A Woman Picking a Restaurant is Setting up a Man for Seduction?

A Woman Picking a Restaurant is Setting up a Man for Seduction? September 25, 2018

Oh good grief! Doug Wilson of Blog and Mablog clearly has the most dirty mind in Evangelical circles. Worse than a 15 year old boy being assaulted by hormones! His reaction to Aimee Byrd’s suggestion in her book “Why Can’t We Be Friends?” that sharing a meal is not a slippery slip n’ slide to adultery. Doug says straight up that a women picking a restaurant is setting up a man for seduction, whether she realizes it or not.

He paints sloppy word picture of candles and roaming violinists, settling the stage for seducing ahoy! Pretty clear he must not ever go to restaurants except for rare special occasions. I can assure him that the vast majority of places women are having friendly lunches with men at are so far removed from his ideas on restaurants. Have you ever seen a romantic atmosphere at the local Panera’s or Sizzler or Burger King? Burgers and candlelight, only in a bad fictional romance or the mind of one sick puppy Doug Wilson.

Childish! Most people are capable of having lunch or dinner with the opposite sex without thinking it’s going to lead to genitalia smushing. For my years in Germany I had lunch at the officer’s club with a Capitain who’d become a friend of mine through my position at the USO. After morning board meetings or briefings we’d met up for lunch. He was married, I was very married and no one even flirted, much less cheated. The officer’s club had white linen tablecloths, candles and flowers but so what? The surroundings were pretty meaningless even if it was the best place near both of our offices to get a steak. No one once even once referred to bumping uglies on those lunches. What we did was talk about our lifes, our hopes, our frustrations. Work subjects, asking about each others families, it was completely innocent, a friendship, something that you cannot do in Evangelical Christianity lest adultery happens.

In my many years of working and socializing with men, including one on one meals, I’ve never seen anything like what Wilson is describing. It’s a view that tells me he does not know what the heck he’s talking about. He’s shut into fundytown with only a warped funhouse mirror telling him what it’s like right outside his window.

I leave you with this, a quote from the book:

“Having lunch shouldn’t feel like a challenge to marital fidelity. Eating together is a platonic practice intended to bring joy to our friendships”


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NLQ Recommended Reading …

Quiverfull: Inside the Christian Patriarchy Movement by Kathryn Joyce

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About Suzanne Titkemeyer
Suzanne Titkemeyer went from a childhood in Louisiana to a life lived in the shadow of Washington D.C. For many years she worked in the field of social work, from national licensure to working hands on in a children's residential treatment center. Suzanne has been involved with helping ithe plights of women and children' in religious bondage. She is a ordained Stephen's Minister with many years of counseling experience. Now she's retired to be a full time beach bum in Tamarindo, Costa Rica with the monkeys and iguanas. She is also a thalassophile. She also left behind years in a Quiverfull church and loves to chronicle the worst abuses of that particular theology. You can read more about the author here.
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What Are Your Thoughts?leave a comment
  • Nea

    I’m so confused. Mike-Mike Pearl says a woman choosing a restaurant will make the man’s dick fall off. You can’t seduce and emasculate simultaneously.

  • Saraquill

    By this logic, the male friends I’ve eaten out with are very much not male. Or Doug is a twit.

  • SAO

    What an obnoxious post. Wilson has no argument, so he paints an unrealistic scenario and sneers at it. When was the last time you were at a restaurant with a violinist wending his way through the tables? Maybe at some super expensive restaurant booked weeks in advance for Valentine’s Day, which, yeah, might suggext romance was on the cards, but, that hardly means an ordinary restaurant on an ordinary day is the same.

  • Anri

    “Sometimes, when I look at a woman, my wee-wee gets all tingly. That makes her bad.”

  • Freodin

    She must be sending out some kind of tingly-rays or such, I am sure!

  • Consistency is not their strong point.

  • Rachel

    The closest I have ever gotten was a Mexican restaurant in San Antonio where guys with guitars went from table to table offering to play for tips. It was pretty definitively a family atmosphere.

