Can You Spank Out Rebellion?

Can You Spank Out Rebellion? September 17, 2019
Recreation of a graphic by someone else that had too many dirty words to pass our filter. Not my idea originally, but someone else’s clever simplistic idea.

This was something posted on Lori Alexander’s secret chatroom and it’s quite appalling. I’ve blacked out the names of the guilty original parties. This post is a perfect example of homeschooling to isolate, which sometimes turns into homeschooling to hide abuse. Not saying that is what this poster is doing, but this type of isolation just breeds abuse.

The original poster has already deleted this post and all of the replies, even if at least a few of the replies agreed this was overkill for punishment. The original poster is upset that she got swift, hard, immediate pushback. Negative comments when she was expecting glowing, gushing telling how right she was.

Why punish at all? Why not simply stop and talk to your child and ask what was going on? In some of the replies the mother stated that the girl had eaten ‘junk food’ and suffered some sort of gastric distress. Who wants to go sit through a class when they are unwell? There could have been good reasons why the girl skipped the class that has nothing to do with any perceived rebellion.

Whatever the reason this is just completely over the top punishment, even beyond what Debi and Michael Pearl might mete out. Sometimes I wonder with these chat rooms and things if it’s making things worse. One woman says she spanked for disobedience, so the next mother must say she spanked and took away the cell phone. Someone else says spanked, took cell phone and grounded, and so on, a sick one upmanship  that keeps spiraling to a ridiculous place.

This poor girl has nothing, no ability to even visit the restroom without it being noted and controlled by her mother. This is not parenting, this is being a prison guard.

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Quiverfull: Inside the Christian Patriarchy Movement by Kathryn Joyce

I Fired God by Jocelyn Zichtermann

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About Suzanne Titkemeyer
Suzanne Titkemeyer went from a childhood in Louisiana to a life lived in the shadow of Washington D.C. For many years she worked in the field of social work, from national licensure to working hands on in a children's residential treatment center. Suzanne has been involved with helping the plights of women and children' in religious bondage. She is a ordained Stephen's Minister with many years of counseling experience. Now she's retired to be a full time beach bum in Tamarindo, Costa Rica with the monkeys and iguanas. She is also a thalassophile. She also left behind years in a Quiverfull church and loves to chronicle the worst abuses of that particular theology. She has been happily married to her best friend for the last 33 years. You can read more about the author here.

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What Are Your Thoughts?leave a comment
  • Jim Jones

    Sadism2 with excuses.

  • Tawreos

    Did anyone figure out that she wasn’t asking for advice about the punishment but was instead there to show off how “godly” she was in her over the top punishment for a minor “crime”?

  • Jezebel’sOlderSister

    I see this child approaching Recovering from Religion once she’s able to recognize the damage that has already been done.

  • Cynthia

    Mom of 3 posting – my kids are 15, turning 17 and turning 20.

    My top 3 tools for my kids’ behavior are:

    1. Having a close relationship with them, in which they trust me and know that they can tell me anything, and in which they have no reason to rebel and actually look to us as role models and seek our advice.

    Shocking, right? I don’t hate my teens or police them. At most, they may get a look of quiet disapproval or some questions. The result is that they will actively come to me – even the super-quiet one, and even with the hard stuff.

    2. Role models

    This part takes more work. WE need to be the sort of people that we want our kids to become, all the time, because kids don’t stop learning from our example when we are having a bad day. We also need to expose them to other people who are good role models.

    3. Positive peer pressure

    Yes, kids are influenced by other kids. That’s not a reason to keep them isolated. It’s a reason to try to arrange for your kids to have really good friends with good values.

    Bottom line is that the only “punishment” I ever really did was sending them to their room if they were having a meltdown or tantrum, or unplugging the TV if they weren’t listening to me. Both were actually logical consequences – time out was intended to be space to calm down and sometimes sleep, and the TV was unplugged when it was distracting them from getting ready. [Warning, shameless brag ahead] Today, they are hard-working, self-disciplined, exceptionally nice and kind, and the sort of kids that do volunteer work, work well with kids with special needs, have jobs, get great grades, and get constant praise from other parents and teachers.

    OT – but I just looked at Lori’s post on women being created to nurture. She thinks that if men and women were the same, that we would see a 50/50 split in various occupations – and she lists lawyer as one of them. Huh? My law class 25 years ago was evenly split between men and women. She really doesn’t get out much, does she?

  • Nightshade

    Some kids who are punished that severely will just decide the next time they misbehave, they might as well make it worth the consequences.

  • AFo

    I’m sure that whatever the girl was doing when she was supposed to be in class was much better for her and more productive than the class.

  • lady_black

    I agree, this isn’t a punishment issue. This is an issue that first calls for asking the child why she didn’t go to Sunday school, but if a child thinks she’s going to be punished, she won’t trust her mother enough to tell the truth. Maybe it was something she ate that didn’t agree with her. Maybe she had a headache. Maybe she’s being bullied by another child. That’s not a hill I would choose to die on, because she could be doing much worse than skipping an optional class.

