE AND EVEN JUSTIFIED. In other words, giving “permission” and encouragement to riots.

    Of course, with Holder on the job, Romney will have to win by about 5% in reality, to eke out a narrow vctory, because they’ll steal at least that much and targeted in key States.

  • Sam L.

    A guy I met in California in 1980 told me then he wasn’t worried; he had guns and maps to all the Mormon houses in the area. Yes, he was kidding.

  • http://chicagoboyz.net TMLutas

    At the very least, it is responsible to stock food, water, and other needs to last from disaster striking to the stated response time of the federal government. That period is three days. There are plenty of people who don’t stock 3 days worth of water and they are just irresponsible. You can add plenty of reserves beyond that just to take advantage of periodic sales. Pay attention to sales cycles and buy during the sale sufficient to get you to the next sale. This isn’t crazy talk, just frugality.

    At a certain point most everybody decides that a certain level of preparation for disaster is enough. I respect, or at least understand those who choose to do more than I do. We are in a situation filled with uncertainty and falsehood. Our budgets are based on fraudulent numbers and every year “unexpected” revisions make them worse. We are hitting the beginning of the end game and it is only going to get tougher from here.

  • CBI

    Thank you for your nice post.

    I’m guessing that you live on the East Coast or in California (or possibly Illinois) due to your somewhat shocked comments regarding firearms. We live in the desert southwest (urban area), and, although I’ve never done a count, I’d reckon that perhaps up to 2/3 of the families we know own firearms, with the majority going shooting at least a time or two a year. Many are hunting equipment, but a goodly number are dual-use or home protection: along the lines of, “yeah, I have a water main shut-off wrench in case of a major leak, a 9-mm for home defense, a plumber’s snake if there’s a major drain blockage, . . . .”
    As for the future and disasters, everyone writing has the possibility of being right. Yes, we can trust in God that He will work things for good. He also uses people to work His will — and that can (not necessarily must) include people using the talents and skills He gave them to prepare for possible hard times.
    I for one don’t have a good read on things. I’d like to be more prepared for major problems, but don’t have that ability. More precisely, I’ve allocated my time and wealth based upon what I see as the greatest current need. My lack of preparation may end up biting me and my family, but I also realize that in 1500 years, it won’t make that much different to me or my family.
    We each should act as God moves us.

  • Willys

    “I expect the crowd in power to destroy everything…”
    * * * * *
    I wouldn’t, or don’t, expect the crowd in power to destroy anything. But then, they don’t really have to do anything. Things are already peaking, reaching or beyond their point of self maintenance. Shovel ready jobs? What bridges have been repaired, rebuilt, or replaced? What city has reworked it fresh water or sewer system? What region has bolstered its electrical grid? Who’s laughing about shovel ready jobs?

    I read a national forum every day. The forum has categories for any fairly populated city, both U.S. and some International. It also has a wide variety of other topics to include Survival, Politics, etc. I check on many of those categories daily. There’s a host of entries for Survival, getting ready for the big crash. In the Politics forum there’s all kinds of political assaults between left and right, but it would seem nobody is wrong. As for the cities, I spend time in the State forum for Texas.

    Every day there is a new post inquiring about moving to Texas. Seems most are from the northeast or L.A., but plenty from central U.S. Some are legitimate job transfers with inquiries about buying high dollar homes in Dallas or Houston. Bunches asking where are the good IT jobs. Many are inquiries in general about moving to Texas. Where is it best they ask, Dallas, Houston, Austin? Where are the jobs? The job transfers ask about big homes and acreage, commutes, schools, and shopping. The general questions are about wanting to get out of ‘where they are’ and having been thinking about or wanting to move to Texas. It’s the old Texas mystique. Any place in Texas is going to be better than the failed communities where they’re coming from. People are looking to get out. I’ll take that job transfer if I can get out from under my current mortgage. Or if I can get to Texas soon enough to rent an apartment before my mortgage goes into foreclosure.

    So you see, the crowd in power doesn’t need to do anything, as everything is at the peak of self sustaining, held together with paint. To paraphrase Glenn Reynolds… ‘Somebody should write a book about this’. Professor, meet John Steinbeck.

    Everybody says it’s happening in Texas. It’s where they go when there’s nowhere else left to go. It’s karma. Swallow some pride and head out for a fresh start. It ain’t much, but it’s self sustaining.

  • JIMV

    I bought my first rifle in 30 years this week as well as a lot of ammo. I already owned a few handguns for defense and have a CC permit in my state. I do not expect to fight a pitched battle with government. I am simply too old. What I do fear is a crash of law and order as the government crumbles around us and roaming mobs of looters looking for goodies as society crashes. People are simply not able to support the mess of a government we have built and the crash, when it comes, will be harder and longer than the government can control.

    I am a military retiree and do not believe the military will simply turn on the people when things get bad. They will do the same thing they did in 1860-1861…they will simply quietly leave the service an go home to look after their families and friends. When the government figures out they can no longer simply order some armed body to scare folk into obedience, they also will quietly stand down and leave government, heading home also to look out for their family before the public seeks them out for the damage they have done. It will be everyone for themselves over much of the country and those prepared will be the ones who largely make it through the new dark age.

