Toxic Masculinity is Godly?

Toxic Masculinity is Godly? August 1, 2018

Larry Solomon of Biblical Gender Roles has abandoned his old format of making videos where he droned on and on. He’s replaced them with a slightly more sophisticated model that does not include his voice. The newest one is about ‘Toxic Masculinity’. According to Larry toxic masculinity is Godly, and the term an invention of a sinful world.

He makes it clear that fearing, being sad, showing emotions and other what he thinks are ‘silly women things’ are not to be done by men ever. Too bad, because he is limiting men into a tightly laced role that they may be very ill-suited for. Screencaps of Larry’s ideas below from his YouTube video.

Larry is now claiming to be a ministry and is asking directly for donations via Paypal. Wonder what Paypal’s rules on white supremacy hate mongers is? I know they refuse to allow Steven Anderson of Faithful Word Baptist Church to use their service.

Watch Larry’s pile of cherry picked Bible verses here:

Here are a few books with much better ideas on what real masculinity actually is without the toxic bits:

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What Are Your Thoughts?leave a comment
  • If Jesus Christ came back today, he would be definitely berated as a “sissy” by many of his self-professed followers.

  • Tawreos

    We get it, Paul didn’t like the gays. I would think that a christian would care more about what christ said than Paul, but I am not looking for a reason to hate people…for Jesus.

  • Saraquill

    Long hair, skirt wearing, praising the meek…

  • Carstonio

    In my browser, there are no suggested books at the end of the post. At first I wondered if Suzanne was making a point that there aren’t such books and there needs to be. But the page’s source code reveals that they are Amazon widges that didn’t show. So here are the links to the books themselves, by Terry Crews and Lewis Howes.

  • Anri

    Too bad, because he is limiting men into a tightly laced role that they may be very ill-suited for.

    Rather the way the bible limits humanity in general into a tightly laced role it doesn’t seem well-suited for.

  • Tawreos

    Always traveling with his 12 “friends”

  • Well, Larry has quite an ethnocentric view of masculinity, as norms vary across cultures. In Chinua Achebe’s book Things Fall Apart, set in an Igbo village (in present-day Nigeria) towards the beginning of British colonialism, a measure of masculinity for the pre-colonial villagers was the ability to feed one’s family on yams for a year. Can Larry do that? (The main character seemed to have a major problem with toxic masculinity, and, IMHO, there is overlap in what Westerners can discuss.)

  • Julia Childress

    What about “Jesus wept” and “I would gather you as a hen gathers her chicks” and all that?

  • Freodin

    “Toxic Masculinity is Godly?”
    Why, yes, it is! I personally don’t see any problems with this statement.

    Now the problems that others might see here is because of the equation of “godly” with “good”.

  • Saraquill

    I recommend the story “Unique Chicken Goes in Reverse.” It’s an amusing yet thoughtful examination of faith and poultry.

  • AFo

    In that one verse where David tells Solomon not to be afraid, it’s pretty obvious that David’s words were specific to that situation. I’m not sure if Larry has no reading comprehension skills, is willfully ignorant, or thinks his followers are stupid. I guess he doesn’t care, as long as men are unfeeling tough guys who place themselves higher than everyone else, just like Jesus would have wanted (/s).

  • Suzanne Harper Titkemeyer

    What? Must go see what’s going on. I’ve read both of those books and they are excellent on what toxic masculinity does. Crews book is autobiographical, but he’s been through a great deal, including being harmed by the Seventh Day Adventist church. Spirit abuse is the gift that keeps on giving.

  • SAO

    I think a fair amount of the idea that women are the weaker sex, in need of manly protection, comes from being more emotional. Therefore, manly men have to be unemotional. Because, let’s face it, in today’s world, a woman doesn’t really need a man to protect her; with a gun, her size and strength are irrelevant. A petite 5’0″ woman in a wheelchair can shoot a muscle-bound giant just as easily as a man of any size and fitness. Strength is not needed for most things we do. The really hard work is done by machines.

