2021-05-17T11:01:34-04:00

The Reformed Protestant / Calvinist anti-Catholic site, Evangelical Miscellanies produced (anonymously) the article, “The Perseverance of the Saints” (2-5-21). It was a [very selective] reply to my paper, Absolute Assurance of Salvation?: Debunking “Prooftexts”, which is Chapter Thirteen of my book, Biblical Catholic Salvation: “Faith Working Through Love” (Oct. 2010). The words of the writer will be in blue; my older cited words in green, and my present response in plain black.

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  1. Perseverance of the Saints: Can we be assured of our salvation?

Dave Armstrong:

Perseverance of the saints, or the “P” in TULIP, is merely a tautological truism: saying that the elect (i.e., those who are eschatologically saved) will be saved (Jesus says in John 6:39: “I should lose nothing of all that he has given me”). No one disputes that. Of course they will be saved, because that is the very definition of “elect” (Romans 11:29: “For the gifts and the call of God are irrevocable”). I am specifically critiquing the notion that we can possess or achieve absolute assurance of our own salvation or anyone else’s.

[my paper and book, had contained the obvious error of asserting that it was the “T” rather than “P” in TULIP. The author went on to correct it (which is fine) but also seems to imply if I wasn’t aware of that and hadn’t made merely a simple inadvertent, human error (which is silly and unnecessary)]

[T]echnically the saints do not persevere but rather are preserved by Christ (cf. Phil 1:6; Jn 6:39). 

Heaven forbid we do absolutely anything in the process . . .

Philippians 1:6 (RSV) And I am sure that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.

John 6:39 and this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up at the last day.

As readers can see, I mentioned John 6:39 in my paper (almost all of which was ignored in this “reply”). As for Philippians 1:6: absolutely! But God being sovereign and faithful and the source of all good things, including absolutely every good thing and act of obedience that we do. Catholics fully believe in the predestination of the elect. But this doesn’t preclude the willing participation with His enabling grace, in these elect, as the Bible also teaches:

Mark 16:20 And they went forth and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them . . .

1 Corinthians 3:9 For we are God’s fellow workers . . . (Phillips: “In this work, we work with God . . .” / Amplified: “For we are fellow workmen — joint promoters, laborers together — with and for God . . .”)

1 Corinthians 15:10 But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace toward me was not in vain. On the contrary, I worked harder than any of them, though it was not I, but the grace of God which is with me.

1 Corinthians 15:58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that in the Lord your labor is not in vain.

2 Corinthians 6:1 Working together with him [i.e., Jesus; see 5:21], then, we entreat you not to accept the grace of God in vain. (Calvinists claim that such grace is irresistible; so why is Paul warning them not to accept it in a wrong way?)

Galatians 5:6 . . . faith working through love.

Galatians 6:7-9 Do not be deceived; God is not mocked, for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. [8] For he who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption; but he who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life. [9] And let us not grow weary in well-doing, for in due season we shall reap, if we do not lose heart.

Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

Philippians 2:12-13 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.

Titus 3:5-8 he saved us, not because of deeds done by us in righteousness, but in virtue of his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration [i.e., baptism] and renewal in the Holy Spirit, [6] which he poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, [7] so that we might be justified by his grace and become heirs in hope of eternal life. [8] The saying is sure. I desire you to insist on these things, so that those who have believed in God may be careful to apply themselves to good deeds; these are excellent and profitable to men.

Notice that our friend provides two biblical passages that supposedly prove his half-truth and in fact do not, whereas I provide ten to prove the partly contrary and true biblical view of cooperation of man with the God Who always enables any and all good things by His grace.

The Council of Trent:

CANON XXIII.—If any one saith, that a man once justified can sin no more, nor lose grace, and that therefore he that falls and sins was never truly justified; or, on the other hand, that he is able, during his whole life, to avoid all sins, even those that are venial,—except by a special privilege from God, as the Church holds in regard of the Blessed Virgin: let him be anathema.[3]

The Roman understanding of justification is predicated on a synergistic view of soteriology.

Yes, it is synergistic because that is the biblical view, as I just showed with ten passages (and there are many more). Because it is the teaching of the Bible, I believed in Arminian soteriology (as opposed to Calvinist) as a Protestant before I ever read Trent or was bound to it as a Catholic.

God alone does not save, rather God contributes in part to salvation and the individual contributes in part to salvation.

That’s not the Catholic teaching, as he is insinuating. Trent taught in its canons on justification:

Canon 1 If any one saith, that man may be justified before God by his own works, whether done through the teaching of human nature, or that of the law, without the grace of God through Jesus Christ; let him be anathema.

Canon 2 If any one saith, that the grace of God, through Jesus Christ, is given only for this, that man may be able more easily to live justly, and to merit eternal life, as if, by free will without grace, he were able to do both, though hardly indeed and with difficulty; let him be anathema.

Canon 3 If any one saith, that without the prevenient inspiration of the Holy Ghost, and without his help, man can believe, hope, love, or be penitent as he ought, so as that the grace of Justification may be bestowed upon him; let him be anathema.

One might describe the different views as follows:

Reformed / Calvinist / “Either/or” outlook: God does all, therefore it is senseless and heretical to speak of man doing anything as regards to grace and salvation, and to do so is at least a semi-Pelagian position, detracting from God’s sole work in salvation.

Catholicism / Bible / “Both/and” outlook: God does all and enables all, pertaining to grace and salvation, yet man can also cooperate with God and in a non-Pelagian sense “participate” in the process.

The Catholic Church teaches salvation by grace alone (sola gratia) and rejects both Pelagianism and semi-Pelagianism, just as Calvinists do.

If the individual falters, that state of grace is lost.

Yes, per the many passages that I provided in the very paper that was supposedly being critiqued (but which was mostly ignored). God doesn’t force us to follow Him. We’re not robots. Therefore, we can rebel, just as Satan did, even though he was with God in heaven and knew much better than to be that stupid and evil.

Compare with the Westminster Confession of Faith:

Chapter XVII.—Of the Perseverance of the Saints.   

I. They whom God hath accepted in his Beloved, effectually called, and sanctified by his Spirit, can neither totally nor finally fall away from the state of grace; but shall certainly persevere therein to the end, and be eternally saved.

The elect are the elect. Of course they are. This is saying, in effect, “those who are eschatologically saved will in fact be eschatologically saved.” It’s circular reasoning (the conclusion already being in the premise). The error is based on the false notions of 1) no human free will (irresistible grace) and 2) that the state of grace or salvation is identical to being in the elect. It’s not. Not all those in a state of grace will be so ever after.

Armstrong:

I am specifically critiquing the notion that we can possess or achieve absolute assurance of our own salvation or anyone else’s.[6]

This is semantics. How do we define absolute? If we define absolute as an infinite or exhaustive knowledge of any given subject then of course man, who is by definition finite, cannot have an absolute or infinite knowledge of any given subject.

It’s just word games. It would be an assurance without any doubt present; not one iota of non-assurance; indubitable knowledge. Even John Calvin taught that we could not know who was a member of the elect; therefore, he denied absolute assurance of salvation, just as I do:

[W]e are not bidden to distinguish between reprobate and elect – that is for God alone, not for us, to do . . . (Institutes of the Christian Religion, IV. 1. 3.)

We must thus consider both God’s secret election and his inner call. For he alone “knows who are his” [II Tim. 2:19] . . . except that they bear his insignia by which they may be distinguished from the reprobate. But because a small and contemptible number are hidden in a huge multitude and a few grains of wheat are covered by a pile of chaff, we must leave to God alone the knowledge of his church, whose foundation is his secret election. It is not sufficient, indeed, for us to comprehend in mind and thought the multitude of the elect, unless we consider the unity of the church as that into which we are convinced we have been truly engrafted. (Inst. IV. 1. 2.)

Of those who openly wear his badge, his eyes alone see the ones who are unfeignedly holy and will persevere to the very end [Matt. 24:13] – the ultimate point of salvation. (Inst. IV. 1. 8.)

It is . . . not our task to erase from the number of the elect those who have been expelled from the church, or to despair as if they were already lost. It is lawful to regard them as estranged from the church, and thus, from Christ – but only for such time as they remain separated. However, if they also display more stubbornness than gentleness, we should still commend them to the Lord’s judgment, hoping for better things of them in the future than we see in the present. Nor should we on this account cease to call upon God in their behalf . . . let us not condemn to death the very person who is in the hand and judgment of God alone; rather, let us only judge of the character of each man’s works by the law of the Lord. While we follow this rule, we rather take our stand upon the divine judgment than put forward our own. Let us not claim for ourselves more license in judgment, unless we wish to limit God’s power and confine his mercy by law. For God, whenever it pleases him, changes the worst men into the best, engrafts the alien, and adopts the stranger into the church. And the Lord does this to frustrate men’s opinion and restrain their rashness – which, unless it is checked, ventures to assume for itself a greater right of judgment than it deserves. (Inst. IV. 12. 9.)

The election of God is hidden and secret in itself . . . men are being fantastic or fanatical if they look for their salvation or for the salvation of others in the labyrinth of predestination instead of keeping to the way of the faith which is offered them . . . To each one, his faith is a sufficient witness of the eternal predestination of God, so that it would be a horrible sacrilege to seek higher assurance. (Commentary on John 6:40; in Francis Wendel, Calvin: Origins and Development of His Religious Thought, translated by Philip Mairet, New York: Harper & Row, 1963, 270)

Let us, then, keep this in view above all other things, that it is no less insane to crave for other knowledge of predestination besides that which is given us in the word of God, than if one wanted to walk over inaccessible rocks or to see in darkness. (Inst. III. 21. 2.; in Wendel, ibid., 270-271)

Calvin even went so far as to state that we should never conclude that even obstinate excommunicates are lost or determined to not be of the elect by their sinful behavior, and should hope better for them (Inst. IV. 12. 9.)

Funny, then, that on one abominable Calvinist discussion group (around 1999-2000 or so), once it was discovered that I was Catholic, some idiot said I was damned and shouldn’t even be prayed for. Virtually no one disagreed with his judgment (all in opposition to their master, John Calvin, not to mention Jesus), excepting Dr. Francis Nigel Lee, who actually displayed rudimentary Christian charity and not pharisaical legalism and false teaching. I didn’t know that he was a famous theologian at the time. He was an impressive Christian. It was an honor to meet him.

Calvin and Luther, of course, both regarded Catholicism as a species of Christianity. For this reason, neither of them felt that they had to be baptized (“again”). But not these clowns in this discussion group (minus Dr. Lee) . . .

Armstrong:

We can, however, arrive at a moral or practical assurance…[7]

I have no surface level objection to this statement, though we would likely disagree on the details. That aside, I am uncertain if Rome would agree.

I’ve written about this issue. Catholic writer Andrew Preslar, underneath his excellent article, “St. Thomas Aquinas on Assurance of Salvation” (Called to Communion, 8-3-09), made a comment relevant to this question:

One cannot have hope, in St. Thomas’s sense, without faith. Hope is based upon faith, but not reducible to faith. Faith accepts the Gospel as divine truth, and hope receives that truth as good news “for me.”

Chapter XII of Session VI (Trent) refers to the possibility of “absolute certainty” of predestination to life, which knowledge can only come by special revelation. In my last comment, I had primarily in mind assurance of being in a state of grace, though I did not mean to rule out assurance of predestination. The evidence from Trent for a kind of “moral certainty” or comforting assurance other than the absolute certainty of faith lies in the phrases and adjectives that qualify the noun “certainty,” both in Chapter XII and in the Canons that touch upon the matter of assurance (emphasis added):

Canon 13.
If anyone says that in order to obtain the remission of sins it is necessary for every man to believe with certainty and without any hesitation arising from his own weakness and indisposition that his sins are forgiven him, let him be anathema.

Canon 14.
If anyone says that man is absolved from his sins and justified because he firmly believes that he is absolved and justified, or that no one is truly justified except him who believes himself justified, and that by this faith alone absolution and justification are effected, let him be anathema.

Canon 15.
If anyone says that a man who is born again and justified is bound ex fide to believe that he is certainly in the number of the predestined, let him be anathema.

Canon 16.
If anyone says that he will for certain, with an absolute and infallible certainty, have that great gift of perseverance even to the end, unless he shall have learned this by a special revelation, let him be anathema.

Among other things, this is to say that our faith is not in faith (Canons 13 and 14), and that the status of one’s own soul and eternal destiny are not among the articles of faith (Canons 15 and 16), to which pertain “absolute and infallible certainty.” The qualifying language (which I emphasized), furthermore, would be entirely gratuitous if the Church denied that, apart from special revelation, Christians could enjoy some form of certainty, and corresponding assurance, about their spiritual condition and eternal destiny.

He elaborates at great and glorious length, in a later comment:

Certainty, or perhaps more accurately, certitude, is a subjective condition relative to a variety of factors. Perhaps some examples will convey my meaning, and at least by implication address the several aspects of your question:

1. I am certain that God is love, and that God loves me. These certainties are based upon what I know (through reason and revelation) about the nature of God and the operations of God. This is what gives rise to the certainty of hope, regarding God’s provision for my own salvation.

2.I am certain that he who has begun a good work in me (at Baptism) will bring it to completion on the Day of Judgment. This is the certainty of hope. . . .

The different kinds or classifications of certainty / certitude (however many they might be; on the one hand: knowledge, faith, hope, moral certainty; on the other hand: presumption, delusion) correspond to the different things of which one is certain, together with the conditions under which certainty obtains, and perhaps the differing significance and subjective “feel” of each instance of certainty (although the latter can vary somewhat from person to person and time to time). My confidence in God regarding salvation is an instance of the certainty or assurance of hope. My confidence in my brother is an example of what I mean by “moral certainty”; that is, although in the realm of logically possibility his intentions could be otherwise, and though God has not revealed my brother’s intentions to me, I am certain that he means me no mortal harm.

This same kind of certainty, moral certainty, to be distinguished from the certainty of the rationally inescapable, the certainty of faith, and the certainty of hope, can legitimately be enjoyed by Catholics with respect to being in a state of grace, at least in the sense that Trent seems not to disallow such moral certainty of grace, as indicated in comment #6. Of course, being morally certain of being in a state of grace is not a necessary condition of actually being in a state of grace.

I can have doubts about myself, and still trust in God for deliverance from sin and sustenance in a state of grace, so long as I make faithful use of the means of grace, especially going to Confession and Mass. For me, one usual result of this religious activity, especially right after a double dose of the sacraments–Reconciliation and Communion–is a kind of confidence, a moral certainty or certitude if you will, of being in a state of grace. Among the conditions or presuppositions underlying this sacramental certainty are a constant reliance on the mercy of God (“Lord, I am not worthy that you should come under my roof, but only say the word and my soul shall be healed”), the intention to obey his will, and a right understanding of the difference between mortal and venial sin.

These sorts of things are indeed, Catholic teaching. Again, in another comment, Preslar sums up:

[A]s I have been arguing in previous comments, there is a kind of certainty distinct from both the certainty of scientific knowledge and the certainty of faith, and this would be moral certainty.

Armstrong:

But the Calvinist has a ready explanation; a stock answer to explain the person who seemed by all appearances to be a Christian, and then fell away or fell into extremely serious sin: they were “obviously” never saved.[8]

I’m not sure I would call the word of God a stock answer, but perhaps I am now the one arguing semantics.