    People do not trust the government. The why is simple. Government lied to us for half a century. SS was secure. Health care would be cheap and for everyone. IslamoFascists would not get the bomb. No one would go hungry and the courts would look after our ‘rights’. Now we know better. SS is broke. My ‘free medical care for life’ as promised by the military for long service, is beginning to cost more than I can afford. Health care costs a fortune and every single facets of the system is greedy beyond belief from the providers to the customers. The left spent half a century promising a free lunch and today half the nation believes it to be possible and worse, a right. People are getting hungry and cannot find work. The legal system is for the rich. The middle class has no real defense in the courts.

    No, things will get worse regardless of who wins the election. The difference is in how long the Dark Time will last. IMHO Romney might limit the hard times to years while Obama would lead to decades of hard times and worsening conditions.

  • scf

    If Obama wins the election, national bankruptcy is guaranteed, but it won’t happen until after he’s gone. That being said, there will be no revolution. Argentina goes bankrupt every dozen years. It probably does help to have a gun handy though, when there are riots and protests going on all around.

  • Pathfinder

    There is no political solution to the circumstances in which we find ourselves. I think that major upheaval in our country is a foregone conclusion. I have been through a few elections and have come to the realization that we get to choose between two evils; National Corporate Socialism(Rep), or Progressive International Communism(Dem). They are opposite sides of the same coin. We passed the point of having any ability to do anything substantial to correct our current course about 15 years ago. I believe that we are currently in the, manage the decay phase of collapse. You hear nothing of it in the MSM because the last thing that the people in power want is a resurgent citizenry that will call them on the carpet for what they have done. The only thing this election is about is who will be in power when things finally fall apart.

    That being said; I didn’t want to believe it myself. In 2007 I was at a managers training conference for the company at which I am employed. Our regional vice-president was the last speaker and he came out and said that the road ahead is going to get rocky; but not to worry that we still had money to make payroll for 2 years. Someone had some inside information; one year later things started to come apart. This past year a very dear friend of mine died. He and his wife were parents to me when my parents weren’t interested in being parents. This man lived a God centered life and his words and actions were beyond reflected such. I traveled to visit his widow and to help her in her time of need. When I arrived I found that He had been preparing for economic upheaval by stocking up on food, fuel, weapons, ammo etc, etc. This set off my alarm bell and made me take a hard look at how prepared I would be to take care of my family should the need arise.

    This brings me to the topic at hand. Things are not going to be fine! We won’t be Mad Max overnight; but we have not seen the end of hard dark days. I do think it naive to have any faith that the systems (political/social/economic) will somehow right themselves. You may think it paranoid; however, if you meditate on it for a minute you can feel the urgency in yourself right beneath the surface. You can hear it in other peoples voices. Most importantly, you can see it in their actions/reactions. I do think it is wise to make as many preparations as you can afford to make. I know for me personally as a father/husband I have a God bound duty to do what I can to ensure the safety and wellness of my family.

    All of the stuff that’s out there as to the how, when, where, and why is simply irrelevant. There are many scriptural references where God tells his servants to be prepared. The one that comes to mind first is the story of Joseph. Jesus makes many references to being prepared. I for one do not want to get caught without oil in my lamp.

  • apodoca

    These people are saying what I’ve long thought about Obama. He has no democratic instincts; his natural inclination is towards oppression; he desperately wants to hold on to power, and he will do that by any means necessary. He is the man who wanted a civilian militia composed of Obama voters. Somehow, mysteriously, nobody knows why, various departments of the government are arming themselves and stocking up on bullets. He has the military training for urban conflict against Americans. He’s done everything he can to stifle our Second Amendment rights. He’s done everything to make bullets unavailable, including the nonsensical anti-lead issue. He has no problem acting in violation of American law, and he has indeed ignored the Congress and used the executive order to replace Congress’s power to legislate.

    It is all these things, and not my very visceral dislike of Obama, which makes me believe none of the people you heard talking are paranoid. As the ancients used to say, “praemonitus praemunitus.”

  • PJ

    I live in CA, which is way ahead of the rest of the country in deterioration. My neighbor bought a .22 each for his wife and daughter, as we are releasing prisoners to save money, as you know. I took a shooting class but haven’t decided whether or not to buy one yet.

    I saw 2016 and thought it was very good, very calm and reasoned. I did think as I walked out, though: there will be blood. Yes, the crowd in power and those who will lose that power in November will get ugly.

  • Grumpy Pelican

    Well, as I sit in New Orleans watching Isaac churn this way, I’m sort of tempted to parrot the local politicians and officials with the always popular line about hoping for the best but preparing for the worst but I don’t know if that really conveys my thoughts about the future of America. I guess that when I’m feeling gloomy about things, I’m more likely to imagine a long, slow decline with life getting a little more coarse every year, expectations and standards forever being lowered a little bit at a time and constant bickering and fighting over how to slice a shrinking pie. I’m not as prone to seeing catastrophic change in a very short period unless the issue is some sort of natural disaster which is not really in our hands. When I’m feeling more optimistic, I can see that the world goes through cycles and that perhaps better times are within our grasp but I do think that a sense of worry, maybe even despair, is pretty pervasive around the country right now. We do seem pretty divided about so many things.