  • Nightshade

    If that’s what Dougie-boy thinks sharing a meal with a woman is like…well, I certainly don’t want to have lunch with him.

  • EbbyBee

    Unless his secret kink is being dominated.

  • I’m probably going to be meeting a woman next Monday at 7 in a local donut shop. It’s supposed to be about a part time job, but I guess she’s actually out to seduce me, despite neither of us having met in person before, or even having an idea what each other looks like.

  • Suzanne Harper Titkemeyer

    Watch out for the candlelight and violins and you should be fine by Dougie standards.

  • I wonder to what degree Wilson and Co *plant* some of these feelings in young men. After all, studies show false memories can be planted. In addition, there are cases in which studies show that the power of suggestion can be such that folks will remember ambiguous things wrongly based on another’s suggestion.

    Thus, since Wilson and Co make such a BFD (big freaking deal) out of getting turned on, and will say this to teen boys not sure what to make of these feelings, to what degree things can be planted. If the leaders just let it be, how many guys would be just fine, and merrily go about their way, able to enjoy friendship regardless of gender.

    Also, notice how cisheteronormative Wilson and Evangelicals are. Even books like Every Man’s Battle (which does pushback against rape apologia, to mention its stopped church clock moment) promote the idea that folks should let opposite sex friendships slide, lest there be adultery during hard times.

    My question is what about encounters with LGBT people? Should Good, Manly Christian Men (TM) avoid gay men, lest you have a hot date? Should straight Christian women avoid dinner with gay guys, though the guys are not interested? The same question with lesbians. When it comes to trans people, should their biological sex or gender identity be the determining factor?

    I thought about this due to something I heard happened on a 2004 episode of The Apprentice, an unpresidented covfefe idea: it was a restaurant task, teams divided by gender. A group of gay guys sat at a table, and the guys decided to do a sex sell: the most attractive was to walk towards their table, walk away, bend over, and tie his shoe. That did help me think of modesty in a new way.

  • My first trip to Hungary in 2006 and it was a wine bar on The Street of Beautiful Women in Eger. Not someplace I’d be able to take a friend of any gender to lunch.

  • AFo

    Jesus Christ, these people can’t just mind their own business and let everyone else live their lives, can they? Who cares if a man and a woman who aren’t “together” want to go out to eat? Who cares if it’s a “fancy” restaurant? As long as they are comfortable and understand the boundaries of their relationship, it’s no one else’s concern.

  • Allison the Great

    How can guys like Wilson be so out of touch with life that they don’t even understand what most restaurants are like?

  • Iain Lovejoy

    Read this carefully. Doug is addressing the motives of the man. His approach is perfectly logical if you accept his basic premise that the only possible interest a man could have in any form of social interaction with a woman is sex. Doug hates women, is contemptuous of them and doesn’t truly believe they are real people. He can’t, and therefore he can’t see how any man could possibly care about what these creatures think or say, or enjoy or value their company other than out of a desire to stick his penis in them. Any social interaction is therefore necessarily an attempt at seduction, even if the man kids himself it is not, because what other possible motive could their sensibly be for initiating it?

  • frostysnowman

    I’ve heard that a meal at Ted’s Montana Grill often leads to genitalia smushing. It’s all the dark wood and animal heads and Wild West-type art.

  • Is it okay to for a man to talk to a woman at Buc-ee’s? (I just saw your post from awhile back with the photo of Buc-ee Beaver. Those are all over Texas, plus there are two in Alabama. I was quite surprised to see it on your blog!)

  • Suzanne Harper Titkemeyer

    We love Buc-Cees~ Relatives in Texas are how we discovered it. That mascot is so strange looking. Did not know they had them in Alabama too!

  • persephone

    My preferences for a lunch are someplace not too loud, quick food delivery, and not crowded tables. If I’m discussing business stuff, I don’t want to be 6″ from the next table. Actually, I don’t want to be 6″ from any other table at any restaurant.

  • persephone

    OT: I made the mistake of starting to watch No Greater Law, a documentary on the Followers of Christ in Idaho. They don’t believe in doctors. They believe that if you take your child to a doctor that you’ve condemned that child to hell. What a nice bunch.