1Jn 2:19 (NASB)

They went out from us, but they were not really of us; for if they had been of us, they would have remained with us; but they went out, so that it would be shown that they all are not of us.

Of course I didn’t call the Bible a “stock answer” (nice try!). Once again, we don’t have absolute assurance of salvation, and John Calvin taught this as strongly as we Catholics believe it. He obviously felt that he had biblical backing on the question. In my quotations from Calvin above, he mentioned, for example, 2 Timothy 2:19 (“The Lord knows those who are his, . . .”) and Matthew 24:13.

As for 1 John 2:19, I reply that this is inspired Scripture, whereas we, today, don’t have the same certainty of knowledge about individuals, as a writer inspired by God will have. Secondly (and more to the point), this book contains many proverbial-type statements, that are obviously not literal, and admit of exceptions,. So, for example, he writes:

1 John 3:6, 8-9 No one who abides in him sins; no one who sins has either seen him or known him.. . . [8] He who commits sin is of the devil; . . . [9] No one born of God commits sin; for God’s nature abides in him, and he cannot sin because he is born of God.

This is clearly not literal, and means “sin doesn’t typify the behavior of a true Christian” or “the essence of a Christian life is to be mostly sin-free” etc. because, for one thing, John himself contradicts a literal understanding by also writing (in these instances, literally and not hyperbolically):

1 John 1:8-10 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. [9] If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness. [10] If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

1 John 2:1 My little children, I am writing this to you so that you may not sin; but if any one does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous;

Moreover, we have biblical examples of man (kings of Israel or Judah) who did good according to God, but are described as having fallen away. I went through some of these in my Chapter Ten of the same book, dealing with total depravity. Here are some excerpts:

What do we make of, for example, King Jehoshaphat? Here is a very interesting case study indeed. He was subjected to the wrath of God, yet it is stated that he had some “good” and sought God: [I cited 2 Chronicles 19:2-3]

Not only the king, but many people in Judah also sought the Lord: [cited 2 Chronicles 20:3-4]

How can this be, under Reformed Protestant assumptions of total depravity? Was he (and all these multitudes who “came to seek the Lord”), therefore, regenerate? The text doesn’t say. He hadn’t heard the gospel, though; that’s for sure. Nor had the people of Judah.

According to Hodge and Calvinism generally, no one can do any “spiritual good” (as opposed to a merely natural good or natural moral virtue) whatsoever unless they are regenerated by the Holy Spirit. Were all these people “good men and women”? Did they seek God or not? . . .

Was Jehoshaphat himself a “good” man? Various passages state that he was (2 Chronicles 19:4-7, 9; 20:3, 6-7,1 2, 18-21). His reign is described as a good, righteous reign, by and large, but not totally: [cited 2 Chronicles 20:32-37]

Was King Jehoshaphat regenerated and saved in the end? We don’t know. But if he wasn’t, he couldn’t do any “spiritual good” at all, according to Calvinist theology. The Bible clearly teaches that he did much good; indeed, that he “did what was right in the sight of the LORD” (if that’s not “spiritual good,” what is?). Yet he didn’t destroy the high places, which were idols, and the last thing written about him was that he was prophesied against for joining with wicked King Ahaziah of Israel.

If he was indeed damned in the end, then how does Calvinism account for the spiritual good that can’t be done except by the regenerate (a state, in turn, that cannot be lost, according to Calvinism)? . . .

How about King Uzziah? The Bible says he sought God too: [cited 2 Chronicles 26:3-5]

But Uzziah met an even more tragic end than Jehoshaphat: [cited 2 Chronicles 26:16-21]

This passage places Calvinists in a tremendous predicament. . . . if it is maintained that only a regenerate person can seek God, so that, therefore Uzziah must have been regenerated, then how is his spiritual demise explained?

For Calvinists also hold that one can never lose regeneration or salvation, precisely because God gives it unconditionally (the “U” in TULIP) and His grace is irresistible (the “I” in TULIP) and that the elect always persevere and cannot fall away (the “P” in TULIP). No one can do any spiritual good unless regenerated because of the “T”: total depravity. If Uzziah was saved in the end, again there is no text whatsoever that would indicate such a thing.

Mt 7:22-23 (NASB)

“Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?’ “And then I will declare to them, ‘I never [οὐδέποτε] knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.’

Notice: “I never knew you,” not “I knew you for a little while and then you departed from me.”

These people were never of the elect because Jesus said so. He knows everything. We know very little: especially about other souls. This is the point. But this doesn’t preclude anyone falling away from grace, ever. I just provided examples of Kings Jehoshaphat and Uzziah, who did truly good things (so the Bible tells us) yet fell away.

Luke 22:31-32 (NASB)

“Simon, Simon, behold, Satan has demanded [ἐξῃτήσατο – or, obtained by asking] permission to sift you like wheat; but I have prayed for you, that your faith may not fail; and you, when once [ποτε – when, not if] you have turned again, strengthen your brothers.”

Both Peter and Judas betrayed Christ, both events were known beforehand by Christ, and yet one was always a believer, and one never was.

Sure, but this has no relevance to our subject matter: whether we ourselves have absolute assurance and/or whether we can know with certainty who else will be eschatologically saved (i.e., will go to heaven) or of the elect. If we had observed St. Paul killing Christians, many of us would conclude that he could never be in the fold. And we would be wrong.

Cf. Jn 17:11-12, 24; 6:70; 13:10-11

John 17:11-12, 24 simply talks about the elect who will not be lost (by definition). No one denies that, so there is nothing to dispute about that. In John 6:70 Jesus says Judas is a “devil” which no one denies, either. 13:10-11 tells us that Jesus knew Judas was corrupt. Of course. Who denies it? None of this tilts the debate between Calvinists and almost all other Christians one way or the other, because we all agree about these things.

Moving on:

Armstrong:

But this perfectly illustrates the conundrum: if such a person was thought by everyone to be saved and in the elect, but actually wasn’t, as later proved by his behavior (that no one imagined ever happening), then in fact, neither the person in question nor anyone else possessed the so-called “assurance” that he or she was saved, from the beginning.[11]

This is the same argument used by the serpent in the garden of Eden. 

Cf. Gen 3:1 (NASB)

Now the serpent was more crafty than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said to the woman,  “Indeed, has God said, ‘You shall not eat from any [כֹּל – every] tree of the garden’?”

Why does the serpent phrase the question thus? Certainly he knew that God did not say this, so why ask the question? What is the obvious implication? If there is even one tree from which you cannot eat, if you are limited in any way, if you do not have absolute autonomy as God does, then you are not really free at all. Armstrong asserts that if a finite man cannot have an absolute (exhaustive or infinite) knowledge of assurance as God does, then he cannot have true assurance at all. This line of reasoning is absurd, and is very clearly not applied to his own beliefs.

All of the above is a lie, and not analogous to my beliefs at all, save for the final sentence. The reasoning described is absurd, but (here’s the catch) it’s not my reasoning. It’s a caricature of my reasoning, or a straw man. And indeed it’s not applied to my own beliefs, as already explained above, in my lengthy distinction between absolute assurance (a falsehood) and moral certainty or assurance, which is Catholic belief. So the above (minus the last sentence) is perfectly irrelevant (what we call in logic, a non sequitur). But clever attempt (like the devil) at sophistry there . . .

Rom 5:1 (NASB)

Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace [εἰρήνην] with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,

How can we have peace with God if we do not have assurance as to the state of our souls? The answer is that we cannot.

Again, in Catholic soteriology, we can know right now that we are in good graces with God, through a serious examination of conscience. We can’t be absolutely sure that we always will be, because that’s the future, and we don’t know the future. Only God does because He is there already (being outside of time).

I do not believe it would be profitable to address all of the assertions made . . . 

Yeah, I noticed. It’s not “profitable” is (in my opinion) code for “I have no solid answer to much of his argumentation; therefore, I will ignore those portions.” This being the case (his ignoring of many, many of my biblical passages and commentaries upon them), I will ignore the rare “exception” where he actually does attempt a reply. Goose and gander . . .

I am left wondering if the Roman Church has infallibly defined the verses that Armstrong is expounding upon or if he is merely providing us with his own personal interpretations of the scriptures (which based on his statements, he certainly appears to believe are perspicuous). 

Very few passages have been infallibly defined (seven; possibly also two more). My biblical (and any other sort of) arguments are in line with Catholic dogmas and doctrines, which they are required to be if I am an orthodox, obedient Catholic (as I am), just as my opponent’s biblical (and any other sort of) arguments are in line with Calvinist dogmas and doctrines, which his are required to be: coming from an orthodox, obedient, five-point Calvinist. There is no difference in this respect: except that Catholics believe in the infallibility of the Church, whereas Calvinists don’t. But we both believe in an authoritative, teaching Church, and in arguing and defending our theology from Holy Scripture, which is held in common as God’s inspired and infallible revelation.

Assurance: 

Assurance ultimately rests upon God, upon His strength, His faithfulness and His ability to preserve (cf. Phil 1:6), not upon the strength, faithfulness and perseverance of man.

Yep. See my ten passages about that, presented early on. But man cooperates with what ultimately causes salvation (God’s grace and power alone). He isn’t led along by God like a lobotomized donkey who can do no other. He actively cooperates and “works with God” as a “co-laborer” or “fellow worker.” Biblical descriptions, not mine . . . The Bible says that we cooperate and we persevere:

James 1:17-25 Every good endowment and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change. [18] Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth that we should be a kind of first fruits of his creatures. [19] Know this, my beloved brethren. Let every man be quick to hear, slow to speak, slow to anger, [20] for the anger of man does not work the righteousness of God. [21] Therefore put away all filthiness and rank growth of wickedness and receive with meekness the implanted word, which is able to save your souls. [22] But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves. [23] For if any one is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man who observes his natural face in a mirror; [24] for he observes himself and goes away and at once forgets what he was like. [25] But he who looks into the perfect law, the law of liberty, and perseveres, being no hearer that forgets but a doer that acts, he shall be blessed in his doing.

2 Cor 5:5 (NASB)

Now He who prepared us for this very purpose is God, who gave to us the Spirit as a pledge [ἀρραβῶνα,[15] lit. down payment, guarantee]. (cf. 2Cor 1:22; Eph 1:14)

Great! God is good! We can be assured right now of our salvific status and of being in a state of grace, in fellowship with God.

Certainty:

1 Jn 5:13 (NASB)

These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know [εἰδῆτε] that you have eternal life.

I am not aware of any Bible translation which renders εἰδῆτε as anything other than know.

See my paper:

“Certainty” of Eternal Life? (1 Jn 5:13 & Jn 5:24) [5-8-02]

The Westminster Confession of Faith: Chapter XVIII – Of the Assurance of Grace and Salvation:[17]

…such as truly believe in the Lord Jesus, and love him in sincerity, endeavoring to walk in all good conscience before him, may in this life be certainly assured that they are in a state of grace, [a] and may rejoice in the hope of the glory of God, which hope shall never make them ashamed. [b] …certainty is not a bare conjectural and probable persuasion, grounded upon a fallible hope; [c] but an infallible assurance of faith, founded upon the divine truth of the promises of salvation, [d] the inward evidence of those graces unto which these promises are made, [e] the testimony of the Spirit of adoption witnessing with our spirits that we are the children of God: [f] which Spirit is the earnest of our inheritance, whereby we are sealed to the day of redemption. [g]

a. 1 John 2:3; 3:14, 18-19, 21, 24; 5:13. • b. Rom 5:2, 5. • c. Heb 6:11, 19. • d. Heb 6:17-18. • e. 2 Cor 1:12; 2 Pet 1:4-5, 10-11; 1 John 2:3; 3:14. • f. Rom 8:15-16. • g. Eph 1:13-14; 4:30; 2 Cor 1:21-22.

The first part of this reads like a Catholic proclamation. The rest is not bad, except that it is a bit more sure about the future than the Bible gives us warrant to be. Earlier my opponent claimedthe saints do not persevere”. But here they do!: “endeavoring to walk in all good conscience before him . . ” That’s something we do, enabled by God’s grace. It’s synergism (a dirty word for Calvinists). Now lets take a look at the “prooftexts”:

1 John 2:3 says “by this we may be sure that we know him, if we keep his commandments.” Once again, it is works and doing things; working with God: not a one-way monergism, and from this we become assured that we “know” God: precisely as in the Catholic view. But knowing God now is not the same as being saved for all eternity.

1 John 3:14: “We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love abides in death.” Again, we are in good graces as long as we do these things, as evidence of the authenticity of our faith (a teaching of both Calvin and Luther). We have to love (that’s us doing it, not God). In fact, this good work of loving others is so crucial that we are spiritually dead and on our way to hell if we refuse to do it. This simply verifies the central place of works and cooperation with God in the schema of salvation. They’re so important that I found fifty Bible passages proclaiming their centrality, as opposed to “faith alone”: which is never stated (and actually flatly denied in James). But nothing here is opposed to the notion that this status or state of soul can be lost.

1 John 3:18-19, 21, 24: 3:18-19, 24 reiterate the essential status of good works in the salvation equation, mentioning “love . . . in deed and in truth” (3:18): the means by which “we shall know that we are of the truth, and reassure our hearts” (3:19; cf. 3:21); in other words, this love, proven by deeds (good works), is what brings about reassurance in our hearts; precisely as in the Catholic examination of one’s own heart. 3:24 is again proverbial language: “All who keep his commandments abide in him, and he in them. . . .” But it’s a great rule for the Christian walk of discipleship, How do we know we are in good graces with God? By good works: love and keeping the commandments. That’s how we know; not by the memory of a “sinner’s prayer” and alleged absolute assurance of one’s eternal salvation from that moment on.

Romans 5:2 refers to “this grace in which we stand”: present tense; not eschatological salvation. 5:5 adds: “hope does not disappoint us.” No it doesn’t. But we have to maintain it in our lives by being willing to suffer and endure (more human perseverance), as 5:3 states.

Hebrews 6:11 requires us to “show the same earnestness in realizing the full assurance of hope until the end”; i.e., more human perseverance and good works. The verse before identified these as “your work and the love which you showed . . . in serving the saints.” 5:12 urges us to not be “sluggish” (i.e., refusing to do the necessary good works that are required to obtain hope, out of laziness). 6:17-19 teaches that God’s promises are trustworthy. Of course they are. But that’s His end. We also have to hold up our end.

2 Corinthians 1:12 again points to good works: “we have behaved . . .  toward you, with holiness and godly sincerity, not by earthly wisdom but by the grace of God.” This is exactly harmonious with the Catholic view. The Westminster Confession is arguing that this Bible passage provides the rationale for “the inward evidence of those graces unto which these promises are made.” And what is the evidence?: good works, done “by the grace of God”! There is not a word about “faith alone” here (as always). Yet this non-biblical concept of sola fide is — oddly enough — one of the “pillars” of the so-called “Reformation.”

