UPDATE — Charlotte Catholic High School’s Parent Meeting…

… Last night, according to the Charlotte Observer, nearly 1,000 people showed up at Charlotte Catholic High School’s parent meeting to “air complaints” regarding the talk given by Sr. Jane Dominic Laurel.

The event was closed to the media and supposed to be for currently enrolled students and their parents only.

Though the Observer and local TV stations were told to leave the campus during the meeting, a reporter from the Catholic News Herald, the diocese’s newspaper, was allowed in the meeting to cover it.

Before being ordered off the high school property, some Charlotte Catholic High School alumni and parents of former students passed out wristbands critical of the nun’s remarks on gays and lesbians. The wristbands read “We are all God’s children.”

One such alumni parent who attempted to attend the event was Diane Troy, who incidentally is the president of PFLAG Charlotte, pictured below.

Interesting.

QNotes (the LGBT arts, entertainment and news publication based here in Charlotte) used the above photo to lead their republishing of the Observer’s story.

The Observer also notes that,

Though the gathering was closed to the media, texts and tweets from parents inside the school gym cast the meeting as often heated, with emotions running high on both sides.

One parent live tweeted from the meeting. You can follow the link here to read her feed.

The Catholic News Herald stated, in their most recent update on the events,

Some parents tried coming to Father Kauth’s defense but were shouted down by other people.

One parent told Father Kauth, “You have divided parents, you have divided students, and we’ve lost respect for you.”

If they had any respect for him to begin with. It certainly doesn’t sound like.

What it does sound like is that this petition may have been heavily influenced by agenda driven parents using their children’s hurt feelings as an excuse to go all lynch mob-y on a priest and gin up manufactured outrage.

RELATED: Will Catholic Parents End Catholic Education. Susan Brinkmann, OCDS, of Women of Grace nails it — I blame the parents.

About Katrina Fernandez

Mackerel Snapping Papist

  • margaret1910

    Wow! I am…speechless. I read Susan’s blog as well. I really don’t see what can be done.

    • LeticiaVelasquez

      Ask the parents who are outraged to leave and remove their children. Then teach more truth, you will see students come out of the woodwork, the very ones whose parents were afraid of political correctness at Catholic schools and homeschool. Like me.

      • margaret1910

        That is an excellent idea.

      • Awkpearl

        Watch out! If you mention that you homeschool, Katrina might call you a hippy and kick you off her lawn…. :-D

  • oregon nurse

    Why did you ignore this statement from the Catholic News Herald which goes right to the heart of what the dissent was based on?

    In his statement, Father Arnsparger explained that Sister Jane “has been
    invited to give this presentation very many times throughout the
    country in many dioceses and with great interest and success. Many said
    that the first part of her presentation at Charlotte Catholic High
    School was excellent and fully in line with the Catholic faith. There
    was unfortunately a misunderstanding about the content of the last part
    of the presentation. In that part, I understand that Sister used data
    from the Linacre Quarterly, a reputable journal, and from other sources.
    That data can be debated and, in fact, is debated back and forth by
    scholars who are researching the areas of human sexuality. Because of
    the ongoing debate, it would have been better if these studies and data
    were omitted from the presentation to the students.”

    This is exactly what was stated by parents and students. Controversial studies were cited where there is room for wide disagreement and which are not necessarily supported by the Church. It was inappropriate for Sr Jane, in her role as theologian and expert, to present this material to a captive audience of teens, unable to dialog with her. Maybe she forgot who she was speaking to and thought she was back in a college classroom where these kinds of studies can be appropriately presented and discussed.

    Oh, and this too. You were very clear that you had great respect for Fr Kauth so why did you leave out his Quote?

    He (Fr Kauth) defended Sister Jane’s presentation on same-sex attraction as it related to Church teaching, but he distanced himself from the social science data she quoted as being appropriate for the forum of the student assembly.

    “I was stunned as anyone,” he said, when asked why he didn’t stop her talk. “I didn’t know she had inserted this other piece. That piece (on homosexuality) is something that I wouldn’t have presented” in that forum. He said later that he takes responsibility for not making that clear.

    Perhaps a humble apology for your rush to judgment of parents and students is in order?

    • Mike

      Knowing very little about this is suspect you’re right: better to leave out academic research that is just that research especially at this age. For ex. imagine if she had said research is showing that an antibody in the womb causes this phenomenon but with genetic engineering society may one day be able to cure it. Can you imagine the hysteria but this is a standard secular possibility.

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/thecrescat Katrina Fernandez

      And the rational reaction is to go all lynch mob-y, start petitions, ruin reputations, divide a school, shout down other parents, froth at the mouth, contact the media, start social media campaigns and lose your mind?

      And again, what she said can be debated either way.

    • http://outsidetheautisticasylum.blogspot.com/ Theodore Seeber

      And when I met with my Pastoral Council last night, fears of a similar backlash turned out to be what was driving the push against this:
      http://outsidetheautisticasylum.blogspot.com/2014/04/jesus-christ-in-womb.html

      It won’t be in our bulletin this year, but I’ve stared what will be 9 months of prayer and study about it to produce something different.