    What made me turn it off, though, was a former member who grew up in the group, telling about the first death that really got her. Her cousin was born on her 9th birthday. She got to hold him since it was her birthday. 10 days later he died. The girl’s mother told her it was her fault the baby died, because she held it, and she must have sinned in some way, so, rather than punishing the girl, God decided to kill the baby.

    Are you f**king kidding me? I want to drive up there and take a cricket bat to these sick a$$holes.

    ETA:
    At the time of the documentary being filmed, Idaho had the religious exemption in place. *angry* But even more upsetting was the local coroner, who, frankly, gave me bad vibes, like drugs or drinking issues, saying that she’d NEVER had any reason to blame a death at the FoC compound on abuse or neglect. For one thing, she said she started there in 1990. But then she says that in her “33 years” there, etc. 5 years difference? Just her demeanor and behavior set off the addict radar.

    One of the deaths was a teenage girl who got food poisoning, and spent four days dying of dehydration.

  • Nightshade

    He’s telling us way more about himself than we really wanted to know.

  • Falconlights

    Huh? I’m not straight, but dated/married a guy for a few years in the seventies. What is with these “Christian” “men”? Seriously. I chose the restaurant often when we went out. I don’t recall my ex thinking it was some kind of seduction scenario. We shared a nice meal. good talk, maybe a glass of wine, then I drove him home and I went home to my place, This is beyond weak, it’s pathetic! Hey, weak Xtian dudes, sometimes a cigar IS just a cigar.

  • Falconlights

    Notice, if you will, these jerks never take responsibility for their own libido. It’s always the woman’s faults.To me, that’s just pathetic. I’ve taken responsibility for any sex I’ve had in my life–we were attracted to one another and that was it. These men are so weak and immature that only some fundie woman would want them. No straight woman with any maturity I’ve known over the years would ever want a man like that.

  • Falconlights

    There’s always that.

  • Falconlights

    I’d say you hit the nail straight on the head. They only want a woman they can dominate and lord it over.Deep-down, they hate women.

  • Falconlights

    When you, put it that way, it’s so ridiculous, isn’t it?

  • Falconlights

    Many a good man has been ensnared by a woman in a donut shop. lol

  • Falconlights

    Yeah. My gay friend really needed to watch out when a lesbian invited him out to dinner. The Christijihadists just can’t live their own lives by their own rules–they seem compelled to force their weirdness on everyone else.

  • Falconlights

    Your last sentence would have set off alarm bells in me, too. How is a girl getting food poisoning and not getting medical support for hydration not child abuse and neglect?. You know, I feel this way about these nuts and the Christian Scientists, etc.: if someone wants to do things like not seek medical help when they need it, they can knock themselves out. I may think it’s stupid, but they’re an adult and it’s ultimately their choice and their right to make it. But minor children, to me, are off limits. Adults have alternatives. Children, as minors, do not, as they are dependent upon their parents.

  • Falconlights

    A guaranteed seduction home-run! /s What blows my mind is that this isn’t tongue-in-cheek. They’re dead serious.

  • persephone

    Also, with these no medicine cults, women and children are disproportionately affected by the lack of medical care. The men in charge just don’t care.

  • Ruthitchka

    So well said, and sadly, so true.

  • Ruthitchka

    I agree 100%.

  • B.A.

    I’d rather have lunch with a rock.

  • zizania

    I regularly have lunch with a bi-sexual friend who’s presently in a heterosexual marriage. (No candles or violinists, though.) We’ve even taken the odd road trip together. Do I need to be afraid that she’s seducing me? Or vice versa?

  • nmgirl

    I was once told that having lunch with the secretaries was not ‘professional’. but as soon as I got to know my male colleagues and lunched with them, I was a slut, sleeping with all of them.

  • Falconlights

    You’re right. They don’t.

  • texassa

    Even if a woman is into you and trying to seduce you, it still takes two. You are not at risk of participating in an affair unless you actually take the actions to do it. Why are these men so helpless?