2 Peter 1:5 gives us the very Catholic teaching (appropriate form the first pope) of “make every effort to supplement your faith with virtue”: lots of human effort and perseverance to do the good works of virtue and another denial of faith alone. This faith must be “supplement[ed]”. Then we have a rather spectacular “Catholic” and very “unProtestant” passage:

2 Peter 1:10-11 Therefore, brethren, be the more zealous to confirm your call and election, for if you do this you will never fall; [11] so there will be richly provided for you an entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

The call and election isn’t simply taken for granted, with us doing nothing but receiving it passively. No; we must be “zealous” and “confirm” it. This is done by good works and perseverance, described in 1:6-7: “self-control, . . . steadfastness, . . . godliness, . . . brotherly affection, and . . . love.” All of this issues in a conditional (not an absolute) promise of salvation: “if you do this you will never fall; [11] so there will be richly provided for you an entrance into the eternal kingdom.”

We have to persevere and do good works by God’s grace. “If” we do that, then we can be eternally saved. If we don’t, we can lose this grace and salvation that goes along with it. It’s exactly as it was in the Old testament and prophetic warnings: “If Israel followed the commandments, then God would save them; if not, they would be judged and rejected by God.”

Romans 8:15-16: “it is the Spirit himself bearing witness with our spirit that we are children of God,” (8:16): a wonderful verse referring to the indwelling of the Holy Spirit: one of the several marks of the authentic Christian, walking in God’s grace. But the Confession omits the next verse: “and if children, then heirs, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.” Suffering is another persevering work we do, to help assure our salvation.

Ephesians 1:13-14: I dealt with this in my paper that my opponent was supposedly critiquing. He dealt with probably a tenth of it: if that much. My reply concerning this passage was as follows:

This is initial justification. Final or eschatological justification and salvation, however, is conditioned upon walking in the good works “which God prepared beforehand” (Eph 2:10; cf. 4:22-32; 5:1-18). Paul later in his epistle emphasizes that attaining salvation is an ongoing struggle, possible only by God’s grace: “be strong in the Lord and in the strength of his might. Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil” (6:10-11).

Nothing here gives any assurance that this battle is already won; it’s not yet certain. Paul is urging perseverance: “take the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand” (6:13); “keep alert with all perseverance” (6:18).

Ephesians 4:30 is related to all this. In the context of the larger passage (Eph 4:22-5:12), Paul issues many stern warnings about various serious sins: “deceitful lusts [4:22] . . .  falsehood [4:25] . . . [prolonged] anger [4:26] . . . [giving] opportunity to the devil [4:27] . . . evil talk [4:29] . . . bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander . . . malice [4:31] . . . fornication and all impurity or covetousness [5:3] . . . filthiness, . . . silly talk, . . . levity [5:4] . . . unfruitful works of darkness [5:11]. Now, right in the middle of this “catalogue of sin and infamy” Paul warns very strongly:

Ephesians 5:5-6 Be sure of this, that no fornicator or impure man, or one who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. [6] Let no one deceive you with empty words, for it is because of these things that the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.

Note how Paul had just warned the Ephesians not to do all of these things that he now says will bar anyone who does them from salvation (“inheritance in the kingdom of Christ”): lusts (which Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount said would lead to adultery / fornication), impurity, and covetousness. It is perfectly plausible, then, to interpret the passage as a warning against these grave sins, that can potentially cause individuals among the Ephesians to fall away from grace and salvation.

If, for example, a landlord says, “don’t do a, b, c” and later says “if you do a, b, c, you’ll be kicked out of your house for good” then we can say that there is a possibility of his losing his rented house based on doing bad, warned-about things. Likewise, by analogy, Paul is saying “if you do these things, you can possibly lose your eternal salvation.” They could be “deceive[d]” and receive “the wrath of God” as a result. And that’s not Calvinism. It’s Catholicism and Bible.

2 Corinthians 1:21-22: yes the Holy Spirit is a “seal” for us. But we have also seen that we can throw away all the good things God has given us in His grace and mercy and spurn salvation. That’s why Paul warned in Ephesians 4:30: “do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, in whom you were sealed”. Why make that warning if there was no serious danger? All the Bible verses I produced that made this peril of salvation if we don’t persevere crystal clear were ignored by my critic. He didn’t thinkit would be profitable” to do that. One can see why! I sure wouldn’t want to, either, if I were in his shoes. But I’m comprehensively addressing his arguments, as anyone can see. Which methodology suggests more confidence in one’s case and more actual biblical support? Yeah, that’s my opinion, too.

I will conclude with the words of Johnathan Edwards, who speaks thus regarding the attainment of assurance:

It is not God’s design that men should obtain assurance in any other way, than by mortifying corruption, and increasing in grace, and obtaining the lively exercises of it.—And although self-examination be a duty of great use and importance, and by no means to be neglected; yet it is not the principal means, by which the saints do get satisfaction of their good estate. Assurance is not to be obtained so much by self-examination, as by action. The Apostle Paul sought assurance chiefly this way, even by “forgetting the things that were behind, and reaching forth unto those things that were before, pressing towards the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus; if by any means he might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.” And it was by this means chiefly that he obtained assurance: 1 Cor. 9:26, “I therefore so run, not as uncertainly.” He obtained assurance of winning the prize, more by running, than by considering.[18]

I’m delighted that he chose this excerpt to end with: as it is in harmony with the Catholic view in so many ways. It has “working with God” (faith and works; faith without works is dead) all through it: “increasing in grace” is necessary (not much different from Catholic merit), “self-examination” is part of it, but “action” (good works) is even more important. Yeah, Catholicism is right along with that! St. Paul had to metaphorically “run the race” to be saved. It wasn’t a given. This work gave him assurance. We fully agree! Edwards never mentions “faith” in the entire excerpt: quite odd if indeed if the great “pillar” of faith alone minus works is so central to salvation.

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Photo credit: Saint Paul Writing His Epistles (c. 1620), attributed to Valentin de Boulogne (1591-1632) [public domain / Wikimedia Commons]

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Summary: In-depth refutation of Calvinist prooftexts for perseverance of the saints. I show how the Bible, again & again (even in passages supposedly “Protestant”) is thoroughly Catholic in substance.

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2021-05-04T10:14:22-04:00

Michael J. Alter is the author of the copiously researched, 913-page volume, The Resurrection: a Critical Inquiry (2015). I initially offered  59 “brief” replies to as many alleged New Testament contradictions (March 2021). We later engaged in amiable correspondence and decided to enter into a major ongoing dialogue about his book. He graciously (and impressively!) sent me a PDF file of it, free of charge, for my review. 

Mike describes himself as “of the Jewish faith” but is quick to point out that labels are often “misleading” and “divisive” (I agree to a large extent). He continues to be influenced by, for example, “Reformed, Conservative, Orthodox, and Chabad” variants of Judaism and learns “from those of other faiths, the secular, the non-theists, etc.” Fair enough. I have a great many influences, too, am very ecumenical, and am a great admirer of Judaism, as I told Michael in a combox comment on my blog.

He says his book “can be described as Jewish apologetics” and one that provides reasons for “why members of the Jewish community should not convert to Christianity.” I will be writing many critiques of the book and we’ll be engaging in ongoing discussion for likely a long time. I’m quite excited about it and am most grateful for Mike’s willingness to interact, minus any personal hostility.

To see all the other installments, search “Michael J. Alter” on either my Jews and Judaism or Trinitarianism & Christology web pages. That will take you to the subsection with the series.

I use RSV for all Bible verses that I cite. His words will be in blue.

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In this installment, I document the views of Michael Alter regarding the motives and ethical standards of the writers of the New Testament; showing how he is indeed a very hostile witness when it comes to these writings, and engages not infrequently in ad hominem attacks. The biases that we all have in one way or another affect our reasoning and the premises we accept, as well as the conclusions that we arrive at, based on those premises. Thus, these false presuppositions adversely affect Alter’s reasoning all throughout his book.

Alter reiterated the gist of his many statements documented below, today (5-3-21) in a comment on my blog: “Throughout John’s Gospel, he has made up additional fictional elements.”

After now 24 replies to his book and also significant personal correspondence, I have never stated, nor implied, that Michael Alter is deliberately dishonest, deceptive, insincere, disingenuous, or a liar (or even a purely ignorant, unassuming, innocent mythmaker). I do not do so now. I think he is wrong about many things, because he has adopted false premises and built false conclusions upon them. I believe that he sincerely believes these things, and the demands of rudimentary Christian charity requires me to extend that benefit of the doubt in the first place. He simply sincerely believes what I firmly believe to be erroneous, untrue things. I hope to dissuade him of these falsehoods through the use of reason and explanation of the meanings of New Testament texts, as best I can ascertain them (with the guidance of Christian — and sometimes also Jewish — tradition).

All bolding is my own; italics are his own.

[I]t is, in fact, possible that the author of one of the gospels (or other portions of the Christian scriptures) was writing what he considered were actual facts and in so doing he was correcting and thus contradicting the earlier narratives . . . (p. 26)

Luke rejected Matthew’s historical narratives many times. (p. 120)

Perhaps Luke’s omission, in fact, confirms that the event is an invention of Matthew. (p. 146)

Why then did Luke omit such an important event that coincided with Jesus’s death? Perhaps his omission is, in fact, a deletion and confirms that the earthquake event is an invention, that is a “myth” developed by Matthew. Moreover, here too there is no historical verification from even one external source for this remarkable event. This omission from sources other than Mark, Luke, or even John should raise the proverbial red flag. (pp. 147-148)

Perhaps Luke’s omission is a deletion that confirmed that the event (i.e., “myth”) is an invention of Matthew. (p. 160)

Either the information in John was unknown to the synoptic authors, deliberately omitted, or a later fabrication. (p. 175)

[subtitle] John’s Invented Dubious Details and Theology (p. 182)

Luke’s omission suggests that either the event was invented by John after Luke had finished his narrative or that he was verifying the narratives of Mark and Matthew that no such event occurred. (p. 185)

Perhaps his omission, in fact, confirms that the event was an invention of John. (p. 238)

Nicodemus appears only in the Fourth Gospel. This remarkable absence casts doubt as to his historical existence. (p. 238)

A more probable explanation is that the synoptic authors did not record this detail because John invented it. (p. 267)

Of course, in addition, these speculations presume that the burial episode is historical. (p. 273)

The entire Joseph of Arimathea personality may be an invention. (p. 279)

It is speculated that Matthew employed unusual wording in 27:62 to deliberately obscure the fact that he would have the Jewish leadership violating the Sabbath. (p. 292)

Nonetheless, according to Christian apologists, members of the Sanhedrin, perhaps all of them, are now going to order non-Jews to work on the Sabbath in direct violation of God’s instruction and in full public view. Such a blatant and deliberate violation of the Torah in public refutes the historicity of this legendary episode [the story of the Roman guards at the tomb]. (p. 294)

[I]t makes perfect sense that Luke deliberately omits this event as a part of his narrative if, in fact, he doubts Matthew’s sources. (p. 295)

One of the foremost objectives of the Gospel of Matthew is to prove Jesus’s resurrection. In order to fulfill this objective its author invented the
episode of the guard at the tomb. Matthew 27:64 narrates that the purpose of the guard is to secure the tomb “least his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people. He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first.” However, this uniquely written episode is nothing more than a clever façade of the author.

Having a guard at the tomb suggests that Jesus’s body could not have been stolen. Given that the body has not been stolen or the tomb mistaken
for another, there is one explanation for it being empty: Jesus’s miraculous resurrection from the dead. The presence of the guard is irrelevant. The issue of concern for Matthew is to create a fail-proof set of circumstances to prove that Jesus resurrected from the tomb. (pp. 297-298)

. . . the writing of this legendary episode [the Roman guards at the tomb] . . . (p. 298)

Yet another explanation is that the gospel writers were writing a legendary account. Gundry (1994, 623-40) has termed these legendary accounts [of the women visitors to Jesus’ tomb] as “Midrash.” (p. 318)

Obviously the three following gospel authors deliberately changed the text of Mark because they understood the inappropriateness between the women’s intention to anoint Jesus’s body and their initial oblivion to the problem of moving the large stone. (p. 326)

Matthew’s legendary earthquake probably occurred between 3:00 and 5:00 a.m. (p. 329)

Undoubtedly, without the empty tomb there could not be a resurrection legend. (p. 333)

[T]he writer did an excellent job not writing a lie but narrating a legendary account to further his theological agenda based on the Hebrew Bible. Specifically, Matthew creatively and skillfully weaves a legendary account incorporating passages from Joshua 10 and Daniel 6 that are supposedly fulfilled by Jesus. (p. 342)

The episode of the guards at the tomb is, in part, artificially created to serve a dual agenda: as an apologetic and as an ad hominem against the Jewish leaderships. (p. 344)

If the guards had made an accusation that they knew it was Jesus’s disciples who carried off his body, they would have had to make some arrests.
Yet there are no arrests or trial for this supposed crime. Furthermore, the guard would have needed some false witnesses to convict the accused body snatchers. Since these events never happened, it demonstrates that Matthew made up the entire episode. (p. 348)

There are several practical problems that challenge the assumed authenticity and historicity of Luke’s narration with the women entering the tomb. (p. 359)

[T]hese writers have omitted at least one other possibility: the entire episode was a fabrication and invention by its author or final redactors. (p. 384)

Later, of course, an unknown redactor of Mark added the final eleven verses not found in the original to cover up the discrepancy of Matthew 28:8 and Luke 24:9, which had the women going forth to tell the disciples. (p. 385)

The evolution of the clothes is apparent: (1) from no clothes (Mark and Matthew), (2) to clothes lying about (Luke), and finally (3) to clothes orderly arranged (John). Thus, the Gospels are clearly and unmistakably embellished. A second possibility advocated by detractors is that the entire burial and Resurrection narratives are ahistoric and written for evangelical and theological reasons. (p. 396)

There are several practical problems that challenge the authenticity and historicity of Peter and the other disciple entering the tomb (similar to the women) on Easter Sunday. (p. 405)

In conclusion, it is dubious that Peter was (1) told before by Jesus that he was going to be arrested, crucified, and resurrected multiple times (Mk 8:31; 9:31; 10:33-34; Mt 16:21; 17:22-23; 20:18-19; Lk 9:22; 18:31-33 and perhaps 24:6 by the women) and (2) Jesus performed multiple supernatural and miraculous events in Peter’s presence on almost a daily occurrence, and yet he did not believe. Rather than being historical, these events were written to serve a theological intent to demonstrate that faith was more important than seeing or witnessing miracles and signs. (p. 409)

[T]he gospel narrators probably lied in the modern sense of the word. When a witness in a court of law deliberately excludes, includes, or rearranges material according to his purposes, he is committing perjury. The authors and final redactors of the gospel narratives were liars in a modern sense. (p. 447)

John 12:1-8 substantially embellishes the text, making Judas appear progressively more heinous and odious than the synoptic narratives: . . . (p. 448)

For several reasons John’s addition that Judas was a one-time thief seems like an artificial embellishment. First, this highly significant fact that Judas was a thief is omitted from the earlier gospels. Second, this information has the ring of a literary design to entertain the reader by making Judas a more contemptible and despicable person. Third, this fact is dubious, . . . (p. 451)

Only Judas would ultimately know why he betrayed Jesus, assuming that this episode is historical. (p. 455)

The Gospels and the Acts of the Apostles present an ever-increasing evolution and embellishment of Judas’s life. (p. 458)

The significant embellishment of Luke was that Judas had now become a Satan-inspired character. (p. 463)

Matthew embellishes Mark in several ways. Matthew’s narrative contained 43 extra words and Jesus speaks 83 extra words (i.e., AV
translation). (p. 468)

This gospel embellished the synoptic Gospels by have the arresting party withdraw backward and falling to the ground. (p. 470)

After being apprehended, John further embellished the synoptic Gospels that not only Jesus was taken but that they also “bound him.” In no previous gospel was Jesus described as being bound. (p. 470)

[T]he Gospels and Acts present an obviously ever increasing evolution and embellishment of Judas’s life that portrayed him in an ever growing negative light. (p. 471)

By understanding this verse, it will be unequivocally apparent that Matthew’s citation is either erroneous or a deliberate embellishment to serve as a proof that the Hebrew Bible foreshadowed (typology) Judas’s heinous crime. (p. 473)

[T]he Judas episode was a legendary development that evolved many years after the events were reported to have occurred. (p. 525)

Assuming that there was an historical Judas . . . (p. 525)

The Judas episodes in the Gospels and Acts do not reflect historicity. (p. 530)

In other words, the narrative [the story of the disciples walking to Emmaus] is theological, not historical! (p. 538)

[A] practical explanation is that the story is Luke’s invention to serve his theological agenda. (p. 544)

Another subject that challenges the historicity and reliability of the Christian scriptures relates to the Emmaus narrative and the Passover. (p. 544)

This listing assumes that Paul is writing historicity [sic] and not theology. (p. 552)

The pertinent question is whether or not the Christian scriptures permit pious fraud to achieve this goal. Writing approximately twenty to thirty years prior to the synoptic Gospels, none other than the apostle Paul unequivocally declares that it was permissible to employ virtually any method to win converts and gain souls:

• Rom 3:7-8 For if the truth of God hath more abounded though my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner? And not rather,
(as we be slanderously reported, and as some affirm that we say,) Let us do evil, that good may come? whose damnation is just.

