Do We Need Michael Voris?

Michael Voris

Until now I have kept mum about the controversial self appointed prophet Michael Voris. However, yesterday I viewed his latest video in which he ‘exposes’ the salaries of people he disparagingly calls ‘professional Catholics.’ He calls out Catholic radio host Al Kresta, author and founder of the apologetics apostolate Karl Keating and his employees Tim Staples and Jimmy Akin. He accuses them of taking exorbitant salaries, then proclaims that his salary is only $40,000.00.

It’s not necessarily a bad thing to hold people accountable and to make sure our ministries are financially sound and communications are transparent.

However, there are serious problems with the way Voris has made his criticism. First of all, what status has he as a Catholic watchdog?  Who appointed him as the policeman of all Catholic apostolates?  Are the financial situation of Catholic Answers and Al Kresta any of his business? Does he have all the facts? Has he checked them? Furthermore, judging another person’s financial status is always dangerous. Money is a very relative thing and we have no idea how the other guy earns it or uses it.

I learned this as a Protestant. There was this rich guy called R.G.LeTourneau who made a pile of cash inventing a better bulldozer of something like that. He lived like a prince. I think he had a ranch in Texas, homes elsewhere, his own jet, a yacht—whatever. I don’t know the details, but I know lots of Christians pointed the finger and accused him of being a rich hypocrite. When he died it turned out that he had quietly given away 90% of his wealth and was living like a prince on 10%.

Therefore it is very ill advised to start judging people on their financial status unless we have all the facts. Clearly when there is dishonesty, greed or overwhelming corruption something must be done and whistles must be blown, but unless that is the case it’s a big mistake to start throwing stones just because somebody has a salary of X amount of dollars. So, for example, Keating’s or Kresta’s salaries might come from the royalties of books they have written, and maybe the royalties are far higher than the salary, but they put all the money into the apostolate, and only take their salary. I have known this to be the case, and if it is, then rather than taking an exorbitant salary the person may be living on less than they could be making with the rest going into the Lord’s work, and the accountants may have advised them to do it that way so they and the apostolate are on the most secure footing. Unless you know what he does with that money and where it comes from–indeed unless you are privy to the full financials you better keep quiet.

Then there is the problem of criticizing another person’s wealth at all. The social teaching of the church makes it clear that there is nothing wrong with a person accumulating wealth as the result of their hard work and enterprise. These are laypeople with families. They have not taken a vow of poverty. Why should they not get a fair wage for the hard work they do? Why should they not be rewarded properly for the education, learning and ministry they give to the church? The question is not really how much they are paid, but what they do with it. If they are good stewards of their blessings great. If they are living opulent lives, then comment and criticize.

So what if they are “professional Catholics”? Would that we had more of them. Would that ordinary Catholics gave so generously that we could afford to hire more “professional Catholics” who are well educated, devoted and ready to serve God and his church. Our good colleges and universities are pumping out well educated, enthusiastic and eager young Catholics who would make great DREs, evangelists, youth workers, organists and choir directors, school teachers and administrators, but Catholics are too stingy to tithe and parishes can’t afford to hire them. Give us more professional Catholics not fewer!

The next problem with Voris’ attack is that his method is unscriptural. The Sacred Scriptures teach us that if you have a problem with your brother you are to go to them first in private. Did Voris sit down in a meeting with Keating, Kresta, Keck and the others? If he thought it was his business did he make an appointment and say, “Fellas, there are some criticisms about the level of your salaries, could we gather some more information?” I don’t know, maybe he did or maybe he simply got in front of the camera and started blasting away. The Sacred Scriptures teach that if the person does not hear you after a private meeting you are to go with two or three brothers for a second meeting. Did this happen, or did Voris simply dish the “dirt”. Lest people accuse me for doing the same thing, the scripture was talking about a private affair that should be kept private before becoming public. I’m criticizing Voris publicly for an action he has already made public himself. Public wrongdoing can be corrected publicly and if amends are due they should be made publicly.

An even more worrying problem is the link back to Catholic Answers’ program criticizing radical Catholics. I have not heard the program, but I’ve done some radio shows with these guys, (BTW I did not receive a fee ) and they’re solid, sensible and level headed Catholic apologists. If they criticized radical Catholics, so have I. When we do, we are careful to repeat over and over again that we love the traditionalist movement. If they are like me they say time and again that the vast majority of traditionalist Catholics are good, God fearing faithful Catholics. They love the liturgy. They l0ve the church. They love their families. We are on their side–and that’s exactly why we criticize the RADICAL traditionalists. We criticize the extremists because the extremists are actually hurting the traditionalists we admire and support. This is not rocket science. We are NOT criticizing traditionalists or the Latin Mass or the traditionalist movement. We’re criticizing the lunatic fringe of the movement. We’re criticizing the angry, sedevacantists, anti Semitic, misogynistic, paranoid conspiracy theory loons. We criticize them because if the traditionalist cause is not careful they will allow these high volume, vocal extremists to do great damage to their own cause and to the Catholic Church and the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Therefore the most worrying thing about Voris’ attack on Catholic Answers, EWTN and others is that it seems like some kind of sick revenge thing. So the guys at Catholic Answers had just one program criticizing the lunatic fringe of the traditionalist movement and a counter attack is launched? For what end? To destroy Catholic Answers and EWTN? To bring down Al Kresta? Within Voris’ video I sensed a kind of gloating glee that Catholic Answers was in financial trouble and the implication that they were down because of their criticism of the traditionalist movement and that it was because traditionalists had withheld donations that CA was going down.

Please do not misunderstand this post. Because I am criticizing this video of Voris does not mean I dislike Michael. I don’t know him. It also doesn’t mean that I condemn everything he says. The few other videos of his that I have watched I pretty much agree with. If I have worries about this particular video of his it does not mean that there should not be whistle blowers in the church or that laypeople should not play this role.

However, I have to be blunt. There is a certain type of personality that is never happy unless it has an enemy, and the enemy they like best are the ones around their own table. This dynamic exists in many different types of groups, but I’ve seen it most in many religious situations. A little group gathers together and they all feel good about their group because they’re right. However, they are never secure in their rectitude. They always feel a bit insecure and the most insecure even feel paranoid. So they begin to blame everyone else for being wrong, for being heretics, for being apostates. Then they feel snug and warm and good about themselves and their little religious group for a little while until the next “enemy” appears. Then they can go on the attack again with their smug self righteousness.

I recognize this sick dynamic. I’ve been in too many groups where this was going on.

Furthermore, I admit that I recognize this sick dynamic because I behave that way sometimes too.

I have also sought to remove the speck from my brother’s eye before removing the plank in my own.

And for this I repent unconditionally.

 

UPDATE: A commenter has asked about my salary. Although I have a wife and four children I receive no more than the salary and benefits of every other priest in my diocese. I minister more widely and help support my family through writing and speaking. Of this extra income I tithe 15% back to my parish. I don’t think it’s smart to put specific financial information online, but if anyone wants more information they can drop me an email.

UPDATE: A sentence in the post which may have been construed as lack of appreciation for all the dedicated people who faithfully serve our church as volunteers has been removed, and I apologize for causing offense.

 

About Fr. Dwight Longenecker
  • http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/ Manny

    Absolutely. No one should criticize what other people make unless it’s through hypocrisy or fraud. I don’t know what Jimmy Aikin makes but he is worth a heck of lot of money in my opinion. The man is brilliant. And plus, as you point out, it’s also what you do with your money. I watch an occasional Voris daily clip (and it seems less frequently lately) but 75% of the time I cringe at what he says. He’s one of those people who seems to be all vinegar and no understanding.

    • Cassandra

      Aikins brilliant?! Perhaps you missed the episode where he was trying to defend taking the host out of somebody’s mouth on the basis that saliva is “consuming” the host. Goes back to an incident in a Southwest parish where an impaired boy would spit out the host from his mouth, so his father would fish it out first to consume it himself. Aikin’s defense was just looney, and overlooked the obvious issue over whether the boy should be receiving at all since he couldn’t discern the Body. But that wouldn’t have been “Nice Church”.

      • http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/ Manny

        I have no idea what you’re talking about. Even if your portrayal of the situation is accurate, everyone, including a genius, is allowed an error or two.

        • Jasper0123

          the status quo is good enough for you.

          • http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/ Manny

            I around charging our bishops are traitors and liars.

      • Susan in Saskatchewan

        The boy shouldn’t receive communion because of his mental impairment that prevents his understanding the true meaning of the host? Perhaps the boy has very strong aversions to things in his mouth and struggles to keep anything there. Or to textures such as that found in the host. We can’t deny Christ to those who need his strength the most, especially those who are mentally handicapped. If that boy spits out the host because he rejects Jesus, then it is us to God to decide and to judge him. Not us mere mortals. Because I know with certainty that I am rarely, if ever, fit to receive the gift of communion at all. It is a gift that I gratefully receive.

        • Brian Anthony

          um on the same note however thats why we have an age for first holy communion, becasue children beneath the age of reason, toddlers and infants cannot discern the gift of the eucharist, so in order to be consistent it would make sense to not distribute to those who cannot discern the gift. if we give it to mentally handicapped we should give it to babies too, by some peopl’e logic…

          • David Thomas

            Holy Communion for infants was Roman Rite tradition up until somewhat recently and is still practiced in the Eastern Churches, even the ones in Communion with Rome (Melkite, Ukrainainian, Ruthenian, etc). My children had their first Communion at their Baptism in the Eastern Orthodox Church and within a few months would open wide when they saw the Chalice to receive Jesus. Of course, it is easier to give a baby Communion on a spoon as they do in the East.

          • Patrick

            Well..Not all Catholics discriminate against the young. We Eastern Catholics do not have an age for first holy communion. We choose to give all the sacraments of initiation at one time.

          • Susan Peterson

            Actually, the Eastern Catholic churches do give the Eucharist to babies, who receive all the sacraments of initiation when they are baptized. Since communion is given to adults as a small piece of leavened bread soaked in wine (I speak of the appearances) on a long handled golden spoon, this works out well for babies as well. As to “not discerning” -do infants understand what is being promised for them at baptism? If you take that road you could wind up a Baptist. Neither do any of us really understand the gift of receiving Our Lord in Holy Communion. Eastern Catholic infants grow up receiving Our Lord.

    • CRO

      That is because you have no conviction as a Catholic. As a Catholic you should be willing to be strung up for your passion as our Lord did.
      Weak limp wristed Catholics are actually protestants that are having an identity crisis.
      If you are Catholic, grow a back bone and stand up for the faith instead of being “inclusive!”
      Jesus said he would be divisive.

      • SusanL

        I’m going to say this: I’m a convert and I’ve been attending the N. O. mass for over ten years. I’ve been interested in attending the Latin mass. After reading posts like yours, CRO (and sadly, there are a quite a few hostile people like you out there), I have to keep reminding myself that the Latin Mass is not a mirror of people like you. Otherwise I would develop a strong dislike for it. I’m going to distance myself from this thread because I would still like to attend the Latin Mass and I don’t want it ruined. I know a young man who talks like you do and I de-friended him from my fb page because of this kind of talk.

        Lest you think that I’m picking on just you….I’m not. This is the second article that I’ve read where the combox is full….just full…of venomous posters who, in my opinion, are crossing over into idol worship of Mr. Voris.

        I’ve said my piece. I’m going to go pray and consider how much I want to donate to Catholic Answers. It sounds like they could use some financial help.

      • http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/ Manny

        What are you talking about? And what do you know about the strength of my faith? What are you basing your comment on? Frankly I don’t care what your answer is. Just buzz off.

  • question

    >> The next problem with Voris’ attack is that his method is unscriptural. The Sacred Scriptures teach us that if you have a problem with your brother you are to go to them first in private.

    Can you explain why you did not contact Voris before publishing this piece, then?

    • Rodrigo Sousa

      >>Can you explain why you did not contact Voris before publishing this piece, then?<<

      Simply because: whatever (SHIT) is made in PUBLIC, has to be fixed in PUBLIC.

      Got that bro?

      • iamhdr

        CA is publicly asking for donations and using layoff and cuts in salary as a means to get them. That’s public as well.

      • Patrick

        Nice language Mr. Sousa. On the blog of a priest as well.

      • David L Alexander

        Bro???

    • SusanL

      Did you not read the article? He answered that very question. Go back and read the whole thing.

    • Anne Jeffries

      Hello! Did you not read and comprehend what Fr. L. wrote? The rule applies to private matters. It wasn’t private. It was public. Public airing of dirty laundry begets a public rebuke. ‘Nuff said.

  • Nicole Resweber

    Thank you! And to answer your title…no. His videos I’ve seen seem to enjoy spitting bile more than spreading balm.

  • Suzy

    Haven’t followed Voris, have been familiar with Protestant “ministries” where the leader lives like a king, the workers live in poverty and the ministry is always begging for funds on the verge of a crisis. I worked briefly in one of those “ministries.” I saw the way the appeal letters were generated, I saw the way that the head of the ministry dressed, lived, ate, and conducted himself (and he had royalties floating around as well). The funding raising letters were always overblown in terms of what was actually being accomplished. The head of the ministry had to be catered to as far as food was concerned while the workers in one facility were reduced to eating mostly donated day old Dunkin Doughnuts. Our facility would not have survived without the good hearted people of the town it was located int (the milkman delivered free milk and juice for example). Meanwhile the head of the ministry was pleading for his impoverished workers to donate more money to the work as a whole (from what support they were receiving from friends and family). It all left a very bad taste in my mouth and this was before the PTL scandal. At home I had a pastor who took only $15 a week from his very poor church and worked a 44 hour a week job to support his family, while still doing all the pastoral work. I don’t think that’s right either. The workman is worthy of a fair recompense. I haven’t supported Catholic Answers for quite some time, not because of the traditionalist thing, but because the tone of what came out of there just didn’t sit right with me. Karl’s book on Fundamentalism is an example of only talking about extremes (Bart Brewer certainly isn’t a typical fundamentalist) and he really doesn’t appear to understand much of the fundamentalist world at all. At the same time, there was information in there about Catholicism that was helpful to me before my conversion. I don’t have a dog in this fight at all, but I do think that perhaps it’s important for the people running apostolates to take some of what Pope Francis says about living in luxury to heart. There’s always the danger to “professional Christians” of assuming that the lavish lifestyle of some of their donors is what they should be trying to have themselves. We’ve had the same problem with some of our bishops and it hasn’t played well with the culture at large. The culture knows we’re not supposed to be wedded to materialism, even if we don’t always know it ourselves.