  • Quiet Guy

    We are armed and stockpiled. I am a military veteran, and we decided about a year ago to tool up and put away emergency supplies. We are primarily concerned about civil unrest, but we are also worried about what Obama will do if he loses.

    God forbid – I hope I feel like an idiot for wasting all that time and effort in six months.

  • Tom F

    I am a little alarmed by what I am hearing here. I am not a regular reader, in fact I stumbled across this blog through another site. I would describe myself as a liberal democrat and definitely an Obama supporter. One, I don’t believe Obama is the evil, antidemocratic person you make him out to be. You may not like what he has done but he has done nothing that is out of line with what other presidents have done. But I don’t think any of you can see reason on that one so I will go to point two. He would have to have the active backing of US military, given what I know of people in the military — he wouldn’t find much support and any such coup would collapse almost instantly. And this brings me to the third point, liberals are your neighbors. We do live among you. Do you think we have such little regard for our country and it’s constitution that we would continue to follow such a leader involved in naked power grab like the one you guys have been describing? Any political support for Obama would collapse as well. I don’t want to live under a dictatorship, right or left. So lighten up guys it is just an election and no matter what happens we will survive. The sun will shine no matter who wins and the country will go muddle through four years of whoever becomes president. And just for the record, my far lefty friends believed the same thing were going to happen in Mr. Bush’s last year and, after the financial collapse (which I think I need to remind you of — did happen under Mr. Bush’s administration), a lot of people on the left thought Bush would suspend elections. But he didn’t. And I think that is because most people in this country, left and right, and especially it’s political leaders (Bush and Obama), respect it’s institutions and want to see us continue being a constitutional democracy. Stop scaring yourself and let us fight this election and get back to being neighbors (who never should discuss politics).

  • kenneth

    On what basis does anyone think running out and buying a gun, or additional guns, is going to carry them through a “societal collapse”? Who is it you fancy you’re going to shoot who is “coming for you”? Unless you’re a very serious survivalist with the space and months and years of preparation under your belt, what are you going to have worth looting? A extra couple weeks or perhaps a month or two of canned food and rice? If the normal distribution chains have failed, what are you going to do then? Turn bandit or looter yourself? Do you have the acreage and tools and know-how to raise, prepare and preserve meaningful amounts of food? Do you have the hundreds of gallons of fuel it will require to run that portable generator in perpetuity? What about heating? Water? Medical supplies?

    Given that criminals will also be armed, do you have any training or experience in combat shooting? Most people I’ve known who ran out and bought a gun after Obama’s last election “trained” by putting one box of ammo through a piece of paper at an indoor range, if even that. Finally, does anyone seriously believe their Bubba-customized Chinese semi-automatic rifle is going to fend off the military if Democrats give in to their apparently inborn urge to round up the masses for gulag? Unless you happen to own very high-grade anti-aircraft and anti-tank weapons, you won’t even rate as a minor inconvenience to any real military force.

  • Gregory Koster

    Dear Ms. Scalia: “There is a lot of ruin in a nation,” said Adam Smith. That is just as true today as then.

    Next, why should we pay attention to the mob of dolts who voted for The Won in 2008? What evidence do they provide that there panicky judgment today is any better than their euphoric judgment of 2008? Vote for Mitt and get on with your business. If you feel the need to atone, write on the blackboard 200 times: “I was a fool to vote for The Won. I was even stupider to believe the liars in the press who pushed him on us.”

    Stockpiling survival items? Could be sensible, just as buying a bicycle for exercise is sensible. We seeing hundreds of thousands of bicycles sitting idle in garages. Care to hazard a guess how much of the food being stockpiled now will be spoiled a year from now?

    I’ll take this forlorn mob seriously when I see their names on Mitt’s list of donors. I’ll take them seriously when I see them canvassing their neighborhoods. I’ll take them seriously when they cancel their sub to NEWSWEEK. Etc.

    Until then, laugh loudly and enjoy the show. There’s a lot of work ahead for all of us, and we can use the amusement.

    Sincerely yours,
    Gregory Koster

  • Jack Reacher

    Not that bad. But it’ll do you little good to do all this stocking up…those with the bigger guns and mass of people will just come and take all that you stocked up on. If it was really that bad.

    And those 22s, are just going to make someone mad, that’s all.

  • JeremyR

    Well, bear in mind the thing with the hay is that there was a drought over much of the middle of the country, which means instead of two hay cuttings there was only one (and not much of one)

    Usually my land puts out about 300-350 big bales of hay, this year only 130. No rain, no hay.

  • lostingotham

    I’ve got a 4-year-old son who has type-1 diabetes. If it all comes crashing down, he’s facing a pretty unpleasant death, so putting in a garden and stocking up on canned foods ain’t an alternative foe me. Realistically, it’s not much of one for anybody. Road Warrior is a silly adolescent fantasy. Should the proverbial fecal matter actually hit the fan, “The Road” will be much closer to reality. I’ll devote my efforts to keeping things bumping along rather than worrying about what to do if it doesn’t.

  • tom swift

    No, We The People won’t be fighting the US military. Riots, however, are a possibility. Which is why I’ve done my part as a US consumer and bought a goodly stash of 12 gauge 00 buck at Walmart.