      • oregon nurse

        Ted, I cannot even fathom what anyone could find objectionable about that series of medical facts. Were any specifics given? Queasy stomachs perhaps?

        However, that is totally different from this situation where studies which may or may not be proven to be conclusively true (scientifically true) were apparently presented as scientifc facts and binding upon Catholics to believe them. Even the diocesan representative and the priest who lined up the talk were dismayed at what was presented. That ought to tell all those who are up in arms over the response that where there is smoke there is usually fire and it’s best to hold back and wait for the facts before throwing gas on it.

        It’s not enough that Sr believes her studies to be true. She was there as a Catholic theologian and last I checked the Church doesn’t hold that its theology is open to being added to, or subtracted from by personal opinion.

        • http://outsidetheautisticasylum.blogspot.com/ Theodore Seeber

          Mostly mentioned were three issues:
          1. Precocious five year olds reading the bulletin (I didn’t even know that was a problem!).
          2. “Creating an apocryphal gospel” adding to scripture and tradition with science (isn’t science a source of revelation? I told the priest that later when I wasn’t so under the gun, I’d be having a talk with him about Fides Et Ratio).
          3. Removing the “mystery” surrounding Christ’s gestation in the womb.

          Based on this, I’ve started my own private devotion of rewriting it. I’m calling mine _The Word Made Flesh_ and I’m using a lot more spiritual/scriptural references from both the Old and New Testament, along with separating the science entirely from Christ by positing a fictional little girl conceived March 25, 2015 who will share the birthday of Our Lord. I’m planning on doing it as a weekly devotion and having it done by Christmas, and yes, I plan to release it to the world online with a Creative Commons License in plenty of time for others to use it in 2015. Episode 2 will be done sometime tomorrow, Episode 1 you can find on my council blog, I just edited the original post.

          • oregon nurse

            Excellent Ted. I will pray that the Holy Spirit will inspire you. God is helping you make lemonade from lemons!

      • http://rosarynovice.stblogs.com/ Augustine

        Why be a sign of contradiction against the world when it’s much easier to be a sign of conformism? If Christians in the Roman Empire were so spineless as we are now, there’d be no Christians today.

        It’s the generations-old plague of social climbing, so cherished by American Catholics, yearning to be accepted by a Protestant culture, i.e., a semi-pelagian, semi-gnostic, semi-pagan culture.

    • LeticiaVelasquez

      I wish I had an apology for every piece of junk science data I had to memorize in public school. Remember this nonsense?We would all be starving and eating one another by now. https://www.princeton.edu/~achaney/tmve/wiki100k/docs/The_Population_Bomb.html

    • Laura Lowder

      The problem is that the data Sister Jane is said to have offered has a heckuva better clinical backing than not, and it’s being actively suppressed and opposed as being “homophobic” or otherwise anti-gay. Meanwhile, even after NUMEROUS complaints about biased research funding, outcome-driven “research,” poor clinical practice, etc., the gay “research” is presented as objective truth.

      It’s obvious from the rhetoric who’s been dominating the “catechesis” of these kids.

      And what the HELL was PFLAG doing there? I don’t care if the president IS an alum mom — that group is so anti-Catholic, anti-Christian, head-in-the-sand dishonest, and they were working HARD to sway public opinion and student attitudes.

      • oregon nurse

        “The problem is that the data Sister Jane is said to have offered has a
        heckuva better clinical backing than not, and it’s being actively
        suppressed”

        Give me a break with your conspiracy theories. I’m sure if you really wanted the data Sr. Jane would oblige you. If she won’t, then you’ll have to draw your own conclusions.

        • Laura Lowder

          I’m sure she would oblige. However, that’s not what I’m saying. I’m saying that I have encountered the same data she’s supposed to have presented, that “isn’t part of Catholic teaching,” in some highly respectable independent place. I’m saying that some of these sentiment-driven parents (and others) would rather the kids be swayed by rhetoric than by actual data, and that they do whatever they can to discredit and defame the data.

          • raisinhead

            She presented lies as facts, lies dressed up with scientific laaguage but not supported by the mainstream. The Linacre review is not a peer reviewed journal, it is Catholic bias dressed up as science.

      • raisinhead

        ‘better clinical backing’. What does that even mean? You’ll have to be specific about the research you are saying is biased. There is a wide body of knowledge across many branches of inquiry and fields, supporting the notion that being gay is an innate and natural variation in human sexuality. Sr Jane is not a liar only because she is ignorant of the untruths she presented as fact.

      • mitch64

        Society has become so polarized that if anyone is presented with a study that goes against their beliefs they automatically hand wave it away saying it was biased and part of some scary agenda…(both sides are guilty of this. )Sister is not a liar but she did what we all do when presenting an argument, she looked for the information which fit her narrative.

        I can tell you this, I am a gay man and I had very good relationship with my very present father, I played sports, never looked at porn with other guys (obviously we wouldnt be interested in the same) if masturbation turned me gay then almost every man I ever met would also be gay and I think that I make a good parent, blah, blah, blah. Am I the exception to the rule, maybe, but I know many others that don’t fall under Sister’s statistics.