  • Yankeesprof

    Bravo, father! BTW, I did listen to all the CA programs on Rad trads and your comments were spot on with what Tim and Patrick said.

  • bill bannon

    Salaries should be public knowledge if said person or institution is asking money from the Catholic public. Google Bill Donahue Salary. You’ll faint since it equals that of a brain surgeon and if you realize that many older, Boston/ Brooklyn, just making it on social security, skip eating out Catholics send him money at the Catholic Defense League without their knowing that he can afford dinner at Manhattan’s Per Se if he so chose.

  • steve5656546346

    Catholic Answers had TWO programs, not one, on “radical traditionalists,” and an insulting posting after the first. Still, their problem was lack of understanding, not malice.

    Traditionalists, and others, encounter much greater and ongoing problems on their Forums.

    Finally, there is something much deeper going on here: the issue of what our basic approach should be going forward. Were the approaches adopted at Vatican II, and even more so afterwards, pastoral in fact? Effective in fact? Engaging the culture so as to convert, in fact?

    Or do human beings have a human nature: with societies being the sum total of the humans in them? If so, things go in cycles (rebellion; repentance), and technology changes, but the APPROACH that should be taken is basically the same as taken by Jesus, the saints, and the popes through the ages. For example, should Vatican II have given the REASON for evangelization (to save souls) as did Christ and all the saints, or has something fundamentally changed? And is modern society even coherent enough to engage through dialogue? Is it wise to constantly seek to be modern? And so on.

    • chasso

      Do you have links to those 2 programs? I searched their web site and didn’t see any. Thanks.

  • charlie

    If he wants to go after someone, I suggest making Food For the Poor your target at which to aim. Massive scandal, multiple holding companies that are merely funnels to channel the donations back to the Mahfood family, and more.

  • Emily

    I have listened to all of the segments on Radical Traditionalism at Catholic Answers and I am baffled by the beating that CA has taken over those. They point out several times that the Extraordinary Form of the Mass is celebrated there and they are *not* talking about traditionally-minded Catholics, but those who have placed themselves outside of the Catholic Church. IMHO, they have been fair (and clear) in their handling of the matter.

  • Christine Niles

    “The Sacred Scriptures teach us that if you have a problem with your brother you are to go to them first in private.”

    Did you go to Michael Voris first in private before publicly charging him with an attitude of “sick revenge” and “gloating glee”?

    I am sorry, Father–you completely missed the point of this Vortex episode. It had nothing at all to do with comparing wealth, but with the temptation that such wealth presents to people charged with honestly and forthrightly defending the Faith. The reason certain mainstream apologists don’t risk breathing a word about the scandals in the hierarchy is most likely because their income depends on being in the good graces of the bishops–many who disapprove of publicly discussing scandal, and who would turn on them in a heartbeat and make them persona non grata in their dioceses. It happens.

    When you’re making $250K a year, and you know that the only way to ensure you maintain that level of income is not offending the bishops in order to guarantee that you can still speak in their dioceses, you are going to be tempted to stay mum on scandals. That’s just human nature.

    • James

      I’m surprised how many people on this forum seem to be missing the public nature of Voris’s act and therefore fail to distinguish properly between Voris stirring up a hornet’s nest where one didn’t exist and Father Longenecker’s correction of that public act. Where a public act has been committed, Catholic moral theology distinguishes this from an act that has been committed in private.

      So if Voris had written a letter to Keating and the others accusing them of making exorbitant salaries and Father Longenecker had criticized him publicly, this may have been worthy of criticism. But where an act is public, the correction should be public. Or have we forgotten that Catholic priests have a duty to instruct and guide the faithful where a public scandal or offense is involved? I’m not taking sides on the ultimate dispute, because I haven’t seen Mr. Voris’s video yet, but the issue of public correction of public error is simple Catholic moral theology.

      • CT Catholic Corner

        You are uninformed. The hornets nest was buzzing a day BEFORE Voris said anything. Go read it Kathy Schiffer on Patheos’ blog asking for money for Catholic Answers- the uproar is in the comments by UNHAPPY Catholics. Then go to Creative Minority where the unhappiness spilled over. Voris merely picked up the story from those two sources. The uproar was already in full swing.

  • Kit

    I take him for what he is, I enjoy his videos, and somebody’s got to be stamping their feet and yelling about that absolute, mind-boggling idiocy that’s going on. Maybe he starts fires and runs away, but at least he lit a fire to start with. And frankly, people like Voris (whom I believe do a necessary service) occasionally run off the rails. It’s the nature of the creature. And he’s not walking around apologizing for being an orthodox Catholic, which is a refreshing change.

  • Guest

    Amen, and Amen, and Amen, and Amen to your last four lines – I come as you do – having been judgmental too quickly too often, myself!!!! So,we are easily offended with others who do, and are doing it, it as is our subject of this blog. I also agree with Every statement you made, and think you speak for others of us, who dared not.

    I am a Convert who loves the Church and all of Rome.

    “Rome has spoken, the matter is closed.” St Augustine! I hardly think we need someone screaming at us as though we have no GOD appointed leader.

    PS God bless the Soul of Mr. Voris

  • http://rosarynovice.stblogs.com/ Augustine

    You mean that these fine Catholic professionals make north of $100,000, even a QUARTER of a million? I have to say that, as a professional in the IT industry, those lower salaries are a little above starter engineering salaries, especially in San Diego. As a matter of fact, I feel even more confident that CA, EWTN and RR use my meager donations judiciously, not to further personal fortunes, but their ministries.

  • bullschuck

    I don’t follow Voris. I seem to follow folks who are occasionally critical of him and I don’t know that I would enjoy talking to him over a beer. But I have to say, we are a big-tent Church. And while you never came close to kicking him out, I think we need folks like Voris in our Church. Just like we need Father Feelgood and Sister Liturgical Invention. We need to be constantly challenged about what we believe and what we know. As an example, our Church would not have definitively answered the question of women’s ordination if the question had never been asked. We wouldn’t have allowances for female altar servers unless we had folks challenging our assumptions about what liturgical actions were truly priestly in nature. While heresy in and of itself is always wrong (please don’t think I’m calling Voris a heretic though), it always provides a way forward, an opportunity to correct, a chance to really crystallize the Faith in a new way. We run the risks of falling into a rut of confirmation bias (not related to the sacrament) and give occasion to groupthink unless we are open to those with different opinions.

    That said, I do wish Voris had more charity. And I think your criticism of his actions being contrary to the scriptural direction for dealing with internal Church division is spot on.

  • Magdalene

    Yes, we need Voris. No one else is shedding light on things of darkness within our Church and we need to know. The CRS or CCHD with their donations to organizations that support intrinsic evils should be known! I want my donations to truly help people, body and soul.
    Anyone who thinks there is no corruption in the Church has their head in the sand.

  • Baptismal Vows

    Voris represents a valuable service to the Church. He does what many are afraid to do. I am generalizing here but I found that those who dislike him are the ones who are afraid of confrontation, the “can’t we all get just along attitude” crowd. Those who don’t like to fight. The problem is that sometimes a Christian has to shake things up, even if it means getting us out of our comfort zones. The point is that we need confrontation in the Church today (Catholics who are not afraid to say it like it is and call others out – even bishops). That’s his point too.
    This being said Voris is not infallible either. It was unnecessary to call out these other Catholics. Catholic Answers, Kresta, et al… are doing a great service for the Church. It is unreasonable for them not to be paid a due wage (especially for guys like Staples and Akins who live in high cost of living So Cal). I am more than happy to contribute to Catholic Answers, Church Militant TV and Catholic Radio if it means spreading the faith and bringing people to Our Lord.

  • Church Militant

    Voris does what many weak-kneed Catholics see but lack the courage to do it. He exposes charlatans, profiteers and problems in the Church. He’s a hero to many!

  • Chris

    I agree with your assessment of the situation and have felt the same way for a while, but I have a question… did you take this to Mr.Voris in private first?

  • http://pegponderingagain.com/ Peg Demetris

    I don’t need him, but I pray for his conversion back home – I find him doing more damage then good. http://pegponderingagain.com/2013/08/02/the-blame-game-fake-war/

  • mariamgal

    Thank you, Fr. Longenecker, for your great article and insightful comments. When any of us Catholics remove ourselves from living the Gospel of Jesus Christ, His Gospel of love, charity, compassion, understanding, forgiving, consoling, self giving and sacrifice, the devil and his minions take over very quickly. This is the spiritual battle we have to fight every single day: love God with all our heart, soul, mind, and strength, and our neighbor as ourselves. We are not capable of accomplishing this Commandments unless we abide in Our Lord ALL THE TIME!
    May God abundantly bless you and the ministry He has called you to do for His Greater Glory! +

  • Sus_1

    I’m quick to jump on what I consider fake charities that only exist to line the organization’s pockets. There are many fake breast cancer charities.

    I did wonder about the salaries for Catholic Answers. However, someone pointed out they are based out of San Diego. Considering the cost of living in the San Diego area, the salaries aren’t outrageous.

  • jarms40

    Wow. Gee…Father… I didn’t get anything LIKE what you got from the Voris piece. His point was to think about the salaries that the executives of nonprofits get paid before you give money to them. Frankly, many lawyers (me included) advise clients to do that every day of the week. Not uncharitable, practical. If Catholic Answers is having financial difficulties, maybe its compensation structure is part of the problem, no? Is the thing to do just bail them out because they do good work? Some would think they’d be a stronger organization if they had to fight through this and make different decisions about how to allocate funds. Most people give to charity because they want to do good, not necessarily to pay the senior staff – although 6-figure salaries are certainly SOMETIMES justified, say for heads of colleges or hospital systems where there is extreme competition for talent. Voris’ other point is that, at some level, you have to wonder whether money slants the charity’s message. Again, it’s hard for me to see why that’s not a fair question. +Kicanas certainly believes he is making some kind of point, with money, in the ALL situation. Otherwise, why change vendors? Are we supposed to PRETEND that this isn’t retaliation for the perceived slight to CRS and that it isn’t an implicit WARNING to others who might want to follow through on ALL’s investigations? In any event, whether you like the WAY Voris delivers the message or not, it is hard to see how the message itself deserves your foray into amateur psychology, let alone the “sick dynamic” characterization.

    • Chesire11

      He explicitly accused “professional Catholics” of complicity in the destruction of the Holy Church in exchange for cash.

      I don’t know if that qualifies as sick, but unless he has rock solid evidence, it certainly is vicious, and gravely sinful.

      • Allan Daniel

        You judge without understanding. Voris, as he has stated numerous times, is saying that the demolition of the Catholic Church has already taken place and it is the duty of those who call themselves loyal Catholics to do something about it, and that some who could be doing something are asleep in dreamland acting as if all is well.

      • Churchill4President

        Nobody is swayed by your pious and precious mischaracterizations of Michael Voris. Catholics like you always are first in line to cast the first stone aren’t you?

        Michael Voris is a hero for speaking the truth and standing up to the professional Catholic media. It’s time to chase the money changers from the temple.

        You can’t handle the truth.

    • CRO

      Also it is important to note that Voris has never claimed to prophesize anything. I think he just say’s things as he sees them…
      I guess the truth is too much for “Fr” Dwight Longenecker!
      Maybe Fr. Dwight became a priest for all the wrong reasons.
      Heed Pope Francis’ warning when he says careerist Catholics need to find humility. Jesus speaks about hypocrites a lot and he has nothing good to say about them.

      • SusanL

        CRO, that is an ugly post. You need to go to confession.

  • Overstated much?

    What really gets me is that some Catholics are criticizing others’ salaries.

    Most of these people are extremely intelligent, hard-working, well-educated, and good at what they do, which is why they are successful. In the private sector they would make much more. So, they aren’t supposed to make a good salary just because they work for the Church or an apostolate? Give me a break. Ask any youth minister, campus minister, DRE, etc. if they think the salaries (on average) of these kind of positions are just and equitable.

    We should be CHAMPIONING those that pay more, not denigrating them!!!

    • Cassandra

      Then, hey, send your check right to them. That’s what CA is asking for. Support poor, poor Mr. Keating.

    • milk steak

      Jesus saith to him: If thou wilt be perfect, go sell what thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come follow me.

      22 – And when the young man had heard this word, he went away sad: for he had great possessions.

      23 – Then Jesus said to his disciples: Amen, I say to you, that a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven…………championing eh?

      • Dan Sealana

        Do you work for free at your job?

  • Jeff

    Maybe hurts the argument a little to use a picture that makes Voris look as absurd as possible.

    Why do Christians have such low expectations of themselves?

    If Voris blasted me for my high salary and told me I was undermining the Catholic Church, I’d invite him out for a beer and propose doing a video together.

  • http://rosarynovice.stblogs.com/ Augustine

    As many other Catholics, I was a fan of Fr. Corapi’s, a truly talented preacher who taught the true faith. However, I admit that there were some bitter things that he sneaked in that would make me cringe if I hadn’t allowed my admiration for him ignore them. And then Fr. Corapi became the Black Sheepdog and then many of those bitter things became all that he had to say.

    Among those bitter things was his open attack on bishops, instilling in the faithful the mistrust in their anointed shepherds. So, when it came the time for a bishop to bring him into the discipline of the Church, he used those homeopathic doses of mistrust administered over a long time to turn his fans against that bishop. If it weren’t for the fact that Bp. Mulvey had been a priest for many years in the diocese of Austin whom I knew personally, I’d be tempted at believing how Fr. Corapi pictured him, the antipodes of the man I know as a kind, gentle and faithful priest.

    Now, I never liked the histrionics of Voris’, or of Mariani’s for that matter, so I never followed his daily videos. But after Fr. Corapi, I became refractory to self-appointed bishop inquisitors like Voris. Unfortunately, I have many friends who follow him, so I sometimes have to temper their inquisitorial impulses every now and then when I can. For instance, recently someone was relating what he had watched on one of Voris’ videos about an interview with some insider on VII spewing absurdities that couldn’t be verified. My friend didn’t recall the expert’s name, so I blurted “Louis Cypher?”, and he immediately said that this was his name. Well, for those who haven’t watched Alan Parker’s “Angel Heart”, Louis Cypher was a character who was Lucifer in disguise. In this jest, I meant to test where that expert’s venom was coming from, and I think that I got a positive confirmation of the source I suspected.

    Self-appointed inquisitors like Voris are a scourge that poisons the flock. They are hirelings who weren’t called by the shepherds and are leading the sheep to away directly into the jaws of wolves.

    • Baptismal Vows

      I wouldn’t label Voris a “self-appointed” anything. He is simply Catholic man who has found a forum to express his ideas – and he has an audience. Good for him. By the way you are doing the same thing Augustine – using a forum to express your ideas.

