Lori Alexander’s Cruel Child Discipline Advice

Lori Alexander’s Cruel Child Discipline Advice January 4, 2019

Here are a series of 34 different screen caps of Lori Alexander’s advice on beating children to make them behave. Some are from her The Transformed Wife site, or Facebook page, some are from Lori’s private chatroom. All are real. This is Lori Alexander’s cruel child discipline advice.

I have nothing snarky or much to add. I’ve sat on these for awhile thinking of what to say, but there are no words adequate to describe what this makes one feel.

Keep in mind that most of this advice is geared towards toddlers and young children.

These were sent to me by someone in the chatroom who is as sickened by the advice as I was upon reading it.

Are you still here? Realize a few things. Lori Alexander is advising using a leather strap or hard implement on the bare bottom of a small child, making it hurt as much as possible. Plus she started this many years before she read Debi and Michael Pearl’s abuse manual “To Train Up A Child” This cruelty was always in her.

Please do not do this to your child. It is illegal in many jurisdictions now, which is why Lori puts the disclaimer that you must find out what is legal in your area and to only do it in private. Spanking children has long term negative effects that have been documented by the American Pediatric Association and others.

And here is Lori denying that she’s doing anything wrong in teaching her methods. Sorry Lori, but spanking children to teach them to be kind never works. It only promotes an outward performance that is just enough to stave off more beatings while causing an inward simmering resentment.


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NLQ Recommended Reading …

Quiverfull: Inside the Christian Patriarchy Movement by Kathryn Joyce

I Fired God by Jcoelyn Zichtermann

13:24 A Dark Thriller by M Dolon Hickmon

 

About Suzanne Titkemeyer
Suzanne Titkemeyer went from a childhood in Louisiana to a life lived in the shadow of Washington D.C. For many years she worked in the field of social work, from national licensure to working hands on in a children's residential treatment center. Suzanne has been involved with helping the plights of women and children' in religious bondage. She is a ordained Stephen's Minister with many years of counseling experience. Now she's retired to be a full time beach bum in Tamarindo, Costa Rica with the monkeys and iguanas. She is also a thalassophile. She also left behind years in a Quiverfull church and loves to chronicle the worst abuses of that particular theology. She has been happily married to her best friend for the last 32 years. You can read more about the author here.

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What Are Your Thoughts?leave a comment
  • Iain Lovejoy

    Note that Lori’s statement about never spanking after 5 years’ old and the children not remembering is an out-and-out lie. Here’s a quote from Lori about this from a few years ago I dug up:
    “We hardly had to spank after 5 years old because they obeyed us. I would still spank at 7 and 9 years old to let them know I meant business. It has to be hard enough to hurt. Pain is a great teacher. You will probably only have to do it a couple of times if it hurts enough. They will obey you then rather than get spanked again. You must not let them run the house anymore. It will only get worse and harder to discipline as they get older.”
    In other words, it didn’t work and they had to keep right in spanking.
    (I am reasonably confident that the ludicrous contention each of their children only had one temper tantrum ever is a complete pile of BS as well.)

  • Skansen

    They took turns spanking the kids for HOURS during a temper tantrum? Apart from being horribly cruel, it doesn’t sound particularly efficient…

  • Nea

    So, continuing to follow the Pearls, then, who both claimed that they didn’t need to spank often and bragged how often they spanked.

  • Nea

    Lori worships the Pearls, on whose advice children have been murdered. It’s no surprise she’s a child abuser and in denial; I’m only surprised she wasn’t investigated for her abuse.

  • Missicat

    That is a horrifying read. And why does she sound so ecstatic when she describes that the child really needs to feel pain? Or is that just me?

  • Iain Lovejoy

    To be fair, it’s certainly true both that they repeatedly spanked their children and that it was entirely unnecessary (although that is probably not what they meant by not needing to spank).

  • Iain Lovejoy

    Maybe she likes pain? Certainly the strange obsession with the “pleasure of disobedience” suggests something weird is going on

  • Saraquill

    She went out of her way to have multiple children. From the way she describes beating infants for acting their age, it sounds like she never wanted to be a mom. Why the **** did she have offspring then, and not dolls? It sounds like she wanted the appearance of children, not crying, moving things with autonomy and needs.