        Which is the point that many people are missing. Some people have bemoaning that these kids (and their parents) haven’t been taught Church teaching (correctly.) While that may or may not be true, many of these families have gay friends and family and neighbors who are not miserable, unhealthy creatures hiding in bushes ready to spring out at children. Its not Modern Family which is showing them that it real life. So when someone uses “weird science,” to cast gays or anyone else as “others” it just doesn’t work. Also no matter what your thoughts on the topic is, think of the gay kids sitting in that lecture..(and don’t fool yourself they were there) do you think this made them want to confide in any adult, much less the clergy. “Oh hi, I am confused so you must think I have been masturbating to porn and I don’t have a dad at home and I am a big SissyMary so I feel real comfortable talking to you about this very uncomfortable topic”

        I have no doubt that Sister had nothing but good intentions and meant to help and inform, the problem with stats are that they are trying to define real people, many of whom we know and love and work with and play golf with and eat dinner with etc.

    • CCHSparent

      Thank you, oregon nurse for trying to show some balance here. As (possibly) the lone commenter on this thread who actually attended last night’s meeting I can report that it was not nearly as contentious as most have described. Yes, there were a few loud comments when a small number of people, from each point of view stepped up to the mic, however the vast majority of speakers were treated very respectfully. Fr. Arnsparger did an excellent job of defending our Diocese’s stance on what transpired on March 21. Immediately most people were more at ease and tension was reduced. For those who want to focus on the parent who spoke on behalf of the LBGTQ community, she was there as a parent and she was given her 3 minutes to speak. I will say that the overwhelming majority of parents who chose to speak avoided the topic of homosexuality or any aspect of Sr. Jane’s speech. The answers most wanted were related to 3 items, which Fr. Arnsparger introduced in his opening remarks: 1. Why was there no advance notice that this assembly would take place? 2. When you knew that Sr. Jane had departed from her usual presentation, why did no one bring her back to the original topic? And 3. When you knew that she had gone beyond your expectation and were aware that there was a backlash, why did it take 11 days for any communication from the school?
      You all need to know that Charlotte Catholic is already a fairly conservative high school. The reason that parents were alarmed is that there was no notification. This is a school that still separates freshman boys and girls for Health class. As parents we have to sign waivers for our children to watch a PG-13 movie at school. When Sr. jane came to CCHS back in the Fall, multiple methods of communication were used and in those communications it stated that she will discuss sensitive subject-matter and the program is intended for children to attend with their children (and they did 2 sessions…one for girls and moms and one for sons and dads). We are constantly receiving e-mails, automated calls and text messages about events at the school…sometimes for weeks prior to the actual event or assembly. So, given all of that, and especially the Health class aspect and the format for Sr. Jane’s previous appearance, parents wanted to know why the administration felt that it was not necessary to notify parents about the March 21 assembly, which would include all 1400+ kids, aged 13 through 19 of both genders.
      Those who are not associated with the school, as well as those who are, who continue to try and make this a Catholic Church v PFLAG issue are way off base when it comes to commenting on why the parents are upset.

      • Laura Lowder

        Thank you for sharing this. Really, I appreciate it.

        Just who’s overseeing the school during the headmaster’s absence? Could that be at least part of the explanation why notification wasn’t sent out, this time?

        However — it’s the content of the talks that raised the ruckus. Again and again, we’ve read people quoted as saying that the data Sister provided flies in the face of the message of Pope Francis… etc. etc. The language being used is boilerplate gay lobby rhetoric.

        I also want to explain that I’ve had sufficient elbow-rubbing with PFLAG to have red flags pop up whenever I see they’re involved in a situation – such as distributing bracelets to people attending (and trying to attend) the meeting. Suffice it to say that PFLAG and Courage/EnCourage are not on the same page.

        • CCHSparent

          Laura, you’re welcome.
          The absence of our principal did, probably, contribute to the communication issue…at least in terms of the post-event damage control with angry parents (on both sides). Fr. Kauth was the primary point of origin for communication related to Sr. Jane’s Fall presentation, so I would expect that he should have also been responsible for sending out notifications on this, most recent, assembly as well. I really don’t know much about how responsibility is allocated and shared for such things. I just know who sends stuff to the house or the inbox and can assume (I know…dangerous) some degree of responsibility from that. The school, itself, is operating under a “principal by committee” model with the 2 Assistant Principals and the Dean of Students each taking components of the duties of the Principal. All 3 of these individuals have been at the school for many years and are well-known and respected. None have been in the “big chair” before, so I’m sure that this has caught them somewhat off-guard.
          I’m more in the moderate range of the scale on our current situation. To me, it is really about the communication and the responsibility. We spoke with our child about Sister’s comments. She was not confused or embarrassed, but she had questions and we did our best to answer them. She was going to encounter these points of view at some point in her life and I was not likely to be holding her hand when it happened. With that said, I would have very much appreciated knowing that this was coming so that I was able to prepare her for the topic and could develop some talking points to answer her questions more quickly. She did not see this as a “gay-bashing” assembly, although she did see several of her classmates become visibly upset and uncomfortable.
          I, for one, am not pleased that the PFLAG contingent has decided to use this as a means to support their platform, however I can not fault anyone for displaying their own passion regardless of my opinions.
          I have been part of the Catholic school system here for a long time, having graduated from Charlotte Catholic High School many years ago. It bothers me to see this community divided, when it could have been avoided so easily.