• 1 Cor 9:20-23 And unto the Jews I become as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law; To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law. To the weak become I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some. And this I do for the gospel’s sake, that I might partaker thereof with you. (Refuted by Brown 2000, 14-15)

• Phil 1:18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.

This last reading is awkward and somewhat arcane. However, this verse is much easier to understand in the NIV rendering: “But what does it matter? The important thing is that in every way, whether from false motives or true, Christ is preached. And because of this I rejoice.”

Unequivocally, the Christian scriptures advocate and promote pious fraud. Given that the gospel narrators had access to Paul’s epistles, it is speculated that they followed the advice of Paul and employed pious fraud, that is, they incorporated ahistorical portions in their gospels to fulfill their theological agendas. (pp. 553-554)

[O]ne purpose of John’s narratives in 20:20 and 20:27 was to corroborate itself with details which seemingly created an illusion that the side-piercing episode was historical. . . . Here, history was being replaced with theology. (p. 579)

The historicity of Jesus’s response to his disciples on Easter Sunday evening in Jerusalem is questioned on three grounds. (p. 579)

The eating episodes [involving the risen Jesus] appear to be legendary embellishments that served a theological agenda. (p. 583)

[T]he Doubting Thomas episode was written to fulfill a theological agenda. In this episode of the Christian scriptures, there is no historicity. (p. 600)

John’s agenda was to write a missionary and theological text, not one that was historical. This agenda is clearly delineated in John 20:31: “But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.” . . . To recap, the deliberate agenda of John was both missionary and theological. One such agenda was promoting blind faith in a risen Jesus.
Although there may be “grains of truth” (historicity) within his gospel, many of the signs were nonhistorical and definitely unconfirmed. (p. 604)

It is speculated that the historicity of the call to the lake is doubtfulInstead of being a real historical event it is posited that this episode, recorded only in John 21, was really a larger call. . . . John’s call to the lake served as a theological metaphor. (p. 605)

[A] speculated alternative is that this episode [of Peter catching 153 fish] was a legendary account written to promote Peter over the other apostles. (p. 609)

[I]t is possible that this entire episode was a literary invention with a hidden symbolic or theological agenda. (p. 609)

[I]t must be remembered that the Christian scriptures approve of pious fraud when they support the spread of Christianity. (p. 628)

John, being the last of the Gospels, embellished and aggrandized the postresurrection appearances. (p. 632)

If Paul, in fact, lied [about there being 500 witnesses of the risen Jesus] and the lie was in fact discovered, he still would have gotten away with his deceit by claiming that it must have had something to do with a conspiracy against him. Such a potential argument is found in 2 Corinthians 11:2: “Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices” and in Thessalonians 2:2: “That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.” Similarly, those who denied Paul’s claims could simply have been accused of being false teachers. 

Rom 16:17-18 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them [[false teachers]] which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple. . . .

Furthermore, there is ample reason to believe that Paul’s claim was nothing more than a facade, knowing full well that his assertion could not have been successfully disproved. (pp. 673-674)

Perhaps his omission was, in fact, a deletion and Luke was, in fact, challenging the historicity of Paul’s claim. (p. 685)

Only Luke provided an exclusive description of Jesus’s ascension, although here there is much to doubt regarding the authenticity of this narrative. (p. 702)

Barnes’s apologetic that the differing accounts confirm that the two writers [Luke and Paul]: . . . (2) . . . are honest men is bogus. (p. 723)

It is the position of doubters and skeptics that the events recorded in Matthew and Luke were embellishments or legendary texts incorporated to fulfill a theological agenda. (p. 724)

On a prima facie level the episodes detailed in Acts [about Paul’s conversion] are historically dubious. (p. 731)

[T]here is a stronger argument that can be raised about Jesus employing this Greek proverb, an argument that raises doubt regarding the
historicity of the incident. . . . it seems highly dubious that Jesus would choose to quote a Greek proverb to Paul while speaking Aramaic even if the proverb was well-known. (p. 732)

Collectively, these and other differences in the three readings raise doubt to the historicity of this episode. (p. 733)

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Photo credit: Selva Rasalingam as Jesus in the The Gospel of Luke (2016, Netflix USA) [Wikimedia CommonsCreative Commons CC0 1.0 Universal Public Domain Dedication]

Summary: I document Michael Alter’s many contentions in his book that the New Testament writers sought to produce ahistorical legends, fables, myths, & pure inventions of fictional accounts.

Tags: alleged Bible contradictions, alleged Resurrection contradictions, Bible “contradictions”, Bible “difficulties”, Bible Only, biblical inspiration, biblical prooftexts, biblical skeptics, biblical theology, exegesis, hermeneutics, Holy Bible, inerrancy, infallibility, Jewish anti-Christian polemics, Jewish apologetics, Jewish critique of Christianity, Jewish-Christian discussion, Michael J. Alter, New Testament, New Testament critics, New Testament skepticism, Resurrection “Contradictions”, Resurrection of Jesus, The Resurrection: A Critical Inquiry, NT writers: unethical mythmakers?, New Testament writers, the four evangelists, skeptical claims regarding biblical writers 

2020-09-16T12:03:08-04:00

[originally posted on 10-12-17; revised on 9-16-20]

The following outrageous, asinine, hateful comment has been up four days, without anyone over at this reactionary rag seeing fit to remove it:
María de Habsburgo-Lorena • 4 days ago
Dr. [Dawn Eden] Goldstein [a Catholic academic]? A JEW woman teaching about Our Lord?
¡¡¡Jajajajaja!!!
[This appeared under the article, “Wait! Wait! It’s all a MISTRANSLATION!” (10-1-17, by Christopher Ferrara). It was posted on 10-8-17 and still remains online in the combox, now almost three years later, as of this re-posting]
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It’s pathetic. Jesus, Paul, Mary, Joseph, John, Peter, Mary Magdalene, John the Baptist, Nicodemus, Joseph of Arimathea, and other disciples and female companions of Jesus: all Jewish, yet we hear this rotgut? It comes straight from hell. It doesn’t matter if someone has become a Catholic or not. They’re still Jewish!
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Ironically, tonight I pulled out one of the many books in my library I need to start reading, called, Our Father Abraham: Jewish Roots of the Christian Faith (by Marvin R. Wilson). It looks marvelous.
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Chris Ferrara responded in the combox: “A troll, obviously.” I replied: “Why don’t you delete the trash, then?” But alas, the Remnant deletes all comments from me, including this one.
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So this trash is sitting there, and now with a second comment. They know it’s there, don’t delete it and/or ban the person, but what they did delete was my reply where I objected to it. That was delete-worthy.
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Ferrara later proceeded to trash Dr. Robert Fastiggi, who has been working with Dr. Goldstein and defending the pope. I posted on my blog the farcical “exchange”.
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María de Habsburgo-Lorena has responded to being called a troll:
Señor Ferrara,
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Me permito felicitarle por su defensa de la doctrina y por su firme posición ante las enseñanzas erróneas del Santo Padre Francisco.
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Y… recordemos que Nuestro Señor calificó a los pérfidos judíos como hijos de Satanás: Jn 8,44.
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Y hay tres formas de botar el agua:
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Echándola al mar, poniéndosela al wishky, Y USÁNDOLA PARA BAUTIZAR A UN JUDÍO.
Nuestra Señora le bendiga.
Google translation:
Mr. Ferrara,
I would like to congratulate you on your defense of the doctrine and on your firm position regarding the erroneous teachings of the Holy Father Francisco.
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And … remember that Our Lord called the perfidious Jews the children of Satan: Jn 8.44.
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And there are three ways to dump the water:
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Casting it to the sea, putting it to the wishky [?], AND USING IT TO BAPTIZE A JEW.
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Our Lady bless you.
Note on John 8:44:
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Maria butchers the passage, because it’s clearly not referring to all Jews. John habitually uses “the Jews” and some have interpreted that as bigotry, but one has to understand context. He identifies the particular sub-group. In this case, it was “The scribes and the Pharisees” who (some of them) constantly opposed him. But Scripture also shows righteous Pharisees, like Nicodemus and Joseph of Arimathea, and Paul called himself a Pharisee twice (because it was the mainstream group at that time).
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The hard-nosed, obstinate [sub-group of] Pharisees were the ones whom He referred to as follows, in John 8:44 (RSV):
“You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and has nothing to do with the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks according to his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies.”
If anyone doubts that this is not all Jews, then 8:31-32 will disabuse him or her of that false notion:
“Jesus then said to the Jews who had believed in him, ‘If you continue in my word, you are truly my disciples, [32] and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.'”
Related Reading
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2020-05-04T12:45:05-04:00

They allowed me — bless their hearts — to post a one-sentence reply, to their comments under an article about myself, Karl Keating, and Phil Lawler. Then when I gave a lengthier reply to Ferrara’s answer, they censored it. Just now I tried to post a one-sentence protest at being censored, which was censored. What are they so scared of over there?

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Steve SkojecI wonder why these guys think about us so much when we don’t give them any consideration at all…

Chris FerraraSteve, you know the answer to that.

Steve Skojec • :-)

Dave Armstrong • Really? Why this article then? Thanks for the humorous self-contradiction.

Chris FerraraIt’s called a reply, Dave. Otherwise there would have been nothing. You brought us up again. For the umpteenth time.

It occurs to me (now, after the fact), that if the reason was merely that their names were “brought up”, then the article would have been only about me, since I was the only one who brought up their names. So this puts the lie all the more to the claims that no “consideration at all” is given to us, and that the article is only there because we (i.e., I) mentioned these guys.

Anyone can see what they did allow to remain up in the thread:

Dave Armstrong • Why should I participate if I’m muzzled and censored?

You’re right, Dave. Don’t bother.
Now my censored comment:

Dave Armstrong • Why would you guys think it reflects well on you because we bring you up as quintessential examples of inconsistent Catholics? It would be like Arius taking pride that Alexander condemned him (in your parlance, “thought of him”) a lot, whereas he never gave Alexander a moment’s thought. LOL

You were brought up as examples of those who are characterized by the attitude and mindset of always having to bash the pope, whoever it is (since Pius XII). I compared that with Lawler’s book; then I noted that it’s obvious he thinks like you reactionaries in some respects since your major sites (like One Vader Five) are now all lauding him to the skies.

Whether you or Skojo or Hilary White and all the rest “think” of me or not is perfectly irrelevant. I couldn’t care less. Ignore me all you like. My job as an apologist is to refute error and to name names where it’s necessary in order to prevent people from being taken in by same.

You can see why they censored it! Wouldn’t it have been more impressive, though, to attempt to refute me? Would that strain their naysaying brains past the breaking point?

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Related Reading

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(originally posted on 1-4-18 on Facebook)

Photo credit: [public domain / Flickr]

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2019-09-01T10:51:33-04:00

Mark 11:15-17 (RSV) And they came to Jerusalem. And he entered the temple and began to drive out those who sold and those who bought in the temple, and he overturned the tables of the money-changers and the seats of those who sold pigeons; [16] and he would not allow any one to carry anything through the temple. [17] And he taught, and said to them, “Is it not written, `My house shall be called a house of prayer for all the nations’? But you have made it a den of robbers.” 

Atheist apostate (former Methodist minister) Dr. David Madison observed about this passage (his words will be in blue henceforth):

What provoked Jesus to do this? Why was he upset about money-changers and dove-sellers? Jesus himself had once told a man he’d healed to “offer for your cleansing what Moses commanded,” meaning the sacrifice of a bird (according to Leviticus 14). The Temple existed for this form of devotion.

Cambridge Bible for Schools and Colleges provides an answer:

the tables of the moneychangers] The Greek word signifies those who took a small coin (Hebr. Kolbon, Grk. κόλλυβος, perhaps a Phœnician word) as a fee for exchanging the money of the worshippers, who were required to pay in Hebrew coin. This exaction of the fee was itself unlawful (Lightfoot). And probably other dishonest practices were rife.

Encyclopedia Judaica (“Money Changers”) confirms that this interest-taking was contrary to Jewish Law:

In the period of the Second Temple vast numbers of Jews streamed to Palestine and Jerusalem “out or every nation under heaven” (Acts 2:5), taking with them considerable sums of money in foreign currencies. This is referred to in the famous instance of Jesus’ driving the money changers out of the Temple (Matt. 21:12). Not only did these foreign coins have to be changed but also ordinary deposits were often handed over to the Temple authorities for safe deposit in the Temple treasury (Jos., Wars 6:281–2). Thus Jerusalem became a sort of central bourse and exchange mart, and the Temple vaults served as “safe deposits” in which every type of coin was represented (TJ, Ma’as. Sh. 1:2, 52d, and parallels). The business of money exchange was carried out by the shulḥani (“exchange banker”), who would change foreign coins into local currency and vice versa (Tosef., Shek. 2:13; Matt. 21:12). People coming from distant countries would bring their money in large denominations rather than in cumbersome small coins. The provision of small change was a further function of the shulḥani (cf. Sif. Deut., 306; Ma’as Sh., 2:9). For both of these kinds of transactions the shulḥani charged a small fee (agio), called in rabbinic literature a kolbon (a word of doubtful etymology but perhaps from the Greek κόλλυβος “small coin”; TJ, Shek. 1:6, 46b). This premium seems to have varied from 4 percent to 8 percent (Shek. 1:6, et al.). The shulḥani served also as a banker, and would receive money on deposit for investment and pay out an interest at a fixed rate (Matt. 25:27), although this was contrary to Jewish law (see below; *Moneylending ). . . .