  • Saraquill

    It sounds like she enjoys wielding power over those smaller, weaker and dependent on her.

  • Skansen

    I agree, it sounds like she really enjoyed handing out those beatings.

  • Nea

    Her heroes sure do. Mikey writes at length about his pleasure in showing his dominance over anything too weak to give a fair fight.

  • Nea

    For the same reason all of the quiverfuls have children and then pound them flat – because they don’t want children, they want living, breathing proof of their fertility and power-over.

  • Tawreos

    I couldn’t make it through all of that. To see people gleefully and boastfully talk about treating their kids worse than I have ever treated my dog and know that they think that this please some mythological deity is just disgusting. Of course, we shouldn’t be surprised. Lori and Ken like to bully adults so why would they not do the same to a child. They are completely disgusting.

  • Nightshade

    Lori claims that a rod is biblical, yet she insists on using a strap. Doesn’t Lori believe the Bible? If God meant for parents to use a strap, wouldn’t he have said strap? I guess she just doesn’t love God, or his perfect ways.

    Just for the record, I think it’s all BS, but according to Lori’s own rules the strap is wrong.

  • Saraquill

    Not to mention, shepherds who used their rods to beat their animals would end up with a flock too terrified to trust them, and of poor market value from the wounds.

  • Saraquill

    I’m not sure how much this is to actually please a deity. It reads more like “abuse first, brag later. Make sure to wrap you boasts in in keywords your audience will approve of.”

    I’ve seen people get away with hideous stuff cause they covered it in the right keywords.

  • Tawreos

    That is one sick world they live in, because in my world there are no good keywords for physical abuse.

  • Friend

    My own belief is that Psalm 23 has been misused. I think “Thy rod and thy staff, they comfort me” refers to a rod of protection against predators, and a staff to guide the sheep.

  • Friend

    Many states ban corporal punishment of adopted children and foster children. If a family has a mixture of biological children and adoptees/foster children, the biological kids would receive different discipline from the others. This would probably even apply in second marriages, if the family went through an adoption proceeding.

    (Forgive me for posting something like this every time the topic of spanking comes up. Our family has a very long history of adoption, and this bugs me no end.)

  • Jen (*.*)

    That was a horrifying read, because that’s how my parents disciplined. Spank until they’re broken, and then some more for good measure. But it’s not the sinful will that’s broken – it’s their spirit. That’s why they collapse crying into the parents arms.

    Working on “wrong thinking” completes the brainwashing.

    It’s physical, verbal and psychological abuse. And you wonder why these types are afraid of CPS showing up…

  • Jen (*.*)

    I’ve know lots of Christians like this. They’re usually fringe, not affiliated with major denominations, and homeschool. There are more out there than one would imagine because they usually keep a low profile.

  • Jen (*.*)

    One of my siblings had a four hour temper tantrum/beating and never threw one again. Spankings after that (and there were MANY) were for minor infringements. “Swift correction,” as my parents used to call it, is just an easy way to get kids to behave.

  • Skansen

    Yeah, I think the comments about raising their kids being a pleasure because the kids were obedient are quite telling. I personally find raising my kid to be a pleasure because he’s an awesome little guy and following along as he grows up, explores the world around him and learns new things is so much fun.

  • SAO

    Kids under 5 have temper tantrums because their self-control isn’t well-developed nor is their ability to recognize and express their needs. My kids had tantrums when they were hungry, tried or overwhelmed — they needed something they couldn’t tell me they needed. At first glance, it might look like willful greed — my son had tantrums a number of times in front of the cookie kiosk at the mall. But he only had them when it was a little past lunch time, never when he was not hungry. I trained him out of tantrums by repeating ‘boys who lie on the floor and scream, never get cookies.’

    It is immoral to hurt children unnecessarily. I note most of Lori’s examples are about her convenience. Is wriggling during diaper changes a problem? If a nursing baby bites (mine never did), stop nursing. Wait a few minutes.

    It is immoral to hurt children because of evil parenting practices.

    If you have a kid absolutely determined to stick a fork in an electrical outlet, spanking isn’t going to guarantee he won’t electrocute himself when you aren’t looking. You should get covers.

    Despite the fact that far fewer adults today were spanked as kids than 50 years ago, you don’t see more adults unable to control their tempers.