    Plus, it’s a way to put down and ignore women’s feelings. You have nothing to be angry about, you’re just being weak and emotional.

  • Hannah

    Because being strong and courageous are just for men, right? History shows us that this is utter rubbish, but I doubt this creature has ever picked up a history book. And then there’s this lady…

  • smrnda

    Men who embrace toxic masculinity often fail at being providers and protectors, because aggression and poor impulse control aren’t great assets in the job market. Toxic masculinity leaves men unemployed because they won’t consider fields like nursing or other health care occupations because these difficult jobs, which can actually pay pretty well, are ‘not masculine enough.’

  • bekabot

    And David said to Solomon his son, Be strong and of good courage, and do it: fear not, nor be dismayed: for the Lord God, even my God, will be with thee; he will not fail thee, nor forsake thee, until thou hast finished all the work for the service of the house of the Lord.

    Yup, and after you’ve done the Lord’s work the Lord may just drop you like a steaming hot rock; because once you’ve accomplished his bidding, he needs you no longer.*

    That’s the Dispensationalist philosophy — and the building and destruction of the Temple is one of their favorite illustrations.

    I wonder if Larry is a Dispensationalist. It would make sense if he were. Most especially, it would make emotional sense, since Dispensationalism is a philosophy which fosters a great deal of rational fear (IOW the fear is well-grounded if the Dispensationalist view turns out to be the right one) — and fear, however sensible in its origins, is an emotion with a strong and deleterious effect on human behavior (often it gets translated into anger).

    *God gets what he wants — but once the party’s over, Man gets kicked to the curb. IMO the people who place a strongly gendered interpretation on this picture are not wrong, particularly since its proponents tend to be fans of the view that Man’s relationship to Woman should be the same as God’s relationship to Man.

  • bekabot

    In some Orthodox Jewish communities, the pattern is that the women work while the men study. Maybe the Fundies are trending the same way.

  • Iain Lovejoy

    Just. Wow.

  • persephone

    There are some great posts on that site.

    It’s very clear that men who need to dominate women are insecure, fearful, and every -ist in the book.

  • persephone

    I just found @toxictheodog on Twitter. He’s a bot that woofs at any tweet with toxic theology, similar to racism dog.

  • Hannah

    I know! There’s no other words for it.

  • Hannah

    I agree with you on both counts. I would also love to get my hands on old Larry boy. He wouldn’t like me very much when I’m finished with him.

  • Iain Lovejoy

    How, precisely, is toxic Larry a “leader”, “protector” or “provider”?
    1. He’s no leader of anything or anyone except an unpleasant bully to a vulnerable wife and a fantasy cheerleader for a bunch of saddo losers who can’t get dates or can only keep a wife by threats.
    2. He’s patently never protected anyone in his life: he’s the one people need protecting from.
    3. In so far as he thinks he’s a “provider” because he has a job, the only way he’s keeping that job is by saving big macho fantasy Larry for the internet hidden under a pseudonym: I suspect if his employer found out how he advocates treating women his feet wouldn’t touch the floor on the way out.
    One of the many ironies of Sad Larry is that he blathers about “traditional masculinity” when the traditional (if clichéd and somewhat sexist) “manly” traits of stoicism, calmness, gentle protective strength, self-control and taciturn common sense completely elude him. What Larry thinks is “masculine” is what any past generation of “manly men” would call “selfish, spoilt adolescent”.

  • Martin Penwald

    Paul didn’t like women either. And marriages.

  • SAO

    I think in orthodox Jewish circles, being a Talmud scholar is one of the most admired ‘professions’. So, the husband sits and reads the Talmud and discusses it learnedly with other men and the wife works. I’m sure Larry would be fine with reading the bible, making pronouncements while someone else supports him.

    I’ve noticed that that’s an ambition of a lot of CPM men — to have their own ministries. How many Duggar sons-in-law were hoping their Duggar bride would help them jump-start their career as as a televangelist jetting around the country?