      • http://rosarynovice.stblogs.com/ Augustine

        Voris has his own forum where he’s the only voice where he adds to the pervading cynicism of contemporary media. Definitely the last thing we need in the New Evangelization.

    • chasso

      So he should just give all the bishops a pass on not teaching the Truth of the Church? We should just blindly follow the bishops and their acquiescence on abortion, gay marriage, contraception, all the way to hell?

  • Suzanna

    Great post.

    Also, Catholic Answers is based in Southern California. Salaries should reflect cost of living in this crazy state.

    • Cassandra

      It Catholic Answers choice to be based in high cost SoCal. They could relocate anywhere in the US.

      • http://a-star-of-hope.blogspot.com/ JoAnna Wahlund

        Which would mean firing all their employees or forcing them to uproot their families, find new homes, incur the costs of moving, etc. plus, moving itself is expensive. Finding new office space, new data center for technology needs, moving all the office equipment, the cost of new letterhead and business cards, incorporating in another state…etc. it’s not nearly so simple or inexpensive as you seem to believe.

  • BrianKillian

    Does Voris really not see the irony in his criticism of professional Catholics?

  • Terry Fenwick

    Thank you for saying what others can’t – it needed to be heard

  • Dan

    But isn’t Michael Voris a “professional Catholic” as well? Further, isn’t it the job of the diocese of San Diego (where I believe Catholic Answers are HQed) to monitor Catholic Answers, not Mr. Voris? I’ve browsed a little through Catholic Answers out of curiosity and they seem to be on message (but often a little overzealous for my tastes).

    Although, I do have to admit that my eyebrows are raised when I see a non-clergy or non-religious person write about Catholic theology or apologetics. I suppose I have a lingering cradle-Catholic impulse to only accept bishops, priests, deacons, sisters, and brothers as religious authorities. Maybe, however, converts from Protestantism respond better to lay apologists because that’s what they are used to?

  • Fraybird

    Absolutely we need Michael Voris!! While yesterday’s Vortex episode did leave me shaking my head, I will take him warts and all. My take on it was more frustration, due to the sisification of our male Catholic Laity rather than jealousy. Very few are calling things as they are these days, especially when is comes to the corruption of many of our Bishops. My perspective is most likely slanted due to the fact I live in a diocese with an extremely corrupt “careerist” Bishop and would like nothing more than his removal so our Holy Priests can live up to their calling, like being allowed to pray in front of Planned Parenthood without repercussions or speaking the TRUTH without being called into his office for “rocking the boat.” GO VORIS!!

  • defiant12314

    If you’ll allow me my 2 cents Father

    First may I ask “What is a good Traditionalist ?” is criticism of the Novus ordo allowed, criticism of the documents of Vatican two (which Cardinal Kasper has admitted contained ‘compromise’ i.e. ambiguous statements? Is criticism of the clergy allowed, Lord knows I would give Cdl. Kasper an earful if I ever got near to him, is criticism of Israel or proposing that the Consecration of Russia has not been fulfilled allowed?

    The ‘professional Catholics’ to which Mr Voris alludes are those who will not criticize the clergy who have practically destroyed the Faith over the last 60 years in the west because to do so would endanger their pay packets. Here in England Fr Raymond Blake recently wrote on how 50 years ago it would have been Granny who took the children through the Catechism with the result that most people knew the Faith if not in depth then at least enough to participate fully at Mass (not through ‘doing’ things but through contemplation) and that as soon as the ‘experts’ got their hands on it and started trying to make it ‘fun and hip’ (not to mention dissenting from Church teaching) a mass apostasy occurred. We are now in the bizzare situation where those who actually hold to the Faith that is ever ancient and ever new, are being called bigots by those Catholics who view religion as relative rather than revealed.

  • Jay Boyd

    Fr. Longenecker, have you first gone to your brother with this criticism?!
    As for me…well, yes, I DO need Michael Voris.

    • Led

      Uh, Voris’ statement was public, so a public response is appropriate. That’s pretty elementary.

      • iamhdr

        But CA asking for donations and using cut salaries and layoffs is public as well. And Father’s criticism is that it should have been kept private. That seems misplaced.

        • Chesire11

          The salaries are private, besides which Mr. Voris very publicly and explicitly accused them of a lack of integrity and complicity in the alleged decline of the Church in exchange for lucre – a vicious public accusation if there ever was one.

          • Joe

            Those salaries aren’t private…. That’s how he got them in the first place…

          • Samuel Howard

            Their salaries are not private. As a 501(c)(3), Catholic Answers, for example, has to file a Form 990 or 990 EZ every year with the IRS listing the compensation of, among others, including trustees and its “five current highest compensated employees (other than an officer, director, trustee or key employee) who received reportable compensation (Box 5 of Form W-2 and/or Box 7 of Form 1099-MISC) of more than $100,000 from the organization and any related organizations”.

            These are public records, you can read their 990 for 2011 on Charity Navigator and see Karl Keating and the next four highest compensated employees making over $100k:

            http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.irs&ein=953754404#.UiFNKJJt6H0

            This is where Fr. Longenecker’s scriptural argument breaks down. Operating a public charity is a public trust. These salaries are public records. Just like Fr .Longenecker’s public criticism can follow Mr. Voris’s public actions, the receipt of salaries this high by the employees of charities is also public and legitimately subject to public scrutiny.

            This doesn’t mean Mr. Voris’s tone or presentation or even his decision to criticize is necessarily correct, just that it’s acceptable to discuss in public what is already public record.

          • Janet Baker

            Pardon me while I put on my CPA hat. Salaries of the officers of 501c3 not-for-profits and other highly-compensated staff are public information. They must be disclosed on the Form 990 of that charity and that tax form must be available for public inspection. Many charities choose to publicize their 990s on sites such as Guidestar.
            I agree that Father’s admonition for privacy is misplaced. Was not our Lord speaking of private and personal disputes as opposed to public matters? If so, what does he say of Paul’s immediate rebuke of Peter, as described in Galatians, or the Baptist’s rebuke of Herod Antipas?

          • Jack Lampwick

            The salaries are not private. For a non-profit they are made public. The IRS statements are public information. Anyone can look them up. And the problem is not that they make a high salary, nor what they do with their money–the troubles, as Voris pointed out, lie elsewhere: these organizations giving high salaries (public) while at the same time asking constantly for donations (public). So I’m not sure how the Scripture verse you quote applies here. The other points Voris made are valid as well. I’m afraid there are a lot of ad hominum attacks in this article directed at Voris, and other flaws as well. Sorry Father, that’s not to attack you, but this is a public article, and I think there’s a lot to humbly accept and learn from many of the comments on your article.

    • Rodrigo Sousa

      whatever (SHIT) is made in PUBLIC, has to be fixed in PUBLIC.

      • Chloe Austyn

        how many times are you going to say this? we get it. stop swearing.

    • James

      Where an offense is public, it is INSUFFICIENT to correct in private. That’s basic Catholic moral theology.

    • slsls

      Jay, did Michael Voris go to Keating, Akin, Kresta, etc. with his criticism? I don’t think so.

  • Sancte_Alphonsus

    “Furthermore, I admit that I recognize this sick dynamic because I behave that way sometimes too.”

    Article title: “Do We Need Michael Voris?”

    “controversial self appointed prophet..some kind of sick revenge thing..personality that is never happy unless it has an enemy..”

    And you say the ‘problem with Voris’ attack is that his method is unscriptural.’

    What about yours?

    • Rodrigo Sousa

      whatever (SHIT) is made in PUBLIC, has to be fixed in PUBLIC…

      • James

        Mr. Sousa is correct. Once something has been publicly uttered/done by someone, that is subject to public correction without further consulting the one who has offended. That doesn’t violate the Biblical command. If there is public scandal or other offense, it is INSUFFICIENT to reprimand the culprit in private. This is a basic distinction in Catholic moral theology, and I suggest we all consider it before criticizing Father Longenecker.

  • Alex

    I agree its no ones business but if you are out asking for more money to support high salaries, i think the company needs to start cutting at the top not at the bottom.

  • luis

    Michael Voris is a very arrogant man, for him, he is always right. I have alerted him and asked him why on earth he is not connecting the clergy apostasy with the signs of the end times? But no, he is the righteous one and never listens to anyone. I just wonder why did Michael feel the need to point a finger to other people’s earning !! Isn’t he travelling all the time , reporting one day from the Vatican and on the other day from Brazil?

  • dreaded catholic

    Man up all you soft catholics 100,000 dollars a year is a ton of money no matter how you make it and then you ask for more sounds like greed and corruption to me. This article coming from a priest who unfortunatley because of their years of neglect of the faith are the most unreliable source of catholosism today

    • JefZeph

      Don’t you recognize how relative $100,000 is? How big is your family? Do you live in the Ozarks or Manhattan?

      Accusations of greed and corruption based on a static dollar amount are grossly unjust.

  • Geoff Kirby

    I’m a subscriber to Michael Voris’ site and watch his daily videos. The episode from yesterday really rubbed me the wrong way too. Catholic Answers is a beacon in the Catholic world, as is EWTN. Tim Staples and Jimmy Akin are winning souls for Christ with their insane knowledge, eloquent delivery and faithfulness to the Church. The fact that Tim Staples makes around $100K does not seem all that exorbitant to me. He’s raising 5 kids in the San Diego area. That hardly makes him rich. He also holds one of the top positions at Catholic Answers. Michael Voris raises a lot of good points and I know he loves the Church. However, his message is always from a negative perspective. You’d never know of the amazing things going on in the Catholic world if his material was your only exposure to it. As a fairly young father of 5 children myself, I am increasingly energized by the renewal that is taking place in the Church in the face of an ever darkening world. It’s good to call out poor catechesis or failed leadership from time to time, but let’s hear some of the good things too. Fr. Dwight – thank you for another great perspective!

    • standtall909

      Everyone has a “gift” or a “charism” in Christ’s Church. Voris has been called to point out the pitfalls of certain groups. And if he’s a “watchdog” GOOD! WE DON’T HAVE ANY AT THE MOMENT, AND IT IS SORELY NEEDED. There are indeed wonderful things going on in the Church, but there are other places to go online and elsewhere to gather this info. Hopefully Voris’ site isn’t the ONLY SOURCE people have for Catholic info.
      Some people want to look at the Church today through rose colored glasses. They think it’s “uncharitable” to call out clergy or other Catholic groups for their gross inconsistencies with Catholic teaching. What’s REALLY UNCHARITABLE is to lead people to eternal destruction by false Catholic teaching. NOW THAT I call REALLY UNCHARITABLE!

  • Lisa

    It really is a good for all those involved in apostolates to be transparent and accountable and always willing to be corrected. We should know how much parish and diocesan employees make. Apostolates that solicit contributions should be transparent about the salaries they pay. Speakers should be forthright about their charges. And Patheos columnists should be upfront about their compensation and how that works. Why not? I can’t think of one good reason all of this shouldn’t be public knowledge. (And Voris’ accounts as well.)

  • Laura Lowder

    Thank you. I have never liked Voris, even when I knew he was right about specific issues, because he’s seemed to me always to be looking for something to get outraged over. I don’t like to see outrage fostered, or distrust, or resentment. And just as there are people who are only happy stirring up pots, there are even more pathetic people who seem to want to do nothing more than to eat from those pots. It’s a vicious and sick cycle.

    Thank you, again.

    • http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/ Manny

      Yes, he’s an outrage fisher, or whatever the internet term is. That’s a cheap and perhaps sinful way to exploit the Catholic faith.

    • chasso

      Did you ever think he was doing it on purpose to try and wake up the useless, sleepwalking Catholics in America that could care less about the Truth of the Catholic Church and just walk along supporting abortion, gay marriage, contraception, etc.? Did you ever think he was trying to save their souls since none of the Catholic hierarchy in this country seem to care about them?

  • standtall909

    Agree with most of it, because if there is no evidence of corruption, this information should always be private. After all, how do we know how much of their own money these people give to the poor? Or how many charities they help keep on their feet?
    That said, one thing I do not agree with. “Who appointed him as the policeman of all Catholic Apostolates.” No one appointed him, but this much I know. IN THE CATHOLIC CHURCH TODAY, WE NEED THEM. I don’t know of ANY that will call the Bishops out on gross misconduct. Cardinal Dolan stated a while back that “there are no real heresies happening in the Church today” “the Church doesn’t have those kinds of problems.” WHAT?!! Where has he been I’m wondering? Catholic Answers may or may not have offended some by their off color remarks about traditional Catholic……I don’t know because I did not hear the broadcast, but yes, Voris did cross the line on the salaries. None of us are without “blunders”, but for the Church to close her eyes to some of the irregularities and some of the out and out glaring heresies that are STILL HAPPENING TO THIS DAY, is INEXCUSABLE.
    After many years of being sucked into the “new, fresh Catholic Church” my own eyes were thankfully opened to the TRUTH of the Catholic Church. I’ve only been a “revert” for about 7 or 8 years now, but to be honest, I’ve had it up to my eyeballs with the dissidents and their falsehoods. And to tell you the truth, yes, I am still a little “miffed” about being led down a treacherous road for so many years. Michael Voris may have really crossed the line, but there are times he hits the nail on the head. No one else in the Church seems to be able to do that. It takes “courage” to do that.

    • Chloe Austyn

      I don’t get the “who appointed you” argument; it’s like the Catholic “you’re not my mother/the boss of me/etc.” Refute him all you want, but calling out the fact that he opened his mouth isn’t really a call out, in my opinion.

  • Jo Hapin

    Regardles of what you think about Michael Voris, when a “Non-Profit” organization is in dire straits because of $300K, and a handful of its salaried leaders together make up 3 times that amount, then there is a problem. A VERY SERIOUS PROBLEM.

  • dadof8

    I know all the names mentioned in the article but one – Michael Voris. And I have met Al Kresta a few times. I basically don’t care what anyone makes high or low. Paraphrasing from the Bible John said, “Master, we saw someone (making a lot of money and) casting out demons in your name.” Jesus said to him, “Do not prevent him, for whoever is not against you is for you.” Is Voris against us?