    The most likely scenario in which potential firepower might be appropriate is temporary volunteer neighborhood watches to cover hiccoughs when town or city services experience intermittent failures. The American propensity for spontaneous order will fill in the gaps when the things touted by Mr You-Didn’t-Build-That turn out to be less robust than advertised, but we do have to have some basic tools available. Hence the purchase of ammo.

  • RedHat

    My wife and I (we’re 60) purchased our first firearm six years or so ago when we moved to a ten acre homestead out in the middle of nowhere, and got some chickens and livestock and discovered that the food chain doesn’t just automatically sort itself out in our favor. Then we discovered that we were not only able to defend our chickens, but we could defend ourselves, and that this is a Very Good Thing.

    Kenneth: you’re right that simply purchasing a firearm is not enough. I’m a volunteer instructor with the Appleseed Project (a two day rifle marksmanship clinic) and I spend one weekend a month helping people move from gun buyer to being able to safely and effectively use it.

    In his autobiography, GK Chesterton relates how he stopped to purchase a revolver and some cartridges on the way to his wedding, in case there were pirates along the way on the honeymoon. Being able to have the capacity to effectively defend ourselves and our families with personal firearms is one of the more extraordinary features of being privileged to live in America.

    There were no small number of people in Louisiana after Katrina that wished they had realized this earlier (we live next door in Texas; this is “first hand understanding”).

  • Gal

    It seems to me that these people are making it happen, they enable the very thing they blame Obama for doing.
    I’m from Israel, a country that started socialist-communist, then turned capitalist in the ’80. Things are harder here, but managed. So giving up is self-destructive at best, since only by working hard at it, the USA can return to glory.

  • Fiestamom

    The same thing happened to me in the salon a couple of weeks ago. The guy washing out my hair and I struck up a conversation about the show Doomsday Preppers. We weren’t making fun of the show, we were talking about the preparations that needed to be made. I couldn’t believe I was having the conversation, I mean, he’s a man! who works in a rather high end beauty salon. But he was as serious as a heart attack. So am I.

    I just bought a pressure canner, I too, saw that article on Instapundit yesterday,and thought to myself ‘guess, I’ll be canning a lot of beef this weekend”. Was at a family reunion this summer, and this was a main topic of conversation. People are truly scared of our government (shouldn’t it be the other way around?). No one that I talk to trusts Obama, and the phrase I keep hearing is “because he doesn’t love (or ‘get’) America/Americans” or that Obama actively dislikes us.

  • Weisshaupt

    Folks , a major disruption is coming; Its called Math. I just made you America’s dictator. Now get out the calculator and figure out how you will make everything work. Can’t? Yeah, neither can the people in charge. It doesn’t matter who President Scapegoat will be. You are looking at 3rd world standards of living. Most rational people are not looking at this as “The End of the World” – Mad Max style, but the “End of the World as we Know it”- Big Nanny Govt isn’t going to be able to pay its bills. No more free stuff. Limited Public services. A lot of desperate and scared people. That means a gun to protect yourself from violent crime if nothing else- and yes Kenneth, when things get bad enough, your can of beans makes you a target and worth looting. Read about Argentina. Read about other currency crises through history.

    Half the population is willing to support laws that violate an individual’s right of conscience, right of association, right to property – basically willing to enslave them to support thier own causes and create benefits for themselves. Combine this with the congress’ willingness to pass bills without reading them, and the Supreme Courts willingness to break the separation of powers to legislate and rewrite the law for congress as a tax, as well as Obama’s willingness to just ignore laws he doesn’t like,and its pretty obvious we have lost our right to government by the consent of the governed as well. By ignoring the meaning of the Constitution as passed and understood by the people, the Federal Government has proven itself to be wholly illegitimate. A Civil War is not out of the question- especially as those who think that they are entitled to the labor of others via government force are confronted with the reality that they are not so entitled. I am certainly not going to obey Obamacare in any capacity, and if that ends with Suicide by cop, so be it. It will be at least one less cop going to the next guy’s house. Liberals don’t like people being armed, because no bully likes a victim who might decide to retaliate. You reap what you sow. Harvest time is coming.

  • Mark in Texas

    Living on Long Island there is the possibility of hurricanes such as the one that hit in 1938. You should keep enough food to get through the disruption that would follow such an event in order to not be a burden on the responders who will have their hands full trying to deal with those who did not prepare ahead of time. I would recommend a case of bottled water, a case of tuna fish, a case of chili and a case of stew. Since those are regular staples, you can use them as part of regular life cooking and just make sure that you keep a large enough inventory. That way they don’t get old and expired as you use them. If you need clean water, you can get some from the faucet at the bottom of your water heater. These sorts of preparations don’t take much time, money or space but can help you get through a few weeks of disruption. If you are going to share with those in need, it helps to have something to share.

    It is probably a good idea to learn first aid and to keep a first aid kit on hand. That can be useful or even save lives whether or not the worst case scenarios ever happen.

    There are all sorts of ways that things can go wrong and it is reasonable to make provisions for dealing with the most likely of those possibilities just like we keep a spare tire in our car and a fire extinguisher in our kitchen.