  • katiehippie

    Men are just as emotional. But in the toxic masculinity world, all you get to be is angry.

  • persephone

    Unfortunately, the Orthodox, especially the Haredim, don’t teach their children very well, except the Talmud for the boys, which makes it very hard for men and women to leave, just like the homeschooling fundies, because they have no marketable skills, or even the most basic of modern life skills. How many of them have ever taken public transit? Opened or kept a bank account? Gone to a government office for any reason? How many of them have Social Security Numbers? Birthing babies at home to couples not legally married is an excellent way to hide your children from government oversight.

  • B.A.

    I am Jewish,but thankfully NOT a member of these denominations!

  • Cynthia

    From what I understand, the lack of skills is in other areas.

    I haven’t heard of any trend to be totally off the radar. Many will qualify for benefits like Medicaid, so they have bank accounts and use government offices and have social security numbers. Years ago, I was on a Jewish mommy board that included some Haredi women and they told birth stories that included going to hospitals.

    Haredi is an umbrella term and not all groups have the same rules and issues. Groups like Chabad have a lot more outside contact than groups like Satmar, even though both are Hasidic.

    Education is a factor that keeps many trapped. The Modern Orthodox give kids a good secular education, but many Haredi groups do not. It is often worse for the boys, because so much time is spent on religious subjects that they have very little time for anything else. Boys are also more likely to be taught in Yiddish. Girls get less religious education but are often taught enough so that they can get jobs, and they usually have been English. Access to Internet is extremely limited, esp for boys, since there is a fear of porn. Things like TV are generally not permitted. The community can be extremely close, which is great when it is being supportive, but it means that it is harder to suddenly lose that support. In some communities, the degree of conformity expected is very high and people fear doing anything that is “not done”. Early marriage and childbearing is expected, and it is far harder to leave is you already have a family.

  • Mr Kish

    The church has become limp wristed and femine thanks the false teachings. It needs to be more manly

  • Mr Kish

    The Bible also says the cowardly will not inherent the Kingdom of God.

  • Mr Kish

    A good talk on this is if you go to youtube and type

    Bob On Rediscovering Courage & Fleeing Cowardice | Speakers Corner

  • AFo

    I grew up near a Satmar Hasidic village, and this is spot on. This particular village is often listed as one of, if not the, poorest in America. Something like 94% of them are on Medicaid, and a good chunk use food stamps, which the mothers register for as single because they don’t issue marriage licenses. They pay almost no property tax because most of the buildings, including homes, are declared religious buildings and tax exempt. Basically, the adjacent towns, the county, and the state subsidize their lifestyle. You see them all the time at Wal Mart or Target, a young mother or couple with six or seven kids running wild and the baby (there’s always a baby) screaming his head off. They know very little English, and learn almost nothing at their yeshivas besides scripture. The girls are pulled out of school early to prepare for marriage. Almost no one leaves, because where are they going to go?

  • Benjamin Muller

    One of the reasons I can’t help but see fundamentalists as stupid is they fall for such obviously stupid ploys. “real men lead, so follow me and give me money and I will help you be a real man”.

    If you’re the kinda guy who gets sucked into submission by people like that, you don’t need to worry about feminists, you’ve got much bigger personal issues at work in your life that are holding you back.

  • Suzanne Harper Titkemeyer

    Sorry, just watched and just No no NO! He is ‘cheap grace’ and the exact type of ‘Christian’ killing the religion.

  • Mr Kish

    What do you mean by cheap grace? How is he killing his religion?

    Is Jesus Christ God?

    What is the gospel?

  • Suzanne Harper Titkemeyer

    Have you even looked at the comment policy here? You’ve already violated it several times and stand a good chance of ending up on Jerks 4 Jesus.

  • Mr Kish

    What is the comment policy? Where is it? I am trying to find it. How am I breaking the rules?

    Why are you making fun of people who have have different views from yourself?