          • Laura Lowder

            Thank you — I really appreciate your response. I appreciate its tone, your thoughtfulness, and the depth of your sharing. God bless you!

          • CCHSparent

            Again, you are welcome. I have seen too many of these comments trying to depict the parents as being wildly separated on opposite ends of a spectrum. I know a lot of these families and most of us are much more centered than these sites imply. There were roughly 1,000 people there, last night, and only about 40 (or so) chose to speak. Of those 40 there were only a handful of themes introduced and then opinion-based variations on those themes. The rest of us were there to listen and learn. As is typical, the far left and the far right take the headlines and gain support from those on the outside who do not have the full story and are reacting to what extremists report and publish. We’re good Catholic folks and we trust that the Diocese and the school administration will get us all through this so that we can return to the family atmosphere that CCHS has maintained for many years.

      • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/thecrescat Katrina Fernandez

        Thank you for your comments and perspective. As a parent, I understand the desire for wanting to be notified in advance. I think your concerns are valid and deserved a mea culpa.

        I also think all parties involved in that petition deserve disciplinary action, suspension perhaps. Was that discussed?

        • CCHSparent

          The petitions themselves were not really discussed, other than to acknowledge that they exist and were started by students. There was no comment from school administration or representatives from the Diocese about repercussions or discipline of the students responsible. I would expect that both have had their time in the hot seat with administration. I will just trust that it will be handled fairly and that no disciplinary action is more harsh for one than the other.

        • Michael Boyle

          Good idea. Charlotte Catholic High School has already done such a wonderful job of showing that it, and by extension the Catholic Church, cares deeply about providing students with solid, factual arguments in support of its positions when it allowed a woman with no psychological or sociological background to opine on the causes of homosexuality. I mean, nothing says solid teaching like relying on some journal articles from the Who’s Who of the entirely discredited National Association for Research and Treatment of Homosexuality (NARTH).

          Let’s double down and punish students who wrote and signed on to a respectful petition asking the administration to address their concerns. That way, we can come across as ignorant and oppressive, as opposed to just ignorant.

          I truly hope you are not serious.

    • BTP

      Whoa, there. So, she presents reputable, though controversial, information to high school students and this is, somehow, incorrect?

      I’m very sorry, but you students and parents rather miss the point of education if this seems like a big problem to you. When someone makes points you suspect are mistaken, what an educated parent would do is suggest that the student find, say, some facts with which to engage the debate.

      What you parents decided to do was to behave like savages.

      • CCHSparent

        BTP, exactly what did the uneducated savage parents do? I’d like to know of what I am being accused. Is it savage to ask for an explanation? Is it savage to have questions about decisions made by the school? Our own administration, the Diocese and our chaplain have publicly stated that they did not pre-approve the additional content that Sister shared…at least not for the forum of that day. The Diocese arranged the open meeting…it was not the result of any demands by the parents. Please see my other posts in this discussion thread to gain my perspective prior to throwing a blanket over the behavior of “us parents”.

        • BTP

          CCHS parent, I think I explained that there is a response proper to factual claims with which you disagree: provide accurate facts. A petition is a thing used for an entirely different purpose, which is why academic debates aren’t done through petition.

          Thus, a parent with some clue about what education means would have directed his child not to sign anything so embarrassing as a petition over factual questions.

          • CCHSparent

            Have you read either petition? One has 4,000+ signatures and other has 3,000+ signatures. The school only has 1,400 students and many abstained from signing anything. If you assume that most students who signed either did so immediately upon release, during school hours, those signatures were obtained prior to any discussion with a parent. But still that leaves a huge number of supporters, from either side, who do not have any connection to the school at all. I did speak with my child about it, and we discussed the valid points and the speculative points made by authors of the petitions, but only after she followed the herd mentality and signed one of the petitions (I’m not saying which one because it was her decision and that isn’t really the point anyway).
            I still fail to see how the parents have behaved savagely. To imply that would be to say that no parent at the school cares what his or her child learns and that could not be farther from the truth and is not the least bit fair to good, caring parents.

          • BTP

            Ok. So it’s nobody’s fault, then. Except, maybe the school who allowed someone to make a statement some students disagree with. Got it.

  • echarles1

    “she felt the presentation created nothing but an unsafe environment” This whole “unsafe environment” thing drives me crazy. If you imply that homosexuality is less than ideal whatever its origin, you are creating an “unsafe environment” and are shouted down. Anything less than approval can never equal tolerance in the minds of some. If the aggrieved are so sure of their righteousness why do they need my, or anyone else’s, approval?

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/thecrescat Katrina Fernandez

      I bet the kids who actually believe in what the Church teaches feel REAL safe to express their views in that type of hostile, intolerant environment.