  • Knitting Cat Lady

    That woman is sick. Seriously.

    And the Pearl book is on the ‘Index of Media Dangerous to the Youth’ in Germany. Meaning it’s illegal to buy or sell it Germany. And it’s very difficult for something to get on the Index.

    Also: Any kind of physical discipline is illegal in Germany. No slap with the hand, no rods, no straps…

    My parents slapped me once each. They had the policy that they would always follow through on their threats if I refused to do something. Like taking an antibiotic that one time. So when they threatened to slap me and I didn’t comply they had to slap me. And apologized right after. I don’t remember either time as I was about 3 years old.

    My parents took away this lesson: Never threaten to do something you don’t actually want to do.

    And guess what? They never hit me aside from that and I turned out fine.

    And I’m much more well adjusted than pretty much all my cousins on my dad’s side.

    Despite severe mental illness and Asperger’s on my part.

    Do you want to know why? My parents treated me like a fucking human being while I was growing up. And explained the reasoning behind their decisions to me.

    You can reason with a toddler. You just have to get creative with your words.

  • Knitting Cat Lady

    Especially if kids are not that verbal yet they often have the problem of knowing what they need and not being able to express it, because they don’t have the words yet.

    Wanting to say something and not being able to is incredibly frustrating.

    I suspect that my relative lack of tantrums as a small child was likely due to my rapid speech development. I used the German equivalent to aerofoil when talking about planes. As a 4 year old…

    Seriously, kids are way more reasonable than adults give them credit for. You just need patience.

  • bekabot

    Yet when grown men, like Trump or Kavanaugh or Anderson, throw fits and stomp and pout in public, they get nothing but praise and affirmation from this crowd. Have said before; will say again: with these people, babies weeks old are expected to act like centenarian sages, but grown folk, men especially, are allowed (if not encouraged) to thump their chests and swear. It does not compute.

  • bekabot

    They’ve substituted bragging about thwacking their kids for bragging about their kids’ test scores or dishing about their own ailments. It sounds (weirdly) almost exactly the same.

  • Friend

    Lately I have more difficulty trying to discuss controversial topics with young adults. They tend to take a firm position and just interrupt and repeat themselves. This is not new, but I think it’s more intense these days in a country that, as we keep hearing, is “sharply divided.”

    (ETA: Taking a firm position isn’t unique to young adults, but I haven’t had to change strategies in talking with younger kids or people my age. We are all living in argumentative times.)

  • Friend

    It is bragging. “This works for me, what’s wrong with YOU?” And it plays on a parent’s deepest fears, because there is never a guarantee that a kid will turn out well, even with the wisest parents in the world.

  • bekabot

    Kids These Days strike me as being better people than I was at their age or than my approximate cohort was at the same stage of life; that is, they’re better people in the sense that they’re much more polite and self-disciplined and well-behaved. None of which means they’re more open-minded – they’re not. But, I don’t feel inclined to complain about this, for a couple of reasons. The first is that every good quality has its corresponding defect and that if you want the one thing you’ll often have to put up with the other. The second is that people my age (and just slightly older and just slightly younger) had a long list of the qualities we wanted to see in the next generation or two, and open-mindedness was not one of those traits (we thought we’d more than taken care of that aspect of things ourselves). IOW, we got what we asked for, to an absolutely spooky number of decimal places, and I consider it churlish first to ask for something and then to complain when you get it. ‘Be careful what you wish for’ is a proverb whose usefulness will never wear out, for exactly this reason. JMO.

  • Friend

    Great insights, thanks. Most of the teens and young adults I know are taking good risks of one kind or another–a hard job or too many difficult classes. That does suggest they will be stubborn and determined in every way. I do agree that this is a serious and generally polite young generation.

    We really did try for open mindedness, both in the family and with young visitors. Never told who we voted for. Always started by asking “what do you think?” and then “what would happen if…?” Often added, “why do you think somebody would disagree with that?” Now some folks seem less inclined to think about an answer. They state a talking point.

    This might just be in my circle, but many articles have been written about getting through the holidays with politically divided families. As you say, JMO.