  • Suzanne Harper Titkemeyer

    This is a site for recovery from Evangelical Quiverfull and we do not allow any proselytizing of any religion, not Mormon, not Catholic, not Islam, not Hindu, not Satanism, and especially not Evangelicalism which has harmed many here. It is specifically geared towards those leaving Evangelicalism. There is a link to our comment policy at the very bottom of the page. I suggest you read it. It does state that if you go against our policies I have no problem with banning you.

  • Mr Kish

    Interesting I cannot see that in the links right at bottom but clearly you are the mod and your rules go.

    The people here have sadly attended the wrong evangelical churches but hey ho I pray for you all! Be blessed!

  • Benjamin Muller

    They(christian ‘men’ who propagate these silly notions) are not even good at being angry. They get all whiney and self pitying, casting themselves as victims. how the hell that’s supposed to be “masculine” is beyond me.

  • bekabot

    That’s kind of the pattern with the Proverbs 31 woman too. She runs a business, while her husband sits at the gates and discusses things with his peers. Same deal.

  • zizania

    Ever read the one about Fritjof Nansen? It’s wonderful. I laughed myself into an asthma attack.

  • persephone

    Except the Proverbs 31 wife has created such a good income that she has servants and slaves to take care of the house and kids.

  • persephone

    I didn’t make my segue into fundies clear.

    I’ve heard about the Medicaid and social services BS. That’s one of the reasons secular Israelis have gotten really angry about. They also refuse to serve in the military.

    The Satmar, I think, are also literally taking children from new immigrants to the U.S. and hiding them away, then adding them to their families, leaving the parents in the dark as to where their children are, abandoning them to find their way.

    And the various Haredi have convinced New York state and Canada to allow them to handle legal matters in their own religious, something, to me, that seems entirely unconstitutional, as well as taking over school boards and pushing money to their private schools.

    It is so effed up.

  • persephone

    My ex is a secular Jew. His mom and her siblings do little things foodwise, but I think it’s more from habit. The only time I know of that they went to temple was at their mother’s funeral.

    Unfortunately, my MIL suffered the Ashkenazi curse of breast cancer. But she’s managed to survive two bouts.

  • bekabot

    Well, true. It’s always the upscale types who make it into the official record.

    (Vide purblind white folks who think that if they’d lived in the Old South they’d have been plantation owners and that if they’d lived around the turn of the 19th century they’d have lived in the Addams family mansion — before it got decrepit — lounging around on rattan furniture whilst being waited on by hosts of servants. That’s what they’ve read about and seen on TV.)

  • Cynthia

    Do you have a link for that information about Satmar taking kids from new immigrants? That’s not something that I’ve ever heard before.

    Re legal matters:

    That’s the Beis Din. New York State and Canada allow people to arbitrate disputes as an alternative to going to court for civil matters (not criminal), and the Beis Din is a form of arbitration. Both parties sign an arbitration agreement saying that they will be bound by the arbitrator’s ruling, which can then be enforced by the courts.

    In Ontario, Canada, the law was changed around 10 years ago so that religious arbitration was no longer permitted in family court (because there was an uproar after the Muslim community made a proposal for a Sharia court that would function as the Beis Din had been running). It is still used in regular civil matters, to settle things like contract disputes.

    Re Israel:

    The draft exemption started off as something that was granted for a fairly small number of yeshivah students, because Shimon Peres felt sorry for them after the Holocaust, when most of their communities had been wiped out and they were seen as the very last remnant. That mushroomed into an entire lifestyle for a fast-growing segment of the population today, and it’s a mess. Because the exemption is for full-time students, men in these circles simply don’t work at all, because doing so means they could be drafted. The incomes earned by the wives are lower, the rents are often higher, and the poverty of many of the families is even worse than it is in North America (45% living below the Israeli poverty line).

  • persephone

    I saw it on a documentary a few years ago, and I just can’t recall the name. I was horrified while I watched. It was also about kids in the community working as drug mules and dealers, because they could pass easily through airports.