    • chasso

      Michael Voris doesn’t care how much they make either. That was not his point. His point was that one organization was doing a desperate plea to the public for money while its head was making $250k a year. If they are so hard up for cash maybe he could take a pay cut…

  • Montenegro

    Well, Father, I am afraid this passage says all I need to know about you (and why you oppose Voris): “So what if they are “professional Catholics”? Would that we had more of them. Would that ordinary Catholics gave so generously that we could afford to hire more “professional Catholics” who are well educated, devoted and ready to serve God and his church. I’m actually rather tired of the “amateur Catholics” and the band of often ill trained, uneducated and unreliable volunteers who we have to work with because we can’t afford another proper salary. (Don’t read this the wrong way. I’m not knocking all the hard working people who volunteer so much of their time to the church–just saying we could also use more well equipped professionals–and to get professional results you need sensible and professional remuneration).”
    So you are a “Church as professional organization” guy, are ya? I would have thought you would want more saints than professionals. St. John Vianney did. So sorry you have to tolerate “uneducated” volunteers. Your thinking here is misguided. You should be wanting holy volunteers who are seeking sanctity and will help sanctify others. You should want us all to be saints! Instead, you prove Voris’s point that this mainstream Catholic set treats the Church like a wage-generator, not like the means of our salvation and our path to Heaven.

  • Kitchener Waterloo Traditional

    If the Church wasn’t in a crisis right now then no, we wouldn’t need Michael Voris.

    I don’t like adjectives when describing fellow Catholics and ‘rad trad’ is insulting and uncharitable especially when used solely against those attached to the Extra Ordinary Form. However, appropriate and helpful descriptions have their place.

    In my humble opinion there are three types of Catholics today:

    1. Those who believe we are in yet another crisis and must overcome it with orthodoxy and tradition. Souls are at stake.

    2. Those who believe the ‘spirit of Vatican II’ hasn’t gone far enough. They believe the Council Fathers wanted even more changes like women priests, divorce, etc. They embrace liturgical novelties, ‘dialogue’, and ways to make the faith ‘relevant’ to modern values.

    3. Those who say, “What crisis?”.

    Most in the third group are part of the 80% who don’t attend Mass. Of the 20% who do and deny there’s a crisis some are ‘Status Quo’ Catholics. I believe these are the people Voris is referring to.

    If a ship is sinking would you rather take direction from someone who says, “Everything’s fine” or someone who points out the life rafts?

    80% don’t attend Mass thus they’ve lost the faith. In most parishes the percentage of those attending Mass who also participate in the Sacrament of Confession is a single digit. If this isn’t a crisis then what is? Who is alarmed by this? Our bishops, not really. Professional Catholics like those Voris mentions, not really either.

    The reality is you’re either a practicing Catholic or you’re not. You may show up to Mass every Sunday but if you deny any doctrine then you’re in a defacto schism. You may be at Mass but if living in sin then any unconfessed sin will deny you passage through the gates of Heaven. Isn’t getting souls to Heaven the primary purpose of the Catholic Church?

    If ruffling a few feathers draws attention to the crisis and by doing so helps get souls to Heaven then yes, we need Michael Voris. If the clergy and ‘professionals’ were as alarmed and speaking out against the crisis then Michael Voris wouldn’t be an issue.

  • echarles1

    This reminds me of the story of Zaccheaus, and of the story of the Rich Young Man. Zacchaeus pleased Christ with his promise to give *half* his possessions to the poor, yet Christ told the Rich Young Man to sell *all* his possession and follow him. It cannot be what you keep (or make) but what you are willing to do with it.

  • fossum

    Thanks for giving him more publicity! Who needs advertizing right?

  • JJ

    CAL is fantastic there is no doubt. But no matter what Karl Keating does with his salary CA has no business putting on the “poor mouth” and seeking “the widows mite” from those of us who are made feel guilty because we can’t afford to contribute any more. Also the practice of mentioning high contributors names on air during the recent drive is naff and sows seeds of vain glory.

    Bang Michael Voris on the head if you like but he is the only one calling out publicly those in our church who are out of line including our Bishops. For too long many hid behind a sanctimonious curtain and were untouchable. Here in Ireland anyway it was this fear of criticising the clergy that led to the past scandals going on for so long.

    • Jacob Suggs

      “…he is the only one calling out publicly those in our church who are out of line including our Bishops.”

      First, this is blatantly false, second, publicly calling out others shouldn’t be the sort of gleeful venom spitting that is being described here, and third, half of the “calling out” that I’ve heard him do is completely unjustified. Such as the salary thing.

  • Mach 1

    The Catholic Church needs Michael Voris. And more journalists like him.

    • JefZeph

      I generally agree with most things Voris says on his Vortex episodes. I appreciate straightforward, unabashed truth proclaimed courageously.

      This particular episode however, was very disappointing, for all the reasons Fr. Longenecker states. My respect for Voris has diminished, and I fear I will be more apt to question some of his motives in the future.

      • chasso

        What was so disappointing? He called out an organization for pleading poverty to the public while the head is earning $250k a year. And for their kowtowing to the bishops to keep the money coming in. And for a bishop being vindictive and screwing over a company because a family member of the owner said something he didn’t like. Not exactly Christ-like behavior on his part.

    • Jacob Suggs

      But it doesn’t need the sort of rot that is discussed here. The man himself could probably accomplish some good if he’d think a little bit before throwing rocks at everything he doesn’t like.

    • Chesire11

      Personally, Michael Voris’ stuff isn’t my cup of tea. It comes across as a tad too smug and self-congratulatory for my taste – more triumphant, than militant. Its also a bit more divisive than I would expect of a member of the Mystical Body, more interested in separating the sheep from the sheep, so we can call each other goats.

      His object may be laudable, but if so, his tone and manner are counterproductive.

  • TommyG

    Jesus said the measure we use to judge others is the same measure He will use to judge us. I think I will give a lot more grace and mercy when judging others. Personally, I LOVE Catholic Answers and Al Kresta. They speak of love. Love is the ONE way Jesus said we would know His followers. (I haven’t sensed “love” in Michael Voris…rather, he seems to take the position of Pharisees…to me).

  • Aida

    The times and the economy have changed tremendously. A man who makes $100,000 plus is just making a decent wage, especially here in California, Those earnings allow him to pay his mortgage in a modest home, live in a decent neighborhood, feed his family and hopefully affords him to pay for parochial schooling or Mom to home school the children as they forgo a second wage earner. Public schools today are detrimental to our children and families. $100,000 + is not considered high earnings, especially when Dad is the sole wage earner. Earning over $100,000 is not living high on the hog. I wish more men could earn such a decent wage and afford more Moms to stay home to guide and raise their children.. That’s what or society needs and it’s a sacrifice more parents ought to make for the good of the family. I know one of the families mentioned from Catholic Answers. They are generous and faithful to God’s word and are trying to raise their children in a godly manner. I know many men who make a lot more, their wives work and make just as much and they still can’t make ends meet. Their lives are disordered and lack God in their lives and homes. I have to question why a grown man with a higher education is only making $40,000 a year? I know young men in their mid 20s and 30s earning that amount. I believe (correct me if i’m wrong) diocesan Priests get an annual salary of around $40,000. My husband had no college education and at times in his career was earning over $100,000 because of his hard work. We maintained a modest living style and always give generously to charities.

    • chasso

      Michael Voris used to make a lot more when he worked for the secular press. He is only making $40k because he is offering up what he could be making as a sacrifice for the Church he loves as he tries to save it from itself and secular society. Instead of questioning it, you should be praising it.

  • George Albinson

    Voris may have a point: organizations appeal to the hardworking faithful for donations and then first pay their heads top salaries. Four years ago, the Catholic League was paying Bill Donohue $400,000 is salary and benefits. Who knows what it is now? They also have about $30 million in reserve funds according to Wikipedia (will they publish their accounts, if they claim this is not true?) and yet they still ask for donations. – But as for Voris, his embarrassing rantings in Rome during the recent Conclave (including an insinuation that the new Pope was going to fire any number of Cardinals) was so uninformed, that he lost all credibility. And even if he thinks he is underpaid, could he not afford better hair?

    • Cassandra

      “could he not afford better hair?”

      Aikins’ beard is any better?

    • Chesire11

      …and your opinion of Michael Voris’ hair is relevant to the discussion…how?

  • http://www.gadel.info/ GADEL

    Fr. Dwight I think we need Voris. I love Karl Kearting. He is one of my American Catholic hero’s alive today and I am a big fan of Tim Staples as well. I do agree that the financial matters of apostolate should not be expose unless in the case of corruption.

    I think I make $000,000.00 from my ministry. I probably might need some donation from Voris as well as all ye Good Catholic Apologist who makes more than 1 dollar :)

  • MeanLizzie
    • Cassandra

      Any wage? The point is that before begging from the poor, they should be upfront about their wages. If they can be and still get donations, then good for them.

      Remember, too, that Elizabeth is one of those who benefits from the recognition of these groups. Heck just a few weeks ago the Patheos crowd was getting interviewed on Relevant Radio. You might be interested to know Elizabeth was advancing the idea of women Cardinals on that show.

  • PatS

    To answer your question, Fr. Longenecker, “YES” we need Michael Voris and a few more like him. Some comboxers found and reported the salaries, not Michael. He mentioned their information, taken from IRS records available online, in reference to the pleas for donations. Why, the comboxers asked, should we donate to pay for large salaries? Even if 90% goes to a charity, we’d like to control our charitable giving, thank you. I watched the 8/29 Vortex, and I think Michael has an important
    message. I did not hear the “attack,” “sick dynamic,” or “gloating glee” you seemed to hear. I heard a direct, honest, sober assessment of a serious problem. That kind of assessment is not tolerated because the truth hurts. So let’s stick our fingers in our ears, yell “lalalalala”, and maybe this problem will go away.

  • Jay

    I like Voris, I think I will join his CMTV. Fr. have your written anything about CRS, CCHD, or bishops gone bad? Yes, we need Voris and others who can keep up awake and show us who to pray for specifically.

    • AnneG

      Yes, Jay. Father L is faithful to the teachings of the Church. You might want to read his blog sometime.

  • tobin nieto

    Me thinks thou protest to much Father. If anything Voris is saying we have to be cautious when we depend on the bishops to dole out our livelihood. i mean if your apostolate needs the support of the bishops to stay open are you not going to hold your tongue more often than not.

    Seems easier to understand why Paul stayed a tent maker, huh.

  • Sarah

    There’s a very real and important difference between a just wage and exorbitant salaries donated by individuals who believe they are supporting the active ministry of a non-profit. We don’t know the case here, but let’s not conflate the two regardless!

  • flyingtoupee

    As long as there are Catholics in positions of authority who put “getting along with the world” above the Faith, we need Michael Voris. It would be nice to see Bishops and priests who are more concerned with Catholic schools teaching proper doctrine to children than they are with issues like illegal immigration. It would be wonderful to be able to go to one’s own parish and see the Mass celebrated reverently and according to the rubrics instead of the usual hootenanny available in 98% of dioceses in the USA today. It would be nice to see some “mainstream” Catholics on the blogosphere express outrage at the irreverent manner in which Our Lord’s Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity were treated at World Youth Day.
    Frankly, not only do we need Michael Voris, but we need a lot more like him.

  • SUSAN

    An unqualified “YES”! Yes indeed we need Michael Voris. And God bless him.

  • Jason R. Pascucci

    Somehow we managed to evangelize all nations with relatively few people doing it full time for pay.

    The issue is the double-standard: there are many people who give their lives or donate large amounts of their cash, time, talent, and energy to apostolates and ministries, but unless you are being paid by someone else – preferably a Diocese, you have no authority, regardless of your fidelity to Christ and to the integrity of the faith.

    That’s the way the world works, not the way the Church works.

    The Church’s economy, on the other hand, is fidelity to truth without regard for human respect, obedience to just authority exercised justly and not obedience to ‘the world’ and the things thereof, and unfailingly laying one’s own life down, in matters small and large, as Christ.

    “Professional Catholics” of the sort referred to are, for the overwhelming part, a blight on the Church: there is no problem with anybody earning their keep outside the Church or in media or whatever. And, there are certainly jobs worth paying someone to do, but if you’re getting large sums of money from the Church – directly via salary, or indirectly via grants, maybe you shouldn’t be making big money.

    And the real question to ask is: what is the Church getting for the expense? I see ineffective programs and schemes galore, and a continued destruction of fidelity, and somehow we manage to grant an awful lot of money to people who are not just a bit contrary, but actively and poisonously contrary to the Church’s anthropology and faith.

    The competent laypeople in the Church who hold the faith in its fullness are not just alienated by professional Catholics: I have seen that they are actively turned away.

    Many of these professional Catholics, and the very reason their positions exist, are the results of the ‘long march through the institutions’ by people who had no intent of fidelity, but rather the opposite.

  • flankus7

    I can’t believe this blog by Fr Longenecker. I think he has not idea how bad things really are in the Church, and how deep the corruption and decay goes. If he had even a clue of what is going on, he would be a subscriber to Voris’s material. Also, if you make over one hundred thousand dollars a year, don’t be begging for money. Take a cut in salary. What is your salary, Fr. Longenecker?

    • frdlongenecker

      check the update on the original post for a comment about my own income

  • GAgrandma

    Yes, more people need to listen to Michael Voris. I am tired of many of the Bishops who seem to forget that their duty is to actually teach the faith and follow it themselves! I’m for telling it like it is. The truth will set you free!

  • flankus7

    Dear Friends who completely disagree with this ridiculous screed by Fr. Longenecker, take holy vengeance by sending Michael Voris’ Church Militant a thousand dollars!

    • http://www.bonfx.com Douglas Bonneville

      I (re)signed up for his Premium Account. In 4 or 5 years, there has never once been a “were are doomed unless you donate”-athon. Just a value-added proposition to pay for actual content that is for sale. What a deal. Why are CA and other websites constantly badgering and dying ever other day? One popular news site makes it seem like they are going bankrupt every other day, even at 30,000 a month. If that what it takes to run a website, you are doin’ it wrong.

  • Carol

    Knowing that Karl Keating is making $250,000 annually while posting on Catholic Answers’ website about the apostolate’s dire financial situation would make me unlikely to contribute to them again until I see some reform on those big salaries. The typical salary for a CEO of a non-profit the size of Catholic Answers, $5-6 million annually, is in the $150,000 range. And, they have far fewer six-figure employees. There are lots of individual apologists doing good work in far more modest circumstances that might be a better option for contributions.

  • bill

    Your article is full of contradictions, Father. Have you been appointed watchdog over Michael Voris? And did you speak to him in private, first (an excellent point).

    Tossing out questions about “how does he know? Did he check his facts? Maybe he’s wrong!” is not worthy of you. You need to attack him based upon facts in your possession. Do you have any?

    Mr. Voris was commenting on the info circulating in the blogosphere. The salaries that he was discussing were reported to the IRS by the non-profits. Royalties are not salaries, and, if they are from personal book sales, would not be reported by the non-profit.