  • Iain Lovejoy

    I am not sure I understand: how old was your sibling when they were beaten for four hours? Are you saying that this was the first and last time in their entire life that they ever lost their temper (because this would seem to be very unusual if so)? Also, just to clarify, if this only happened to your sibling, does this mean neither you nor any of your other siblings ever lost their temper, or were you not beaten for four hours, or did you still lose your tempers despite being beaten?
    Finally, if there were in fact “MANY” spankings (and therefore presumably “MANY” of these “minor infringements”) after that, exactly how is it that these “spankings” were being easy or effective in getting kids to behave?

  • Iain Lovejoy

    It computes exactly; it’s completely consistent. You beat those smaller than you for trying to do as they please because having them subservient makes you feel bigger and more important, whilst you admire those bigger than you for getting away with doing just as they please because they are able to do what you want to do, but can’t.

  • bekabot

    Yes, but in the meantime, you never get what you (say you) want, which is the consideration which counts with me. (Though I guess it’s all good if you like to complain.)

  • AFo

    Pediatricians don’t know anything about raising kids? They specialize in children’s health. It’s right there in the name. I would certainly trust their word over Lori’s.

  • hotapplepie

    I’m crying. Two grown adults taking turns abusing a young child for FOUR HOURS until she’s “broken”?!? I’m convinced that she’s a sociopath. No normal, loving parent could do that to a child.

  • Friend

    Right… pediatricians usually don’t know anything about raising a child “especially in today’s day and age.” In other words, pediatric medicine continues to advance, while Lori’s views become more and more backward—er, eternal and biblical.

  • Jen (*.*)

    I need to back up. My parents believed that every child is born with the spirit of rebellion that must be dealt with, or else they will grow up to be rebellious (rebellion against God was the biggest fear). What others called “willful” was a manifestation of the rebellious spirit. So, they were on the lookout for it from the day of birth.

    The temper tantrum incident was a battle of wills (i.e., rebellion against authority). After the four hours the child (my older brother) finally obeyed/relented, signifying that the rebellious spirit was broken off. My parents said the other three of us took various lengths of time to comply during a willful incident (meaning not doing what the parent ordered), but that one took the longest. We were all very, very young (under four). I have no memory of when it happened to me, but I have a lot of memory loss from childhood.

    Anyway, after that point, none of us dared go against our parents, especially because of continuous spankings. Mine spanked for almost every infraction, right when it happened. Not because we were warned before and chose to disobey. It was for anything, like being too loud or just accidents when we didn’t realize the implications of a situation like an adult would. Spankings were the ultimate parental tool.

    It was mixed with authoritarianism, so for example, we were told explicitly what to do in various situations (what to tell a friend who wasn’t being nice, how to respond to people asking if we believed in Santa, etc.). No reasoning, no nuance, no space to grow or develop. All that mattered was that we behaved and looked perfect to the world. Total control is the easy way of doing it when you’re working with little robots.

    That’s a long answer…

  • Iain Lovejoy

    Lori boasts that through beating a it will never have a “temper tantrum” again. If your parents were following the same pattern, what Lori actually appears to mean is that she has beaten a child for hours until they cease fighting back and instead passively accept the abuse, and the child then learns never to fight their abusers again. This is making me sick, and more angry than sick.

  • SAO

    It took me some time into adulthood to fully understand my body, but we expect a toddler to do it? To know that he’s cranky because it’s past lunch time (when he can’t tell time) and then to ask politely for lunch? Instead of seeing and smelling the cookie kiosk and suddenly really, really wanting a cookie.

    Kids don’t even know the words for their feelings unless an adult teaches them. So, is it hunger? Or is it ‘willfulness’, ‘sin’ or ‘rebellion’?

  • paganheart

    Probably never investigated because she is white and wealthy, and CPS social workers and administrators are rather notorious for ignoring complaints about abuse in wealthy white families, or glossing them over with excuses…while they throw the proverbial book at poor and non-white families, for relatively minor offenses like leaving kids unsupervised, or letting them play outside barefoot….

    At least, that’s what often happens here in AZ, according to a good friend of mine who used to work for our equivalent of CPS (called DCS now.) I doubt it’s much different in Southern California, where Lori lives, and probably for the same reasons.