  • Weisshaupt

    @Tom F “Stop scaring yourself and let us fight this election and get back to being neighbors (who never should discuss politics).”

    Translation: Lets live and let live, and you don’t get to mention that I vote for people who will violate your rights and bully you into living my way. Can’t you just submit to my tyranny and all just get along?

    Tom F, if you didn’t want a civil war, you shouldn’t have voted to start one and left your neighbors alone to live their own lives without your self-righteous meddling.

  • spinoneone

    Well, if you were wondering how 0 might get the authority to run the Government by himself, it seems he already has. Don’t believe me? Look at these gems, from the White House web site. You can look up each and every one of them if you don’t believe me.

    * Executive Order 10990 allows the Government to take over all modes of transportation and control of highways and seaports.

    * Executive Order 10995 allows the government to seize and control the communication media.

    * Executive Order 10997 allows the government to take over all electrical power, gas, petroleum, fuels, and minerals.

    * Executive Order 11000 allows the government to mobilize civilians into work brigades under government supervision.

    * Executive Order 11001 allows the government to take over all health education and welfare functions.

    * Executive Order 11002 designates the Postmaster General to operate a national registration of all persons.

    * Executive Order 11003 allows the government to take over all airports and aircraft, including commercial aircraft.

    * Executive Order 11004 allows the Housing and Finance Authority to relocate and establish new locations for populations.

    * Executive Order 11005 allows the government to take over railroads, inland waterways, and public storage facilities.

    * Executive Order 11049 assigns emergency preparedness function to federal departments and agencies, consolidating 21 operative Executive Orders issues over a fifteen-year period.

    * Executive Order 11051 specifies the responsibility of the Office of Emergency Planning and gives authorization to put all Executive Orders into effect in times of increased international tensions and economic or financial crisis.

    * Executive Order 11310 grants authority to the Department of Justice to enforce the plans set out in Executive Orders, to institute Industrial support, to establish judicial and legislative liaison, to control all aliens, to operate penal and correctional institutions, and to advise and assist the President.

    * Executive Order 11921 allows the Federal Emergency Preparedness Agency to develop plans to establish control over the mechanisms of production and distribution of energy sources, wages, salaries, credit, and the flow of money in U.S. financial institutions in any undefined national emergency. It also provides that when the president declares a state of emergency, Congress cannot review the action for six months.

    It is more than clear that Obama is planning for the total control and takeover of America via Martial Law. Food, energy, transportation, work, banking, and health… he has it covered.

  • http://chilesfiles.wordpress.com PatC

    I find myself alternating between the one extreme and what I hope is reality. There is a widespread loss of trust in our institutions, which really is the first step towards collapse – that is, foreseeing exactly how it could all go down.
    What differentiates the worst-case fantasies of Obama from Bush is that Obama has consistently sided with third-world strongmen over our democratic allies. He has expressed a desire for the ability to circumvent Congress, and has in fact done so. He has taken increasingly unconstitutional actions safe in the knowledge that impeachment would never happen – even if the House found the courage to do it, Harry Reid would never let it past the Senate.
    Not to mention his Atty Gen giving the Black Panthers a pass over clearly intimidating white voters and arming Mexican drug cartels.
    There is a difference between the left’s fantasies over what Bush *might* have done vs. what Obama has *already* done.

  • Mark in Texas

    TomF

    I am going to respond to you in the assumption that you are writing in good faith and that you genuinely do not understand why people are reacting to conditions in general and Obama in particular the way we are. I’ll address your three points:

    One: We’ll just have to agree to disagree on the character, competence and goals of Barack Obama.

    Two: The present day military might not support a coup but I believe it is reasonable to think that another term might give Obama enough time to change the nature of the US armed forces. The change of policy with respect to homosexuals might be the “long overdue granting of basic human rights and respect that should never have been denied in the first place” as I am sure you believe. Or it might be part of a plan to reshape the makeup of the military by driving out the predominantly small town southern men who make up such a large fraction of the military today and replace them with a minority that is alienated from much of American society and would not particularly mind shooting “breeders” if they were ordered to do so.

    Three: ” Do you think we have such little regard for our country and it’s constitution that we would continue to follow such a leader involved in naked power grab like the one you guys have been describing?”

    Yes. That describes it pretty well. That is exactly how I think of leftists. In an article that was published on September 11, 2001 Bill Ayers, adviser to Barack Obama and possibly ghost writer of “Dreams From My Father” there is a photograph of Ayers trampling on an American flag. I don’t think that is edgy. I think that is a perfect expression of the contempt that Bill Ayers, Jeremiah Wright and Barack Obama have for our country and its constitution. I believe that contempt is shared by the leadership of the Democratic Party and many, if not most, Democrats.

  • LisaB

    “constitutional democracy”

    We live in a Constitutional Republic, but I know you all are trying hard to change that, too.

  • BABY Glock

    Total breakdown? Not at all! Readjustment? Absolutely. Having food, water, first aid, etc is just good preparedness. Flood, drought,earthquake, etc. Can hit any time. .