    We desperately need Michael Voris. We also need good apologetics organizations. I think we need less of organizations that attack good Catholics due to prudential differences in opinion (such as Keating towards young-earth catholics, or Akins & Staples against traditionalists who don’t quite sit right with them). I think one thing that we might have enough of are protestants, who upon converting, move right into the the Catholic Media, and bring down huge salaries as if the Catholic Media was a televangelist money-maker. But, above all, we do need more Catholic faithful, converts or not. We might get them if we take being a Catholic a bit more serious.

    Michael Voris takes being a Catholic seriously. Would that every Catholic did.

  • Anne

    What about the Retreats at Sea ?They don’t come cheap. Why does he (M.Voris) have to have retreats at Sea on a luxurious liner when so many people can’t afford to go on retreats at all these days never mind this one. If the Catholic Church wants more professionals you need to start with education. So many so called Catholic schools gave very little proper religious education into forming Catholics who could bring that faith to their work and to their future professions. But thank God that is changing slowly and thank God for EWTN which also helps to encourage good formation in the Faith. There are alot of very good volunteers out there who do what they can (professional and non professional) and God works through all our weaknesses and he prunes the characters of those who have to put up with well intentioned ‘amateur Catholics’. And many of them can shame the so called ‘wise and educated’. We should never judge by externals. If we had agreeable and great people working around us all the time and everything was fantastic and hunky dory, then we would never achieve sanctity….!!

    • chasso

      $1000 for a Carribean cruise is pretty cheap. He shouldn’t be allowed to set up a vacation/retreat where he could spend time with like-minded Catholics and enlighten each other at the same time? He has plenty of other engagements on land for those who don’t care to join him. So don’t join him – nobody is forcing you.

  • mchicha

    While obviously Mr. Voris has his problems, there is a disturbing trend within the Church where people become ‘professional Catholics’

    That is, a person works in preaching while avoiding holy orders. There are many of them, including no religious theologians, speakers, radio hosts etc. They are gospel profiteers.

    Now I understand they do good works, but this sort of work has always been done by Clergy and Missionaries (Religious).

    You got to admit, its a disturbing trend.

  • Cassandra

    Weak. Very weak.

    For starters, you call Voris a “self-appointed prophet”. ALL these lay apostolates are self-appointed, including every lay blogger out there purporting to be Catholic. Every last one of them, so spread that charge around evenly.

    Secondly, you distort Voris’ point on salaries, which he makes clear is the charge being made by laity like me on the blogosphere. It isn’t the salary; it’s the fact that they are begging money from poor Catholics trying to survive a bad economy with families.

    “unless you are privy to the full financials you better keep quiet.”
    Integrity on the part of these organizations demands that they make clear to their donors. Their IRS form 990 should be available on their websites right next to the Donate button. If Keating can make a good case for making over $200K year after year after year, then fine. But make sure your donors know it before they donate.

    The real problem with these lay apostolates is how sloppy they are in presentation and formation. The very fact that you have to spend so much time trying to clarify that “radical traditionalists” are not “traditionalists” only demonstrates my case. If CA wanted to talk about sede vacantists, then say “sede vacantists”. Identify the exact error you are attacking. The reaction they got was the result of their own sloppiness.

    I, for one, *would* like these independent lay apostolates to disappear. I could give example of example of misleading and downright wrong teaching being broadcast by these apostolates. Let them petition to operate under the direct control of their local bishops. ,,,,,Or do you see a problem with bishops controlling and authorizing these endeavors? Maybe you lack confidence in the performance and behaviour of those who are “the authentic teachers” in their diocese? Maybe there was a reason these people *didn’t* want to be under such control?

  • Adeodatus

    So, Father, I assume you went to Mr. Voris privately and hashed this out before blogging? Otherwise that would make your criticism somewhat hypocritical.

    Do *we* need Michael Voris? Well, I for one am tired of having the Church dominated by homosexuals, Marxists and outright heretics. Where I live, our bishop emeritus is publishing a book where he advocates women’s ordination. The clergy is still *filled* with homosexuals, Marxists and their fellow travelers. These people dupe Catholics into tossing money into the plate that gets spent on abuse settlements and shunted over to pro-abortion associations. Oh, but try discussing that on Catholic Answers Forum. You’ll get banned, because when Catholic Answers has to choose between the bishops and Jesus Christ, apparently they choose the bishops.

    I guess I can see why. Jesus Christ doesn’t pay six figures.

  • http://remnantofremnant.blogspot.com/ priest’s wife

    my husband is a ‘professional’ Catholic (being a ByzCath priest and a hospital chaplain/director of spiritual care)…talking about money always brings out the worst in people. My husband receives $700 a month from church. Yet certain people have said “you are all about the money!”….hmmm…$700 a month for the past 10 years with a growing family in S California

    so anyways….Voris can calm down…talk to the source- isn’t that Biblical? I just assume that the people with decent homes here are lotto winners, 5 generation Californians or celebrities. I don’t know how a normal family does it

  • W Meyer

    Yes, Father, we do need Michael Voris. Just as we also needed Michael Davies. Not all is right with the Church (we are all sinners, even the clergy) and I am very tired of those who pretend otherwise. 50%+ of Catholics voted for Obama, despite his views on abortion. Bishops believe they can lie with government pigs and not get up dirty. Great errors are made in the name of “social justice” a never really defined goal, errors which are contrary to Church teaching. Can feelings about social justice trump doctrine? No! And if the bishops won’t say it then someone needs to. Thank God for Michael Voris and his strength.

    As to salaries, if Voris is making $40,000, then it is a good deal less than he made before he left broadcast news. And as he is based close to Detroit, he must live in one of the more expensive suburbs, or live in danger.

    Is Voris always right? No, but who among us is? Let that one cast the first stone. Father, this article looks like an opportunistic dig. Too few priests tell us in the homilies what we need to hear–too many tell us something to make us smile. I treasure anyone who has the courage to stand up and declare the emperor is buck naked, be that person a priest or a layman.

    I need Michael Voris, and so does the Church in this country. At least until we all turn away from the happy, clappy communal meal nonsense which seems to infest so many parishes.

    • johnnyc

      He has some great shows. His One True Faith series on the Eucharist is worth a subscription alone. Season 4 if anyone is interested.

  • LMuse

    did you go to Mr. Voris privately before you published this rant against his methods?

  • Christine Niles

    Voris followed up on yesterday’s Vortex clarifying his intentions. Please watch this before commenting:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=kkE-H5PaHBQ

  • Woody

    Well, we all have our likes and dislikes, and that includes people and their personalities. So, you don’t like MV. Okay. I’ll bet there are lots of people who don’t like you, Father. That’s okay, also. Now the rub- I like you both! Go figure. Have a great weekend, Father.

    • frdlongenecker

      I don’t like or dislike Mr Voris. I don’t know him. My comments were about his actions not him personally.

      • Melkite Catholic

        You’re a liar Father. Your headlines speak volumes you are talking about him personally. Your experiences with know it all’s in feel good groups speaks to your protestant up bringing. When you become a real Catholic then you can lecture us on what is and isn’t appropriate for a Catholic.

  • Igor S Alejandre

    This new breed of “professional catholics” always looked suspicious to me. Many of them are ex-protestants, that converted and are making a living out of it. Scott Hahn, for example. All this people have in common, that they hate the TRADITIONAL LATIN MASS. And they are always attacking the Traditional Catholics. I do not know the reason, but seems very odd.

    • Chesire11

      Perhaps traditionalists have fallen into the very modern habit of fancying themselves victims whenever someone disagrees with them?

    • David Bates

      Hypobole much?! Do you have any evidence that Scott Hahn hates the Latin Mass?

      The comment about converts “making a living out of it”…*sigh*…

    • chasso

      You couldn’t be further from the truth – at least in the case of Dr. Hahn. He teaches at Franciscan University of Steubenville which is about the most traditional Catholic College in the US.

  • Russell Grigaitis

    I just happen to have made a video about Voris a little over a week ago:
    http://youtu.be/frwPzwqQsA8

    • Michael MacDonell

      Michael Voris was right about the Winnipeg Statement Russel. The Canadian Bishops have since spoken out against artificial contraception but they still need to retract the Winnipeg Statement. If there was nothing wrong with the Winnipeg Statement then there would not have been immediate and vocal opposition to it by conservative practicing Catholic pro-lifers. Monsignor Vincent Foy, the former head of Toronto’s archdiocesan marriage tribunal was very much against the Winnipeg Statement. Msgr. Foy to start with said the Winnipeg Statement is tantamount to blasphemy. I could go on and on about Msgr. Foy’s condemnation of the Winnipeg Statement but I’ll just some it up by saying that within the statement lies just about everything that the heresy of modernism takes in. The main problem with the Winnipeg Statement is that it taught a false notion of conscience regarding artificial contraception. Like I say the Winnipeg Statement still needs to be retracted. Man, what are you people learning at CA and these other places. Just so you know that I am not speaking as someone out side of the country (as if that would matter), I am also a Canadian. Russel do yourself a favour and delete that youtube video. Then sign this petition to have the Winnipeg Statement retracted.
      http://www.gopetition.com/petitions/retract-the-winnipeg-statement.html

      • Russell Grigaitis

        Some say the same thing about the Documents of Vatican II; thus, they say we haven’t had a pope since at least John XXIII or Pius XII. One could say the same thing about the New Testament. Perhaps someone should start a petition to have the Bible retracted. There sure seems to be a great many persons that do not understand it.

        Note what the bishops of the Philippines said: “We abandoned you to your confused and lonely consciences with a lame
        excuse: ‘follow what your conscience tells you’. How little did we
        realize that it was our consciences that needed to be formed first.” How is this any different than what the Canadian bishops did two decades earlier, only there wasn’t anything for them to apologize for?

        Have you read the “Statement on Family Life and Related Matters”, which the Canadian bishops released on April 18, 1969? Have you read the “Statement on the Formation of Conscience”, which the Canadian bishops released on December 1, 1973? Perhaps Canadians should listen to their bishops and form their conscience to the teachings of the Church, including “Humanae Vitae.” This is the message of the ‘Canadian Bishops’ Statement on the Encyclical “Humanae Vitae”’ if one is willing to take the time to understand it.

  • vexilla regis

    My recollection of the Voris piece is that he was reporting what others had already made public. That seemed to me not unreasonable. I do not lie the Voris style – it does not go down well with Australians. However, his research and analysis is very often quite penetrating. And in this case I be;ieve he is ” on the money” to coin a phrase . I realise it may be considered ” unAmerican” to criticise someone’s salary success. But in the case of spreading the Faith , I do not like to see people whose business is selling books ,tapes on the Faith making a fortune out of it. The labourer is indeed worthy of his hire but has no right to getting rich in the process. Freely we receive, and should freely give, is the appropriate spirit to adopt. I believe Voris had every right to contrast his own organisation’s salaries with the others already revealed. In sum Father, I think your criticism is unfair.I could go further but prefer not to.

  • Michael Brooks

    Michael Voris could have done this with those who run the Mega Churches (the Fundies), and be quite correct in his assessments, as we are just now finding out about the founders of Trinity Broadcasting Network, and this will get played out in Court.

  • Kathy

    Thank you for this piece.

  • Robe Roberto

    Why didn’t you post a link to the Voris video clip father? Seems a little odd to trash the guy’s vid and not link it.

  • Romulus

    I listen to Catholic Answers frequently — but usually not for long
    stretches, because I can bear only so much happy talk and cheerleading.
    Frankly, those guys do not perform at the six-figure level. Neither
    does the ridiculous Raymond Arroyo. The weirdness of Catholic Answers
    wrt matters traddy is troubling for cultural reasons: no one is asking
    for the show to be produced in Latin, but when one’s spirituality is
    completely untouched (and therefore unformed) by the ancient and
    venerable tradition, traditionalism inevitably comes off as “the other”. Yes, I am a little tired of the tame, suburban, Americanized image they (and EWTN) present.

    I completely agree that it costs money to attract talented people. My
    worry is that many of the talented ones are still on the outside trying
    to figure out how to get in.

    Voris makes a darn good point about the pettiness and unforgiving ways of certain clergy when turf and especially money are concerned. The CCHD is a “disgrace” (I hesitate to employ the saltier term I believe it deserves), and has been for years. I have not given to them in decades, and actively discourage others as well.

  • Maggie Sullivan

    Fr. longnecker, What can one say about your article. You attack michale voris because you claim he is attacking others.
    So your attack is right and Mr. Voris is wrong?
    I for one am VERY glad to know how much the people in these Catholic orginizations make.
    You spend your entire article attacking Mr. Voris is the stongest and mst hateful terms possible…….because you calim he attacks others.
    You can’t see………that you are EXACTLY the same as Mr. Voris.

    • Chesire11

      There is a difference between chastisement and attack. Chastisement is correction for the benefit of the chastised. An attack is an attempt to harm.

      Father’s comments fall under the former category, while Mr. Voris’ appear to fall under the latter.

  • Maryanne Linkes

    Sadly he has made a cottage industry of bashing priests and bishops and in this, Holy Mother Church. The man who refused to file his 990 tax forms and therefore lost his Nonprofit Status with the IRS has a lot of nerve talking about money. He needs to clean his own house first. The devil has a hold of him via his ego and that is his downfall! Very sad as he could use his knowledge for good rather than for calumny and notoriety.

    • chasso

      He only bashes those that deserve it for their actions against the Church. Unfortunately, that includes a lot of American bishops. And he listed his salary in his video. Its his choice as the business owner whether he chooses to be a non-profit or not. Maybe he felt he couldn’t do his job with the restrictions placed on non-profits by the government (or didn’t want to be targeted by the IRS). Many of us think he is one of the few using his knowledge for good – despite how uncomfortable it makes some people.

  • Maggie Sullivan

    Fr. L, I’m guessing this post of mine will never make to your site but here goes anyway.
    To make a long story short we had a fundraiser for a young pro-life Catholic who was dying of cancer.
    A group of us sent requests to large Catholic groups seeking items we could auction off to help this young man with medical expenses. We offered to pay for the items but hope the items could be signed.
    Nothing from Catholic answers (and that’s fine)
    Nothing from EWTN (and that’s fine, they owed us nothing)
    A huge box full of items all signed by Michael Voris and at no charge and a wonderful letter from him.
    Sure you can claim that Catholic professionals deserve to get huge pay checks.
    But we had better be very well aware that with huge pay checks may well come the love of money.
    It is interesting that Mr. Voris was more than generous.

    • frdlongenecker

      I post all comments except those that are irrational, too long, obscene or blasphemous. I’m glad to hear Mr Voris was generous. I never said he was all bad.