    For example, my friend once received a complaint from an administrator at a private school, regarding a mom–white, wealthy and from the well-off suburb of Scottsdale–who frequently had alcohol on her breath when she dropped her (hungry, dirty, often sick) kids at school. My friend claimed that before she could investigate, a supervisor interfered and, basically, told her to drop it. My friend was informed that investigating this mom was “dangerous” and not worth the trouble, because mom came from a family with money, who could hire attorneys who would “make life hell” for the agency. Said mom was also related to a politician who had been hostile to funding for the agency in the past, and was likely to be even more hostile if one of their family members was targeted. Therefore, it would be best, said the supervisor, if an administrator was allowed to notify the mom’s family and let them “deal with the issue.”

    Add in the isolated bubbles that conservative, white Christians tend to live in, their hostility to goverrnment, and our general fear of interfering with anyone’s “religious freedumb” in the US, and you probably have a lot of families like Lori’s getting away with horrendous abuse.

  • Jen (*.*)

    Yup. In that world personal autonomy is not allowed. Beatings aren’t considered abuse. Men keeping women in line is not abuse. Marital rape isn’t abuse. It’s a culture of abuse that leaves everyone vulnerable. It took a therapist for me to realize this is *not* OK.

    Anger is good. I wish people on the outside had spoken up for me. But then again, I don’t think anyone had the chance to see what was actually going on behind closed doors. To this day everyone I knew from back then still says I had great my parents.

  • Skansen

    I am so sorry that you had to grow up in an environment like that. Sorry and angry on behalf of all kids being subjected to that kind of abuse.

  • Friend

    I had a neighbor who used phrases like “willful disobedience” to describe her children, the oldest of whom was six when they arrived and eight when they moved away. I just didn’t think such young children were capable of forming motives, being deliberately defiant, etc.

    She was a wooden spoon mom. One time she struck the oldest kid for saying “darn,” presumably because it was a gateway word.

  • Friend

    I’ve reread your comment a couple of times today. You are fortunate to have had such humane and loving parents. And your parents are fortunate that you recognize their efforts.

  • persephone

    I’ve said it before, and I’m sticking to it: if it comes down to her kids having to take Lori on when she starts declining mentally and physically (well, worse than she has), odds are they’re going to dump her in the cheapest facility they can find.

    ETA: Possibly a better facility, guilt, you know, but I doubt they’ll visit, at all.

  • persephone

    The creator of the comic strip “For Better or For Worse” grew up with an abusive mother. Her mother was careful to only beat her and her brother where it wouldn’t show when she was wearing clothes. She said she could tell what her mother had beaten her with by the shape of the bruise. http://cartoonician.com/the-lynn-johnston-interview/

  • persephone

    I know, everyone hates Dr. Phil, but he made a point about corporal punishment with a young mother. She slapped her toddler daughter’s hand as punishment, then was upset when her daughter avoided her and didn’t want to go out with her, and had started acting aggressively.

    Dr. Phil told her to hit his hand the way she would her daughter’s. The woman refused. So Phil confronted her about it. Why was it okay for her to hit a small child, but not to hit an adult, an adult asking her to do so. You could see the connections flipping in the woman’s brain.

  • Knitting Cat Lady

    Now you made me blush!

  • Saraquill

    “Love, tough love, helping, discipline, encouragement, teaching moment…”

  • Saraquill

    My brother used to attend a posh private school. Said school locked him in a closet for an afternoon, pissed my parents enough to transfer him, and never experienced other consequences.

    In retrospect, I’m jealous that school did something so blatant. I was never pulled out of my different but also posh, abusive school.

  • Saraquill

    I know someone who things spanking offspring is sexy. They don’t understand why I screamed.