      Can you imagine… being afraid to be Catholic in a Catholic school. The whole thing infuriates me. GTFO if you don’t agree with Church teaching. Find another private school.

      And the school caved to parental pressure because they care more about tuition than they do about teaching solid doctrine.

      They never should have had this parent’s meeting. It just gave these parents a platform to get all frothy mouthed and hateful. CCHS should have issued a statement with a mea cupla for not giving more notice and called it a day.

      • margaret1910

        I think they should close the school. This is a diocesan school, right? Clearly, the kids cannot get a Catholic education there, so close it down. We are not supposed to be in the business of running cheap private schools..The Church is supposed to be in the business of saving souls and caring for God’s people.

      • echarles1

        The mob wants what it wants. It was going to get frothy mouthed somewhere.

      • Laura Lowder

        I hate to say it. I hate even more to think it… but did the priests try to be accommodating because they really don’t have solid backing? Because if Fr K wasn’t there, he’s getting his info from the whiners and complainers who might be mis-representing (!) what was actually presented.

        WHY do WE always back down???

        • margaret1910

          I understood that Fr K was there. Read the linked blog in the post.

        • kenofken

          Because you don’t have the numbers.

    • http://rosarynovice.stblogs.com/ Augustine

      Condoning and disregarding the need to help those suffering from homosexual attraction creates an unsafe environment, lest teenagers enter into the physical and mental disease-filled LGBT world.

    • Gail Finke

      I agree. What if the speaker had addressed any other “hot button” topic of interest to Catholics — immigration, euthanasia, the death penalty, etc. — and had said things that either were not true or that listeners did not agree with. Would this be their reaction? I don’t htink so..

  • Awkpearl

    I cannot say that I totally blame the parents. I mostly blame the Church Herself. I grew up as a guinea pig in the 70′s and 80′s. I was experimented on in various ways in my 12 years of Catholic education. But, I was never taught the fullness of what our Church has taught for 2,000 years.

    By the grace of God, I (as well as many others I know) was able to overcome the ignorance I was raised with. However, many adults today have not been able to overcome that ignorance.

    Yes, we are responsible for our own education. Yes, we are responsible for always saying “yes” to God and learning the Truth He entrusted to the Catholic Church. But, I still say that the Church is also to blame for the Truth not being known.

    If these parents had been properly catechized in the first place, then they would be able to hand the Truth on to their children. I am a humble servant of our dear Mother, the Church. But, I must be honest when I say that people of my generation and the generations following have been horribly let down.

    It will take a lot of work, a lot of suffering, and a lot of painful events like this one before we are able to once again be truly “Catholic/universal”. As a wise pope once said, the Church will become much smaller before She again begins to grow.

    Unfortunately, or fortunately, depending on how you look at it, the Church always grows from the blood of martyrs. Those who stand up for the timeless Truths will always be persecuted. Let us pray that the Truth (Who is a Person, BTW) will very quickly be known, loved and served throughout the world.

  • BigBallinBaalman

    It is people like y’all who are dividing us at Catholic. Very few of us students care anymore about Sister’s speach but there are now parents and outsiders who have become very passionate about this issue. The petitions were both started by students but have been high jacked by outsiders who have heard of them on sites like this. Sites like yours are dragging our schools reputation through the mud for not being Catholic enough and pro-LGBT sites drag us through the mud for being intolerant. The only way any of this gets cleared up is if both sides start acting like adults and calm down.

    • LNBE

      “The petitions were both started by students but have been high jacked by outsiders”

      That’s what happens when you post things in a public forum like the internet. The public tends to notice.

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/thecrescat Katrina Fernandez

      No, it’s dissenting ill informed students and their parents (the ones who put this situation in the spotlight to begin with) that are dividing your school and dragging it through the mud.

      The request for a parent’s meeting was a call for blood. Their behavior was pathetic. Direct your indignation there. Not here.

      PS- you kids really learn to take responsibility for your own actions and stop blaming everyone else when things blow up in your face.

      • BigBallinBaalman

        I did not mean ya’ll as in only those who support sister I meant ya’ll as in everyone who has become so impassioned by the events at Catholic for or against. As Catholics I would hope that the viewers of this page would want to help a Catholic school by calming down and handling this issue like adults. As for your second part, a parent’s meeting had become necessary because a public statement was not issued soon enough, anything less than a meeting would not have been tolerated by many parents including some on your side. And in response to your postscript, many people at our school took issue with how Sister spoke of things that can make you gay not that she taught that homosexuality is wrong which we have learned to accept is a part of our Catholic education. These people, myself included, signed a petition to a petition to express our belief that what she said was wrong and some of my fellow students signed a petition saying that what she taught was right and was in line with Catholic teaching. We take full responsibility for these petitions but we do not take responsibility for starting a shouting match on the internet conducted by people who are mostly unconnected to the high school. I hope you will understand and if you still wish to express your opinion do so in a more constructive way.
        Peace and Love

        • Laura Lowder

          Hey — how come your username reflects devotion to a pagan deity? You know what was happening when Israel left off following the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob and went after the baals and ashteroths, right?