      • mchicha

        Michael Voris is a professional Catholic too.

        But your article leaks of venom towards him. If you look beyond his abrasiveness nature, he has an underlying point. The problem is not professional Catholics, Michael Does not have the wisdom to see this. But his anger is justified in a way.

      • Maggie Sullivan

        Fr. Longenecker,
        I guess your article really frustrated me because it seemd to have nothing to with the issue at hand (the money made by big name Catholics) – it seems to me that it is a chance for you to attack.
        A few things that confused me.
        1. “Self appointed profit” – did Mr. Voris ever call himself that? (are you one because of your website?)
        2. “However, there are serious problems with the way Voris has made his criticism. First of all, what status has he as a Catholic watchdog?” (mr. voris is a catholic like you, because you are a priest does that allow you to speak on these isuess and not him?)
        3. “I’m actually rather tired of the “amateur Catholics” and the band of often ill trained, uneducated and unreliable volunteers who we have to work with because we can’t afford another proper salary.” (you got me on this one, I’am one of those ill trained not to bright people who volenteer at church all the time.
        I know what I do is not worth much but people like me try)
        4. “The next problem with Voris’ attack is that his method is unscriptural. The Sacred Scriptures teach us that if you have a problem with your brother you are to go to them first in private. Did Voris sit down in a meeting with Keating, Kresta, Keck and the others?” (did you sit down with Mr. Voris before this article?)
        5. The Catholic answers program that critized traditionalists was very condesending. You do a lot of commenting on it and you never heard it? Shouldn’t you have at least listened to it before commenting on it?
        6. You claim Mr. Voris’s attack is “some kind of sick revenge.” Very serious charge calling omeone “sick.” What proof do you have he is “sick?” Have you met Mr. Voris….did he seem “sick” to you? You make the clear charge that he is “sick.”
        8. “They always feel a bit insecure and the most insecure even feel paranoid. So they begin to blame everyone else for being wrong, for being heretics, for being apostates. Then they feel snug and warm and good about themselves and their little religious group for a little while until the next “enemy” appears. Then they can go on the attack again with their smug self righteousness.” ( So all people who believe we have problems in the world and the Church are paranoid, insecure, smug. I see some problems in the Church am i paranoid, insecure, smug?? )

  • 8fuersleben

    Thank you, Father, for this frank answer. I agree with some of it. As my family of 8 has found its way to the EF, I have also noticed the temptation in myself to regard myself a superior Catholic because I prefer what in my mind is a superior rite. I think instead we need to focus on how humbling the Divine Liturgy is that Our Lord shall humble Himself to come to us. Someone recently coined the term “traditude” – this has to be dropped if we want to advance that old rite.
    As regards to people’s salaries, Voris’ clip made me uncomfortable too. We are fortunate in that my husband makes a good salary, but we have to support a family of 8 on it. In comparison, Voris with his 40K as one person seems very wealthy.
    What I would like to have pointed out, however, where in the Catechism of the Catholic Church I may find the term “tithe”. Where do we find the obligation to give a “tenth” of our income? That we should donate where we can, yes, but giving a “tenth” while clearly an OT concept, I haven’t found it in the Catechism yet.
    Thank you.

    • bill bannon

      The catechism does not say to tithe but to give according to one’s ability…ccc 2043.

    • Chesire11

      Though I never had the opportunity to attend a mass in the EF until a few months ago, I have made a conscious decision to stay away from it. Though I had some difficulty in following what was going on, I found it to be beautiful, and mysterious, and also perilous. I am glad that it is an option, and would like to see it made more widely available, but for myself, if I learned it and attended it, the EF would become a temptation to pride, imagining myself more “authentically” Catholic than those poor souls who do not.

      • http://rosarynovice.stblogs.com/ Augustine

        I attended the EF several times and, having a Romance language as my first language, I can understand a lot of what’s said, provided that the priest can properly speak Ecclesiastic Latin.

        However, I can’t see why some think that the EF is non plus ultra. Well, the NO was composed by those who attended and celebrated nothing but the EF for all their lives, so surely in and of itself the EF is not sufficient, and perhaps neither necessary, for the fidelity that its radical proponents suggest.

        • prayerisouronlyhope

          Funny, the EF was “sufficient” and “necessary” for about 1960 years! But all of a sudden, now it is neither?

  • Dan

    Wow, the comments in here have turned scary! Apparently this Michael Voris is more Catholic than the pope?!

    Anyway Father, keep up the good work. I know my parish priest has a tough job ministering the gospel in this day and age, and I’m sure your ministry is just as difficult. I think that’s something the Voris supporters should understand instead of criticizing our priests. It’s a difficult and often lonely life.

    • chasso

      So priests are above criticism? My priest never mentions the evils of abortion, contraception, gay marriage, etc. in his homilies, but talk to him in the narthex and all you’ll hear about is those “bad catholics” that don’t support immigration reform or Obamacare and how wonderful our current president is. Sorry – that deserves criticism.

      • Dan

        No, just above criticism for the petty things that traddies usually complain about. The vast majority of priests are good men who have devoted their lives to God. I see men in their 60s and 70s who are struggling with condensed parishes, sometimes multiple parishes, and usually no assistants (if they are lucky, they have a deacon to help out). The priest shortage is putting a huge demand on these men.

        If you want to point to a crisis in the church–that’s the crisis. Not the argument over the Latin Mass or homily themes or girl altar servers or professional, lay Catholics or whatever the new trend for conservative Catholics to argue about is. Instead, it is the priest shortage threatening to push our existing priests to the breaking point.

        • prayerisouronlyhope

          And many “traddies” believe it is exactly those things you mentioned (along with others) that have contributed to the shortage of priests. The “traddie” seminaries are full to overflowing. Maybe they have a point?

    • Allan Daniel

      There have been bad popes, you know.

  • GuestGirl

    Forget college or religious houses, I’ll just tell my kids when they grow up they should start their own Catholic non-profit. They get to be rich and Saints at the same time, always above criticism no matter what.

  • Shane Floyd

    I saw the Vortex yesterday, and with all due respect Father, Mr. Voris was not being uncharitable. Now I will agree with some peoples statements that some of the salaries he mentioned were not all that excessive but it certainly wasn’t unscriptural, as you stated. He (Voris) stated that Catholic answers has done very good apologetics work. He then links their current financial problems as a result of a backlash from an episode they did on radical traditionalist. As a result some bloggers then dug up and began posting salaries of these people. He links this to a larger problem of a Liberal Catholic machine that feeds itself. The only assertion he makes is that Catholic Answers financial problems could be a result of a show that they did on traditionalism. Now you can disagree with that but he (Voris) did good reporting and was not unduly critical during the segment. The salaries were a manner of public record so the money would only be from their jobs as a radio host etc. People can judge for themselves whether an employee from a non profit Catholic apostolate that relies on donations from people, should make a six figure salary. Your only critique was that you think that Michael Voris was being critical of other peoples wealth. The rest of it is you stating that your own personal experience with unpaid volunteers and your psychological assessment of Mr. Voris’s motivations. I encourage you to listen to what he said again. Don’t kill the messenger here.

    • Chesire11

      Listen to his comments from the 9:30 mark. He explicitly accuses “professional Catholics” of betraying the welfare of our Holy Mother for cash. This after engaging in the “some people say…” brand of gossip by quoting e-mails he has received, thus giving voice to accusations without actually making them himself.

      All in all it was a rather nasty, snide little piece from which charity was conspicuously absent.

      • Allan Daniel

        Are the points he made true?

  • prayerisouronlyhope

    Wow! I do not visit your site often, so maybe this is not the way
    you usually write, or respond, but I found your comments to be very
    sarcastic and arrogant.
    I watched Voris’ episode, and the
    salaries mentioned did not concern me – what concerns me is that people
    are being silenced by the Church hierarchy for speaking out about the
    problems in the Church. What concerns me is that Catholic organizations
    are contributing to other organizations that promote/condone
    contraception and abortion, and this needs to be made known. Maybe I
    watched a different episode than you? All this conversation about
    salaries – I really don’t think that was the point of the piece.

    I visited the your link to The Anchoress, and expressed the same sentiments on her blog.

  • Deacon Ed Peitler

    I will not comment on Michael Voris. He, like the rest us, is imperfect.

    But I will comment on not for profit Church organizations. If the primary or sole source of revenue for that entity is donations, then I think full disclosure is in order. People who donate have, I believe, a right to know how their money is being used and that includes salaries. It helps them to be good stewards of their own money when deciding whether or not to contribute to that not-for-profit. I think it would be exceedingly interesting if all salaries were disclosed. We know for a fact that the Church is not immune to all sorts of abuses and I consider the abuse of money to be a far more widespread problem than the abuse of minors by homosexual clergy.

    • http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/ Manny

      I think those salaries are public knowledge. That’s how Voris got a hold of them. You have to look them up, but they are available to the public.

  • blesski saving babies

    He makes himself pretty clear; I don’t see much to criticize. He articulates the truth, clearly.

  • Janie Wright Kearns

    Father…. Micheal Voris brings to light and talks about, the evil that exists in our church today. I don’t hear anyone else doing that, not even the clergy, which are the ones that should be. I am fortunate enough to have a priest that does speak out. He understands that as a shepherd, he is responsible for telling us the truth, as unpleasant as it can be at times, I’m sure. His priority is my soul.. and that should be preserved at any cost.

    I think you missed the point of his video. It was not about salaries ….https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=kkE-H5PaHBQ

  • contrarian

    I like Michael Voris a lot (though I wish he’d criticize our pope in the same way he criticizes bishops), and I agree that Catholic Answers was quite wrong (that is, their arguments were flawed) in their shows on ‘radical traditionalism’. The Remnant ran a few pieces that eviscerated Catholic Answers, and other notable people with electronic pens have given casual readers good reason to think that Catholic Answers screwed the pooch in running those shows.

    However: I don’t know, pace Voris, if these shows were part of the reason that their money dried up. Perhaps this will become clearer as we go here. Certainly, however, if I was financially contributing to Catholic Answers (and I don’t know why I would be) and they ran these shows on ‘rad trads’, I’d kindly write them to inform them that I’d no longer be financially supporting them. Perhaps many of their supporters were of like mind. But who knows.

    Also: I guess I wasn’t particularly impressed with the salaries of these folks (and I confess that I didn’t know who any of these people are, save for the EWTN guy). Perhaps where these people live, the salary that they make is generous. I can imagine that a low six-figure salary in Michigan (where Voris is) could probably get you some nice digs and a comfortable life. But where I am here in New York City, no one is going to be impressed with a salary barely in the six-figure range. And considering that these people have kids and mortgages and whatnot…meh. 100,000? That’ll get you a high interest mortgage on a small fixer-upper in a bad neighborhood. So I guess I wish Voris wouldn’t have said that. Things are most certainly different where he lives.

    I’ll still keep watching the Vortex, because I think he’s great (and I think he’s right 99% of the time). He’s had some real winners lately. But I hope that he offers a mea culpa or some sort of longer explanation for this particular show.

    Also: re the sarcastic comment: I’m quite sure that the author of this fine blog is not making anything to brag about. I can think of many reasons to go into his field, but ‘good pay’ is not one of them.

  • Chesire11

    Just wondering, since he is so opposed to “professional Catholics,” could someone remind me what Mr. Voris does for a living?

  • CT Catholic Corner

    You ask who made Voris “policeman”? Try: “The laity are given this special vocation: to make the Church present and fruitful in those places and circumstances where it is only through them that she can become the salt of the earth.” -Lumen Gentium Ch.4

  • Chesire11

    Do we need Michael Voris? Absolutely yes!

    Does Michael Voris need lessons in humility and charity? If his lay homilies are anything by which to judge, the answer appear to be yes, as well.

    • David Bates

      My favourite response to date.

  • Allan Daniel

    Don’t be silly. Your article quickly turned into a screed. Voris is a watchdog because Catholics like you can’t do the job–don’t even know there is a job to be done. Every Catholic must be a watchdog. If something is found wanting, it must be addressed. We do not stupidly look around and wonder who has been granted the right to criticize.

    Voris used information gathered from public records. It was found that a group of professional Catholics (people who make their living from their religion) are making between $100,000 to $250,000 per year for their work. And in Boston some are making $350,000. My village priest done not make that much I assure you. But salaries are beside the point. It was not merely about extravagant pay, but the role such large sums have in forming a Catholic apologists perspective. And whether it can lead to inaction when the truth is in contradiction with the guy who signs the paycheck.

    Reading some of the comments, I noticed the criticism of Voris is vague. Brilliant statement like “He’s one of those people who seems to be all vinegar and no understanding.” If the vinegar is true it needs to be told. What does he not understand? The neo-Catholic church is the church of never getting anyone upset. (Which reminds me that I’ve never heard a sermon on contraception.) It is a false church. Christ made it his job to break false notions.

    There is a faulty opinion that sees observation of fact as equal to sinful judgment. It is not. Such an opinion is merely a case of applying ignorance to moral theology.

    Don’t you understand that the issue is not about destroying EWTN of Catholic Answers, but calling them to attention.

  • CRO

    We need Michael Voris a lot more than the filth that has infiltrated the Church and Pope Francis’ word echo from Michael Voris’ mouth when he said that we should live for worldliness or careerist.
    Bishops have become increasingly weak in their stance against the filth within.
    The Church of nice is rotten.

  • Joseph Jordan

    What is wrong with Michael Voris exposing truth?

  • OneTimothyThreeFifteen

    Who needs atheists to destroy the Church when we seem to be doing a pretty good job ourselves?

    Not disagreeing, but I think to talk about fanaticism is somehow to secularise it, to dumb down what’s actually happening, and I’m very mindful of what you’ve said in the past about the Smoke of Satan. The demonic can enter only where we give him permission to go.
    http://rcspiritualdirection.com/blog/2013/08/29/can-demons-read-our-thoughts

    It seems to me fanaticism is, most often now, considered something to be ‘understood’, and yet, paradoxically, it begins at the very point past which reason breaks down. It’s like an addiction, an obsession. It’s sending 35,000 facebook messages a month stuff. The demonic, on the other hand, seems to me to be something lucid, if not rabid. It is not insane but something which believes its perception of the cancer is so crystal clear, it can wield the scapel or guillotine, like an expert surgeon, like God. It’s reason is so clear, it can no longer feel. It can immanentise the Eschaton, bring heaven to earth, but that heaven is Utopia, literally, no-place fit for human habitation. Frozen Architecture and Rubrics.

  • mchicha

    So we all agree.
    1.Mr. Voris is not the problem.
    2.Some find a problem with his delivery
    3. Catholic Venom towards traditionalists should stop
    4. All is not well with the life of the Church in America.