  • Thomas Hazlewood

    Tom F- “I am a little alarmed by what I am hearing here.” I see. Apparently, though, you are NOT alarmed by a Presidet who uses the IRS to hound his political foes and religious organizations. You are NOT alarmed when the President brags that he personally chooses the targets to be assassinated by drones. You are NOT alarmed by a President that seeks to force Catholic organizations to perform abortions. You are NOT alarmed that the Attorney General approved selling weapons to Mexican cartels to further his anti-gun views.
    You are NOT alarmed that those heading Homeland Security consider American soldiers to be a terrorist threat. You are NOT alarmed when New Black Panthers threaten voters and then walk free. You are NOT alarmed when this government inflates our costs for everything by willfully printing money for political purpose.

    Want to see Obama’s hand at work? See who has set up layers of ‘protection’ around the GOP Convention to frustrate attendance. It’s ok, though, beause they’re doing that for…well, you tell me why. Semingly, you can’t understand why people are fearful of the President and government that people like YOU gave us…presumably, beause you were to blind to see what was plain to so many others. Obama is a disaster for this country and peope are, rightfully, preparng for what could be coming. Obama’s given reason to wonder if he’s really that incompetent or is it exactly according to plan?

  • Kerani

    Put me down for “don’t believe the US will dissolve into chaos and/or a dictatorship.” I didn’t buy it when my left leaning friends were hyperventilating about then-President Bush (pick any year of his eight year term) and I don’t buy it now (even though the economy is much worse now, and I am distressed at how long it has been failing to get better.) We the people hold the country together, not the man at the top (no matter who he is) and so long as we the people are committed to upholding the law, and putting the good of the community ahead of ourselves, we will be fine. (Tested, but ultimately triumphant.) Having said that, I also agree with the poster above who urges everyone to have a 3 day supply in order to survive until help comes – and I’ll say make it a seven day supply, so you can help your neighbors, as a responsible adult Christian should. Firearms – the decision to buy – and use – firearms (or any sort of weapon) should be undertaken with a lot of prayer. The potential is there to do a lot of good and protect people who are being threatened…but that is not the only potential.

  • George B

    I live in a suburb of Dallas and around here there is a sense that something bad is going to happen, but there is great uncertainty about what will fail first. The majority of the population around here believes that the current policies of President Obama must not continue or the country will go past some tipping point of no return. A significant minority believes that country will collapse if Romney wins. Either way, millions of people will be disappointed in November.

    Preparation for disaster is just a normal part of life in flyover country. Guaranteed that electrical power will go out or roads will be impassible due to weather at some time. Sensible people have canned goods in the pantry and at least half a tank of gasoline in the car. Owning tools and being competent at DIY repairs around the home and garage both helps disaster resilience and saves money.

    Thoughts of what happens in a disaster get included in my life decisions. Thoughts like a 4 cylinder Toyota Camry would make a great bug out vehicle because it has lots of room to haul people or stuff, it’s reliable, it’s fuel efficient, and it doesn’t attract attention. A BMW 328, in contrast, is less reliable, requires parts not readily available out in the country, and generally attracts more attention from criminals.

    I think most Texans have a very clear idea of what guns are used for. In good times government is barely competent. In a crisis they will flail around even more and eventually potential criminals lose fear of law enforcement. Armed citizens banding together in their neighborhood can repel outsiders and prevent crime within the neighborhood. Think neighborhood watch with deadly force capability, not armed overthrow of the government. From the start of the Texas Revolution at the Battle of Gonzales to using guns like the Colt revolver to repel Indians, armed citizens created Texas out of the leftover land distant governments didn’t want that bad.

  • Brett Bellmore

    I’ve had guns since I was in my late teens, grew up in that sort of family. Living in rural Michigan I got used to being stocked up on food and such, too, just in case I’d be snowed in for a week. So I don’t really need to go out and buy anything, and thank goodness, ’cause guns and ammo are getting expensive what with all the panic buying.

    Revolution/dictatorship is the sort of thing you’re crazy to predict until the day when suddenly they happen. They don’t give you a lot of warning. But there are signs it’s not totally crazy. This President doesn’t have a lot of patience for the idea that he has to enforce the laws Congress actually passed, not the ones he wanted them to pass. The Dream act is being implemented right now, without ever being voted on in Congress. He is, already, in a small way a dictator. Testing the waters, maybe.

    I think we’ll get through this election, but I’m not sure how much longer. Nothing lasts forever, and our constitutional system seems to be in the end game.

  • Chuck Pelto

    TO: Elizabeth Scalia, et al.
    RE: Heh

    ….do you also “expect the crowd in power to destroy everything”? — Elizabeth Scalia

    I don’t necessarily. But I do expect things to go to hell in the proverbial handbasket in the not-too-distant future.

    Something to do with parallels in history.

    Ever read Flavius Josephus’ account of the destruction of Israel in their war with Rome 70-73 AD? You should.

    So 40 years after the murder of the most innocent Man to walk the Earth, Israel is utterly destroyed.

    Next year marks the 40th anniversary of Roe v. Wade wherein US began the mass murder of the most innocent amongst US. Over 50 million murdered so far.

    Back to parallels. Josephus reports that the Jews were more interested in killing each other than they were in dealing with the invading Roman army. I see similar internicene feelings developing here.

    Whether or not Obama takes advantage of the situation to attempt to make himself absolute ruler remains to be seen. If he does, there WILL BE BLOOD.