  • lady_black

    4. Natural consequences.

  • Cynthia

    Does it occur to these people that they are not preparing kids for adulthood, but preparing them to live in an authoritarian regime? I mean, constant surveillance is what police states do. Training to instantly follow orders? Honestly, my immediate association with “just following orders” is Adolf Eichmann. So, yeah, NOT a parenting goal for me.

    Do I want kids that can go away to school or camp, and one day move out entirely, without me worrying that they will do something awful or harmful? Yes.

  • Cynthia

    LOL, forgot that because it just seems obvious. But yes, I’ve been shocked by people who don’t think that a kid could learn something on their own even if the parent didn’t do anything. Girl 2 had a grade 1 teacher that would force kids to put on their jackets outside, and I actually had to bring up at a parent-teacher meeting that she had my permission to decide for herself if she felt cold enough to wear it. The teacher was reluctant to accept this.

  • johnsoncatman

    Some people should not be parents, or even a pet owner. They think that a child is property. What a twisted way to raise children.

  • johnsoncatman

    But the teacher was just trying to make sure your child was raised to be a good robot.

  • Cynthia

    Teacher acknowledged that Girl 2 was perfectly good, but feared the “bad influence” on other kids if she was seen to be exercising her own judgment.

  • johnsoncatman

    LOLOLOL! Can’t have kids having independent thought!

  • persephone

    As well be hung for a sheep as a lamb.

  • persephone

    Nobody knows where she went, so she could have been hanging out in a restroom or in a cool spot near the church.

  • B.A.

    Let’s hope so. She’ll need it.

  • Heffalumps&Woozles

    I’m a preschool teacher myself. What I tell my kids is that they have to wear their coats when it’s chilly outside, but I do let them remove them on the playground if they’re feeling warm with the caveat that they are responsible for picking up their own coats when it’s time to go back inside.

  • Mimc

    Or she could have actually had a stomach ache because she felt so left out when the other kids were talking about the fun sleepover she wasn’t allowed to go to because of her controlling mother. That’s where my mind immediately went. Poor girl.

  • Mimc

    I can see not wanting a bunch of kids leaving there cost inside and then complaining about being cold. But recess is short and the first couple of real cold days should get the point across. One hopes. I do have a nice that will run barefoot in the snow.

  • Jennifer

    Forcing her to face the wall?? Determined she needs that and MORE shame because she missed a freaking class and then enjoying scaring her with insane threats? Not to mention that an 11-year-old should be considered too old for spanking even in fams that don’t mind doing it. That poor child IS receiving 1abusive2 treatment.

  • Cynthia

    You get a lot of fall days that have a chill when kids are dropped off at 8 am but which warm up by lunch. Weather isn’t always predictable, so I would send a jacket just in case. Frostbite prevention in sub-zero temperatures is something else (and I will mother even adult family members about that).

  • Clancy

    When my daughter was pre-school aged, she decided not to wear her jacket when we were going out on a very cold day My wife starts to cause a fuss, but I say, “Sure! I’ll bring your coat in case you change your mind.” Said mind was changed before we got to the car. I say it’s easier to let physics do the arguing for you.

  • Hannah

    I skipped actual school all the time, (there’s a reason I now work in a supermarket) aside from my mum yelling at me I didn’t get any punishments at all (reasons for skipping classes were I was bullied, couldn’t stand doing homework and I was severely depressed, not a good combination.) As and when I get released from Primary I’m probably going to skip Sunday School as well (and possibly Relief Society, we have to sit in a circle which makes writing really hard. Maybe I’ll just do that anyway.) Probably get hauled into the Bishop’s office if I skip it every week. (I’m not even a half-@rsed Mormon anymore, probably more quarter-@rsed.)

    Poor kid, that’s blinking awful. Someone tell the mother that she needs to take a chill pill. That is such a torrent of misery to unleash upon a child for doing something so minor as to be insignificant. So she skipped Sunday School? So what? Who cares? (Not me.) I’d have been more worried about why. Was she ill, tired, didn’t feel up to it, being picked on or left out? Why can’t these people just talk to there kids? Is that really so blooming difficult?

  • Mimc

    Oh good sure send the coat to school. I was thinking more leaving the coat in the class room on chilly but not dangerous days.

  • argyranthemum

    This girl is going to be under her authoritarian husband’s thumb when she leaves the house, so her mother is definitely preparing her for the future.

  • Jennifer A. Nolan

    This daughter is hated, not loved. I hope she understands this.

  • Astrin Ymris

    Since most CPM members support Trump, we can assume that they don’t see any problem with conditioning their kids to live under a fascist regime.

  • Lynn

    Lol. This is every other parent on the playground when my kids get to play in the mud. Seriously, who brings a kid out right after it rains and expects them to stay clean and dry?