    • http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/ Manny

      No, Mr. Voris has a problem. It’s not just he identifies the Church’s problems but that he attributes those problems to malicious intent. He claims our bishops are essentially traitors and heretics. That is dispicable and paranoid.

  • johnnyc

    I just wonder how much money CAL would save by shutting down that wacky forum.

  • tobin nieto

    Oh and father if you agree with the fitz article, well i guess this peasant Catholic is not good enough to past your threshold.

    I’ve been a “volunteer” CCD teacher for five yrs and i don’t get paid but that doesn’t mean I’m not qualified to teach.

    “If a thing is worth doing, it is worth doing badly.” G.K. Chesterton

    • PeonyMoss

      The point of the Fitz article is that there are some people who can never be pleased and can always find something to complain about.

  • Dean Lucas

    Is Voris even a traditionalist? No one has ever seen him at a traditional chapel but he IS an EMHC at one of the wackiest parishes in Detroit.

    HE is the ultimate PROFESSIONAL CATHOLIC; he is just a journalist tapping into a fertile revenue stream.

    The ones who goofed on this are EWTN and CA. If they hadn’t shunned him as an outsider years ago, he’d be very happy talking T.O.B. and telling conversion stories for six figures.

    Don’t blame Voris, he doesn’t believe what he says, he’s JUST A MESSENGER.

    • chasso

      He also has a chapel right in the building with his recording studio. Wow – what a wacko!

  • Guy Fox

    I thought the salary thing was a sideshow. The really important point is the blind eye that is being turned away from the heretics and sodomites who are pretend clergy who are subverting the Truth. Michael Voris should be judged on the accuracy of what he says. From where I stand he has it about right.

    • http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/ Manny

      Are you claiming the bishops are heretics and sodomites? That kind of claim is beyond the pale.

  • tobin nieto

    That article by Fitz i find highly condescending. And Father you don’t further your argument by linking to it, though maybe that is what you think of lay volunteers such as myself.

    • PeonyMoss

      No, the point of the Fitz article is that some people are able to find fault with everything – there’s no pleasing them.

  • Sandra Embry

    After watching Michael Voris, I didn’t feel at all like you did. I even said to my husband, I don’t mind them making so much money at all. Its just that there are people in high places, inside and outside the Catholic Church, who have a certain amount of control over people and situations. The situations Michael mentioned about the stations canceling his program, and the one about the social justice and poverty group not using Judie Brown’s husband’s printing company are examples.. What I got out of it is that sometimes when a person makes such a large amount of money, then they don’t want to bite the hand that feeds them by saying something that the one who pays their salary, or the one who has some control over their very job, might not want them to say. I do notice that when I listen to Catholic radio. There are certain problems in the Church that they won’t dare to mention. I think Michael hit the nail right on the head as to the reason for this.

  • Russ

    We need more Father Longeneckers!! Keep preaching it Father. I will be sending a big check to Catholic Answers this weekend. God bless you and continue to preach the truth , even when it is unpopular.

  • Joe

    Wow. I was a fan of Fr. Longenecker but his attack on Voris is totally off base. He claims Voris’ accusations are unbiblical…. Has Fr. Longenecker ever attacked Obama, Pelosi, or anyone else in his writing? I’m not sure if he has, but if he did, has he spoken with them in private first?

  • V.Rozance

    Yes, we need
    M.Voris. I was shocked at the “not for profit” salaries. This is not
    BIG DOG journalism. His point was two-fold. First, I think he was also shocked
    at the salary (verified by the IRS) of an operation that begs for its bread.
    Second, he was implying the salary was the reason for their lack of ability to criticize
    the power structure because if you do you will suffer. The story about Judy
    Brown’s husband being made to pay for Judy’s criticism of the CRS is alarming
    (isn’t it Father?). The alarm is real and needs to be sounded (as shrill as it is).

  • Teresa Grodi

    This reminds me of Peter Kreeft’s infamous talk “How to Win the Culture War.” It’s definitely worth a listen.

  • GAgrandma

    Wasn’t it Mother Angelica of EWTN the one who used to point out certain things about what was going on in the Church? She didn’t mince words about a certain Bishop from California, liberal nuns and other things. She got into trouble about speaking the truth and the Bishops tried to take over EWTN so she gave up being in charge. Isn’t Michael Voris doing the same thing now…..speaking the truth of what is actually going on in the Catholic Church!

  • Carol McKinley

    Wow. What a despicable turn of events.

  • Terry Fenwick

    Thank you, Father Dwight, for being the anointed priest of GOD and speaking to us and sharing for us. So often we jump in and do more damage, just as the person in the blog you wrote of, by saying things without cooling down. We need a priest who looks at the situation and speaks from the heart and tells it like it is. Thank you. I removed my earlier comment as it was really not needed. Thank you for your leadership!

  • Carol McKinley

    Voris is absolutely correct. The amount of scandals, misfeasance and malfeasance that you and others turn a blind eye to is breathtaking. You cover their crimes with your silence and you attack people who speak the truth about their crimes. It’s the same blackballing done to parents who were trying to stop pedophiles.
    We literally have bishops outsourcing abortions – contracting to kill people – and the people in the media making money to report on Catholic news refuse to report it. When Cardinal O’Malley tried to call in a chit with the National Catholic Register, they went so far to cover up the crimes against children for money with an article that was filled with lies and omissions about what was transpiring – to undermine and discredit Catholics who were exposing it.
    I smell and taste your contempt.

  • Cotton

    Didn’t read Voris as calling out these people – saw it more as providing the information “donors” should have. That is the intent of the IRS’ new 990 form – it is very specific and the incomes listed are listed as salaries and not book or CD sales. It’s a bit like the Catholic Charities USA….who long ago sold their soul to the Federal Government – in Virginia CC gets 3% from donations and 97% to do the government’s charity work, yet they come every Christmas with long faces to beg that they cannot do their wonderful work with out our donations. They, like all these Catholic groups, need to be more open to their donors without having to go through the 990s to find out what’s going on.

  • KP

    People just aren’t getting the point. It seems people don’t understand what “professional Catholic” means. It’s a term invented by Pope Benedict, NOT Michael Voris.

    The term refers to Catholics who care about career advancement by not rocking the boat. For instance, if you’re on Catholic Answers or EWTN, you know that being critical of Cardinal Dolan sitting down and laughing it up at dinner with Obama is a bad move. And let’s not even get started on Cardinal Dolan saying Governer Cuomo is “not in bad standing with the Church” after Cuomo tried to pass abortion on demand in NY!

    As a Catholic Answers apologist you know not to be critical of the Bishop! He may get you booted out of the (very small) Catholic media circle! Back to the secular world you go! So rather than be critical of Dolan going to dinner with Obama and saying Gov Cuomo is still in good standing with the Church even though he’s publicly praising abortion on demand, you just sit idly by and don’t rock the boat, lest Cardinal Dolan gets upset that you’re critical of him, and you lose your job!

    THAT is what “Professional Catholic” is.

    And the term was invented by Pope Benedict, not Michal Voris.

  • rayschneider

    I think this is a tempest in a teapot … Voris identified salaries of $130000 at the highest and for senior people this is not a huge salary. For comparison you should check what the head of the Red Cross is making and then shudder.

    Also Voris’s point is that the Church of Nice as he calls it isn’t very nice when push comes to shove and it’s crossed. The last point he made was that it is stupid to alienate the really faithful Catholics who are in fact the traditionalists and that Catholic Answers is likely suffering from the backlash of making fun of them.

    Gee that sounds a cautionary note. So I really think the reaction is overdone. I think Voris can be legitimately criticized for making out that these low six figure salaries are over the top and I think Fr. Longenecker overreacted.

  • Karl Keating

    1. Catholic Answers never has asked for, and never has received, grants from bishops. It always has been our policy not to ask the Church to underwrite our work. (Of course, when we send a speaker to a parish, the parish pays an honorarium and travel and lodging expenses.)
    2. We have no evidence that our May 31 show on “radical Traditionalism” resulted in any loss of donations. So far as I know, we weren’t receiving donations from “radical Traditionalists” anyway, and nearly all “regular Traditionalists” who commented on the program to us said they appreciated it and thought it fair and helpful. (The August 12 follow-up show aired after our “summer slump” occurred.)
    3. After Jerry Usher retired as host of “Catholic Answers Live,” Michael Voris was in discussion with us about becoming the new host. We decided he was not the right person for that role, which later was filled by Patrick Coffin. We otherwise have never had any contact with Mr. Voris. He did not contact us before airing his videos.
    4. In a few days I will have a post at the Catholic Answers blog concerning a recent anti-Catholic Answers video by Michael Matt and Christopher Ferrara of “The Remnant.” My blog post discusses their video only and makes no attempt to address wider questions, but it may nevertheless be of interest to people on this thread.

  • steve5656546346

    The Vortex today was a clarification: and a good one.

    Yes, the Church needs Michael Voris and ALL faithful Catholics: why would this even be a question?

    Who appointed him? I suppose the same person as appointed those who reported the scandal when it was covered up. Who exactly to you have to be to oppose religious indifference within Christ’s Church? I would say that even atheists would have a right to object.

  • CT Catholic Corner
  • Paul Moeller

    All the regulars in the established “Lay Magisterium” of the apologetics industry have engaged in accusing and marginalizing all sorts of faithful Catholics for years, just because they don’t conform to the industry’s interpretation of what it means to be a good American Catholic. It’s about time someone told the truth about the industry regulars. They seems to think they can take out after anyone they want, by they cry like sissies if you swing back.

  • DavidWerling

    SSPX priests who blog = 0
    FSSP priests who blog = 0
    Institute of the Christ the King Sovereign Priest priests who blog = 0

    Priest bloggers who attack Catholic laymen = too many, and now +1. Voris ought to do a piece on that topic!

    I don’t listen to Voris, but he does have a point. There are a lot of professional Catholics out there making their livings at evangelizing, and, ironically, I have always included Voris in that group.

    At any rate, Father, how about you let us Catholic laymen work out this squabble among ourselves? Voris wasn’t addressing you to begin with, and your treatment of a man whom you should be willing to die for leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

    God bless!

  • Rob

    Wow, this article is so filled with ad hominem attacks that as a philosophy professor, I would fail it and have the student write it over. I pray that this is not the philosophical training our priests are getting in the seminary today! How sad!

  • Lucidmimi

    We absolutely need, Michael Voris and may the Lord Jesus, in His infinite mercy and justice raise up other Holy Warriors in the Church Militant, because the time is NOW!

  • Joey Storer

    Fr. Longenecker,

    We absolutely need Michael Voris. You see, 70% of Catholics don’t go to church anymore. Did you get this memo? So, the likes of your generation (certainly not you in particular) but your innovative generation have presided over this massive train wreck and continue to march along thinking that it will get better if they just do more of the same.

    Michael Voris is brilliant since he clearly points out that those who have been driving the train and have wrecked the train should excuse themselves from all sight, repent, and do penance for deciding to willfully override all the Popes, Bishops, experts and councils that pointed us in the right direction now fifty miserable years ago.

    The Bishops have no credibility (since they wrecked the train). We have to look to clear thinkers like Michael Voris to understand the extent of the damage, those who did the damage, and work to remove them so that they will stop doing what they know how to do best – that is make the church smaller.

    Father, your nitpicking about Catholic Answers and pay levels is just irrelevant. It is only Michael Voris who has the guts to say what needs to be said.

  • Kirk Hansen

    Father, you said, “The next problem with Voris’ attack is that his method is unscriptural. The Sacred Scriptures teach us that if you have a problem with your brother you are to go to them first in private.” However, you then took the exact same approach to Voris. Did you contact him first?

  • jeff

    My recollection of the video was that these guys, out of fear of losing their salaries, refuse to rock the boat. only fools with cult-member like blindness can claim that our bishops bear no responsibility for the problems in the church today.

    Eg, Were the bishops really oblivious to their seminarians cruising gay bars in packs on a Saturday night? we know they weren’t because they expelled the godly ones who complained about it.

    were the the bishops really oblivious to heresy being taught to catholic school kids, or to “Catholic” sex ed classes involving students being required to put condoms onto bananas?

    no. the bishops have a lot to answer for.

  • Jasper0123

    yes, we need about 100 more MV’s

  • Melkite Catholic

    blah blah blah blah blah… “I’m so educated and know so much more about theology than anyone else does I’m a Priest and can dis the faithful because I’m soooo educated.” In the words of Padre Pio “Go to Hell”

  • Churchill4President

    I support Michael Voris 100%! He is a modern day John the Baptist, a voice crying out in the wilderness.

    Years of Saul Alinsky inspired wickedness and corruption in the Catholic Church in America must stop!

    Follow the money and starve them. I suggest everyone stop blindly supporting Catholic Churches and dioceses that are contributing to this problem. Find a true pious and worthy Catholic organization to support instead. That is the only way things will change.

  • Michael MacDonell

    Yes the Catholic Church desperately needs people like Michael Voris. And many more people just like him.

  • Alicia Acebedo

    We do need Michael Voris and the likes of him!!! In spite of the article above, it is only through his videos that i was convinced and realized that contraception is really wrong and what it has done to destroy our culture, our society and our church without knowing it. His is the only ministry I know so far who would spend lots of money, time and other resources on research and studies just to courageously present these materials to us Catholics (knowing that he will be persecuted and attacked in the process) in an intellectual manner and not theologically and in vague terms. His materials give us more reason to resist these sins because we get to realize the impact of these, which in most cases we cannot see and touch, and these sins will attack and harm us the most when it is too late already. Most Catholics do not even know there is really wrong in the church because most of us are ignorant about our faith and wouldn’t care, and also do not know why our people leave the church. At the same time, there are lots of people, especially politicians and other public figures, claiming that they are Catholics but promoting immoral issues and reject the teachings of the church publicly, and the number of priests are deteriorating and people are still wondering why we have come to this and until now, no serious action is being done or have not heard anything to counteract publicly about these, by the bishops who should be responsible to feed and protect their own flocks. I wouldn’t want to come to a time when there will be no more priests anymore for me to receive the Blessed Eucharist and my children and grandchildren will be rediculed and persecuted in their faith and become future martyrs.

  • JuanOskar JayMaynes

    I listen to all Voris’ daily posts. I didn’t quite get the Keating thing, but I
    remember glossing over his comments.