    Are you arming yourselves, stocking up on food and buying generators? — Elizabeth Scalia

    Being a retired Airborne-Ranger infantryman with a strong secondary in logistics? Well….

    ….Is the Pope a Roman Catholic? And a Kraut?

    But I’ve been prepared for trouble ever since I learned that Chernobyl translates from its native Ukrainian to English as….wait for it….”Wormwood”. [NOTE: Please check Rev 8:10-11 and (1) notice the use of the proper noun and (2) think about how a man of the First Century would describe a vision of a runaway nuclear reactor to his contemporaries.]

    Or do you think everything is going to be fine, and we all need to take a breath? — Elizabeth Scalia

    If someone thinks everything is going to be fine, they aren’t paying attention. Or maybe they’re so young and under-educated not to appreciate what’s happening around them. After all, the vaunted American public education system stopped teaching History and Civics over 30 years ago.

    Regards,

    Chuck(le)
    [Chance favors the prepared mind. -- Louis Pastuer, Father of Modern Microbiology]

    P.S. He probably said it when he was going to China to track down and isolate the bacterium that caused the Black Death….as there was an outbreak going on there at the time…..

  • J

    I live in MA. Right after obama’s election I happened to be in Bass Pro Shop and wandered over the the gun area. It was VERY busy. I asked the clerk if sale of guns and ammo had picked up and he said that recently, starting with the 2008 election date, their sales had increased hugely!
    Recently I went back to that same locale. They were passing out tickets, like at the deli?, and you had to wait in line for help.
    MA armed but still, probably, voting for a dem. It is interesting that the state that helped launch the Revolution, now does everything in its power to destroy the country born from that bloody fight.

  • ErikZ

    I don’t think it matters what you believe.

    You are either mentally and physically prepared for a problem when it appears, or you’re not.

    When I get worried I start to read up on accounts/articles/books by people who have lived through economic disasters and nation upheavals.

    Oddly enough, my prep involved getting an electric power assist bike. If gas gets too expensive, this is all the range and carrying ability I really need.

  • Matt

    The left doesn’t realize the extent to which they have been and continue to be brainwashed by the media they watch/read thus they leap to link this to Bush paranoia which was…created primarily by their media. I had the same prepper conversation with my chiropractor – out of the blue. This is real and whether it’s Obama’s thugs or an EMP, it’s best to be prepared.

  • iGout

    Do you think it went like this on the Titanic too, among the passengers, I mean? Who was first to put it together? “Holy Cow! We’re going to sink!” In our lingo, he was open to the paradigm shift and probably got heavily scoffed for it. Most probably had a queasy feeling something wasn’t right but at that stage denial was easier than working through the implications. Nonetheless, the funny fun-house slope of the deck and the mounting disquiet of others probably forced that train of thought upon everybody, although not all at once. We’re probably at this stage.

    I’m not too concerned about Obama declaring himself Dear Leader for Life; if he tried it, his would be a short one. I’m more worried about our having a national stroke. You have to admit our arteries, the energy supply, food, the financial system, the economy, the social institutions, are in pretty bad shape.

    Turning your home into your castle keep is at least a step, but thinking beyond that about making your street, your town a hard nut to crack is better; which brings us back to the part about “well-regulated Militia”. That should please the gun control crowd, if there are any left.

  • Mike M.

    At 49, I remember this all happened before – in the mid and late ’70s. If you had told anyone on 1 January 1980 that a decade later, the economy would be roaring, inflation would be curbed, and the Soviet Union a bad memory – well, you would have been considered a hopeless optimist. Or insane.

    Yet that is precisely what happened.

    Prepare, but don’t despair.

  • WPZ

    I have a business, along with my female partner, instructing in firearms. When we started, we thought we’d have some women’s intro to handguns classes, one or two a month, and do some competition stuff (my partner’s a sponsored action pistol competitor).
    Nothing of the sort. Now, we’re seeing women by the scores in our intro classes and the message they give us during the part of the class when we ask their experience and motivation is: I want a gun to protect myself. More than two-thirds of them say it, every class.
    But related to what the commenter noted above, we’re in the Chicagoland area. These are Chicagoans saying this. Chicago has long been one of the hotbeds of anti-gun activism (see: Joyce Foundation, one of the major funders of anti-gun organizations, formerly headed by Barack Obama), yet they’re lining up to buy guns.
    I’ve been involved in shooting nearly all my life. Even ten years ago, I could not have even imagined such a thing, certainly not around here. Good heavens.

  • Andy

    I am not stockpiling yet, though we did enlarge our garden considerably. The issue is not Obama alone – it takes a government of all working together to keep a country on an even keel. The blame resides with all of us – when we put partisan beliefs in front of what is good, when we look at the other person as being not worthy we create the conditions that are described. It is a time for all of us to ask for the guidance of the Holy Spirit and not look to worldly “princes” of any stripe to lead us. If we continue to look for the worldly leader we invite the wrath that appears to be heading our way.

  • Anne B.

    MarkF in Texas wrote (responding to Tom):

    Three: ” Do you think we have such little regard for our country and it’s constitution that we would continue to follow such a leader involved in naked power grab like the one you guys have been describing?”