          • CCHSparent

            Laura Lowder, that is the young man’s surname. He did not choose a screen name based on anything in the Bible. It really isn’t always a conspiracy against the Church. :)

          • Laura Lowder

            Okay. I’m not familiar with that family name (my area is predominately Scots) — but “Big Ballin’” doesn’t exactly seem to support the expectation that what follows is a legit real name.

        • SteveP

          “These people, myself included, signed a petition to a petition to express our belief that what she said was wrong and some of my fellow students signed a petition saying that what she taught was right and was in line with Catholic teaching.”
          .
          What you have just shown is that right and wrong is the whim of the mob. I would add: politicizing your disagreement – you made it political by appealing to the mob via a petition – is a very weak step. In fact it avoids argumentation as it removes any position of compromise: to listen to an opposing view you run the risk of agreeing with that view; that is, to enter a debate one must risk that one’s position is wrong.
          .
          Finally, a diocesan school is not a public institution. No “public statement” is required. School administrators and teachers are obliged to communicate with parents of students but are not obliged to communicate with the public.

        • BTP

          I see. A petition over a statement you believe is factually incorrect. May I suggest to you that the proper response to facts you think are incorrect is to provide facts that are correct. A petition, you see, is something with an entirely different usefulness.

          How is it that no student at your school picked up on this fact? I am genuinely curious.

    • MaryW1

      No, it is erroneous teaching in our Catholic schools that is at issue here otherwise there would be no issue with sister’s SPEECH; and those of us faithful to the Magisterium of the Catholic Church will not be silenced. In the comments of a previous thread, one commenter kept referring to “mainstream (read secular) Catholic schools which is in fact an oxymoron. I’d be curious to know if the Catechism of the Catholic Church can be found anywhere on the premises of this school.

  • Toby

    The petition *might* have begun with the students, but the outcry was very much agenda driven from inside the school system and picked up by outsiders who wanted to fan the flames. Ultimately it has to do with money and controlling parents. Last year similar talk on Catholic doctrine was given to teachers inside the diocese at a retreat/meeting. Several teachers were “hurt” and “offended” indicating that they were divorced or had a gay family members. I heard a comment about someone crying. The oft-repeated phrase was a variation on “Arnsparger wants to take the schools back to the (fill in the blank) century”. Later I heard the exact same phrase used against Fr. Kauth at CCHS. Fast forward to the principal being suspended due to financial issues and the talk became of a Kauth/Arnsparger/Jugis coup. Sr. Jane played right into their hand. They were loaded for bear and ready to jump at the slightest perceived offense. The wealthy at CCHS think they own the administration and forget that the Bishop literally owns the school and they all work at his discretion.

    • LeticiaVelasquez

      Thank you for the true insider perspective Toby. I was told to pander to parents at a conservative Catholic elementary school when discussing candidate Obama’s stand on life issues. I never told anyone whom to vote for, but the principal a nun in a traditional habit was bullied by a couple of loud-mouthed liberal parents.

    • Laura Lowder

      Makes sense. Did PFLAG have anything to do with drafting that petition? I can just about bet my bottom dollar they were involved. I ran into them when I was finding about my own family member, 25 years ago — well-intentioned, but I’m not sure whether not willfully stupid because they’re scared if they state the truth their family member won’t love them any more. They sure as heck have a screwed-up idea of what it mean to love and support the gay family member/friend.

    • KyriaGrace

      I’ve suspected that the students had “help.” That petition was online within hours of Sister’s talk, way too fast for it to have been the result of a normal reaction.

  • Awkpearl

    The truly sad thing is that this is not an isolated incident. I personally know of more than one priest who has received death threats from people who want to call themselves “Catholic” without accepting Catholic teaching.

    These priests didn’t even get anywhere near the issues brought up by the good Sister. The people who gave them death threats were reacting to the priests mentioning such simple things as praying for the dead and trying to focus our worship on God and not each other.

    One group of outraged parishioners even went so far as to hold their “we hate Father” meetings in the local Masonic Temple.

    Freaky!!

    Anyway, it is just getting started, I’m afraid. Pray for our priests and religious.

  • Awkpearl

    Katrina – are comments being moderated or did I push the wrong button when I submitted a comment a couple hours ago? Or, is my computer messing with me? – Thanks!!

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/thecrescat Katrina Fernandez

      lemme check. Disqus hiccups when people post comments @ the same time.

      • Awkpearl

        Thanks!

  • SteveP

    What are the connotations of “We are all God’s children” bracelets? Does this mean there is no sin because God created me perfectly? I am baffled . . .

    • Laura Lowder

      The bracelets were being distributed by PFLAG — Parents & Friends of Lesbians And Gays. The idea that group is promoting is that anyone who doesn’t endorse the gay agenda hates gays. The bracelet, and PFLAG, want people to sincerely believe that God doesn’t care what we do.

      • SteveP

        Ah, I see. Kind of a dumbed down Deism where there’s an acceptance of a god based on bodily experience rather than rational assent to the proposition there is a Creator?