  • lady_black

    I’ve found two ways that seemed to work for tantrums. The first one applies to tantrums not in front of others. Ignore them. Leave the room. If they follow you, move again. Close the door if necessary. If they whine, tell them your ears don’t hear whining, and to speak in a normal voice.
    My middle son liked throwing a fit when it was time to leave preschool. When he did, my husband would say “Come on, if you’re going to dance, dance for everyone. You aren’t stomping or shrugging your shoulders enough. Come on, dance. I want to see it.” That usually stopped the show, because even a young child understands how foolish they look doing that.
    When he would fall out in the grocery store, I would just ignore him, and continue with my shopping. The net result was that he stopped what he was doing, and ran to catch up with me, and that was the end of the fit. I tried not to have to take him in the first place, but that’s not always possible.
    It’s never necessary to hit a child for a temper tantrum. Then you have TWO of you acting out. You don’t teach children self control by losing control yourself. If we were some place like an amusement park, that they enjoyed, I would get down on their level, look them in the eye, and ask if they ever wanted to come back. Of course, they did. So, I would tell them they better stop acting out, right now. Otherwise, we will leave, and I will never bring you back. That works with kids a little bit older than pre-school age. With younger kids, it’s just better not to allow them to get over-stimulated, and over tired, so you just take them and leave when they’ve had enough.
    Let natural consequences be the best teacher. And THAT philosophy works at every age.

  • Martha Anne Underwood

    Lori Alexander and others like her are child abusers and have no business being around children. Also, they really belong in jail!

  • Allison the Great

    I’m convinced that people like the Pearls and Lori don’t actuallylike and didn’t want children. Debi had them because she was expected to and Mikey wanted more people to torture. Lori had them so she wouldn’t have to go to work anymore. Honestly I couldn’t read all of what Lori had to say about raising children. Seriously, if you don’t understand that babies wriggle, cry, accidentally bite you while breast-feeding and do all sorts of things that babies normally do, (duh, they’re babies, they don’t know any better) don’t have them, period. Beating a baby to force them to act much older than they are is something a sociopath would do. If this does indeed please some god-type figure then that doesn’t say anything good about the god, does it?

    I do not understand for the life of me how these people have the gall to say that those (me) who don’t want children are selfish, while they beat the tar out of infants and children so that these kids don’t act like kids. They say we don’t want to inconvenience ourselves, but then they turn around and talk about violently training children to behave in a way that is more convenient for the adult. Hmmm, which one is more harmful, knowing one isn’t the parenting type and deciding to forgo parenthood, or having a kid as a means to an end (Lori) and going out of one’s way to beat and harm the kids for acting like the kids they are? There are more humane ways to teach a child how to behave, Lori just doesn’t care.

  • Allison the Great

    The woman does seem to have a problem with empathy.

  • Taylor

    The part about “wrong thinking” really bothered me, too. It was likely something as simple as the oldest girl having ambition and wanting to actually achieve something in life rather than sit home doing nothing all day. But Father Dearest “corrected” it, and now she’s a woman-child like her parents and the Pearls wanted.

  • B.A.

    They should be reported to CPS! This is horrible.

  • B.A.

    Lori and all of these people are nothing but sadistic psychopaths. 🙁

  • Ann Lunsford

    I can’t stand awful and lazy parents who have to resort to spanking. I suppose a smack on the hand to a toddler trying to stick a fork into an electrical outlet is warranted and not traumatizing. A child that young won’t understand why it could kill them. But a belt for not picking up toys? I was spanked for less. It stopped when I began hitting back. This builds resentment in children unless you can successfully brainwash them into having Stockholm Syndrome which is exactly what it sounds like. Children have no choice but to love and rely on their abusers. It certainly didn’t teach me how to behave getting smacked around and spanked. It taught me how to be sneaky. And made me despise the people who “did it out of love”. They can remember that when they die alone in a nursing home. This will make a child hate their parents if they have more than two brain cells rubbing together. Awful and impractical advice.

  • Jencendiary

    There are some things that aren’t matters for opinion. There are positions where on one side is decency and the other is age-old bigotry. We’re not entertaining that anymore.

  • Friend

    Heartily agree.

  • Zeldacat

    To this day my stepdad doesn’t recognize how cranky he gets when he’s hungry, and he’s well past young childhood. Mom learned years ago when to make him eat something to stave off a big fight because he can’t read his body’s signals and they both have quite the tempers. In his defense he’s had major stomach problems over the years, so I’m betting the “I’m hungry” pathways are messed up. But it doesn’t make it easier to be around him when he really really needs to eat!

    And even if it’s not hunger, I can imagine that being a toddler is intensely frustrating a lot of the time. All these IDEAS! And everybody says NO! I’d lose my temper too!

  • Sassafras

    These people will strike a small child who’s not likely to fight back, but won’t even dare hit another adult.

  • BridgetD

    I can’t read all of this. It makes me rage.