    “Yes. That describes it pretty well. That is exactly how I think of leftists. In an article that was published on September 11, 2001 Bill Ayers, adviser to Barack Obama and possibly ghost writer of “Dreams From My Father” there is a photograph of Ayers trampling on an American flag. I don’t think that is edgy. I think that is a perfect expression of the contempt that Bill Ayers, Jeremiah Wright and Barack Obama have for our country and its constitution. I believe that contempt is shared by the leadership of the Democratic Party and many, if not most, Democrats.”

    YES. This is it exactly. The rabid left hates us, and makes no secret of it. Should we pretend that they don’t really mean it?

    If Obama loses this election I fully expect riots and mayhem among his disappointed supporters.

    Yes, we have guns (two shotguns) and ammo. We have been canning/preserving food here for years anyway; now I’m just going to have to increase the volume. I have a pressure canner, so I’m going to try canning meat – something to have handy on the shelves, in case the power goes out. And I’m looking into the best was to store tap water long-term. I’ve read that 1 teaspoon bleach to 5 gallons of water keeps it drinkable for a long time – anyone have an opinion on that?

  • M

    When I was a Freshman at Indiana University, in 1972, I attended a Student Communist Party meeting. We were told that the Communist goal was to destroy Americans faith in their traditional institutions: Police, Army, Government, Clergy, Industry, Banking etc and create chaos. Then, as Society collapsed, offer a “New Hope” of stability by installing Socialist/Communist institutions as a savior of the People. These people have been working for 40 yrs. Sound like they are succeeding in their plans? You bet your ass they are. Fools that vote Democrat/Socialist/Communist are incapable of understanding what they have brought upon us but they will suffer the same as the Conservatives. The irony?; they now rely upon the Constitution they have destroyed for their protection. Hey New Yorkers, what do you think of the Midwestern and Southern “rightwing nuts” now? Personally, I would deny guns sales to anyone not now currently a gun owner. The Liberal weenies are not to be trusted around guns.

  • Ron Mitchell

    We live in Houston and for us the national standard of keeping three days of disaster supplies is way low. If you are in any potential disaster zone, you need at least two weeks. After Hurricane Ike in 2008 our neighbors didn’t have electricity for 21 days, and after Hurricane Alicia in 1983 we went 10 days without electricity.

    After Alicia my Latino neighbors across the street ran a single extension cable across the street, then we ran cords from house to house on our side. For 10 days my pregnant wife and I had a single fan and one lamp. After Ike, we had a generator and supplied ourselves and the neighbors enough power to run a refrigerator, fan and lights. The neighbors supplied the wine. Since I had a chain saw and knew how to use it, I cut the debris blocking our driveways and doors , and the neighbors did the step and fetching. This being Texas, we were all well-armed.

    I believe the key to successfully surviving a disaster, whether political or natural, is not to try and stand alone, but to stand with your family, friends, and neighbors.

  • DWPittelli

    It can’t hurt to have a week or more of canned food and water, plus some guns, if for nothing else in case a hurricane or earthquake cuts off supplies and/or leads to looting. And enough cordwood or propane to get through a winter (at a low but nonfreezing thermostat) isn’t a bad idea either. All of these things would also be helpful in the unlikely event that society collapses more generally. But while a generator is convenient during a power outage, there’s little point in buying one for a societal-collapse scenario. You don’t need air conditioning, you don’t need electricity for heat, and you’d be safer stocking dry or canned food than trying to keep more than 3 days worth of food in the freezer. And what difference would it make if you had electricity for maybe a week?

  • http://www.skinnydaveproject.com Dave LeBlanc

    Reagan’s shining city on the hill is beginning to remind me more of defensible strong hold, particularly if the shiny part is given a coat of camo paint.

  • Chuck Pelto

    TO: All
    RE: Going to Hell In a Handbasket

    The current crowd could be out to destroy everything. Indeed, there’s plenty of ‘key indicators’ that support that ‘Most Likely Intention’ as one might say. But there are numerous scenarios of how things could fall apart. Most of which are not mutually exclusive.

    • Cometary Impact….Think Lucifer’s Hammer and understand there have been global ‘wintes’ lasting for years on five different occasions. The last was c. 450 AD, and caused the final collapse of the decrepit Roman Empire and the onset of the Dark Ages.
    • Another Black Death…albeit next could be viral instead of bacterial. Think Bird/Swine Flu.
    • Iran develops a nuke and pops it 250 miles above Omaha, Nebraska. Read One Second After….available at Amazon.
    • Solar Flare that knocks out the electrical grid for several months.
    • Massive Civil Unrest.

    That’s just the short list of real catastrophes.

    And any such single event could allow ‘the current crowd’ to try to seize power.

    Regards,

    Chuck(le)
    P.S. In the last part of my professional military career, I used to develop scenarios to drive exercises of State Area Commands (STARCs)—State Adjutants General and their staffs—preparing them for national emergencies, i.e., Gulf Wars, and natural disastes, i.e., Katrinas.

    Indeed, in the Spring of 1990, we were working up an exercise based on the possible invasion of Kuwait by Iraq. In early August, that scenario came to be reality and the state we were intending the exercise for did it as a ‘live fire’ exercise, that Fall/Winder…..


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