    Father, you lost me when you said, “Our good colleges and
    universities are pumping out well educated, enthusiastic and eager young
    Catholics who would make great DREs, evangelists, ….etc.” I’ll take your word
    for it. All I see are more ‘career Catholics’. My impression of MOST American priests and bishops is that they are mostly introverts, never want to debate and mix it up
    a little bit, are frightened of lawsuits, and live in a clerical bubble. With less than 20% of Catholics actually keeping the Sacraments Voris at least shows some urgency. Peace………………JO

  • Alicia Acebedo

    We do need Michael Voris and the likes of him!!! In spite of the article above, it is only through his videos that i was convinced and realized that contraception is really wrong and what it has done to destroy our culture, our society and our church without knowing it. His is the only ministry I know so far who would spend lots of money, time and other resources on research and studies just to courageously present these materials to us Catholics (knowing that he will be persecuted and attacked in the process) in an intellectual manner and not theologically and in vague terms. His materials give us more reason to resist these sins because we get to realize the impact of these, which in most cases we cannot see and touch, and these sins will attack and harm us the most when it is too late already. Most Catholics do not even know there is really wrong in the church because most of us are ignorant about our faith and wouldn’t care, and also do not know why our people leave the church. At the same time, there are lots of people, especially politicians and other public figures, claiming that they are Catholics but promoting immoral issues and reject the teachings of the church publicly, and the number of priests are deteriorating and people are still wondering why we have come to this and until now, no serious action is being done or have not heard anything to counteract publicly about these by the bishops who should be responsible to feed and protect their own flocks. I wouldn’t want to come to a time when there will be no more priests anymore for me to receive the Blessed Eucharist and my children and grandchildren will be unnecessarily rediculed and persecuted in their faith and become future martyrs.

  • Lily

    Father you say we Need watchdogs. So why is it not OK for Michael to be that watchdog? No one else seems to be stepping up to the plate. There is a reason that Michael has a large following. So many of us are seeing the Church we love being destroyed from within. I see abuses in the mass even among the very clergy charged to defend and preserve it. I don’t see why the topic of their salaries is off limits. They are fund raising and it is relevant. I personally like all those people and believe they are doing a great job. I believe they have saved souls by leading them to the Church. I was not surprised by their income but I respect Michael and Church Militant more for keeping their salaries down and focusing on their mission. I don’t see why their salaries are off limits. I’m a state employee and anyone can look up my salary. It’s no big deal to me. I don’t see why it should be a big deal to anyone else.

  • Alicia Acebedo

    We do need Michael Voris and the likes of him!!! In spite of the article above, it is only through his videos that i was convinced and realized that contraception is really wrong and what it has done to destroy our culture, our society and our church so far without knowing it. His is the only ministry I know so far who would spend lots of money, time and resources on research, statistics and studies just to courageously present these materials to us Catholics (knowing that he will be persecuted and attacked in the process) in an intellectual manner and not theologically and in vague terms. His materials give us more reason to resist these sins because we get to realize the impact of these, which in most cases we cannot see and touch, and these sins will attack and harm us the most when it is too late already. Most unsuspecting Catholics do not even know there is really wrong in the church because most of us are ignorant about our faith and wouldn’t care, and also do not know why our people leave the church and it is their business anyway. At the same time, there are lots of people, especially politicians and other public influential figures, claiming that they are Catholics but promoting immoral issues and reject and redicules the teachings of the church publicly, and the number of priests are deteriorating and people are still wondering why we have come to this and until now, no serious action is being done or we have not heard anything to publicly condemn these people by the bishops who are authorized to speak on behalf of the church and should be responsible to feed and protect their own flocks. So if a layman, like Michael Voris, speaks and expose these issues, people would criticize and say he is not authorized to do that, but the question is if the bishops don’t do their jobs, then who will? I wouldn’t want to come to a time when there will be no more priests anymore for me to receive the Blessed Eucharist and my children and grandchildren will be unnecessarily rediculed and persecuted in their faith and become future martyrs.

  • Elizabeth

    I’ll admit I don’t know much about Michael Voris and don’t watch his programs. I did see this particular episode as someone had posted the link on my FB page. As I watched it, I found it to be un-christian, and I was scandalized but not for the reasons that Mr. Voris would have. Problems with another’s salary? Really? Compared to others in the same positions in media, these salaries are a mere pittance. And unless you know what percentage of donations is actually going to salaries versus the apostolate, listing their salaries and calling them scandalous is mere vitriol designed to outrage others. Are there problems in the Church? Most assuredly, as there have been in every generation. I agree that the Church does need its “watchdogs”, but we need more like St. Catherine and St. Francis. When Mr. Voris speaks first with love and in charity, as taught to us by Christ, then he might find more willing ears. As St. Paul writes “To speak evil of no man, not to be litigious, but gentle: shewing all mildness towards all men.”

  • Ran

    Do we need Michael Voris? Yes, we need many more like him. We see the mess Michael talks about. I saw the mess years before I ever heard of Michael Voris. The real question is why are priests, like Father Dwight Longenecker, not trying to clean up the mess? God bless Michael Voris and his team!

  • Chloe Austyn

    My first thought was pro-life. Your title could be read as questioning the validity of his existence. “We don’t need you to exist unless you agree with us” is no way to begin a dialogue. Voris isn’t my favorite person, but c’mon. You can do better than that.

    Ars orandi has an excellent rebuttal, for those who would prefer not just to read “update” posts that agree with the original poster: http://arsorandi.blogspot.com/2013/08/do-we-need-fr-dwight-longenecker.html

  • OneTimothyThreeFifteen

    At root, the problem is that the Poster Boy of all the luvvies resigned from the papacy.

    But they have not responded like sheep without a shepherd, but more like Lemmings without a leader: they were going in a certain direction – and they’ll continue without the leader in the same direction if they have to – towards the cliff.

    They cannot survive without rubrics and rules, like being on train-tracks (when they become the ‘traditions’ St Paul condemns), like little babies.

    An unfortunate epiphenomenon of the work Benedict needed (had) to do to clarify certain things, pandered to the needs of the immature and insecure, and he was taken away from them, so they’re having a hissy fit, like a child when a parent takes something away from them that was actually more likely to cause them harm.

    Our current Holy Father is saying, ‘Grow Up!’, ‘Be Responsible!’, ‘Put your money where your mouth is!’, and they really don’t like it as it’s ripping them out of their comfort zone. They need the safety of the play pen, and he’s saying, ‘Go out into the World! It’s a messy place!’.

    It is at this point, that many of us, if not all of us, feel ourselves pulled out of our comfort zone. It is the pull of faith. It is the moment of choice. it is the time to grow up.

    Will we fling ourselves into the arms of our loving Father and the Good Shepherd, in the Holy Spirit, knowing he won’t abandon us – what we should do – or throw our toys about, put ourselves into the service of bullies like Voris to feel secure again, following the demonic: put ourselves in charge of fixing the problem, or follow others that claim to have the solution?

    What on earth (literally) is the Church for? Who is She?
    Voris made a video on the Church as ‘She’ and ‘It’, and interestingly, he his words do not describe an ‘et-et’, but an ‘aut-aut’, an ‘either-or’.

    Whatever we think about the Liturgy, we have a crisis in Ecclesiology, and it’s called Protestantism. And yes, it’s to be found at the very heart of ‘traditionalism’, and that’s why it’s on the verge of schism. As Benedict wrote Lumen Fidei, but Francis promulgated it, might the same be the case with the FFI ‘debacle’?

    Are FFI doing something about it, or now in disobedience? A statement like that would have been a long time coming, in my view, not something concocted in a few weeks. Pope Francis is a Holy Father, not a figurehead like Justin Welby, and the Magisterium isn’t the General Synod of the Church of England. It is guaranteed, guided, and protected, as infallible, by the Holy Spirit.

    Voris is a vortex:
    ‘A spiral motion of fluid within a limited area, especially a whirling mass of water or air that sucks everything near it toward its center.’ The things that get pulled in are those things too weak fight it. The naive, the gullible, the credulous.

    People only get aggressive when they’re insecure. A sure sign of grace is where there’s compassion where there should be aggression, to my mind.

    Who will we run to? Papa or pride? We have to choose, but we have no reason to be afraid if we choose the first option…

  • Nephi

    Capitalizing on Jesus eh Fr. Longnecker? Thou protesteth too much. Try reading Denzinger.

  • Brian Mershon

    You didn’t answer the question about salary and income from your apostolate. In the interest of full disclosure, how much?

  • Marie Dean

    Father, many pensioners, like myself, on very low salaries, give money to charities thinking it is going to necessary things. As a worker in Catholic schools and even one chancery office, and as the wage earner in the family, I never made more in those institutions than $35,000 and in recent times. I think older people are shocked at these salaries, especially when the older people are eating ramen noodles and little meat AND giving to these charities. One cannot have a double standard and expect really poor Catholics to support middle-class or upper middle-class Catholics. And, I made that salary above in a well-known institution in California with a dependent. Hard? You bet.

    We need independent voices who are not connected to institutions giving insights into situations. And, being a Catholic in the world is a sacrifice, and should be.

  • Long-Skirts

    SEMPER

    FI

    St. Michael

    Protect him

    This man

    Among…

    His status,

    Reputation,

    For Christ

    Away flung.

    Only the brave

    Have guts

    So to

    Speak -

    We think

    It sound harsh

    Because men

    Are so weak.

    The proud -

    The few -

    This Catholic

    Marine…

    He’s keen -

    He’s lean -

    Church Militant

    Machine!

  • Anne

    I have long since come to believe that people never mean half of what they say, and that it is best to disregard their talk and judge only their actions.
    Dorothy Day

  • Chris

    Father Dwight,

    How is what Voris said any different from the Pope inspecting cars and telling seminarians not to have smart phones? Based on what I have read from our Holy Father, Francis and Voris would largely agree about compensation.

    I mostly agree with you, I just find your points inconsistent, you seemingly rush in to defend this Pope from radical traditionalists in other cases, but yet when Voris makes similar points to the Pope,
    you attack him.

  • Stu

    Father,

    Much of your criticism in Voris’ presentation is indeed apt. The point he raises is a good one but the method misses the mark and there is room to hear some other sides of the story. But I do have to bring up some points.

    You say, “We criticize them because if the traditionalist cause is not careful they will allow these high volume, vocal extremists to do great damage to their own cause and to the Catholic Church and the gospel of Jesus Christ.”

    Really? I find it hard to believe that this very tiny group is such a threat. So-called “traditionalists” are already a minority in of themselves. Certainly the extremes within that group are even more tiny. Yet you wouldn’t know that with all of the attention given to this fringe group by many Catholic (Patheos) bloggers, some of which seemed fuel by hurt feelings more than anything over insults made in the past.

    You go on to say, “However, I have to be blunt. There is a certain type of personality that is never happy unless it has an enemy, and the enemy they like best are the ones around their own table…” (And to your credit, you include yourself in that.) Well, I would submit that it is that exact dynamic that fuels much of the criticism of traditionalists (and indeed some of your fellow Catholic (Patheos) bloggers are so exacting) and so-called radical traditionalists, mad-trads, etc.

    Voris made one good recommendation in his latest video and that was a call for a “reboot.”

    God bless you, Father and thank you for your vocation.

  • Stewball

    I personally dislike the use of the term ‘traditionalist’ esp when used with a capital ‘t’, as it implies that Catholics who follow all of Church tradition including V2 are somehow not traditional. What about those of us who attend both forms, who want reverent liturgy under both forms? (And that refers to liturgy alone, not to mind the rest of Church teaching…)

  • doctorb

    Yes…..we need Michael Voris. Mr. Voris is a true Catholic gentleman who is unafraid of “offending” someone by speaking the truth. His comments about salaries are irrelevant because the crux of the matter is that these people have been following what the world says is right rather than what the Church says. If the politically correct element of the Church is upset, so be it. The Church is present to save souls so what may appear to be “uncharitable”, is the cold, hard truth.

    The Church needs a man revolution…real men who are unafraid of the world, but answer to God. Men have been experiencing emasculation for nearly 50 years with catastrophic results. I admire Mr. Voris and wish more men were like him, especially our bishops (successors to the apostles) and our priests (alter Christus) who have been effected the most.

    So listen to the real context of Mr Voris’ presentation. Buck-up men…there were no wimpy apostles.

    If this writer has “offended” anyone….cast the first stone.

  • Nathan718

    I’m probably what would be considered a “traditionalist” Catholic. I attend the usus antiquior (TLM), prefer to pray in Latin, dislike altar girls, etc. and a truer statement than “we criticize the extremists because the extremists are actually hurting the traditionalists” will not be found. If you think semi-schismatic, neo-Protestant groups like SSPX or SSPV or worse yet sedevacantists do anything but hold back the reform of the reform you are not paying attention. I don’t know how many people are held back from embracing our Catholic heritage because of the loony, anti-Semitic fringe. We will never regain the beautiful traditions of our Church until we realize such groups are not allies, but the worst enemies of real, faithful traditionalists.

  • barbieahayes

    Father, I think there are many bloggers who are a little too happy-go-lucky about the state of the Church. We are in crisis, as Michael often tells us, and some of his readers find your posts, as well as the Deacon’s and the Anchoress’ a little lacking in the discussion and easement of the evils that indeed are in the Church. I love to watch EWTN and I read Catholic Answers almost daily. But I am very disappointed that there is little support and help from the Catholic media outlets to fight against abortion, the LBGT (and whatever) agenda, same-sex ”marriage,” contraception, liberalism, heterodoxy in the Catholic Church, etc. It is as if some Catholic bloggers take a hands-off approach to the crimes against the Church lest they are dragged into the sturm und drang (and really who nowadays wants to be in the thick of the battle?). Michael is knee-deep defending the Church against the culture wars, it is not just a shtick, and I think he could use some help. Won’t you lay down the sword of contention and take up the cause? Those of us who fight the good fight are pretty exhausted. Those of you who are prominent in the Catholic media have an obligation to call your readership to arms.

  • AnneG

    I worked for years as a nurse and finally learned that there are reasons doctors, surgeons and managers make the decisions they make. Sometimes it was because they had information I did not have, others it was because I was wrong!
    That is what irritates me about the Magesterium of Michael Voris and Mark Shea. Makes me want to say, “Wo died and made you Pope?”
    Thanks Father.

  • Lynne

    Peace makes us see things as they are before God and not as creatures see them. Let us always do God’s Will and we will live in His Peace. Fiat!

  • Patti Day

    Father, You don’t need one more comment, so this is for myself. I stopped reading MIchael Voris’ blog or looking at his videos some time ago. There was something about him that seemed too much like a showman, and he seemed to take too much delight in his various “exposes”. Now I will have to go back and at least watch this particular video lest I judge him based on the articles of two people I trust, yourself and Elizabet Scalia.


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