    • http://rosarynovice.stblogs.com/ Augustine

      Only those baptized are children of God by adoption, without exception. Before baptism we are merely creatures of God. We are created with the inheritance of our foreparents: our fallen, wounded nature. Through baptism, we follow Christ in His path to healing and salvation in our human nature that He elevated from the death of sin into the glory of Heaven. And His path demands us to be perfect as He is perfect, without sin, loving Him by obeying His commandments. There is no other way to salvation, redemption and eternal life but Jesus.

  • tj.nelson

    I blame the parents too – and then the teachers who educated them – and then Disney.

    • Awkpearl

      The buck stops with Disney? It must go back farther than that!! O.o I was under the impression that Adam and Eve were involved! :)

  • Philippa Martyr

    One of your other commented on the previous blog post revealed that the whole idea of the petition was to ‘get an apology’.
    An apology from a Catholic teacher for teaching Catholic doctrine, and then sharing some personal stories about her own journey in faith?
    Taking offence at this is a sign of a narrow and undernourished mind, both on the part of the children and their parents. (It’s often also a sign of a guilty conscience, but that’s a whole ‘nother ball game.)

  • KyriaGrace

    A CCHS parent who was at the meeting has shared his reflections on a Catholic forum. I think the most disturbing thing was the disrespect and anger shown by the one group of parents towards Father Kauth. Calling for the removal of the chaplain is a ridiculous and extreme reaction on the part of the pro-homosexuality parents. It’s certainly not loving and tolerant. That is not how to unite and go forward, especially since they got their apology.

    “Now for the bad things:
    - Overwhelming cognitive dissonance from the opposing side. More than a few times, those preaching love and tolerance were screaming at Father Kauth at the top of their lungs in a rude and hateful manner. As I sat watching this, I could not help but think these are the people that would walk into a confessional on a given day and expect absolution from sin from this same Priest. At worst, Father made a mistake by not looking into what Sister would talk about. We all make mistakes. I have never seen a Priest treated in a manner such as this. One gentleman got up from the audience and said very calmly, “I was waiting for someone to yell, crucify him! ” It was that bad.
    - Overall loud, obnoxious, and rude behavior from the opposing side towards fellow Catholics who supported Father.
    - A call to have Father removed from his position due to lack of confidence in his ability to be a Good Shepherd to the students.

    “I want to finish by saying that one of the teachers stood up and spoke from the heart. She stated that since Father Kauth has come to Charlotte Catholic High School, Mass attendance and attendance at adoration has skyrocketed. It would be a great shame to lose a Priest that has done such wonderful things for the school. I absolutely agree. Feel free to share this post with others so they can truly understand what went on last night.”

    http://forums.catholic.com/showpost.php?p=11862361&postcount=164

    • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/thecrescat Katrina Fernandez

      Like I stated before. CCHS never should have had this meeting. Anyone with eyes could have seen this outcome. The meeting was a call for blood. I am not surprised at all they parent’s screamed for his resignation. All liberals know how to do is bully.

      I keep hearing from parents that this was really about not being notified but NOWHERE on that petition is the lack of notification mentioned. And if that was all there was to it then what were the “We are all God’s children” bracelets for?

  • http://www.patheos.com/blogs/thecrescat Katrina Fernandez

    No debate that you will accept. You’ve closed your mind to hearing anything that doesn’t support your own beliefs. There is no point in further addressing you.

  • Romulus

    Nonsense. There is no such thing as “homosexuality” as a defined condition. Homosexuality is nothing more than the practice of homosexual behavior — which takes place for a broad spectrum of reasons. When sexual identity and attractions are genuinely confused from a very early age, that is manifestly an innate disorder, as such confusion serves no natural purpose.

    I happen to be badly near-sighted. I don’t demand that since I was “born this way” that others pretend there’s nothing wrong with me — and I don’t refrain from taking appropriate measure to correct the problem as well as I can.

  • imabitterclinger2

    I am a parent who was at the meeting and a supporter of Father Kauth, and I will tell you that this particular group who is so supportive of “love and “tolerance” had no love or tolerance at all for this Priest of God. The cognitive dissonance was overwhelming. One gent went up late in the meeting after most of the rowdy parents left, looked at the crowd with an appalled look on his face and a tear in his eye and said, “I was waiting for someone to yell Crucify Him!”
    To be fair, there were some parents who calmly and considerately aired grievances, and they were respectfully answered. Mistakes were made, and apologies made by Father Kauth. Steps will be taken to better inform parents. That’s good enough for me. I’m a Catholic who believes we all sin and make mistakes. I can surely forgive a man who dedicates his life to Christ.

    • Awkpearl

      Thank you for sharing this.

  • oregon nurse

    Katrina, Have you read this statement from St. Thomas Aquinas College that states in no uncertain terms that Sr Jane’s
    “…deviation into realms of sociology and anthropology was beyond the scope of her expertise.” and “The unfortunate events at Charlotte Catholic High School are not representative of the quality of Sister’s academic contributions or the positive influence that she has had on her students.”
    See more at: http://www.aquinascollege.edu/college-statement-charlotte-catholic-sister-jane-dominic/#sthash.0MP1VF0R.dpuf

    I think the following, also from the statement, is a nice way of saying that Sr. Jane acted irresponsibly in her role as Catholic educator and is not welcome at this time on the faculty.