The activity of the Jewish banker, shulḥani, was of a closely defined nature, as his transactions had to be in accordance with the biblical prohibition against taking interest (ribit).

John Lightfoot’s commentary on Matthew 21:12 adds more relevant information:

[Overthrew the tables of the moneychangers.] Who those moneychangers were, may be learned very well from the Talmud, and Maimonides in the treatise Shekalim:– . . .

At that time when they paid pence for the half shekel, a kolbon [or the fee that was paid to the moneychanger] was half a mea, that is, the twelfth part of a penny, and never less. But the kolbons were not like the half shekel; but the exchangers laid them by themselves till the holy treasury were paid out of them.” You see what these moneychangers were, and whence they had their name. You see that Christ did not overturn the chests in which the holy money was laid up, but the tables on which they trafficked for this unholy gain.

Note that Jesus specifically concentrated on two groups: the moneychangers and those who sold doves. This was mentioned in the current account from Mark (above), and in the parallel stories (Mt 21:12-13; Jn 2:13-16). His anger at the moneychangers has just been explained. They were unlawfully extracting interest, which would hurt the poor the most. Why did He go after the dove sellers? It’s a similar reason. The Experimental Theology blog explains:

As most know, the preferred sacrifice to be offered at the temple was a lamb. But a provision is made in the Levitical code for the poor:

Leviticus 5.7 Anyone who cannot afford a lamb is to bring two doves or two young pigeons to the Lord as a penalty for their sin—one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering.

By going after the dove sellers we see Jesus directly attacking the group who were having economic dealings with the poor. When the poor would go to the temple they would head for the dove sellers.

The point being, while we know that Jesus was upset about economic exploitation going on in the temple, his focus on the dove sellers sharpens the message and priorities. . . . Jesus’s anger is stirred at the way the poor are being treated and economically exploited.

Hence, He described this scenario with these people who exploited the poor, a “den of robbers” or “den of thieves.” Dr. Madison asked why Jesus was upset. I have provided an answer, through these excellent commentaries. Now Dr. Madison knows more than he did (so do I).

He blends wording from Isaiah 56:7 and Jeremiah 7:11, which have no relevance whatever to this incident—but Mark knew that he could get away with it.

• In Isaiah 56, the prophet looks forward to the day when all nations will bend the knee to his own god, Yahweh, and in that sense only will the temple be a house of prayer for all nations, i.e., when they have converted. Nor is this verse (7) a denunciation of the gory business of the temple; the text reads: “…their burnt offerings and their sacrifices will be accepted on my altar; for my house shall be called a house of prayer for all peoples.”

All Jesus cited was “My house shall be called a house of prayer” (Mk 11:17), which is from Isaiah 56:7. The point is that this is its central purpose: a place of worship and praise and prayer and ritual sacrifice: not of collection of unlawful interest and exploiting the poor, contrary to the Jewish Law. That’s all Jesus was saying.

It doesn’t follow (as with partial analogies) that every jot and tittle of a prophecy must be applicable to the situation about which it is cited. New Testament citation of the Old Testament is a long and complex subject in and of itself (see one article that gets into that). The same Isaiah 56:7 refers to “my house of prayer” (God speaking) before it says it will be called the same.

• In Jeremiah 7:11, the prophet blasts the wickedness of the people of Israel, and no amount of worship at the temple can cancel that reality. Thus the temple is a sham: “ Has this house, which is called by my name, become a den of robbers in your sight?” Den of robbers seems to have been an allusion to the sin that annulls the value of worship, not to the practice of selling animals and exchanging currency.

Here is the passage and some context as well:

Jeremiah 7:9-11 Will you steal, murder, commit adultery, swear falsely, burn incense to Ba’al, and go after other gods that you have not known, [10] and then come and stand before me in this house, which is called by my name, and say, `We are delivered!’ — only to go on doing all these abominations? [11] Has this house, which is called by my name, become a den of robbers in your eyes? Behold, I myself have seen it, says the LORD. 

The moneychangers and sellers of doves were stealing by extracting unlawful interest and excessive prices for items sold to the poor (the birds). 7:6 also states: “do not oppress the alien, the fatherless or the widow”. So the passage is exactly applicable. The passage in its larger context lists a bunch of sins: two of which applied to the temple situation in Jesus’ time (stealing and exploitation of the less fortunate), and so He cited it accordingly. Yet Dr. Madison claimed that both passageshave no relevance whatever to this incident.” Poppycock!

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Photo credit: Christ driving the money changers from the temple (1556), by Jan Sanders van Hemessen (b. 1500) [public domain / Wikimedia Commons]

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2019-08-22T10:03:08-04:00

Dr. David Madison is an atheist who was a Methodist minister for nine years: with a Ph.D. in Biblical Studies from Boston University. He believes we are not at all sure whether Jesus in fact said anything recorded in the Gospels. The atheist always has a convenient “out” (when refuted in argument about some biblical text) that Jesus never said it anyway and that the text in question was simply made up and added later by unscrupulous and “cultish” Christian propagandists.

I always refuse to play this silly and ultimately intellectually dishonest game, because there is no way to “win” with such a stacked, subjective deck. I start with the assumption (based on many historical evidences) that the manuscripts we have are quite sufficient for us to know what is in the Bible (believe it or not). 

Dr. Madison himself — in his anti-Jesus project noted above, granted my outlook, strictly in terms of practical “x vs. y” debate purposes: “For the sake of argument, I’m willing to say, okay, Jesus was real and, yes, we have gospels that tell the story.” And in the combox: “So, we can go along with their insistence that he did exist. We’ll play on their field, i.e., the gospels.” Excellent! Otherwise, there would be no possible discussion at all.

His words below will be in blue.

*****

He wrote an article called, ” ‘This Howling Conflict between Mark and John’: Yet so many Christians don’t seem to have a clue” (10-26-18).

Even if there wasn’t a Beloved Disciple, there is a Beloved Gospel—and that would be John, in which Jesus has a superhuman commanding presence. Well, as seen through the eyes of adoring faith. For those who aren’t so adoring, that ‘commanding presence’ looks more like bragging, insufferable egregious egotism. Which is what can happen—as in John’s case—when the author isn’t even trying to depict a real human. . . . Mark was schooled in Greek tragedy . . . and constructed his Jesus story accordingly, i.e., he made Jesus a real human who agonized over his fate; Mark assumed that even the Son of God could do that.

But John would have none of it; a human Jesus was out of the question. As an exercise to shock Christians out of faith-complacency, I suggest that they read Mark and John back-to-back. It should jump out at them, . . . If they aren’t puzzled—if they aren’t alarmed—then they’re not paying attention. Someone is lying about their Jesus. . . . 

John . . . doesn’t even mention—as do Matthew, Mark, and Luke—that Jesus was distraught [during the time when His Passion was imminent], . . . 

Really? Not human, and not distraught?:

John 11:32-33, 38 (RSV) Then Mary, when she came where Jesus was and saw him, fell at his feet, saying to him, “Lord, if you had been here, my brother would not have died.” [33] When Jesus saw her weeping, and the Jews who came with her also weeping, he was deeply moved in spirit and troubled; . . . [38] Then Jesus, deeply moved again, came to the tomb; . . . 

John 12:27 “Now is my soul troubled. And what shall I say? `Father, save me from this hour’? No, for this purpose I have come to this hour.”

John 13:21 When Jesus had thus spoken, he was troubled in spirit, and testified, “Truly, truly, I say to you, one of you will betray me.”

Dr. Madison cites Louis A. Ruprecht, Jr.:

• “The Synoptic story of Gethsemane raised two critical questions that are nearly impossible to answer. First, if Jesus was alone when he prayed, then how can anyone know exactly what he said? Second, if Jesus was on such intimate terms with God, then how can their wills be so dramatically out of sync at the very end of the story? John’s evangel cuts the complicated Gordian knot of such questions with a very simple answer: Jesus didn’t pray that way.” (p. 74)

• “If the Synoptic story of Gethsemane is a story about praying in the face of temptation prior to betrayal, then John’s is no longer the same story at all.” (p. 74) . . . 

• “…John had to erase the dramatic episode that Mark located in Gethsemane—a powerful story about prayer and temptation, about the sheer humanity of Jesus’s doubts and the awful depth of his suffering. Mark’s tragedy hinges on the fact that we are witnesses to the collision between two wills, a tragic struggle for self-definition in which we are invited to participate and to recognize as our own. John simply cannot tell a story like that because his theology cannot allow for a collision of wills between Father and Son or for a divided picture of Jesus.” (p. 76) Remember these key words: his theology cannot allow. . . . 

Ruprecht makes it starkly clear that Mark and John thought very differently about Jesus. . . . 

• “… we modern people must work very carefully, with more finally developed historical habits, to be able to feel the shock that John’s evangel might have created in an ancient Christian audience that knew and admired Mark’s version. The power of Marks performance has something to do with Jesus’s passionate humanity, something to do with compassion in the face of unimaginable suffering, and it has everything to do with tragedy. John turned all this upside down by writing an anti-tragic evangel in which Jesus’s humanity is muted and all compassion, much like the wavering disciples, has fled.” (p. 101) . . . 

“Gethsemane admits a level not just of humanity, but of actual doubt, and that Luther finds completely unacceptable in the Savior of humankind.” (p. 174) . . . 

Unbeknown to most of the folks in the pews, the New Testament is a minefield of conflicting, contradictory theologies—as well as portraits of Jesus that cannot be reconciled. Oblivious to all this, they show up to worship. It’s comforting to hear nice verses read from the Good Book on Sunday morning. So there was a howling conflict between Mark and John? That would be too much information.

There is no supposed “collision of wills between Father and Son” in the Synoptic Gospels. Jesus made it clear (as recorded in those three Gospels) that His will was fully in line with the Father’s will that He suffer and die for the sake of all men. There is no hint that He disagrees with that or that he “doubts”; only that He is agonized over what is to come (as any human being would be):

Matthew 26:36-42 Then Jesus went with them to a place called Gethsem’ane, and he said to his disciples, “Sit here, while I go yonder and pray.” [37] And taking with him Peter and the two sons of Zeb’edee, he began to be sorrowful and troubled. [38] Then he said to them, “My soul is very sorrowful, even to death; remain here, and watch with me.” [39] And going a little farther he fell on his face and prayed, “My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as thou wilt.” [40] And he came to the disciples and found them sleeping; and he said to Peter, “So, could you not watch with me one hour? [41] Watch and pray that you may not enter into temptation; the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.” [42] Again, for the second time, he went away and prayed, “My Father, if this cannot pass unless I drink it, thy will be done.”

Mark 14:32-36 And they went to a place which was called Gethsem’ane; and he said to his disciples, “Sit here, while I pray.” [33] And he took with him Peter and James and John, and began to be greatly distressed and troubled. [34] And he said to them, “My soul is very sorrowful, even to death; remain here, and watch.” [35] And going a little farther, he fell on the ground and prayed that, if it were possible, the hour might pass from him. [36] And he said, “Abba, Father, all things are possible to thee; remove this cup from me; yet not what I will, but what thou wilt.” 

Luke 22:39-42 And he came out, and went, as was his custom, to the Mount of Olives [where Gethsem’ane is located]; and the disciples followed him. [40] And when he came to the place he said to them, “Pray that you may not enter into temptation.” [41] And he withdrew from them about a stone’s throw, and knelt down and prayed, [42] “Father, if thou art willing, remove this cup from me; nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.” 

Likewise, the unity of the wills of Jesus and God the Father was also expressed by Jesus in John’s Gospel: “And he who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what is pleasing to him” (Jn 8:29); “Now is my soul troubled. And what shall I say? `Father, save me from this hour’? No, for this purpose I have come to this hour” (Jn 12:27); “I lay down my life, that I may take it again. [18] No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again; this charge I have received from my Father” (Jn 10:17-18) 

Moreover, Jesus shows no inclination whatsoever to not willingly suffer and die for the purpose of redemption, and indeed, rather casually predicted what was to come, over and over: as seen in all four Gospels:

Matthew 16:21 From that time Jesus began to show his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things from the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised.

Matthew 17:22-23 As they were gathering in Galilee, Jesus said to them, “The Son of man is to be delivered into the hands of men, [23] and they will kill him, and he will be raised on the third day.” And they were greatly distressed. 

Matthew 20:17-19 And as Jesus was going up to Jerusalem, he took the twelve disciples aside, and on the way he said to them, [18] “Behold, we are going up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man will be delivered to the chief priests and scribes, and they will condemn him to death, [19] and deliver him to the Gentiles to be mocked and scourged and crucified, and he will be raised on the third day.” 

Matthew 26:1-2 When Jesus had finished all these sayings, he said to his disciples, [2] “You know that after two days the Passover is coming, and the Son of man will be delivered up to be crucified.” 

Matthew 26:31-32 Then Jesus said to them, “You will all fall away because of me this night; for it is written, `I will strike the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock will be scattered.’ [32] But after I am raised up, I will go before you to Galilee.” 

Mark 8:31 And he began to teach them that the Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected by the elders and the chief priests and the scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again.

Mark 9:31 for he was teaching his disciples, saying to them, “The Son of man will be delivered into the hands of men, and they will kill him; and when he is killed, after three days he will rise.” 

Mark 10:32-34 And they were on the road, going up to Jerusalem, and Jesus was walking ahead of them; and they were amazed, and those who followed were afraid. And taking the twelve again, he began to tell them what was to happen to him, [33] saying, “Behold, we are going up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man will be delivered to the chief priests and the scribes, and they will condemn him to death, and deliver him to the Gentiles; [34] and they will mock him, and spit upon him, and scourge him, and kill him; and after three days he will rise.” 

Mark 12:1-11 And he began to speak to them in parables. “A man planted a vineyard, and set a hedge around it, and dug a pit for the wine press, and built a tower, and let it out to tenants, and went into another country. [2] When the time came, he sent a servant to the tenants, to get from them some of the fruit of the vineyard. [3] And they took him and beat him, and sent him away empty-handed. [4] Again he sent to them another servant, and they wounded him in the head, and treated him shamefully. [5] And he sent another, and him they killed; and so with many others, some they beat and some they killed. [6] He had still one other, a beloved son; finally he sent him to them, saying, `They will respect my son.’ [7] But those tenants said to one another, `This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and the inheritance will be ours.’ [8] And they took him and killed him, and cast him out of the vineyard. [9] What will the owner of the vineyard do? He will come and destroy the tenants, and give the vineyard to others. [10] Have you not read this scripture: `The very stone which the builders rejected has become the head of the corner; [11] this was the Lord’s doing, and it is marvelous in our eyes’?”

Luke 9:22 . . . “The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected by the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised.” 

Luke 9:44 “Let these words sink into your ears; for the Son of man is to be delivered into the hands of men.” 

Luke 18:31-33 And taking the twelve, he said to them, “Behold, we are going up to Jerusalem, and everything that is written of the Son of man by the prophets will be accomplished. [32] For he will be delivered to the Gentiles, and will be mocked and shamefully treated and spit upon; [33] they will scourge him and kill him, and on the third day he will rise.” 

John 2:19-21 Jesus answered them, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.” [20] The Jews then said, “It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and will you raise it up in three days?” [21] But he spoke of the temple of his body. 

John 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of man be lifted up, 

John 8:28 So Jesus said, “When you have lifted up the Son of man, then you will know that I am he, . . . 

John 10:15, 17-18 . . . I lay down my life for the sheep. . . . [17] For this reason the Father loves me, because I lay down my life, that I may take it again. [18] No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again; this charge I have received from my Father.” 

John 12:23-24 And Jesus answered them, “The hour has come for the Son of man to be glorified. [24] Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains alone; but if it dies, it bears much fruit. 

John 12:31-33 “Now is the judgment of this world, now shall the ruler of this world be cast out; [32] and I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to myself.” [33] He said this to show by what death he was to die. 

John 13:1 Now before the feast of the Passover, when Jesus knew that his hour had come to depart out of this world to the Father, having loved his own who were in the world, he loved them to the end. (cf. 14:18-19, 27-29)

John 16:5 But now I am going to him who sent me; . . . (cf. 16:7, 16-22, 28; 17:13)

There is no imagined “difference” or “contradiction” in these respects (or any other) between Mark and John, or Matthew and Luke, and John. It’s simply one of many “Madison myths.”

***

Photo credit: Christ in Gethsemane (1886), by Heinrich Hofmann (1824-1911) [public domain / Wikimedia Commons]

***

 

2022-03-19T13:14:35-04:00

Two Donkeys? / Fig Tree / Moneychangers

This is an installment of my replies to a series of articles on Mark by Dr. David Madison: an atheist who was a Methodist minister for nine years: with a Ph.D. in Biblical Studies from Boston University. His summary article is called, “Not-Your-Pastor’s Tour of Mark’s Gospel: The falsification of Christianity made easy” (Debunking Christianity, 7-17-19). His words will be in blue below.

Dr. Madison has utterly ignored my twelve refutations of his “dirty dozen” podcasts against Jesus, and I fully expect that stony silence to continue. If he wants to be repeatedly critiqued and make no response, that’s his choice (which would challenge Bob Seidensticker as the most intellectually cowardly atheist I know). I will continue on, whatever he decides to do (no skin off my back).

Dr. Madison believes we are not at all sure whether Jesus in fact said anything recorded in the Gospels. The atheist always has a convenient “out” (when refuted in argument about some biblical text) that Jesus never said it anyway and that the text in question was simply made up and added later by unscrupulous and “cultish” Christian propagandists.

I always refuse to play this silly and ultimately intellectually dishonest game, because there is no way to “win” with such a stacked, subjective deck. I start with the assumption (based on many historical evidences) that the manuscripts we have are quite sufficient for us to know what is in the Bible (believe it or not). 

Dr. Madison himself — in his anti-Jesus project noted above, granted my outlook, strictly in terms of practical “x vs. y” debate purposes: “For the sake of argument, I’m willing to say, okay, Jesus was real and, yes, we have gospels that tell the story.” And in the combox: “So, we can go along with their insistence that he did exist. We’ll play on their field, i.e., the gospels.” Excellent! Otherwise, there would be no possible discussion at all.

*****

Dr. Madison called this installment: “The Day Jesus Cursed a Fig Tree: …and followed the deed with bad theology” (1-25-19)

The theological agenda of the gospel authors included Jesus as a fulfillment of scripture—everybody knows that, right?—so they frequently quoted OT texts out of context.

Dr. Madison doesn’t, alas, tell us how he thinks Matthew cited Zechariah 9:9 out of context, so there is nothing here to refute. It’s simply one of his gratuitous and groundless swipes at Jesus and the Gospel writer.

Matthew failed to grasp the technique of the parallelism in Hebrew poetry (line 1: say something; line 2, say the same thing using a different word), and reports that Jesus rode on two animals, a donkey and a colt. (Matthew 21:7) Yes, Matthew could be that goofy . . . 

Matthew does not report that Jesus rode on two animals. He wrote: “they brought the ass and the colt, and put their garments on them, and he sat thereon” (Mt 21:7, RSV). He can hardly have sat on (let alone ride) two animals at once.  Does Dr. Madison think Matthew was trying to present Jesus as a circus stunt rider? How silly are we gonna get? There must be some other sensible meaning. But then, what does “them” mean in this verse? And why two animals? It does seem strange at first glance. Apologist Eric Lyons, in a comprehensive article on this very issue of the colt and the ass, writes:

Mark recorded that Jesus told the two disciples that they would find “a colt tied, on which no one has sat” (11:2). . . . 

Mark, Luke, and John did not say that only one donkey was obtained for Jesus, or that only one donkey traveled up to Jerusalem with Jesus. The writers simply mentioned one donkey (the colt). They never denied that another donkey (the mother of the colt) was present. . . . 

[W]hen Matthew’s gospel is taken into account, the elusive female donkey of Zechariah 9:9 is brought to light. Both the foal and the female donkey were brought to Christ at Mount Olivet, and both made the trip to Jerusalem. Since the colt never had been ridden, or even sat upon (as stated by Mark and Luke), its dependence upon its mother is very understandable (as implied by Matthew). The journey to Jerusalem, with multitudes of people in front of and behind Jesus and the donkeys (Matthew 21:8-9), obviously would have been much easier for the colt if the mother donkey were led nearby down the same road. . . . 

Greek scholar A.T. Robertson believed that the second “them” (Greek αυτων) refers to the garments that the disciples laid on the donkeys, and not to the donkeys themselves. In commenting on Matthew 21:7 he stated: “The garments thrown on the animals were the outer garments (himatia), Jesus ‘took his seat’ (epekathisen) upon the garments” (1930, [Word Pictures in the New Testament], 1:167).

Two Bible translations, whose purpose is to provide an exceptionally literal rendering of the Greek biblical text: Amplified Bible and Wuest Expanded Translation, concur with this interpretation:

They brought the donkey and the colt and laid their coats upon them, and He seated Himself on them [the clothing].

And they placed upon them their outer garments. And He took His seat upon them [the garments].

New American Standard Bible also brings out this more specific meaning:

and brought the donkey and the colt, and laid on them their garments, on which He sat.

“On the following day, when they came from Bethany, he was hungry. Seeing in the distance a fig tree in leaf, he went to see whether perhaps he would find anything on it. When he came to it, he found nothing but leaves, for it was not the season for figs. He said to it, ‘May no one ever eat fruit from you again.’ And his disciples heard it.”

D. E. Nineham, in his 1963 commentary, noted: “This story is one of the most difficult in the Gospels, for it approximates more closely than any other episode in Mark to the type of ‘unreasonable’ miracle characteristic of the non-canonical Gospel literature.” (p. 298) C. F. D. Moule, in his 1965 commentary: “It is very odd that Jesus should condemn a fig-tree for having no fruit when it was not even the season for fruit.” (p. 89)

Apologist Kyle Butt offers a plausible explanation:

One prominent question naturally arises from a straightforward reading of the text. Why would Jesus curse a fig tree that did not have figs on it, especially since the text says that “it was not the season for figs”? In response to this puzzling question, skeptical minds have let themselves run wild with accusations regarding the passage. . . . 

When Jesus approached the fig tree, the text indicates that the tree had plenty of leaves. R.K. Harrison, writing in the International Standard Bible Encyclopedia, explains that various kinds of figs grew in Palestine during the first century. One very important aspect of fig growth has to do with the relationship between the leaf and the fruit. Harrison notes that the tiny figs, known to the Arabs as taksh, “appear simultaneously in the leaf axils” (1982, 2:302) This taksh is edible and “is often gathered for sale in the markets” (2:302). Furthermore, the text notes: “When the young leaves are appearing in spring, every fertile fig will have some taksh on it…. But if a tree with leaves has no fruit, it will be barren for the entire season” (2:301-302).

Thus, when Jesus approached the leafy fig tree, He had every reason to suspect that something edible would be on it. However, after inspecting the tree, Mark records that “He found nothing but leaves.” No taksh were budding as they should have been if the tree was going to produce edible figs that year. The tree appeared to be fruitful, but it only had outward signs of bearing fruit (leaves) and in truth offered nothing of value to weary travelers. . . . 

[I]n a general sense, Jesus often insisted that trees which do not bear good fruit will be cut down (Matthew 7:19; Luke 13:6-9). The fig tree did not bear fruit, was useless, and deserved to be destroyed: the spiritual application being that any human who does not bear fruit for God will also be destroyed for his or her failure to produce.

Jesus did not throw a temper tantrum and curse the fig tree even though it was incapable of producing fruit. He cursed the tree because it should have been growing fruit since it had the outward signs of productivity. Jesus’ calculated timing underscored the spiritual truth that barren spiritual trees eventually run out of time. As for personal application, we should all diligently strive to ensure that we are not the barren fig tree.

Upon arriving at the Temple (v.15): “And he entered the temple and began to drive out those who were selling and those who were buying in the temple, and he overturned the tables of the money changers and the seats of those who sold doves.”

What provoked Jesus to do this? Why was he upset about money-changers and dove-sellers? Jesus himself had once told a man he’d healed to “offer for your cleansing what Moses commanded,” meaning the sacrifice of a bird (according to Leviticus 14). The Temple existed for this form of devotion.

Cambridge Bible for Schools and Colleges provides an answer:

the tables of the moneychangers] The Greek word signifies those who took a small coin (Hebr. Kolbon, Grk. κόλλυβος, perhaps a Phœnician word) as a fee for exchanging the money of the worshippers, who were required to pay in Hebrew coin. This exaction of the fee was itself unlawful (Lightfoot). And probably other dishonest practices were rife.

Encyclopedia Judaica (“Money Changers”) confirms that this interest-taking was contrary to Jewish Law:

In the period of the Second Temple vast numbers of Jews streamed to Palestine and Jerusalem “out or every nation under heaven” (Acts 2:5), taking with them considerable sums of money in foreign currencies. This is referred to in the famous instance of Jesus’ driving the money changers out of the Temple (Matt. 21:12). Not only did these foreign coins have to be changed but also ordinary deposits were often handed over to the Temple authorities for safe deposit in the Temple treasury (Jos., Wars 6:281–2). Thus Jerusalem became a sort of central bourse and exchange mart, and the Temple vaults served as “safe deposits” in which every type of coin was represented (TJ, Ma’as. Sh. 1:2, 52d, and parallels). The business of money exchange was carried out by the shulḥani (“exchange banker”), who would change foreign coins into local currency and vice versa (Tosef., Shek. 2:13; Matt. 21:12). People coming from distant countries would bring their money in large denominations rather than in cumbersome small coins. The provision of small change was a further function of the shulḥani (cf. Sif. Deut., 306; Ma’as Sh., 2:9). For both of these kinds of transactions the shulḥani charged a small fee (agio), called in rabbinic literature a kolbon (a word of doubtful etymology but perhaps from the Greek κόλλυβος “small coin”; TJ, Shek. 1:6, 46b). This premium seems to have varied from 4 percent to 8 percent (Shek. 1:6, et al.). The shulḥani served also as a banker, and would receive money on deposit for investment and pay out an interest at a fixed rate (Matt. 25:27), although this was contrary to Jewish law (see below; *Moneylending ). . . .

The activity of the Jewish banker, shulḥani, was of a closely defined nature, as his transactions had to be in accordance with the biblical prohibition against taking interest (ribit).

John Lightfoot’s commentary on Matthew 21:12 adds more relevant information:

[Overthrew the tables of the moneychangers.] Who those moneychangers were, may be learned very well from the Talmud, and Maimonides in the treatise Shekalim:– . . .

At that time when they paid pence for the half shekel, a kolbon [or the fee that was paid to the moneychanger] was half a mea, that is, the twelfth part of a penny, and never less. But the kolbons were not like the half shekel; but the exchangers laid them by themselves till the holy treasury were paid out of them.” You see what these moneychangers were, and whence they had their name. You see that Christ did not overturn the chests in which the holy money was laid up, but the tables on which they trafficked for this unholy gain.

Note that Jesus specifically concentrated on two groups: the moneychangers and those who sold doves. This was mentioned in the current account from Mark (above), and in the parallel stories (Mt 21:12-13; Jn 2:13-16). His anger at the moneychangers has just been explained. They were unlawfully extracting interest, which would hurt the poor the most. Why did He go after the dove sellers? It’s a similar reason. The Experimental Theology blog explains:

As most know, the preferred sacrifice to be offered at the temple was a lamb. But a provision is made in the Levitical code for the poor:

Leviticus 5.7 Anyone who cannot afford a lamb is to bring two doves or two young pigeons to the Lord as a penalty for their sin—one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering.

By going after the dove sellers we see Jesus directly attacking the group who were having economic dealings with the poor. When the poor would go to the temple they would head for the dove sellers.

The point being, while we know that Jesus was upset about economic exploitation going on in the temple, his focus on the dove sellers sharpens the message and priorities. . . . Jesus’s anger is stirred at the way the poor are being treated and economically exploited.

Hence, He described this scenario with these people who exploited the poor, a “den of robbers” or “den of thieves.” Dr. Madison asked why Jesus was upset. I have provided an answer, through these excellent commentaries. Now Dr. Madison knows more than he did (so do I).

He blends wording from Isaiah 56:7 and Jeremiah 7:11, which have no relevance whatever to this incident—but Mark knew that he could get away with it.

• In Isaiah 56, the prophet looks forward to the day when all nations will bend the knee to his own god, Yahweh, and in that sense only will the temple be a house of prayer for all nations, i.e., when they have converted. Nor is this verse (7) a denunciation of the gory business of the temple; the text reads: “…their burnt offerings and their sacrifices will be accepted on my altar; for my house shall be called a house of prayer for all peoples.”

All Jesus cited was “My house shall be called a house of prayer” (Mk 11:17), which is from Isaiah 56:7. The point is that this is its central purpose: a place of worship and praise and prayer and ritual sacrifice: not of collection of unlawful interest and exploiting the poor, contrary to the Jewish Law. That’s all Jesus was saying.

It doesn’t follow (as with partial analogies) that every jot and tittle of a prophecy must be applicable to the situation about which it is cited. New Testament citation of the Old Testament is a long and complex subject in and of itself (see one article that gets into that). The same Isaiah 56:7 refers to “my house of prayer” (God speaking) before it says it will be called the same.

• In Jeremiah 7:11, the prophet blasts the wickedness of the people of Israel, and no amount of worship at the temple can cancel that reality. Thus the temple is a sham: “ Has this house, which is called by my name, become a den of robbers in your sight?” Den of robbers seems to have been an allusion to the sin that annulls the value of worship, not to the practice of selling animals and exchanging currency.

Here is the passage and some context as well:

Jeremiah 7:9-11 Will you steal, murder, commit adultery, swear falsely, burn incense to Ba’al, and go after other gods that you have not known, [10] and then come and stand before me in this house, which is called by my name, and say, `We are delivered!’ — only to go on doing all these abominations? [11] Has this house, which is called by my name, become a den of robbers in your eyes? Behold, I myself have seen it, says the LORD. 

The moneychangers and sellers of doves were stealing by extracting unlawful interest and excessive prices for items sold to the poor (the birds). 7:6 also states: “do not oppress the alien, the fatherless or the widow”. So the passage is exactly applicable. The passage in its larger context lists a bunch of sins: two of which applied to the temple situation in Jesus’ time (stealing and exploitation of the less fortunate), and so He cited it accordingly. Yet Dr. Madison claimed that both passageshave no relevance whatever to this incident.” Poppycock!