    “Sister Jane Dominic has cancelled her speaking engagements and, at her request, is preparing to begin a sabbatical from teaching at Aquinas College.”

    There may have been overreaction by some parents and students and other harmful interests may have taken advantage of that. But I think Sr. Jane has to (and apparently is) take a large chunk of the responsibility. What she did was egregious and the equivalent of educational malpractice, given her background as a doctor of theology and an educator.

    The last thing we need is more devisiveness based on speculation delivered under the guise of “Catholic theology” or to give our cultural opponents a legitimate club to use to bash us over the head and marginalize us even further.
    I despair when I think about the fallout this will cause and no, I don’t blame the student who posted the petition. Hiding dirty laundry doesn’t make it clean. Sunlight is the best disinfectant.

    • http://thebodyguardtob.wordpress.com/ Jim Russell

      Here’s a little more sunlight from Aquinas College: ” The unfortunate events at Charlotte Catholic High School are not representative of the quality of Sister’s academic contributions or the positive influence that she has had on her students. The students at Charlotte Catholic were unprepared, as were their parents, for the topic that Sister was asked to deliver. The consequence was a complete misrepresentation of the school’s intention to bring a message that would enlighten and bring freedom and peace.”
      And here is a little more Catholic theology:
      Homosexual sex acts are still intrinsically evil.
      Same-sex attraction is still objectively disordered.
      There is still no such thing as a “same-sex ‘marriage’”.
      The person with same-sex attraction, like everyone else, is still called to chastity.
      The US bishops still teach that public self-disclosure of one’s experience of same-sex attraction is “not helpful.”
      Let’s hope that everyone involved in this all agree on letting the sun shine on these truths…

      • oregon nurse

        Directing your comment to me feels like an implication that I am not orthodox when it comes to Catholic teaching on ssa vs homosexual activity. I hope that was not your intent.

        • http://thebodyguardtob.wordpress.com/ Jim Russell

          Not sure what you mean by “teaching on ssa vs. homosexual activity,” but you’re quite right–my comment is reflective of my hope for all involved, as noted, and not directed at you. But it’s attached as a reply to yours because it offers additional important info regarding the statement from Aquinas College.

    • margaret1910

      Ok, I wrote a lot more..and decided I was too, ummm…divisive. I will just say that anyone who thinks that this reaction by parents (never mind the students..teenagers are supposed to be idiots) is just a side issue, and that Sister and Fr, etc are the problem, is a bloody fool.

      Sister quoted some studies from wherever. If the facts are wrong..then respond with other studies. When you respond with..”help, help, I’m being repressed!” then you deserve NO hearing whatsoever.

    • Unsocialized Homeschooler

      So, now we have nuns under a bus?

  • imabitterclinger2

    I can debunk this in 5 minutes. First of all, Sister’s comments are in line with Catholic Doctrine. Father Kauth, therefore, spoke truthfully. It was her delivery to the audience that was off by quite a bit and required more pastoral sensitivity, Q&A, and a smaller audience. Bigotry assumes willful intolerance of a person. Since Catholics are called to love everyone, and this is a nun and priest that have dedicated their life to the Catholic Faith (e.g.God), your argument is illogical.

    Mainstream science does NOT disregard the facts she presented. It may be peer-reviewing some of the statistics, and any good scientist will allow for that. What cannot be ignored is the fact that homosexual acts do lead to shortened lifespan, increased risk of STDs, and other major health issues and concerns. LGBTQ activists love to keep the argument on a civil rights basis, because the health risks are a lot higher. Common Sense tells us that a man’s anus is not designed for another man’s penis. the anus carries bacteria-laden feces. Anal rips and incontinence are common problems. Urinary tract infections are also exponentially elevated, because the normally sterile urethra gets infected with bacteria. Women fare only little better. HPV is easily transmitted between two women, and incidents of STDs are through the roof in the homosexual community versus their heterosexual counterparts. Acting out on homosexual tendencies isn’t a sin just because God says it is. It is a sin because, it is naturally bad for people and it impacts overall life expectancy. Jesus came so we could have life more abundantly. Since God cannot contradict himself, acting out on homosexuality is sinful and disordered. The only reasonable answer is chastity as is called for by the Roman Catholic Church.

    There is no ‘debate’, because you know that logically you don’t have a leg to stand on, so you shout the opposing view down with sloganeering for “love”, “tolerance”, and “civil rights”. This from people who “love” homosexuals. You have a strange way of showing love.

  • One Eye Open

    And thus we have the logical (yet absurd) conclusions that have lead from decades of telling children that they are the very center of the universe and they do no wrong. They, now as adults, will brook no denying what they WANT and what they FEEL…especially what their very own special children want and feel.

    Lack of agreement with their desire = evil.

    Saying “that’s wrong” = cruel & bigoted.

    There is no discussion or argument to be made. You’re simply a bad, mean, evil person for disagreeing with the little darlings and their precious parents. You will simply be Tweeted down and told to Shut Up!

    We have only ourselves to blame and may God have mercy on His foolish, wayward, idiotic children.


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