***

Photo credit: Entry of the Christ in Jerusalem (1897), by Jean-Léon Gérôme (1824-1904) [public domain / Wikimedia Commons]

***

2019-08-19T11:39:24-04:00

This is an installment of my replies to a series of articles on Mark by Dr. David Madison: an atheist who was a Methodist minister for nine years: with a Ph.D. in Biblical Studies from Boston University. His summary article is called, “Not-Your-Pastor’s Tour of Mark’s Gospel: The falsification of Christianity made easy” (Debunking Christianity, 7-17-19). His words will be in blue below.

Dr. Madison has utterly ignored my twelve refutations of his “dirty dozen” podcasts against Jesus, and I fully expect that stony silence to continue. If he wants to be repeatedly critiqued and make no response, that’s his choice (which would challenge Bob Seidensticker as the most intellectually cowardly atheist I know). I will continue on, whatever he decides to do (no skin off my back).

Dr. Madison believes we are not at all sure whether Jesus in fact said anything recorded in the Gospels. The atheist always has a convenient “out” (when refuted in argument about some biblical text) that Jesus never said it anyway and that the text in question was simply made up and added later by unscrupulous and “cultish” Christian propagandists.

I always refuse to play this silly and ultimately intellectually dishonest game, because there is no way to “win” with such a stacked, subjective deck. I start with the assumption (based on many historical evidences) that the manuscripts we have are quite sufficient for us to know what is in the Bible (believe it or not). 

Dr. Madison himself — in his anti-Jesus project noted above, granted my outlook, strictly in terms of practical “x vs. y” debate purposes: “For the sake of argument, I’m willing to say, okay, Jesus was real and, yes, we have gospels that tell the story.” And in the combox: “So, we can go along with their insistence that he did exist. We’ll play on their field, i.e., the gospels.” Excellent! Otherwise, there would be no possible discussion at all.

*****

[Dr. Madison’s critique of chapter 8 was so silly, repetitive, insubstantial, and non-exegetical that it deserved no reply, so I passed over it]

Dr. Madison called this installment: “Jesus the Cult Fanatic, At It Again: Christians pretend not to notice…” (11-16-18)

Gentle Jesus, meek and mild, suddenly disappears, verse 42: “If any of you put a stumbling block before one of these little ones who believe in me, it would be better for you if a great millstone were hung around your neck and you were thrown into the sea.” Wow. Anyone who obstructs belief in the cult leader deserves a grim fate. This is script for the fanatic who was Mark’s hero.

Huh? All He’s saying is that if one messes with the innocent, trusting faith of little children, they are in a very bad spiritual place.  My RSV reads: “Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin . . .” It’s protecting children: hardly a “controversial” notion or example of Dr. Madison’s so-called “bad Jesus.” This would arguably cover pedophilia and other forms of child abuse, too. This kind of polemics is over-the-top ridiculous. Dr. Madison seems to make ever-more lousy arguments as he goes along.

But it gets worse. Priests and preachers wave off the next few grim verses (43-48) as metaphor or hyperbole, but couldn’t a compassionate Jesus have chosen his words more carefully? Unless you chop sin out of your life—literally—you aren’t a good bet for making it into the Kingdom.

“If your hand causes you to stumble, cut it off; it is better for you to enter life maimed than to have two hands and to go to hell to the unquenchable fire. And if your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off; it is better for you to enter life lame than to have two feet and to be thrown into hell. And if your eye causes you to stumble, tear it out; it is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and to be thrown into hell, where their worm never dies, and the fire is never quenched.”

It’s my guess that if many Christians ran into a street preacher shouting these words, they would cross the street to get away. But why is it okay when Jesus says these things, solemnly recited as part of the white noise on Sunday mornings?

The self-mutilation metaphor cannot be considered appropriate for sane religion; moreover, Jesus declines to specify exactly what he has in mind, i.e., the sins that hands, feet, and eyes can commit to deserve severe punishment. This has given license for preachers for centuries to fill in the details, according to their own personal biases about sin.

This is, of course, non-literal hyperbole, or extreme exaggeration to make a point. I dealt with it as a common phenomenon in Scripture in my paper, Dr. David Madison vs. Jesus #1: Hating One’s Family?

Please don’t tout Jesus as greatest ethicist who ever lived if he taught that, for their mistakes, fallible human beings could end up in a place where the punishing fire never ceases. Our role models for morality cannot be mean and vindictive.

An eternal hell can easily be defended as a just notion, and I have done so many times:

Replies to Some Skeptical Objections to the Christian Doctrine of Hell (“Religion Is Lies” website) [5-24-06]

Biblical Annihilationism or Universalism? (w Atheist Ted Drange) [9-30-06]

Dialogue w Atheists on Hell & Whether God is Just [12-5-06]

Hell: Dialogue with a Philosophy Graduate Student [12-26-08]

Dialogue: Hell & God’s Justice, Part II [1-2-09]

Can Hell Actually be Defended? My Shot … [10-7-15]

Atheism & Atheology (Copious Resources, including on hell) [11-5-15]

A Defense of Hell: Philosophical Explanations of its Plausibility, Necessity, and Factuality [12-10-15]

Exchanges with an Atheist on Hell & Skepticism [12-17-15]

How to Annihilate Three Skeptical Fallacies Regarding Hell [National Catholic Register, 6-10-17]

Hell as a Deterrent: Analogy to Our Legal Systems [10-3-18]

As I mentioned earlier, Jesus had given his disciples the ‘authority’ to cast out demons (one aspect of magical thinking found in the gospel). But it turns out that they weren’t always up to the task. In the heart of chapter 9 we learn about a demon that resisted their magic. A father had brought his mute, deaf son to be healed; Jesus was furious that they had failed. Instead of calming asking what might have gone wrong, he lashed out: “You faithless generation, how much longer must I be among you? How much longer must I put up with you? Bring him to me.” (v. 19)

We can see that the text never says that Jesus was “furious.” That’s simply wishful thinking on Dr. Madison’s part: always desperately and vainly looking for “bad Jesus.”

The father reported that his son had been like this since childhood: “It has often cast him into the fire and into the water, to destroy him…”

Now comes one of the most poignant texts in the gospel. The desperate father pleads, “…but if you are able to do anything, have pity on us and help us.” Jesus had snarled at the disciples,

He merely rebuked them for lack of belief (and He later explains why: “This kind cannot be driven out by anything but prayer”: 9:29). And so Dr. Madison calls this reply of Jesus, “a smug, smart-ass answer.”  Really? There are times when Jesus gets truly angry (righteously indignant), such as his encounter with the moneychangers at the temple and with the Pharisees (Matthew 24). This is not one of them; nor is it “proof” that Jesus was sinfully angry at all. It’s just one of the innumerable “Madison myths.” Dr. Madison adds:

Gee, the disciples hadn’t tried that [prayer, to remove the demon]?

Probably, but just not enough: is also a reasonable interpretation. To offer an analogy, it would be like saying that “getting over the death of a loved one comes through crying.” There is momentary crying and there is extended, anguished soul-level weeping and wailing. All of us who have experienced great tragedy, including loss and grieving know the difference well. That’s how prayer is, too. It’s a matter of degree. And this seems to be a plausible take on this incident. The disciples needed to pray more, and with more faith. But they lacked it; hence Jesus’ chastising rebuke (just as all good parents do with children, where necessary for their own good).

now he belittled the father. Jesus said to him, “‘If you are able!—All things can be done for the one who believes.’ Immediately the father of the child cried out, ‘I believe; help my unbelief!’” The poor guy might have wondered if his own lack to belief could have been a factor in his son’s disability. He wants to make amends, “Help my unbelief!”

Again, how is this belittling the father? Dr. Madison is apparently quite the mind-reader: and most of what he seems to observe are alleged “negative” thoughts. The man asked Jesus, “if you can do anything, have pity on us and help us” and  Jesus replied, “If you can! All things are possible to him who believes” (9:22-23). I have noted repeatedly in these replies how faith is tied in with healing in Scripture: not always, but probably the great majority of times. So Jesus was saying that it was not merely a matter of His own divine power, but also of the faith of the man (and with use of more hyperbole).

There are two pieces of bad advice—actually bad theology—in this story which have no doubt caused much Christian anguish for centuries.

• Belief is a key to overcoming illness—it just has to be strong enough: “All things can be done for the one who believes.” Jesus condemned “this faithless generation.”

• Add some prayer to that, and the magic will work: the demon could be vanquished “only through prayer.”

The devout who actually do read the gospels for guidance on how to live and survive, and assume that Jesus is telling the honest truth, sense that these are unreasonable expectations. They know that, far too often, belief and prayer don’t work in the face of chronic suffering, and they beat themselves up for failing. This is not healthy religion. Shame on Jesus for this bad advice.

I have dealt with the repetitive, droning theme in Dr. Madison’s overall polemic (which doesn’t become any more true merely by repeating the same tired lies): Madison vs. Jesus #10: Universal Answered Prayer & Healing?

Mark’s gospel is saturated with miracle, magic, superstition, and fantasy: Jesus glowed on a mountaintop while having a chat with long-dead heroes. Such stories emerge from imaginations fired by religious zeal. If only Christians could read the gospels carefully, meticulously, critically—and wise up that they’ve been conned.

[I pass over further slanders and blasphemies against Jesus and the Holy Bible, such as these. One has only so much patience — even by God’s supernatural enabling grace — with this sort of bilge. I ain’t Job]

***

Photo credit: Christ driving the money-changers from the Temple (1610), by Cecco del Caravaggio (1588-1620) [public domain / Wikimedia Commons]

***

2019-08-26T14:47:08-04:00

Unforgivable Sin (Blaspheming the Holy Spirit) / Plots to Kill Jesus / Rude Jesus? (“Who is My Mother?”)

This is an installment of my replies to a series of articles on Mark by Dr. David Madison: an atheist who was a Methodist minister for nine years: with a Ph.D. in Biblical Studies from Boston University. His summary article is called, “Not-Your-Pastor’s Tour of Mark’s Gospel: The falsification of Christianity made easy” (Debunking Christianity, 7-17-19). His words will be in blue below.

Dr. Madison has utterly ignored my twelve refutations of his “dirty dozen” podcasts against Jesus, and I fully expect that stony silence to continue. If he wants to be repeatedly critiqued and make no response, that’s his choice (which would challenge Bob Seidensticker as the most intellectually cowardly atheist I know). I will continue on, whatever he decides to do (no skin off my back).

Dr. Madison believes we are not at all sure whether Jesus in fact said anything recorded in the Gospels. The atheist always has a convenient “out” (when refuted in argument about some biblical text) that Jesus never said it anyway and that the text in question was simply made up and added later by unscrupulous and “cultish” Christian propagandists.

I always refuse to play this silly and ultimately intellectually dishonest game, because there is no way to “win” with such a stacked, subjective deck. I start with the assumption (based on many historical evidences) that the manuscripts we have are quite sufficient for us to know what is in the Bible (believe it or not). 

Dr. Madison himself — in his anti-Jesus project noted above, granted my outlook, strictly in terms of practical “x vs. y” debate purposes: “For the sake of argument, I’m willing to say, okay, Jesus was real and, yes, we have gospels that tell the story.” And in the combox: “So, we can go along with their insistence that he did exist. We’ll play on their field, i.e., the gospels.” Excellent! Otherwise, there would be no possible discussion at all.

*****

Dr. Madison called this installment: “How Come Jesus Didn’t Know Better?: Jesus and the demons” (4-20-18).

[I pass over Dr. Madison’s rant against angels, demons, Satan, and benevolent dead saints. He gives no arguments and merely assumes that such beings are self-evidently false and superstitious (“Mark chapter 3 is a major embarrassment to devout Christians who have learned to think like citizens of the 21st Century,” etc. ad nauseam); hence, nothing in this section to refute or interact with. I deal with arguments, not bald self-assumed infallible and invulnerable ravings]

Perhaps the most regrettable part of this pronouncement comes at the end: You’re not allowed to insult one of the big shots in the spirit world:

• “Truly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they utter; but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin”—for they had said, ‘He has an unclean spirit.’” (vv. 28-30)

We have to assume that the Christians who ‘love their Jesus’ don’t pay much attention to this text—or are as heavily into magical thinking as the guy who wrote it. Everything else can be forgiven, but not blaspheming the holy spirit? Of course this makes no sense whatever from the standpoint of rational ethics.

It’s because this blasphemy is rejection of God Himself (Whom the Holy Spirit and Jesus are). It’s calling evil good. Hence, it can’t and won’t be forgiven in the sense that there is no repentance and the person has completely and utterly rejected God (completely hardened their hearts, as the Bible often expresses it). Jesus said this after the hostile “scribes” charged that He was “possessed by Be-el’zebul, and by the prince of demons he casts out the demons” (3:22, RSV; cf. Jn 10:20). They were saying He was either a demoniac or an idol- or devil-worshiper. And so Jesus replied (quite sensibly and logically):

Mark 3:23-26 . . . “How can Satan cast out Satan? [24] If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. [25] And if a house is divided against itself, that house will not be able to stand. [26] And if Satan has risen up against himself and is divided, he cannot stand, but is coming to an end.”

He completely nailed them for something that made no sense whatsoever: the devil literally fighting against himself by allowing one of his supposed agents / demons to cast out other of his demons. Huh? Then He made the point that lying about God in this way was so evil that it would lead to damnation (the absence of any more forgiveness and the presence of “eternal sin” in hell). Jesus adds in the parallel account in Matthew:

Matthew 12:28 But if it is by the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you. (cf. Lk 11:20: “. . . by the finger of God . . .”)

How in the world this isregrettable” and how it supposedly “makes no sense whatever from the standpoint of rational ethicsis, I’m afraid, beyond me. It would be like calling a doctor who just did a successful eight-hour heart surgery on a patient (saving her life) an “evil man who serves Satan”: as if what he did was a bad thing, only deserving of scorn and derision. That’s a very wicked lie; and it would richly deserve precisely the rebuke that Jesus gave an even more outrageous and vicious lie.

In effect, Jesus was expressing the thought that, “if you call even the benevolent God evil or in league with Satan and demons, then there is no hope for you, as you have rejected the sole source of your possible salvation.” And that is merciful and perfectly rational and ethical. He’s telling them that they are in extreme spiritual danger, just as any caring person would warn another about impending physical danger, if it is potentially present (say, for example, walking out into a powerful hurricane). They were playing with fire. If they didn’t know that, then they did after Jesus informed them.

Mark declared at the opening of his gospel that Jesus was the son of God, so the hushing of the demons helped explain why this status wasn’t as well known as it could have been. Furthermore, Mark needed to explain why Jesus came to a bad end; yes, it was necessary theologically (Mark 10:45: “For the Son of man also came not to be served but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many”), but how was the bad end plotted?

In chapter 3, Mark introduces this theme. After Jesus had once again (as at the end of chapter 2) challenged the religious bureaucrats on Sabbath rules, we read in v. 3:6: “The Pharisees went out, and immediately held counsel with the Herodians against him, how to destroy him.”

This simple statement reflects the omniscient perspective that novelists enjoy; they can tell the reader what characters are thinking—or in this case, conspiring. Those who want to believe that Mark is history have the burden of explaining how the author could have known what he reports in verse 3:6. Of course, the novelist can write what he wants, but the historian has to gather the facts. If the gospel was composed 40 or 50 years after the death of the protagonist—and after the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 CE—it’s hard to conceive how the author could have documented the plotting of the Pharisees and Herodians. Did they even keep written records of what they were up to? Did such records survive? How would he have had access to them?

It may have been speculative in some sense, I suppose, but if so, it was a quite plausible speculation, since Jesus’ enemies gave many hints that they hated and despised Him: up to and including violent threats and infiltration of Jesus’ own twelve disciples, to get someone willing to betray Him (and the incident I just dealt with, where they accused Him of being “possessed by Be-el’zebul.” After all, all the Gospels (as Dr. Madison never tires of pointing out) were written after the death of Jesus; so they also had the benefit of hindsight. The fact is that Jesus was tried by the Jewish Sanhedrin, in an illegal kangaroo court, complete with absurdly conflicting “witnesses”:

Mark 14:55-59 Now the chief priests and the whole council sought testimony against Jesus to put him to death; but they found none. [56] For many bore false witness against him, and their witness did not agree. [57] And some stood up and bore false witness against him, saying, [58] “We heard him say, `I will destroy this temple that is made with hands, and in three days I will build another, not made with hands.'” [59] Yet not even so did their testimony agree.

We know at least part of these proceedings were public in nature (such as the incident with the crowd yelling for Jesus’ crucifixion), and so the hatred of Jesus could have been observed. Moreover, there were many other public and observable hints of same:

John 10:31-33 The Jews took up stones again to stone him. [32] Jesus answered them, “I have shown you many good works from the Father; for which of these do you stone me?” [33] The Jews answered him, “It is not for a good work that we stone you but for blasphemy; because you, being a man, make yourself God.”

That was a public incident, and that is how the Gospel writers could know — fairly certainly — that there was such a plot to kill Jesus. John himself could write what he did elsewhere precisely because of what happened in the incident above:

John 5:18 This was why the Jews sought all the more to kill him, because he not only broke the sabbath but also called God his Father, making himself equal with God.

Jesus was threatened with stoning or other bodily harm by the scribes and Pharisees other times as well:

John 8:59 So they took up stones to throw at him; but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple.

John 11:8 The disciples said to him, “Rabbi, the Jews were but now seeking to stone you, and are you going there again?”

Luke 4:28-30 When they heard this, all in the synagogue were filled with wrath. [29] And they rose up and put him out of the city, and led him to the brow of the hill on which their city was built, that they might throw him down headlong. [30] But passing through the midst of them he went away.

If an historian (whether professional or “amateur”) made the statement, “John Wilkes Booth hated Abraham Lincoln and sought to destroy him” or “Lee Harvey Oswald hated John F. Kennedy and sought to destroy him” would they be justified, and accurate? I submit that most would think so, based on the documented facts of the two assassinations. Likewise, with Mark’s speculation.

Now, as for the particular assertion of a pharisaical plot with the Herodians (which is Dr. Madison’s main objection here), this is not implausible at all, to put it mildly. There were several outward indications. Herod the Great was determined to kill Jesus, and had all the male children of Bethlehem two years and under killed in the effort to do so (Mt 2:1-16). Would the mothers of those children forget about this? His son Herod Antipas also killed John the Baptist (Mt 14:3; Lk 9:9). Luke records “chief priests and the scribes” along with Herod Antipas and Pontius Pilate all in league against Jesus:

Luke 23:10-12 The chief priests and the scribes stood by, vehemently accusing him. [11] And Herod with his soldiers treated him with contempt and mocked him; then, arraying him in gorgeous apparel, he sent him back to Pilate. [12] And Herod and Pilate became friends with each other that very day, for before this they had been at enmity with each other.

Some good Pharisees were aware of Herod’s plotting and warned Jesus:

Luke 13:31-33 At that very hour some Pharisees came, and said to him, “Get away from here, for Herod wants to kill you.” [32] And he said to them, “Go and tell that fox, `Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I finish my course.  [33] Nevertheless I must go on my way today and tomorrow and the day following; for it cannot be that a prophet should perish away from Jerusalem.'”

This is more than enough external verification for Mark to surmise as he did (even considered separately from the question of biblical inspiration).

“Oh, this tidbit is based on eyewitness accounts and/or reliable oral tradition.” So say those who want Mark to be history. But that is conjecture, wishful thinking—actually it is a ‘faith’ statement—for which there is no evidence. We have no idea where such information could have come from; it is based on the omniscient perspective of the novelist. He is introducing another component of his plot.

I just showed how it is altogether plausible and hardly a stretch at all to so conclude. But (to play his game for a moment) Dr. Madison, in his manifest sagacity and wisdom, doesn’t want this to be true, and engages in mere conjecture and wishful thinking. As the old proverb goes, “a man convinced against his will retains his original belief still.”

Yet More Embarrassment

Mark 3 ends with another text that many Christians would like to wish away, and has generated apologetic rationalization. It makes it hard to ask What Would Jesus Do?

• “…they said to him, ‘Your mother and your brothers are outside, asking for you.’ And he replied, ‘Who are my mother and my brothers?’ And looking around on those who sat about him, he said, ‘Here are my mother and my brothers! Whoever does the will of God is my brother, and sister, and mother.’” (vv. 32-35)

On the most generous interpretation, Jesus is here expanding his understanding of family—but it still sounds like a rebuff of this kin. We wonder how well Jesus and his family got along, based on these verses, also in chapter 3 (vv. 19-21):

• “Then he went home; and the crowd came together again, so that they could not even eat. And when his family heard it, they went out to seize him, for people were saying, ‘He is beside himself.’”

James Spencer Northcote provides a great answer to this line of reasoning:

We are quite at liberty to imagine, if we like, that Our Lord, after uttering the words which the Evangelists have recorded, rose up and proceeded to grant His Mother the interview she had asked for; there would be nothing at all strange in such a supposition; on the contrary, it is more possible than not; but it is not certain. All that we are told is that He answered the interruption in these words, “Who is My mother and My brethren? And then looking round about on them who sat about Him, He saith, Behold My mother and My brethren. For whosoever shall do the will of God, he is My brother, and My sister, and mother.”

I need not say that these words were not really an answer sent to His mother and brethren, but rather a lesson of instruction addressed to those “who sat about Him;” nor can it be necessary to point out to anyone who is familiar with the Gospels, how common a thing it was with our Blessed Lord to direct His answers not so much to the questions that had been put forward, as to the inward thoughts and motives of those who put them; how sometimes He set aside the question altogether as though he had not heard it, yet proceeded to make it the occasion of imparting some general lesson which it suggested. This is precisely what He does now.

Even Dr. Madison almost stumbled into the truth: “On the most generous interpretation, Jesus is here expanding his understanding of family.” Exactly! Jesus took the opportunity to show that He regarded all of His followers (in what would become the Christian Church) as family. Similarly, He told His disciples, “I have called you friends” (Jn 15:15). It doesn’t follow that this is “a rebuff of this kin” (i.e., his immediate family). He simply moved from literal talk of families to a larger conception and vision of of families as those who do “the will of God.” Thus, Jesus habitually used “brethren” to describe those who were not His immediate family:

Matthew 5:47 And if you salute only your brethren, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same?

Matthew 23:8 But you are not to be called rabbi, for you have one teacher, and you are all brethren.

Matthew 25:40 And the King will answer them, `Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brethren, you did it to me.’

Matthew 28:10 Then Jesus said to them, “Do not be afraid; go and tell my brethren to go to Galilee, and there they will see me.”

Luke 22:32 “but I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail; and when you have turned again, strengthen your brethren.”

John 20:17 Jesus said to her, “Do not hold me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brethren and say to them, I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.”

We see that “brethren” is used 191 times in the New Testament, mostly in this sense. So is “brother” (116 times in the New Testament). “Sister” is also used in the epistles, referring to fellow Christians who are female:

Romans 16:1 I commend to you our sister Phoebe, a deaconess of the church at Cen’chre-ae,

1 Corinthians 7:15 But if the unbelieving partner desires to separate, let it be so; in such a case the brother or sister is not bound.

Philemon 1:2 and Ap’phia our sister and Archip’pus our fellow soldier, and the church in your house:

James 2:15 If a brother or sister is ill-clad and in lack of daily food,

Arguably, all of this might be thought to have started in the words of Jesus here under consideration. It’s not a rebuff of His mother and father and half-brothers and/or cousins (also called “brothers” in the New Testament; Jesus was an only Son); it’s simply the beginning of the Body of Christ, and the Christian Church being regarded as one large, extended family.

Lastly, Jesus refers to His own mother as the mother of John, when He asked His disciple to watch over her after Jesus’ death:

John 19:26-27 When Jesus saw his mother, and the disciple whom he loved standing near, he said to his mother, “Woman, behold, your son!” [27] Then he said to the disciple, “Behold, your mother!” And from that hour the disciple took her to his own home. 

And of course, we have the long tradition of calling priests (in Catholicism and Orthodoxy) “father”: the biblical basis for which, I have written about. And female leaders of nuns and religious are called “Mother”; for example, Mother Teresa; now St. Teresa of Calcutta, or Mother Angelica, who founded EWTN. Monks are called “Brother” and nuns, “Sister,” etc.

Never forget this while reading the gospels: they are theological tracts meant to advance the Christ cult at the time of their composition. It wanted followers who would not put family first. This ‘rebuffing’ text in Mark thus aligns well with the infamous verses, Luke 14:26-27:

• “If any one comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple. Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me, cannot be my disciple.”

This text is quite a challenge for believers who want to revere Jesus as a great moral teacher, but it fits perfectly with the cult mentality of the time. . . . Christians say, “Well, Jesus couldn’t have meant that,” . . . It means exactly what it seems to mean.

Not at all, as I showed in a past refutation of the same argument from Dr. Madison, and also a related one, having to do with Jesus’ falsely alleged hostility to families.

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Photo credit: Christ Appearing to His Mother (1496), by Juan de Flandes (fl. by 1496–1519) [public domain / Picryl]

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2019-04-16T11:11:26-04:00

Be of good cheer!

All three rose windows survived. The two iconic towers with their wonderful bells are still standing. Notre Dame can and will be rebuilt. The entire stone frame is still more or less intact. Other cathedrals have been restored: some, with far worse damage (and some even from scratch). The most precious relics were saved, too, by heroic action.

I have collected several articles below about cathedral rebuilding and restoration.

Images appear to show that Notre Dame’s prized rose windows survived the mammoth blaze that engulfed the cathedral on Monday.

The archbishop of Paris confirmed the fire had spared the three 13th-century stained glass masterpieces, French CNN affiliate BFM TV reported.

The iconic rose windows are among Notre Dame’s most recognizable features. The earliest window, which punctures the west facade of the cathedral, dates back to 1225. The north and south roses were created in 1250 and 1260, respectively. (Notre Dame Miracle? Rose Windows’ Stained Glass Appears to Have Survived Savage Blaze, Katherine Hignett, Newsweek, 4-16-19)

As a devastating fire tore through the revered Gothic cathedral on Monday, toppling its spire, many feared these treasures might be lost forever. . . .
The Paris Fire Brigade tweeted that the cathedral’s stone construction has been “saved,” as have the “main works of art.” As more information emerges, what has been rescued from Notre Dame is becoming apparent. . . .
What Was Saved
*
• The Crown of Thorns, which some believe was placed on the head of Jesus and which the cathedral calls its “most precious and most venerated relic,” was rescued from the fire, according to Paris Mayor Anne Hidalgo.
*
• Hidalgo confirmed the Tunic of Saint Louis and other “major” works were also saved.
*
• The facade and twin bell towers, the tallest structures in Paris until the completion of the Eiffel Tower in the late 19th century, survived the blaze.
*
• The Rose windows are a trio of immense round stained-glass windows over the cathedral’s three main portals that date back to the 13th century. The Archbishop of Paris said all three have been saved, reports CNN affiliate BFM TV.
*
• The original Great Organ, one of the world’s most famous musical instruments, dates back to medieval times. Over the years, organ makers renovated the instrument and added onto it, but it still contained pipes from the Middle Ages before Monday’s fire. . . .
*
“We managed to protect the most precious treasures in a safe place,” a Paris City Hall spokesperson told CNN. (Rose windows of Notre Dame are safe but fate of other treasures is unclear, (Rose windows of Notre Dame are safe but fate of other treasures is unclear, Emanuella Grinberg and Jack Guy, CNN, 4-16-19)

[T]he Church of England has already predicted that Notre Dame – no matter how much it lies in ruin – will stand whole again.

“No matter the destruction, the spirit of what it means to be a cathedral can and does survive such catastrophes,” said Becky Clark, the Church of England’s director of cathedrals and church buildings. “All have been rebuilt, sometimes taking on new forms, to stand as reminders of eternity and resurrection.”

Throughout the centuries, famous churches and other holy places have been laid to waste by war, fire, sabotage, earthquakes and just plain old age. And in the case of many, they were rebuilt to their former – or more contemporary – glory.

Here’s a look at some of the more famous examples of resurrected holy buildings:

1. London’s Old St. Paul’s Cathedral. Built from 1087 to 1314, the legendary structure, sheathed in wooden scaffolding during a renovation, was completely gutted in the Great Fire of London in 1666.

. . . the cathedral was rebuilt with a new design by the noted Sir Christoper Wren and was completed by 1710. Today, the new St. Paul’s stands as one of the most famous and recognizable sights in London. . . .

2. Germany’s Dresden Frauenkirche (Church of Our Lady.) Built in the 18th century, the church was spectacularly destroyed by Allied forces in the bombing of Dresden during World War II. . . .

A massive effort to rebuild the church began in 1994 with the help of modern technology. The rubble was carted off stone by stone. Builders, using thousands of old photographs and recollections of worshippers, finished the work in 2005. . . .

3. Italy’s Benedictine Abbey at Monte Cassino. The abbey, about 80 miles southeast of Rome, was a noted holy place for monks that had endured for over 1,000 years prior to World War II. But in February 1944, Allied bombers dropped about 1,000 tons of explosives on the town. The abbey and its adjoining church were turned to rubble. Among the treasures lost were the elaborately detailed frescoed walls of the building.

The abbey was rebuilt by 1964 . . .

4. New Zealand’s Christchurch Cathedral . . .

5. Moscow’s Cathedral of Christ the Saviour. (Cathedral resurrection: A look at famous houses of worship reborn after destruction, Mike James, USA Today, 4-15-19)

See also:

How to rebuild a gothic cathedral: The future of Notre Dame (Oscar Holland, CNN, updated 4-16-19)

Notre Dame: how a rebuilt cathedral could be just as wonderful (The Conversation, 4-16-19)

French billionaires and companies pledge $450 million to rebuild Notre Dame (CNN, 4-16-19)

On the Loss of Cathedrals (“SkipSul”, Ricochet, 4-15-19)

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Photo credit: artonthefly (9-30-12). South stained glass rose window in Notre-Dame de Paris (the most celebrated) [Wikimedia CommonsCreative Commons Attribution 2.0 Generic license]

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